No the skill required for Kaiten is gentle fist. That's why Tenten mentions the fact that Neji is a
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of it and the db states Kaiten is an application of gentle fist. And yet Hinata uses gentle fist but could not do Kaiten. See what i mean?
Hinata cannot use kaiten or she would have used it against juubi firing mokuton spikes like both neji and hiashi.On other hands sakura's case is totally different she has ces wan kicking from leg or lifting things are just application of it .She only needs to kick or lift
You say the underlined like its some fact stated in the manga or db. Concentration of chakra in the fists is not enhancement of strength. Kishi makes that clear not
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but
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. No matter how you spin it, lifting things require body strength. And that's something the technique Sakura uses doesn't grant.
Poison mist and Chakra enhanced strength have zero correlation lmao
Its shizune's jutsu and we don't know how much shizune taught that to sakura.on other hand tsunade's skill and jutsu sakura directly recieved in form of ces and yin seal.Next you are gioing to argue sakura cannot heal from susanoo blade stabbed in her like tsunade or enhance power of ohnoki's jinton
No man...look at the requirements. Sakura should in fact be able to do poison fog but because she hasn't shown it, she doesn't have it. As far as i know, this section doesn't work on speculations but actual feats. Despite Neji being > Hinata, training and being chill with Hiashi, you can't enter a debate with just that and claim Neji can use lion fists can you?
I made a mistake mentioning pathway derangement before btw..that should require lightning release.
That is when she notices when Naruto is in trouble.
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That is when she appears.
So yes. Off panel obviously because her travel wasn't shown on panel. Idk what you are trying to pull here but no, you don't see the entire area where she could've approached from thus this feat did not happen. The 3rd DB ends right before Pain's attack. Hinata has a 2.5. That's below average. Common sense alone would tell you that Hinata is not fast enough to clear a distance equal to half the size of the village in an instant. :lol
Learn to read who le explanation rather than cherry picking the parts that suits your explanation [
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"normally chakra emitted from single point is difficult to control.Even jounins can utile chakra from single part of body at a time but" then she goes on to say what you posted.
Neither hinata is a master of gentle fist struggling to pull off a jutsu neji did in part 1 in chunin exam nor she has chakra Control superior to jounins
yes the go and read the whole part what databook says :lol not just its an application.On other hand sakura kicking will require only what she does with hands and lifting same what she does while lifting normally.If base naruto can do it.she can too
KEKKEI GENKAI; Taijutsu: Hakkeshou Kaiten (Titanic Revolution* of the Eight Trigrams Palm)
User: Hyuuga Neji
Defensive; Close range; Rank: none
Main text
A taijutsu where one releases a large amount of chakra from their body's chakra openings to catch the blows from an enemy's attacks, while making one's body spin to repel them. A secret transmitted by oral tradition within the Hyuuga's Main House, though Hyuuga Neji came up with it own his own, despite him being from the Branch House. It stands in the same league as Gaara's Sand as an ultimate protection, and was even called "the other Absolute Defense". This is the high grade taijutsu that made Neji's prodigious talent known during the Chuunin exam.
Caption
-An application of Juuken, the other "Absolute Defense"!!
Picture comment
-The Byakugan's near-360° field of vision perceives the enemy's attack, and here comes the Kaiten...!!
You say the underlined like its some fact stated in the manga or db. Concentration of chakra in the fists is not enhancement of strength. Kishi makes that clear not
Becoz you have inability to understand or grasp something becoz you are too biased does not mean everyone is
damn man that comprehension that you ignore entry of ces repeteadly but take entry of 64 palms for granted
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Konoha Thousand Leaves Collection #24
It would seem Tsunade's "outrageous strength" completely ignores the laws of nature!! The challenge to common sense that is her power is due in no small part to her artful chakra control and fine-tuning. To give things a name, by instantly collecting chakra into her fist and fingers, she obtains a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve.
Caption
-Here's to a painful and bitter end! Such is Tsunade-hime's insane, "Legendary", power!!
Picture comments
-One finger, and Naruto cannot close in on her. And she can handle Gamabunta's huge dosu** with absurd ease...?!
-The kind of might that opens craters into the ground in one blow!!
Lemme see who is trying to spin it when there is cold hearted fact Fukasaku asking naruto lift a large statue first using ninjutsu chakra [
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]then using senjutsu chakra mixed with it [
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you just don't want to admit thus you are beating around the bush.another example being You arguing for hinata's speed making laughable points things that happened off screen :lol
No man...look at the requirements. Sakura should in fact be able to do poison fog but because she hasn't shown it, she doesn't have it.
