Might Guy and the eight gates

Minato namikaze2

Active member
Regular
Joined
Feb 4, 2011
Messages
751
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Umm wrong ... It was already stated and shown that the Sharingan can see and read movements but it means nothing if their opponent is faster than the uchia then they wouldn't be fast enough to react to attacks, the two best battles will be sasuke(three tomoes) vs Naruto(one tail form) and sasuke(MS) vs the 4th Raikage(lightning armor) . In these battles sasuke saw their movements but wasn't fast enough to react to their attacks, sasuke had to go curse mark lvl 2 against Naruto and had to have sasunoo up for protection against the Raikage.
sharingan is for 1v1 kyuubi had many hands that he couldnt read them all its like when killer bee used those 8 blades against sasuke and sasuke couldnt read them all and being faster doesnt do any good against sharingan because sasuke dodged 2lariats from raikage and killer bee
 

xxSAGExx

Active member
Elite
Joined
Aug 22, 2011
Messages
5,197
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
I think he'd be near indestructable besides instant seals(totsuka sword) but he'd obviously die shortly after so in the end you lose 2 great shinobi, sacrificed for the weaklings.... :(
Ummm no... He beat kisame with 7 gates so the 8th would only increase his powers a few more but not pass the Raikage, his speed and strength will be close to or equal to A's but not pass. I only think this because we seen Gai go 5-6 gates against a 30% clone of kisame and then 7 gates to catch kisame and his strongest attack (as of right now) to win (only because kisame thought is was a chakra base attack and that his attack would absorb it or he would have dodged it. A is the 2nd fastest ninja in the world (1st being Naruto) so you can't say Gai will just pass him just like that, he would if the Raikage doesn't use his lightning armor.
 

NooneSLikeMe

Member
Joined
Oct 16, 2011
Messages
6
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
i would agree with Itachi Namikaze and s0ulja.
don't have anything more to add.
they pretty much said it all, so just rep +


-just to make it clear i like Gai and i'm not saying that he is useless or anything.
 
  • Like
Reactions: s0ulja

Itachi Namikaze

Active member
Elite
Joined
Mar 28, 2011
Messages
5,545
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
i would agree with Itachi Namikaze and s0ulja.
don't have anything more to add.
they pretty much said it all, so just rep +


-just to make it clear i like Gai and i'm not saying that he is useless or anything.
I think Guy is great because of his comic relief and he is a very strong ninja, he just gets outclassed by the strongest people.
 

YetiCrab

Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2010
Messages
45
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Well I am almost 100 percent positive that nowhere in the manga does it say that each gate increases the user's power by a factor of 10. That is ludicrous and sounds sort of like DBZ.

First off I will explain what the gates are and how they work. In the Narutoverse, ninjas use chakra for everything. They use it for taijutsu as well as ninjutsu and genjutsu, chakra is basically their version of DBZ's ki.

So ninjas have all of this chakra in their bodies, but to prevent them from using it all at once there are eight gates that limit chakra flow and strength to the muscles to prevent chakra exhaustion and the body wearing itself out.

What the gates do is release a gate on your chakra, allowing you access to more of your maximum potential chakra and strength (speed goes along with this as it is directly related to leg strength). So with each gate opened you have access to more of your maximum chakra, the gates does not increase the amount of chakra you have nor does it give you speed boosts like the raiton armor or sage mode, what it does instead is allows you to access your highest potential strength (and speed) and chakra output.

This however comes at a cost, with all of the chakra the ninja in the gates is using they become tired and lose chakra at a much higher rate. Also because their muscles are working so hard and at levels they don't normally the mucles start to tear and wear down. This is why Guy is always tired after using the gates and usually in pain depending on which gate he has opened, this is why he and Lee train purely in taijutsu and muscle strength, so that they can reduce the muscle wear and tear caused by the gates.

So now that we know what the gates are and what they do, let's get into why they could never be the best while used by someone who is not already the best.

