If you think of it Oro was a push over...

[mustafagrbz]

Age affects power unless you negate it with weird jutsus like kazuku,orochimaru and tsunade. If you read the fight between the 3rd and oro its said multiple times his abilties were being affected heavily by his age, his chakra was alot lower, his weapon felt heavier, oro said he'd never seen the 3rd out of breath before but after a few back and forth attacks he was breathing heavier, and he wasn't fighting the same in general. (Enma, his personal summon stated that and in one of the translation that he wasn't acting like his useual self)

now even with all that basicly making his "Prime" hidden, he was still the strongest in the village at the time and the only person who could have even came close to stoping oro 1v1.

So you think that Oro is/was weak or not?

 

[BananaAssassin]

nooo. i didn't add time factor. you did with your silly 9yr old naruto thing. in this argument right now and your logic, time does not matter. the two battles have already happened. choji beat jirobo and naruto 'beat' pain. it's already done. this has nothing to do with time since according to your logic:


1. naruto>pain, pain>itachi, so naruto>itachi
2. dosu> choji, choji>jirobo, dosu>jirobo
o well. i explained again but i doubt you're gonna get it.

and i told you you can't discount an actual quote in the manga unless they're proven wrong (ex. kisame beating jiraiya). and you're argument that jiraiya was stronger than orochimaru is still arguable so it's not definitive. you can't use that as evidence.

and look around you. look at the recent posts that have been made. majority of people here agree that orochimaru is stronger than kisame. and yet, you keep insisting that he's not without any legit evidence. and it's your fault you have bad grammar and can't explain your points very well. not mine.

edit: and try to explain your point better instead of criticizing me for your own faults. if you make you points clear, i'll argue.

"1. naruto>pain, pain>itachi, so naruto>itachi
2. dosu> choji, choji>jirobo, dosu>jirobo
o well. i explained again but i doubt you're gonna get it." <-- lol u did it again. u are comparing my examples to urs. ur examples dont have nothing to do with my logic. because Im comparing naruto,pain and itachi in short period of a time (month) you are using "weak" choji to many months later fight with jiroubou. I just exaggerated my 9yrs old naruto examples but it was an exaggeration of your 3-4months example...I know it's a short time but Chouji was able to took the pills against Jirobo. He wasn't able with Dosu.There was 3-4 months between and I guess lot happened. IF Dosu would have fought "pill"Chouji then you could do the comparing and rule out my logic

Well I never said Kisame is stronger than oro. I just felt like arguing you 'cause I think that you dont have proof to say oro would own kisame.
As for ur argument, in my books it doesn't matter or say much about the possible fight in present time with Oro vs Kisame. But then this just got out of hand and 'cause I think that u dont get it and u that I so it's quite annoying..but whatever.

 

[Professor Sarutobi]

So you think that Oro is/was weak or not?

during his fight with the 3rd, no. He had just taken a new body so he wasn't sick at the time and he hadn't had his arms sealed yet, he was staying back and letting the hokages do most of the fighting, mostly for psychological revenge againest the 3rd for not picking him to be the 4th hokage.

edit: he also didn't know about reaper death seal so he didn't think the 3rd could do squat to him or the IWR hokages.

(and you guys argueing over ABC logic, itachi still beats naruto and without help/info/hinata jumping in and pain needing to take naruto alive, Pain>naruto as well.)

 

[tacobelt]

Age affects power unless you negate it with weird jutsus like kazuku,orochimaru and tsunade. If you read the fight between the 3rd and oro its said multiple times his abilties were being affected heavily by his age, his chakra was alot lower, his weapon felt heavier, oro said he'd never seen the 3rd out of breath before but after a few back and forth attacks he was breathing heavier, and he wasn't fighting the same in general. (Enma, his personal summon stated that and in one of the translation that he wasn't acting like his useual self)

now even with all that basicly making his "Prime" hidden, he was still the strongest in the village at the time and the only person who could have even came close to stoping oro 1v1.



lol ok either typo first sentence or just confused on who we are talking about, obito was kakashi's friend that was crushed by rocks and gives kakashi his sharingan. and Hiruzen Sarutobi the 3rd hokage, was nicknamed The God of the Shinobi, i can show you the manga page if you want.

ROFL ur right i kept thinking sarutobi and typed obito.