Yes man please go look at the requirement will help us all
As this techniques combines ninjutsu, chemistry, and medical knowledge, using it requires fine chakra control and advanced ability in medical ninjutsu.
and CES is a jutsu sakura utilises Poison mist is not literally no correlation
its exactly like sakura not having Body pathway derangement since she lacks raiton
As far as i know, this section doesn't work on speculations but actual feats. Despite Neji being > Hinata, training and being chill with Hiashi, you can't enter a debate with just that and claim Neji can use lion fists can you?
I made a mistake mentioning pathway derangement before btw..that should require lightning release.
TLF for Neji's case is different since he has not shown it and its main branch jutsu which he is not allowed to learn.Him learning main branch jutsu were based on his own skills and talents which you can't apply in this case
That is when she notices when Naruto is in trouble.
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That is when she appears.
So yes. Off panel obviously because her travel wasn't shown on panel. Idk what you are trying to pull here but no, you don't see the entire area where she could've approached from thus this feat did not happen. The 3rd DB ends right before Pain's attack. Hinata has a 2.5. That's below average. Common sense alone would tell you that Hinata is not fast enough to clear a distance equal to half the size of the village in an instant. :lol
Yes..and between her last appearance in page 3, Pain inserts 5 more rods in Naruto and
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before she appears. But i'm not referring to her starting position. The innermost crater was leveled and we see to the edge of the crater in the direction she comes from in the scan before she appears. There is no off panel between pages 7 and 8. [
Learn to read who le explanation rather than cherry picking the parts that suits your explanation [
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]
"normally chakra emitted from single point is difficult to control.Even jounins can utile chakra from single part of body at a time but" then she goes on to say what you posted.
Neither hinata is a master of gentle fist struggling to pull off a jutsu neji did in part 1 in chunin exam nor she has chakra Control superior to jounins
yes the go and read the whole part what databook says :lol not just its an application.On other hand sakura kicking will require only what she does with hands and lifting same what she does while lifting normally.If base naruto can do it.she can too
KEKKEI GENKAI; Taijutsu: Hakkeshou Kaiten (Titanic Revolution* of the Eight Trigrams Palm)
User: Hyuuga Neji
Defensive; Close range; Rank: none
Main text
A taijutsu where one releases a large amount of chakra from their body's chakra openings to catch the blows from an enemy's attacks, while making one's body spin to repel them. A secret transmitted by oral tradition within the Hyuuga's Main House, though Hyuuga Neji came up with it own his own, despite him being from the Branch House. It stands in the same league as Gaara's Sand as an ultimate protection, and was even called "the other Absolute Defense". This is the high grade taijutsu that made Neji's prodigious talent known during the Chuunin exam.
Caption
-An application of Juuken, the other "Absolute Defense"!!
Picture comment
-The Byakugan's near-360° field of vision perceives the enemy's attack, and here comes the Kaiten...!!
lol..then why is it that the same thing stated in Tsunade's db is repeated for Sakura in another db but Kishi goes out of his way to reiterate the fact it doesn't grant super strength not once but twice? I've asked this countless times but every time you take me back to Tsunade's db instead. Sakura is not Tsunade man and you can't enhance strength by collecting chakra in the fists except that is what you believe?
And biased? What.. against Sakura? :lol Need i remind you in that other thread i was arguing for Sakura?
Lemme see who is trying to spin it when there is cold hearted fact Fukasaku asking naruto lift a large statue first using ninjutsu chakra [
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]then using senjutsu chakra mixed with it [
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]
you just don't want to admit thus you are beating around the bush.another example being You arguing for hinata's speed making laughable points things that happened off screen :lol
So in other words, Naruto channeled chakra into his fists to try to leave that statue and also since he was able to enhance his strength with chakra, he'll be able to lift Bunta's tanto despite being unable to make that statue move an inch right? :lol
Yes man please go look at the requirement will help us all
and CES is a jutsu sakura utilises Poison mist is not literally no correlation
its exactly like sakura not having Body pathway derangement since she lacks raiton
lmao...did you just put chemistry in bold as a requirement Sakura doesn't have? Come on man..be realistic. I shouldn't have to be proving that is wrong.