Because the gates only allows the user to reach their maximum potential power and chakra levels, the gates user will always fall behind someone who was born with more chakra or has access to different modes that augment their own chakra. (Sage mode, Kyuubi chakra mode, raiton armor) Now this doesn't mean that those people are necessarily faster and stronger, it just depends on how much chakra they are putting into it, but it does mean that if those people are able to surpass the gates user.

My argument here is that you think Guy opening the eighth gate would become the strongest ninja in the Narutoverse, well that is literally an impossibility. He either doesn't have the chakra reserves or the chakra control necessary to push his strength and speed to levels given to people with bijuu level chakra levels.

As we saw in the fight against Kisame, Guy had to go seventh gate just to catch up to Kisame who was running away, and even then his attacks didn't even knock out Kisame let alone kill him. Kisame didn't move because he thought that his shark bullet would absorb Afternoon Tiger, so it was really Kisame's overconfidence that beat him. Guy's movements were still able to be seen, and his strength wasn't super tremendous as he smashed Kisame's body but Kisame was still conscious and later able to perform summonings and a water prison.

Back to the point, Guy and Lee can train their speed and strength, but you can only increase your chakra levels to a certain point, for the most part you are stuck with what you were born with.

So when A who also trains his speed and strength solely, uses his raiton armor there is almost no way that Guy can reach the speeds that A can, because a has bijuu like chakra levels. Maybe his strength is equal or above A's, because I am not sure if lightning armor increases strength or not, but either way he can't be as fast as him.

And as for Naruto and other jinchurriki, if you compare Guy using the gates to them, then that is just insane. What that is doing is saying that Guy's maximum strength and chakra levels is equal to or exceeds that of a bijuu and their jinchurriki's. Naruto's speed whilst using his KM mode is perhaps the fastest that anyone can get, except for Naruto who still has the means to go much faster as he has Sage Mode as well and does not have full access to the Kyuubi's chakra. (By the way can anyone imagine Naruto if he combined KM and SM and then used the gates? He has a high healing rate and near infinite chakra, so that would allow him 100% access to all the chakra he has, man that would be insane)

And I thought I read somewhere in this thread that the gates aren't used that often. Well that would also be incorrect as in either the first or second databook (made by Kishi so it is canon) it says that most jounin can open at least the first two gates. Kakashi used the first gate when climbing a rock wall, so in other words just for fun basically. The gates aren't something super rare and ultra powerful like being a jinchurriki or raiton armor, it is just that Guy and Lee have made it their focus so they have taken it further than most other people.

And to the people who say that it give powers equal or above that of a kage, what does that mean? What makes kages special? Usually it is their unique abilities that make them powerful, something the gates can't give someone. Most kages are faster and stronger than normal ninjas, but that is due to their high chakra levels (I defy you to find a kage who does not have high chakra levels), so that quote only applies to the physical aspect of being a kage. While a gates user who opened the eighth gate might become stronger and faster than most kages, they don't gain the special abilities of a kage and so can only reach their levels in regards to taijutsu but nothing else.

And before I go here is another example of the difference between the gates and someone born strong with high chakra levels. Guy has fought Kisame three times, and the second time Guy was forced to open the fifth gate to be able to fight on par with Kisame. But what do we know about that fight? It was a 30% chakra clone who didn't actually have the real Samehada. And Guy in the seventh gate was still not able to easily kill Kisame, who was taken by surprise and already weakened from before. If used by an average person the gates only puts people on par with exceptional people.


EDIT: to the Lord of Kaos, the third raikage would be able to withstand much more than a few hits from Guy's jutsus. That is if Guy is even able to perform more than one or two, he was exhausted after just running after Kisame and using Afternoon tiger once. The third raikage on the other hand survived the rasenshuriken, and more importantly is able to tank the TBB (as of now the most powerful attack there is), and we don't even know how many the third raikage took from the eight tails.
Even though a kage, or a Bijuu might have more chakra than someone like Might Gai, it doesn't mean that they are able to unleash og control their entire chakra-flow like Gai does when opening, lets say, gate 8. That would tear their muscles and body down aswell. And i've heard of no kage who relied themself on the eight gates like Gai do, and trained it insanely much. Shinobi with higher chakra will only be faster if they also are able to manipulate all of their chakra at once like Gai does, and they can't have trained it as much as he has. This gives Gai the upper hand.
 