 

[Schmack]

"1. naruto>pain, pain>itachi, so naruto>itachi
2. dosu> choji, choji>jirobo, dosu>jirobo
o well. i explained again but i doubt you're gonna get it." <-- lol u did it again. u are comparing my examples to urs. ur examples dont have nothing to do with my logic. because Im comparing naruto,pain and itachi in short period of a time (month) you are using "weak" choji to many months later fight with jiroubou. I just exaggerated my 9yrs old naruto examples but it was an exaggeration of your 3-4months example...I know it's a short time but Chouji was able to took the pills against Jirobo. He wasn't able with Dosu. IF Dosu would have fought "pill"Chouji then you could do the comparing and rule out my logic

Well I never said Kisame is stronger than oro. I just felt like arguing you 'cause I think that you dont have proof to say oro would own kisame.
As for ur argument, in my books it doesn't matter or say much about the possible fight in present time with Oro vs Kisame. But then this just got out of hand and 'cause I think that u dont get it and u that I so it's quite annoying..but whatever.

but then again you clearly said 'no matter how it happened, naruto beat pain'. so you clearly ignore the process of the battle. you only look at the result, according to your logic.

and did i ever say that i have a definitive proof that orochimaru is stronger than kisame? no. all i've had from the beginning was my own argument based upon that one quote in the manga. and no it's not a definitive proof but i never claimed that it is.

edit: and yes my example has everything to do with you logic. at least try to understand it. it doesn't matter how strong or weak they are. it's a relationship between the three ninjas' strengths. NOT who's stronger than who.

 

[tacobelt]

orochimaru was strong, no denying that. but we havent seen him use any of those crazy techniques that other ppl use.

 

[luckyD]

well itachi does have the sharingan so what get over it. and kisame can beat orochimaru hands down if kisame ****ed up killer hachibi bee he is definetly beating orochimaru.

thats so not true kisame can't beat oro and i'll give u my reasons 1 kisame deals more on absorbing jutsu and he absorbs jutsu's that are seen outside the body and i haven't seen oro using that kind of jutsu so absorbing of chakra is out da window 2 kisame uses brute force attacks definetly u would agree with me that he can't win oro with that 3 even if he turns to his bijuu like form i believe that if oro could stand the kyuubi's fourth tail form while he was sick i think he can definetly have a winning chance 4 kisame can't win oro with jutsu cause oro will just counter it cause he knows every jutsu written so there is no way kisame is a match 4 oro like oro said him self his biggest challenge is itachi cause of his genjutsu if he learnt how to resist genjutsu like jiraiya had itachi wouldnt have bin a problem

 

[Schmack]

orochimaru was strong, no denying that. but we havent seen him use any of those crazy techniques that other ppl use.

by other people you mean who?

 

[BananaAssassin]

but then again you clearly said 'no matter how it happened, naruto beat pain'. so you clearly ignore the process of the battle. you only look at the result, according to your logic.

and did i ever say that i have a definitive proof that orochimaru is stronger than kisame? no. all i've had from the beginning was my own argument based upon that one quote in the manga. and no it's not a definitive proof but i never claimed that it is.

edit: and yes my example has everything to do with you logic. at least try to understand it. it doesn't matter how strong or weak they are. it's a relationship between the three ninjas' strengths. NOT who's stronger than who.

Okay I didnt mean it like that. Only point is that I compare those character in the same timeline. Maybe Im not still getting it dunno, but yeah I'll think it another time when Im not this tired.

Yeah I know its not definitive. But you just started saying I couldn't discount it when really it didnt matter if I did or not. Allthough I think I did but there comes the oro vs jiraya thingy and Im not getting into that 'cause frankly Im tired of this arguing. Allthough this is good for killing time.

 

[tacobelt]

by other people you mean who?

specialization, like naruto has rasengan shuriken that would pretty much rip you apart or kazuku launches jutsus, itachi has amaterasu, pain has all those different skills, sasuke chidori blade + the rest

in most of orochimarus fight he relies on his regeneration/sword fight and snake bites. he is more of a slowly wear you down type of fighter.

 

[c0c0]

hold up dont be dissin orochimaru while im around...
-the guy basically invents his own jutsu so can live longer
-then he can resurrect other powerful shinodi to fight 4 him
-then he kicks jairaya an tsunadae a55
-kill the 3rd
-takes on naruto in 4th tail mode

an no matter wat u do...U JUST CANT KILL THE GUY!!!!!!....TALK BOUT PERSISTENCE

 

[Schmack]

Okay I didnt mean it like that. Only point is that I compare those character in the same timeline. Maybe Im not still getting it dunno, but yeah I'll think it another time when Im not this tired.

Yeah I know its not definitive. But you just started saying I couldn't discount it when really it didnt matter if I did or not. Allthough I think I did but there comes the oro vs jiraya thingy and Im not getting into that 'cause frankly Im tired of this arguing. Allthough this is good for killing time.

then why didn't you tell me earlier? we could do without all these posts in one thread. and time has nothing to do with it still because we're not comparing who's stronger than who at what point of time but o well.

discount what? you can't discount a quote from manga unless it's proven wrong. you can discount my argument all you want as long as you provide good evidence and it would lead to a good debate. but you can't just discount a manga quote cuz it was 3 years ago.