Still we give 64 palms and TLF to hiashi :lol
TLF for Neji's case is different since he has not shown it and its main branch jutsu which he is not allowed to learn.Him learning main branch jutsu were based on his own skills and talents which you can't apply in this case
If these techniques are taught only in the main branch and Hiashi is the only main branch character we've ever seen teach, then one would realize he has these techniques. Something you yourself would have realized if you calmed your tits and read to understand.
Yes..and between her last appearance in page 3, Pain inserts 5 more rods in Naruto and
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before she appears. But i'm not referring to her starting position. The innermost crater was leveled and we see to the edge of the crater in the direction she comes from in the scan before she appears. There is no off panel between pages 7 and 8. [
No, you don't see where she could've appeared from. She could've easily come from any of these directions.
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Naruto is facing towards a direction that leads off panel.
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is where she appeared from.
You seriously need to stop if you are going to ignore parts of my post. You've made it pretty clear that you'll make excuse after excuse to try and push this point even though your point is wrong and other pieces of evidence show that you are wrong. This Hinata is canonically not faster than Sakura even before the Yin Seal. Sakura has a 3 in speed. Hinata has a 2.5. Someone with below average speed is not clearing half the village in an instant. Why are you trying to debate facts using off panel feats no less?
And yes, that is off panel. Do you even know what off panel means? Even if what you were saying made sense, every panel between the showing of the crater and Hinata's appearance is panel time where her travel was not shown. Hence "Off Panel".
Like I said, let it go. You are clearly grasping at straws or prolonging this argument just for the fun of it.
No, you don't see where she could've appeared from. She could've easily come from any of these directions.
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Naruto is facing towards a direction that leads off panel.
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is where she appeared from.
You seriously need to stop if you are going to ignore parts of my post. You've made it pretty clear that you'll make excuse after excuse to try and push this point even though your point is wrong and other pieces of evidence show that you are wrong. This Hinata is canonically not faster than Sakura even before the Yin Seal. Sakura has a 3 in speed. Hinata has a 2.5. Someone with below average speed is not clearing half the village in an instant. Why are you trying to debate facts using off panel feats no less?
And yes, that is off panel. Do you even know what off panel means? Even if what you were saying made sense, every panel between the showing of the crater and Hinata's appearance is panel time where her travel was not shown. Hence "Off Panel".
Like I said, let it go. You are clearly grasping at straws or prolonging this argument just for the fun of it.
Those directions you pointed out don't correlate with Naruto's vision. If she was coming from behind or Deva's left, then there wouldn't have been reason for her to shift onto his right. Naruto's view obviously captures Deva's right so i'm not sure what you're referring to as off panel.
There is no pause in events between pages 7 and 8 and if she was close, she would have appeared in the panel you posted. But she wasn't. And she isn't just going to magically appear when the debris around her suggests she got there possibly using body flicker.
And i am not comparing with Sakura..this part broke off of my asking if Hinata would have been able to evade spikes nothing more.
Those directions you pointed out don't correlate with Naruto's vision. If she was coming from behind or Deva's left, then there wouldn't have been reason for her to shift onto his right. Naruto's view obviously captures Deva's right so i'm not sure what you're referring to as off panel.
There is no pause in events between pages 7 and 8 and if she was close, she would have appeared in the panel you posted. But she wasn't. And she isn't just going to magically appear when the debris around her suggests she got there possibly using body flicker.
And i am not comparing with Sakura..this part broke off of my asking if Hinata would have been able to evade spikes nothing more.
What are you on about? Read this, and respond accordingly this time.
And yes, that is off panel. Do you even know what off panel means? Even if what you were saying made sense, every panel between the showing of the crater and Hinata's appearance is panel time where her travel was not shown. Hence "Off Panel".
What is this "pause of events" stuff you keep talking about? That has literally not a thing to do with something being off panel or not so stop bringing it up. Was Hinata's travel shown on panel? No, thus it is off panel.
You can believe whatever you want about this scene. Doesn't change the fact that Sakura is faster than Hinata at this point in time and that is where and why you were making that nonsense comparison with the spikes in the first place, and don't try to say that you weren't.
According to you, Sakura was too slow to dodge the spikes thus anyone slower than her fails too, and Hinata falls under that umbrella.
And goes on to skip the fact it requires expelling of chakra from all the body that requires chakra control superior to jounins that hinata does not have and complete mastery of jyuuken that again hinata does not have
lol..then why is it that the same thing stated in Tsunade's db is repeated for Sakura in another db but Kishi goes out of his way to reiterate the fact it doesn't grant super strength not once but twice? I've asked this countless times but every time you take me back to Tsunade's db instead.