LEAU92

Active member
Regular
Joined
Oct 5, 2011
Messages
1,456
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
The sharingan can't read every move, like killerbee's kenjutsu and taijutsu. If guy is more skilled than anyone in taijutsu then how can sasuke beat guy at point blank range. For a shinobi, they have to fight smart, a sharingan user would obviously know to stay away from taijutsu artisits and fight from mid-long range.
 

Baka Sennin

Active member
Veteran
Joined
Oct 14, 2011
Messages
3,750
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
guy is one of my favourite characters, but i hope he uses the death gate at some point, just to see what technique he will be able to use from it. sacrificing himself to save lee from madara from example would be a great way to go, motivating lee to surpass him.

but the 8th gate won't make guy the most powerful shinobi, as has been mentioned it just takes limiters off the user's physical and chakra capabilities, meaning they can use closer and closer to 100% when usually they use just 20%. the death gate will grant 100%, which still comes up short to naruto's speed and chakra levels for example. plus, even lower level gates are self-damaging, guy one on one would probably have lost to kisame, he wasn't even knocked unconscious and would have outlasted him. it all depends on wether the one hit connects/kills or not, if it doesn't then it's over for the user, as shown in lee vs gaara. not to say it's a bad technique, but it's limitation is much too big for the gates to be one of the best techniques.
 

LEAU92

Active member
Regular
Joined
Oct 5, 2011
Messages
1,456
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
guy is one of my favourite characters, but i hope he uses the death gate at some point, just to see what technique he will be able to use from it. sacrificing himself to save lee from madara from example would be a great way to go, motivating lee to surpass him.

but the 8th gate won't make guy the most powerful shinobi, as has been mentioned it just takes limiters off the user's physical and chakra capabilities, meaning they can use closer and closer to 100% when usually they use just 20%. the death gate will grant 100%, which still comes up short to naruto's speed and chakra levels for example. plus, even lower level gates are self-damaging, guy one on one would probably have lost to kisame, he wasn't even knocked unconscious and would have outlasted him. it all depends on wether the one hit connects/kills or not, if it doesn't then it's over for the user, as shown in lee vs gaara. not to say it's a bad technique, but it's limitation is much too big for the gates to be one of the best techniques.
thanks for your feedback :)
 
Joined
Sep 25, 2011
Messages
493
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Might Gai is THE beast
but eight inner gates?
Too much risk in it.
Neji sayed once that always that Ninja, who trys to win by sacrificing his sane will lose.
What uses incredible strenght, if youre exhausted or dead after using it?

I think hell open all gates, but hes not stronger with it than Naruto or Bee.

Thats just realistic.

Example:
there are two bottles, one small and one big. The small is Gai, the big is Naruto

Both try to fill different pools

The Narutobottle is turned and Water rinns out. slowly
In The Gaibottle, there are several holes made (the opened eight inner gates)
So Gais bottle is faster empty, than Narutos and for a short time theres more water in gais pool than in narutos, but in the end naruto has more water, cause his bottle is bigger and carries more water.
Understand?
sorry for bad english
 
  • Like
Reactions: LEAU92

LEAU92

Active member
Regular
Joined
Oct 5, 2011
Messages
1,456
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Might Gai is THE beast
but eight inner gates?
Too much risk in it.
Neji sayed once that always that Ninja, who trys to win by sacrificing his sane will lose.
What uses incredible strenght, if youre exhausted or dead after using it?

I think hell open all gates, but hes not stronger with it than Naruto or Bee.

