Itachi himself praised kakashi's mastery over the sharingan despite being a non-uchiha. And sasuke broke out of itachis tsukuyomi when they had the battle of their eyes. That means that if your mastery of the sharingan is great enough, then you can break out of any genjutsu, even tsukuyomi.
I shouldve made myself clear, sorry. I was talking about the genjustu duel he had. But also the crows that itachi kept making. Especially the one that dispersed and came at sasuke. Even if kakashi has mastery of the sharigan, he isnt as good with it as sasuke.
MS doesn't increase someone's speed. And sasuke was keeping up with itachi just fine. If anything sasuke held the speed advantage since he was able to not only dodge itachi's eyesight for some time, and was the only one of the two who got comments about his speed from zetsu. As for itachi's amazing signweaving speed:
In their first battle it was made clear that itachi needed to use MS genjutsu to beat kakashi since kakashi could counter all the other forms. In Sasuke's genjutsu battle with itachi, he countered all of itachi's genjutsu easily until itachi used tsukuyomi. Kakashi, posessing the MS will counter all of itachi's non-MS genjutsu easily.
I never said, ms increases your speed. Its already in the data book that itachi is faster than kakashi and sasuke. Also by sharigan itachi i assume he means an healthy itachi with the sharigan since its the ms that not only damaged his eye sight, but also his health.. Also sasuke was able to counter itachi's genjutsu because he is also a genjutsu user, but not even him was able to stop itachi's constantly dispersing into crows
Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but when you start trash talking over the net, using petty insults you just look weak and pathetic.
Kakashi is also a genjutsu user, he takes out two anbu with just one genjutsu no diff. By feats, he is more skilled than sasuke in genjutsu. And once again I reference the reason why itachi used MS on kakashi, despite it draining the hell out of itachi's chakra. I also will reference the fact that after part 2, kakashi is prepared for itachi's MS genjutsu
Basically, the only way that you are saying itachi wins this fight is with non-MS genjutsu, somethig that won't work on kakashi since #1 kakashi has trained through the timeskip to counter even itachi's MS genjutsu, and 2, we've seen sasuke with just a three-tomoe easily counter any and all of itachis non-ms genjutsu.
Of course pre ms sasuke beats kakashi, pre ms sasuke beats BASE Itachi as well, which is why itachi had to constantly use the MS in the fight. Base itachi was getting thrashed by pre ms sasuke.
Lol at by feats kakashi is more skilled at genjutsu than sasuke. The same person who used genjutsu on deidroa, manda, bee, C, danzou. No way in hell has kakashi got more genjutsu feats than sasuke. And as i said, even though sasuke was able to keep up, he still couldnt stop him forming crows.
Sasuke used MS genjutsu on those guys while kakashi's most powerful genjutsu was three tomoe, and it didn't just incap the guys like it did to C, but it knocked two of them out at once.
How was he owning kakashi before he activated MS? The only time he "owned" kakashi was because he saved kurenai from the exploding clone. In the 30% clone battle, how did he stall them? By casting genjutsu on naruto. When the battle became a battle of ninjutsu, he was swiftly outsmarted and beaten.
He disperses in order to catch sasuke in tsukuyomi. All the attack he did after that point including slamming sasuke against the wall, or kicking him were all in the genjutsu. Besides the times where itachi used MS techs, sasuke was owning itachi when he only had his three tomoe out.
Going completely by the databook now? Speed is roughly equal, handseals are nothing special now that everyone has caught up, genjutsu is broken due to kakashi's mastery over sharingan and having the better eye, kakashi has way more powerful ninjutsu, has more chakra reserves (by databook) than itachi, and has cannonically outsmarted itachi in battle.
proof he kicked him before tsukuyomi was used?
no he said if itachi was serious sasuke would have lost. There is nothing about him not even using MS. I know the exact scan you are referring to, please don't change around Tobi's words.
Youve come up with some crazy statement in the past but if you believe kakashi has more genjutsu feats than sasuke then maybe i should completely stop this discussion with you. Again a 30%, itachi clone stalled all 4 of them, enough and its when the his 30% chakra run out were they able to kill the clone. Also im not talking about that genjutsu fight, during their kunai's battle he was able to create a clone, which then dispersed and kicked sasuke. That wasnt genjutsu that was reality, it was then did itachi use tsukuyomi.
Give me proof of the whole kick thing. Post a scan. I've noticed in our debates that I'm the one who always posts scans.
It was shown in the page where the genjutsu was cast, orochimaru and itachi's eyes receive their own panels before the genjutsu was cast, which therefore means that the genjutsu was eye genjutsu. Next, sharingan can see through genjutsu meaning, the non-ms genjutsu will not work, especially weak finger genjutsu.
His shown speed isn't above sasukes, he gets outsmarted by kakashi, he gets outgunned by kakashi, his handspeed isn't great anymore, and kakashi has kamui.
The fact is that all of their base stats are roughly the same, exept kakashi has kamui and a hell lot more powerful jutsus that itachi. And once again non-MS genjutsu isn't working on a person with the sharingan.
Here is why I say him kicking sasuke into the wall is tsukuyomi:
Lets just end it, you keep on dismissing his hand and foot speed yet he blitz sasuke but also his hand speed was so fast that not only did kakashi and kurenai note this, also the fact that he was able to counter every last one of sasuke's shurikens whilst forming seals to create a clone alone should tell you about his hand speed.
Nice catch. So basically itachi didnt kick him then. Basically after he turned into crows, he then activated the ms, had eye contact with sasuke and once he had him in tsukuyomi he kicked him in this genjutsu. Nice catch.
itachi doesn't have those items as they are only used when he uses susanoo and therefore considered MS items.
