Do you think Kishi made an improvement on his depiction of women?

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FuriouslAngel

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Kishimoto failed Sakura's character the moment he let her marry Sasuke.

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^^ The same guy who did this shit. And on top of that, he stated that Sakura has no reason to love him and they might not be happy together :lmao:
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Made in Heaven

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They didn't say it was "negative" or "pathetic"
Those are the exact words Bad Touch Yakushi used to describe them. Are your reading skills this good all the time?

but it does continue to portray them as the very same love sick puppies they always have been.
The phrase "love sick puppy" comes with the connotation of being submissive, depending their happiness on their lovers, and being blinded by one's love interest. This phrase does not at all apply for Hinata.

Hinata has stood up to Naruto in the Bolt anime and Chapter 615. Hence, not submissive.

Hinata has shown to be able move past Naruto, as in The Last she was able to let go of him when she thought he loved someone else. Hence, not dependent.

Hinata has shown to make decisions that go against her love, like abandoning Naruto right after he confessed to go save Hanabi. Hence, she is not blinded by love.


Nothing changed for her.

Hinata went from this to this.

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From this to this

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From this to this

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Meanwhile, Sakura is the exact same person she was back in chapter 3... more or less.
She gets slightly stronger over time, but her entire character and development is based on "Naruto-kun" Just as sakura is based on "Sasuke-kun".
And yet Hinata has her Hyuga Clan plot as well. :lol You Sakura fans are so aware how bad she is that the best you can do is try and drag Hinata down to her level.
 
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chaos control

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Final war arc was the WORST outing for female leads. The Tsuki no Me dreams posed them as lovesick puppies. Hinata and Sakura have their most pathetic moments in the final war arc against Madara. Kaguya is terrible.

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But then you have the likes of Tsunade pummelling a great fight against a sexist, elitist Madara and Ino earning her stripes on the final battlefield. The final Final Fantasy boss being a female is also notable. And then SARADA. Who is a perfect example of a female lead.

In short: Kishimoto is GREAT at his secondary female cast, badassery & vulnerability- he wrote them with respect as people. something he never afforded Sakura & Hinata.

I agree with you except for the statement that Kaguya is terrible. Kaguya was great in my opinion, but I do agree that Sakura and Hinata ( even for as much as I like Hinata) should have been done better.
 

BlazeRelease

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Those are the exact words Bad Touch Yakushi used to describe them. Are your reading skills this good all the time?



The phrase "love sick puppy" comes with the connotation of being submissive, depending their happiness on their lovers, and being blinded by one's love interest. This phrase does not at all apply for Hinata.

Hinata has stood up to Naruto in the Bolt anime and Chapter 615. Hence, not submissive.

Hinata has shown to be able move past Naruto, as in The Last she was able to let go of him when she thought he loved someone else. Hence, not dependent.

Hinata has shown to make decisions that go against her love, like abandoning Naruto right after he confessed to go save Hanabi. Hence, she is not blinded by love.





Hinata went from this to this.

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From this to this

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From this to this

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Meanwhile, Sakura is the exact same person she was back in chapter 3... more or less.


And yet Hinata has her Hyuga Clan plot as well. :lol You Sakura fans are so aware how bad she is that the best you can do is try and drag Hinata down to her level.
Your entire post was to discredit my claim that she was submissive, but I said "love sick puppy" and you merely assumed that meant submissive. I did not intend that to mean anything other than she is constantly pining for him. Just as sakura is for sasuke.

My point was every single piece of Hinatas development was leading her closer to Naruto and that is it. She never became stronger because of herself, or because of anyone else... only Naruto. If she was ever shown, she would 99% of the time end up saying or thinking about Naruto and crediting HIM for HER growth.

I am not saying she did not develop, I am saying that everything about her was always linked towards her love for him, and that is not strong development.

Better than sakura for damn sure, but still a PRIME EXAMPLE of kishi stamping the main females as nothing but love interests.

Prove me wrong. And stop jumping to conclusions about my words and posting walls disproving things that were not said.

And how dare you call me a sakura fan :devil::(
 

JStar King

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That doesn't matter. It's still garbage and for people to be dumb enough to ship this abusive sack of shit pairing astounds me :lol

This ship has done nothing, but shit on Sakura's character. She lacks self-respect, common sense, and has no reason to love Sasuke at all.