It would seem Tsunade's "outrageous strength" completely ignores the laws of nature!! The challenge to common sense that is her power is due in no small part to her artful chakra control and fine-tuning. To give things a name, by instantly collecting chakra into her fist and fingers, she obtains a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve.
Caption
-Here's to a painful and bitter end! Such is Tsunade-hime's insane, "Legendary", power!!
Picture comments
-One finger, and Naruto cannot close in on her. And she can handle Gamabunta's huge dosu** with absurd ease...?!
-The kind of might that opens craters into the ground in one blow!!
Its hilarious when you realise both credit chakra as basis of their strength
@bold kishi never said it was not superstrength.It only stated what it is.An adaptation of medical ninjutsu using chakra unlike superhuman strength that other chars have shown
Sakura is not Tsunade man and you can't enhance strength by collecting chakra in the fists except that is what you believe?
No one said they are.Sakura and tsunade just use the same jutsu.How the hell do you think sakura learn her so called superstrength oh wait from tsunade
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And biased? What.. against Sakura? :lol Need i remind you in that other thread i was arguing for Sakura?
Oh sure seeing how dumb you arguments are i can now safely that you are just desperately trying to troll
So in other words, Naruto channeled chakra into his fists to try to leave that statue and also since he was able to enhance his strength with chakra, he'll be able to lift Bunta's tanto despite being unable to make that statue move an inch right? :lol
Are you that dumb or are trying to act like one.Base Naruto is not tsunade or sakura nor his chakra control is delicate and precise like them thus he cannot lift the either the boulder or the sword.Even Medical ninja's like shizune cannot use CES since it require very delicate chakra control with fine tuning.
But since adding senjutsu increases chakra potency by multiple times he can lift it the stature or giant rhino when he adds it to his ninjutsu chakra
His lifting is still chakra based so this what you are blabbering is just asinine nonsense
"you can't enhance strength by collecting chakra in the fists "
lmao...did you just put chemistry in bold as a requirement Sakura doesn't have? Come on man..be realistic. I shouldn't have to be proving that is wrong.
Becoz we don't know how good she is with it.Same case despite having good chakra control and medical ninjutsu shizune couldn't learn Yin seal :lol
If these techniques are taught only in the main branch and Hiashi is the only main branch character we've ever seen teach, then one would realize he has these techniques. Something you yourself would have realized if you calmed your tits and read to understand.
If you calmed you tits down and stop spmming crap you will realise i never claimed hiashi cannot do those jutsu.Your asinine crap logic that you are trying to apply on sakura applies on hiashi in the same way meaning he cannot have those jutsu :lol
What is this "pause of events" stuff you keep talking about? That has literally not a thing to do with something being off panel or not so stop bringing it up. Was Hinata's travel shown on panel? No, thus it is off panel.
You can believe whatever you want about this scene. Doesn't change the fact that Sakura is faster than Hinata at this point in time and that is where and why you were making that nonsense comparison with the spikes in the first place, and don't try to say that you weren't.
According to you, Sakura was too slow to dodge the spikes thus anyone slower than her fails too, and Hinata falls under that umbrella.
So if i try to get what you're saying clearly, because Hinata is not shown travelling despite the fact we see all the way to the edge of the crater in the direction she came from means she probably traveled slowly?
Serious question...what is your opinion on how she got there then? I won't be replying after this.
And goes on to skip the fact it requires expelling of chakra from all the body [/b]that requires chakra control superior to jounins[/B] that hinata does not have and complete mastery of jyuuken that again hinata does not have
The bold is wrong. You would be implying CE Neji's cc is > jounins who can't do rotation..and that happens to be all Jounin. Expelling chakra from all tenketsu is an application of Gentle fist.
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Its hilarious when you realise both credit chakra as basis of their strength
@bold kishi never said it was not superstrength.It only stated what it is.An adaptation of medical ninjutsu using chakra unlike superhuman strength that other chars have shown
"Though generally considered to be superhuman strength". Ask yourself what that means.
And please explain how chakra that is collected in the body and concentrated in its entirety in the fist would now leave and strengthen the muscles.