 

[Schmack]

specialization, like naruto has rasengan shuriken that would pretty much rip you apart or kazuku launches jutsus, itachi has amaterasu, pain has all those different skills, sasuke chidori blade + the rest

in most of orochimarus fight he relies on his regeneration/sword fight and snake bites. he is more of a slowly wear you down type of fighter.

that's true. he had like a million unnamed jutsus but none of them were extraordinary except iwr. he was a very strong ninja tho.

 

[BananaAssassin]

then why didn't you tell me earlier? we could do without all these posts in one thread. and time has nothing to do with it still because we're not comparing who's stronger than who at what point of time but o well.

discount what? you can't discount a quote from manga unless it's proven wrong. you can discount my argument all you want as long as you provide good evidence and it would lead to a good debate. but you can't just discount a manga quote cuz it was 3 years ago.

Well maybe I cant. I just meant that lot has probably happen after that but then again I dont have proof. My only evidence is that in statbook Jiraya is higher than Orochimaru so that would make the quote quite meaningless 'cause we dont know if Kisame would've said the same thing about Orochimaru. Although I doubt that he would said he could take on orochimaru but still worth arguing but not now.

It's really quite funny for me to argue about this 'cause u know I dont think that kisame could beat oro but I had to argue still 'cause sounded like u where just yelling stuff but I guess u know what ur talking about so I'll leave it then.

 

[Schmack]

Well maybe I cant. I just meant that lot has probably happen after that but then again I dont have proof. My only evidence is that in statbook Jiraya is higher than Orochimaru so that would make the quote quite meaningless 'cause we dont know if Kisame would've said the same thing about Orochimaru. Although I doubt that he would said he could take on orochimaru but still worth arguing but not now.

It's really quite funny for me to argue about this 'cause u know I dont think that kisame could beat oro but I had to argue still 'cause sounded like u where just yelling stuff but I guess u know what ur talking about so I'll leave it then.

i never had anything definitive from the beginning since i'm nothing but a reader and a fan, just like you. and i don't want to get into the whole jiraiya vs orochimaru either cuz i agree with you that jiraiya's stronger than orochimaru but it's not certain since the two have never went all out in a battle.

and i wasn't really shouting stuff out. i merely wanted to see what the other people think. i never tried to force anyone to believe that oro>kisame. everyone is entitled to their own opinion and i was just looking for a good debate. while it was tiring and at times frustrating, i enjoyed this argument with you and thanks buddy for this enjoyment. it was good time killing on a boring afternoon.

 

[NewKageism]

Good debate good debate!

 

[BananaAssassin]

i never had anything definitive from the beginning since i'm nothing but a reader and a fan, just like you. and i don't want to get into the whole jiraiya vs orochimaru either cuz i agree with you that jiraiya's stronger than orochimaru but it's not certain since the two have never went all out in a battle.

and i wasn't really shouting stuff out. i merely wanted to see what the other people think. i never tried to force anyone to believe that oro>kisame. everyone is entitled to their own opinion and i was just looking for a good debate. while it was tiring and at times frustrating, i enjoyed this argument with you and thanks buddy for this enjoyment. it was good time killing on a boring afternoon.

Yeap same for u it was nice to argue for once this long and it killed time nicely as clock is here 4:00 AM so Im little bit tired though ..
But as a conclusion all those dudes Oro,Kisame,Jiraya are badasses and hope we get to see them battle each other sometime in the future so we dont have to speculate! IWR is great thing : D

 

[mustafagrbz]

I am not a Oro fan boy but discussing with haters is just pointless.You keep saying that he is weak against proofs like he is a part of an organization called Akatsuki which includes strongest ninjas in the world despite kage s ofc+maybe he has not some fancy jutsu s but his skill,intelligence and experience acknowlegded amongst even akatsuki and if he didnt do his crazy experiments and be creepy 3rd said that he would announce him as 4th hokage which is basicly is a proof that he is not weak

 

[Cfighter]

would a push over be able to taunt a 4 tailed Naruto? ...I think not

 

[Itachi Namikaze]

during his fight with the 3rd, no. He had just taken a new body so he wasn't sick at the time and he hadn't had his arms sealed yet, he was staying back and letting the hokages do most of the fighting, mostly for psychological revenge againest the 3rd for not picking him to be the 4th hokage.

edit: he also didn't know about reaper death seal so he didn't think the 3rd could do squat to him or the IWR hokages.

(and you guys argueing over ABC logic, itachi still beats naruto and without help/info/hinata jumping in and pain needing to take naruto alive, Pain>naruto as well.)

Actually Oro was almost at the end of his 3 years for that body remember? That's why he needed Sasuke's body so soon afterwards. So he probably wasn't full power then.