How anyone can be happy with someone who shits on them reminds of why I've lost my faith in humanity.
 
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Team7monaa

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That doesn't matter. It's still garbage and for people to be dumb enough to ship this abusive sack of shit pairing astounds me :lol

This ship has done nothing, but shit on Sakura's character. She lacks self-respect, common sense, and has no reason to love Sasuke at all.

How anyone can be happy with someone who shits on them reminds of why I've lost my faith in humanity.
Love is irrational, we don’t truly know why Sakura loves Sasuke but all we know is that there bond together grew stronger as they became a team and Sakura fell for him. Sasuke was literally mentally unstable whenever he attempted to harm Sakura so it’s invalid as **** because Naruto literally went through 10x more and lost an arm for him, when it’s a man it’s fine but whenever it’s a woman doing it it’s a lack of self-respect?

She was 12 and wanted to prove she was worth his time. So when he left, she went off the deep end with Naruto, thanks to his even more strong obsession.

Instead of letting him go, she thought she could save him. (Which is probably an a node to her strong will) Not just in a physical sense, but emotional. That’s why before the last battle between Naruto and Sasuke when Kakashi reminded Sasuke of Sakura’s love he reminisces his family. It’s just that due to Sakura’s lack of backstory and involvement to the plot her love was depicted more.

Don’t even tell me that Kishimoto failed her by putting her with Sasuke because if she went with another male the fandom would go into a meltdown and start mocking her.
 
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Tyrance sasuke

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Love is irrational, we don’t truly know why Sakura loves Sasuke but all we know is that there bond together grew stronger as they became a team and Sakura fell for him. Sasuke was literally mentally unstable whenever he attempted to harm Sakura so it’s invalid as **** because Naruto literally went through 10x more and lost an arm for him, when it’s a man it’s fine but whenever it’s a woman doing it it’s a lack of self-respect?

She was 12 and wanted to prove she was worth his time. So when he left, she went off the deep end with Naruto, thanks to his even more strong obsession.

Instead of letting him go, she thought she could save him. (Which is probably an a node to her strong will) Not just in a physical sense, but emotional. That’s why before the last battle between Naruto and Sasuke when Kakashi reminded Sasuke of Sakura’s love he reminisces his family. It’s just that due to Sakura’s lack of backstory and involvement to the plot her love was depicted more.

Don’t even tell me that Kishimoto failed her by putting her with Sasuke because if she went with another male the fandom would go into a meltdown and start mocking her.
If she went with naruto, she wouldnt be mocked. She is being mocked as of now. Naruto × Sakura was sensible and deserved working hard for. The other pair came outta nowhere. Hinata x Naruto is an epic fail. Naruto never had any feelings for her. I agree love is irrational, like who the hell loves someone for personality and stuff...that's unrealistic, everyone falls for good looking guys despite rotten personality, bad manners and stuff like that. If anything, hyuga fans should realize hinata × naruto was fail pairing more than Sasuke × Sakura ever was.
 

New Dawn

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Not really. Especially Sakura & Hinata. Both submissive & useless. IE) Sakura's constant abuse by Sasuke & Hinata tripping and getting slammed by Pein. Some female characters who are written well include Tsunade, Konan & Temari. So it seems Kishi can write female characters but he can't write them well when they're in a romantic relationship.
 

InfiniteMugen

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No not really, it got slightly better MAYBE. The boruto writers on the other hand(despite saradas outfit in the manga) have already done a much better job with the female characters so far
 

JStar King

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Love is irrational, we don’t truly know why Sakura loves Sasuke but all we know is that there bond together grew stronger as they became a team and Sakura fell for him. Sasuke was literally mentally unstable whenever he attempted to harm Sakura so it’s invalid as **** because Naruto literally went through 10x more and lost an arm for him, when it’s a man it’s fine but whenever it’s a woman doing it it’s a lack of self-respect?

She was 12 and wanted to prove she was worth his time. So when he left, she went off the deep end with Naruto, thanks to his even more strong obsession.

Instead of letting him go, she thought she could save him. (Which is probably an a node to her strong will) Not just in a physical sense, but emotional. That’s why before the last battle between Naruto and Sasuke when Kakashi reminded Sasuke of Sakura’s love he reminisces his family. It’s just that due to Sakura’s lack of backstory and involvement to the plot her love was depicted more.