No one said they are.Sakura and tsunade just use the same jutsu.How the hell do you think sakura learn her so called superstrength oh wait from tsunade
lol what? The way you are quick to insult is funny af man xD
Are you that dumb or are trying to act like one.Base Naruto is not tsunade or sakura nor his chakra control is delicate and precise like them thus he cannot lift the either the boulder or the sword.Even Medical ninja's like shizune cannot use CES since it require very delicate chakra control with fine tuning.
But since adding senjutsu increases chakra potency by multiple times he can lift it the stature or giant rhino when he adds it to his ninjutsu chakra
His lifting is still chakra based so this what you are blabbering is just asinine nonsense
"you can't enhance strength by collecting chakra in the fists "
The bold is correct. Which is why when Naruto tries to lift with normal chakra, he showed precise cc isn't needed to enhance strength. If it required precise cc on Sakura and Tsunade's level, he would have pointed that out :lol
Tsunade is naturally strong..Sakura isn't :lol
Becoz we don't know how good she is with it.Same case despite having good chakra control and medical ninjutsu shizune couldn't learn Yin seal :lol
Oh but we do.. She was the only one able to mix the right stuff to help counter the remaining toxins in Kankuro's system trumping the experienced Chiyo :lol
If you calmed you tits down and stop spmming crap you will realise i never claimed hiashi cannot do those jutsu.Your asinine crap logic that you are trying to apply on sakura applies on hiashi in the same way meaning he cannot have those jutsu :lol
Gold xD
But if you reread our posts, you would see i said the view i'm applying to Sakura can't apply to Hiashi because its indirectly stated he has those techniques since he's the one that teaches them.
The bold is wrong. You would be implying CE Neji's cc is > jounins who can't do rotation..and that happens to be all Jounin. Expelling chakra from all tenketsu is an application of Gentle fist.
Can you read oh wait you can't you just try to read part of manga that suits your argument [
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][
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Neji being master of gentle fist makes his chakra control superior to jounins.Is hinata anywhere close nope has she shown anything close to nope.Just having shape transformation does not mean she has anything comparable what neji did in part 1 when konohaomaru has rasengan pinnacle of shape transformation.Part 1 naruto has the same
stop cherry picking :lol
"Though generally considered to be superhuman strength". Ask yourself what that means.
And please explain how chakra that is collected in the body and concentrated in its entirety in the fist would now leave and strengthen the muscles.
Hey dude how about you learn to read will help everyone man
do you really believe that line is saying she does not have superhuman strength or is it saying courage and ability to assess the situation is more important
lol what? The way you are quick to insult is funny af man xD
Then how about you read the whole part rather than cherry picking
The bold is correct. Which is why when Naruto tries to lift with normal chakra, he showed precise cc isn't needed to enhance strength. If it required precise cc on Sakura and Tsunade's level, he would have pointed that out :lol
I can keep posting you know.Its not hard for me to post same thing again
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Konoha Thousand Leaves Collection #24
It would seem Tsunade's "outrageous strength" completely ignores the laws of nature!! The challenge to common sense that is her power is due in no small part to her artful chakra control and fine-tuning. To give things a name, by instantly collecting chakra into her fist and fingers, she obtains a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve.
Caption
-Here's to a painful and bitter end! Such is Tsunade-hime's insane, "Legendary", power!!
Picture comments
-One finger, and Naruto cannot close in on her. And she can handle Gamabunta's huge dosu** with absurd ease...?!
-The kind of might that opens craters into the ground in one blow!!
Oh but we do.. She was the only one able to mix the right stuff to help counter the remaining toxins in Kankuro's system trumping the experienced Chiyo :lol
Her only skill where chemistry will apply is making antidote for sasori's poison thus we don't know how great she is with thus we can't give her a jutsu just like shizune can't be given CES
Gold xD
But if you reread our posts, you would see i said the view i'm applying to Sakura can't apply to Hiashi because its indirectly stated he has those techniques since he's the one that teaches them.
May I say that while CeS grants super human strength (it is fn enhanced strength), Sakura doesn't have it naturally. That is why she relies on CES.
I've been saving this quote for a long while now
In the Naruto verse enhanced strength is linked to chakra control. Every shinobi can use chakra control to mildly enhance their physical strength but when taken to the highest level with absolutely perfect and precise prowess in manipulating ones own chakra it's possible to achieve superhuman-levels of strength.
Tsunade is revered as one of the top greatest kunoichi that ever lived because of her knack for flawless chakra control which she fine tuned into her super strength as well as her vast knowledge and talent in medical ninjutsu.