Thats just realistic.

Example:
there are two bottles, one small and one big. The small is Gai, the big is Naruto

Both try to fill different pools

The Narutobottle is turned and Water rinns out. slowly
In The Gaibottle, there are several holes made (the opened eight inner gates)
So Gais bottle is faster empty, than Narutos and for a short time theres more water in gais pool than in narutos, but in the end naruto has more water, cause his bottle is bigger and carries more water.
Understand?
sorry for bad english
Good point man, I like the whole comparative thinking, it was pretty accurate too. +rep
 

Itachi Namikaze

Active member
Elite
Joined
Mar 28, 2011
Messages
5,545
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Even though a kage, or a Bijuu might have more chakra than someone like Might Gai, it doesn't mean that they are able to unleash og control their entire chakra-flow like Gai does when opening, lets say, gate 8. That would tear their muscles and body down aswell. And i've heard of no kage who relied themself on the eight gates like Gai do, and trained it insanely much. Shinobi with higher chakra will only be faster if they also are able to manipulate all of their chakra at once like Gai does, and they can't have trained it as much as he has. This gives Gai the upper hand.
That isn't true what you have said there. People who are born with more chakra and/or are jinchurikki are able to release naturally higher levels of chakra without the damage to their body because their bodies were born to contain more and use it. If they used the gates and release all their chakra at once like Guy, then yes they would hurt their own bodies, but otherwise they just have higher chakra output levels.

Now this isn't a guarantee but all of the kages that we have seen have or have had in the past (Hiruzen) extremely large chakras. This is what sets their physical capabilities apart from regular shinobi, they are able to push themselves further because of their large chakras. That was my whole point about comparing Guy to people like A and Kisame and Naruto.

Here is an example of what I mean; ninjas only use around 20% of their chakra normally. Let's just say that Kisame has 10 times the chakra that Guy has (I think that is fair as Neji said a 30% clone had more chakra than basically anyone he had seen except Naruto) anyway so if Guy were to release all the gates and use all of his chakra, he still would only be able to use only half of the chakra that Kisame using 20% would be able to use.

Here is the math for you on the above thing.
Let's say Guy's max chakra = 1x
Kisame's max chakra = 10x
If Guy goes 8 gates he gets to use the full amount of his chakra which is 1x, but Kisame using still the average 20% has a 2x for chakra. So Kisame still is putting out double the chakra that Guy can while not even using the gates.
It doesn't matter if Kisame's chakra is exactly 10 times Guy's because the concept is still the same.

That is why the gates used by someone who is not already kage level is sort of futile. I say sort of because type match ups matter and you are correct that chakra control comes into it, that is why not all people with large chakras are fast and strong, they lack the ability to use their chakra to its potential.
 

LEAU92

Active member
Regular
Joined
Oct 5, 2011
Messages
1,456
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Tbh, i would like to say that kisame is only a threat with samehada, when people think of kisame, they look at his sword, the one thing that he's relied on in every fight. If he were to fight guy without the sword and guy were to fight with no gates at all, who would win then ?

I think this would be a fair match.
 

s0ulja

Active member
Regular
Joined
Jun 15, 2011
Messages
1,771
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Tbh, i would like to say that kisame is only a threat with samehada, when people think of kisame, they look at his sword, the one thing that he's relied on in every fight. If he were to fight guy without the sword and guy were to fight with no gates at all, who would win then ?

I think this would be a fair match.
thats a fair point...but as guy trained to harness the gates, kisame harness's his swords ability...if u are to take away kisame's sword from the equation u have to take away guy's gates to make it fair..no?
 

LEAU92

Active member
Regular
Joined
Oct 5, 2011
Messages
1,456
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
thats a fair point...but as guy trained to harness the gates, kisame harness's his swords ability...if u are to take away kisame's sword from the equation u have to take away guy's gates to make it fair..no?
I did say that lol, i said, take away samehada and gates.

who wins ?
 
Top