Don’t even tell me that Kishimoto failed her by putting her with Sasuke because if she went with another male the fandom would go into a meltdown and start mocking her.
Kishimoto stated she has no reason to love him. It's nothing but lust. Sakura has no self-respect and is now married to someone who neglects and only cares about his self-interests.

And on top, Kishimoto said they might not be happy :lol
 
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JStar King

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If she went with naruto, she wouldnt be mocked. She is being mocked as of now. Naruto × Sakura was sensible and deserved working hard for. The other pair came outta nowhere. Hinata x Naruto is an epic fail. Naruto never had any feelings for her. I agree love is irrational, like who the hell loves someone for personality and stuff...that's unrealistic, everyone falls for good looking guys despite rotten personality, bad manners and stuff like that. If anything, hyuga fans should realize hinata × naruto was fail pairing more than Sasuke × Sakura ever was.
Show me a scan of Naruto trying to kill Hinata 3 times and treating her like trash throughout the series and I'll agree.

I'll wait :coffee:
 

Tyrance sasuke

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Show me a scan of Naruto trying to kill Hinata 3 times and treating her like trash throughout the series and I'll agree.

I'll wait :coffee:
Well, he didn't sprout a bit of feeling for her as a girl, even after she almost died protecting him so where is the whole "devolopment" bs, hyuga fans like to pull?
 

JStar King

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Well, he didn't sprout a bit of feeling for her as a girl, even after she almost died protecting him so where is the whole "devolopment" bs, hyuga fans like to pull?
Did you forget he went berserk after seeing Hinata die during the Pein fight? :lol

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Regardless. Give me what I've asked for. Show me the scans of Naruto trying to kill Hinata 3 times and treating her like garbage the same way Sasuke did to Sakura.

I'll wait :lol
 
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salamander uchiha

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Did you forget he went berserk after seeing Hinata die during the Pein fight? :lol

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Regardless. Give me what I've asked for. Show me the scans of Naruto trying to kill Hinata 3 times and treating her like garbage the same way Sasuke did to Sakura.

I'll wait :lol
That wasn't because of love or feelings for Hinata, but because Naruto felt despair at being powerless to help her.
 

Tyrance sasuke

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Did you forget he went berserk after seeing Hinata die during the Pein fight? :lol

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Regardless. Give me what I've asked for. Show me the scans of Naruto trying to kill Hinata 3 times and treating her like garbage the same way Sasuke did to Sakura.

I'll wait :lol
Hinata was dead according to naruto. If kiba had died he would've reacted that way. If lee had died he would've reacted that way. Not because he had any special feelings for her. If he really had it, he would've shown it towards the war arc, but did he? Not one bit. His true love was always sakura and the director completely destroyed naruto's devolopment and placed with someone he only liked as a friend. There is no proof from my part of naruto treating hinata like garbage. It's just that naruto series doesn't think of Sasuke's doing as very "evil". Orochimaru is lavishly spending his remaining years in the village, which he chose to destroy. He is friends with the same sasuke whom he tried to possess. Whom itachi tried ridding off of sasuke. Naruto completely forgot about how obito tried killing him as a child and created the nine tails incident which caused his terrible childhood. People like kakashi were the type of guy who would abandon comrades for the sake of mission. Not different from what sasuke tried doing to sakura. In narutoverse, killing and cruelty are in the same rank as brushing teeth. Everyone become cruel at some point, which is the typical argument, hyuga fans use to lowball saskura relationship. Itachi killed the entire clan over village protection, sasuke forgived him. Hiruzen, who was known as the nicest hokage, lost hope and agreed to the persecution of the uchiha. See the pattern? There's no such thing as a difference between good and bad in narutoverse, its all a menial matter, if it was even serious to begin with.
 

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That wasn't because of love or feelings for Hinata, but because Naruto felt despair at being powerless to help her.
Still, he went berserk after seeing her die. Of course, Naruto was an idiot when it came to that.

But in The Last, he soon realized her feelings even after she decided giving up on him during the Genjutsu.
 

JStar King

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Show the scans for naruto's feelings towards hinata. None right?
So what you're saying is that you can't provide the scans? How obvious :lol

Instead, you gotta go off topic as in reference of what you said about SS being better than NH, which is a plain lie in the first place unless you can show me scans of Naruto treating Hinata worse than Sasuke did to Sakura :)
 
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