Extremely high levels of chakra control aren't necessarily something that can be achieved through training it's one of those things somebody needs to be gifted with from birth. Sakura's talent for excellent chakra control was something that was touched upon with her several times throughout Part I and it's because of this that she was able to train under Tsunade to achieve the same abilities as her.
So if i try to get what you're saying clearly, because Hinata is not shown travelling despite the fact we see all the way to the edge of the crater in the direction she came from means she probably traveled slowly?
Serious question...what is your opinion on how she got there then? I won't be replying after this.
man seriously you don't know what off panel means or are you blatantly trolling :|
He is just saying the travelling was offpanel.Pain stabbed 6 rods inbetween those moment.Both panels of gai and his team and shika;shikaku etc were shown between it.Later on we have panel of shima screaming.Thus there was a large time for hinata to get to naruto.
she has quite load of time to appear from her position to naruto's.she has 2.5 in speed just before pain attacked meaning she is average or below average in speed so your point is again mooted out since anyone with good speed could have done what she did.Thus its not a speed feat
Then the point of her coming from left as Kidgamer pointed out that is based where naruto is facing [
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][
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] so she could have easily came from the area not being shown in panel
man seriously you don't know what off panel means or are you blatantly trolling :|
He is just saying the travelling was offpanel.Pain stabbed 6 rods inbetween those moment.Both panels of gai and his team and shika;shikaku etc were shown between it.Later on we have panel of shima screaming.Thus there was a large time for hinata to get to naruto.
she has quite load of time to appear from her position to naruto's.she has 2.5 in speed just before pain attacked meaning she is average or below average in speed so your point is again mooted out since anyone with good speed could have done what she did.Thus its not a speed feat
Then the point of her coming from left as Kidgamer pointed out that is based where naruto is facing [
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][
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] so she could have easily came from the area not being shown in panel
Can you read oh wait you can't you just try to read part of manga that suits your argument [
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][
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]
Neji being master of gentle fist makes his chakra control superior to jounins.Is hinata anywhere close nope has she shown anything close to nope.Just having shape transformation does not mean she has anything comparable what neji did in part 1 when konohaomaru has rasengan pinnacle of shape transformation.Part 1 naruto has the same
Interesting. You accuse me of cherry picking yet keep ignoring how Tenten caps it off. She could have gone ahead and said "But Neji can emit chakra from all his points" yet she doesn't say that. She mentions Gentle fist and so does the db which makes sense because without gentle fist, you won't be able to do rotation hence why those at the pinnacle can't do rotation.
Gentle fist is a requirement first then control. Konohamaru or part 1 Naruto being able to do rasengan doesn't change the fact it is an A ranked technique in terms of difficulty. :lol
Yes it means its natural superhuman strength like might guy it just chakra based [
Bro what? The only way this would make sense is if Sakura has been noted to have natural superhuman strength. Why would strength she doesn't have be referred to?
lemme say that you are blatant troll who only reads the part which suits his argument blatantly ignoring other parts
Why would a comparison be made with something she doesn't have?
I can keep posting you know.Its not hard for me to post same thing again
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Konoha Thousand Leaves Collection #24
It would seem Tsunade's "outrageous strength" completely ignores the laws of nature!! The challenge to common sense that is her power is due in no small part to her artful chakra control and fine-tuning. To give things a name, by instantly collecting chakra into her fist and fingers, she obtains a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve.
Caption
-Here's to a painful and bitter end! Such is Tsunade-hime's insane, "Legendary", power!!
Picture comments
-One finger, and Naruto cannot close in on her. And she can handle Gamabunta's huge dosu** with absurd ease...?!
-The kind of might that opens craters into the ground in one blow!!
Posting this doesn't answer the question though? Naruto did try to lift the statue by enhancing his strength which means precise cc isn't needed to enhance strength. Heck the db makes no mention of precise cc being needed to enhance strength.
Chakra
Accumulating chakra and forming seals to activate a jutsu!
The physical and mental energies from 130 million body cells, that is, chakra, are accumulated, and by performing seals, this energy is converted into a jutsu. If this sequence is performed impeccably, the jutsu is activated.
To activate jutsu other than taijutsu, basic chakra conversion is needed.
To put it plainly, chakra is what fuels a jutsu. The mental and physical energies of a shinobi’s body are joined together into stamina, which is internally converted into chakra, the energy source for a jutsu’s activation. The efficiency of this conversion is influenced by the user’s skill. Being able to efficiently convert stamina means a possibility to cast an even larger number of jutsu. In addition, chakra can be used to temporarily trigger some physical abilities. Thanks to this, shinobi can perform superhuman physical feats.
Yet Naruto wasn't able to make it at least budge...and definitely won't be able to lift that tanto.
Her only skill where chemistry will apply is making antidote for sasori's poison thus we don't know how great she is with thus we can't give her a jutsu just like shizune can't be given CES
man seriously you don't know what off panel means or are you blatantly trolling :|
He is just saying the travelling was offpanel.Pain stabbed 6 rods inbetween those moment.Both panels of gai and his team and shika;shikaku etc were shown between it.Later on we have panel of shima screaming.Thus there was a large time for hinata to get to naruto.
she has quite load of time to appear from her position to naruto's.she has 2.5 in speed just before pain attacked meaning she is average or below average in speed so your point is again mooted out since anyone with good speed could have done what she did.Thus its not a speed feat
Then the point of her coming from left as Kidgamer pointed out that is based where naruto is facing [
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][
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] so she could have easily came from the area not being shown in panel
Deva leveled Konoha with 3 distinct craters and all the other ninjas + debris were sent to the
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If you re-read, you'll see i am not talking about her travelling from debris section to Deva. I'm talking about travelling from the edge of the innermost crater (which we clearly see) to Pain.
Naruto is right there in front of Deva's feet and Deva's right hand where she came from is clearly in the panel.
Interesting. You accuse me of cherry picking yet keep ignoring how Tenten caps it off. She could have gone ahead and said "But Neji can emit chakra from all his points" yet she doesn't say that. She mentions Gentle fist and so does the db which makes sense because without gentle fist, you won't be able to do rotation hence why those at the pinnacle can't do rotation.
Gentle fist is a requirement first then control. Konohamaru or part 1 Naruto being able to do rasengan doesn't change the fact it is an A ranked technique in terms of difficulty. :lol
How stupid can you be.yes gentle fist is a requirement so is insane chakra control lmao
Next argument will be what since sasuke can use fireball jutsu he would be automatically be able to do every fire jutsu despite how differently they are used
No dude it just means shape transformation does not mean chakra control above jounins
Bro what? The only way this would make sense is if Sakura has been noted to have natural superhuman strength. Why would strength she doesn't have be referred to?
This exactly whats cherry picking is.Explicitly ignoring the new databook and the same databook that this is from and even first databook and then going on like broken record .This is what it is something you want to deny since it doesn't fit you argument lmao
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Konoha Thousand Leaves Collection #24
It would seem Tsunade's "outrageous strength" completely ignores the laws of nature!! The challenge to common sense that is her power is due in no small part to her artful chakra control and fine-tuning. To give things a name, by instantly collecting chakra into her fist and fingers, she obtains a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve.
Caption
-Here's to a painful and bitter end! Such is Tsunade-hime's insane, "Legendary", power!!
Picture comments
-One finger, and Naruto cannot close in on her. And she can handle Gamabunta's huge dosu** with absurd ease...?!
-The kind of might that opens craters into the ground in one blow!!
Next part that you completely ignored
"As for Superhuman Strength"
Why would a comparison be made with something she doesn't have?
Why won't it becoz she does not have.The lines explicitly means her strength is chakra based a jutsu that tsunade herself uses to punch;kick and lift aka 1st databook
Posting this doesn't answer the question though? Naruto did try to lift the statue by enhancing his strength which means precise cc isn't needed to enhance strength. Heck the db makes no mention of precise cc being needed to enhance strength.
Chakra
Accumulating chakra and forming seals to activate a jutsu!
The physical and mental energies from 130 million body cells, that is, chakra, are accumulated, and by performing seals, this energy is converted into a jutsu. If this sequence is performed impeccably, the jutsu is activated.
To activate jutsu other than taijutsu, basic chakra conversion is needed.
To put it plainly, chakra is what fuels a jutsu. The mental and physical energies of a shinobi’s body are joined together into stamina, which is internally converted into chakra, the energy source for a jutsu’s activation. The efficiency of this conversion is influenced by the user’s skill. Being able to efficiently convert stamina means a possibility to cast an even larger number of jutsu. In addition, chakra can be used to temporarily trigger some physical abilities. Thanks to this, shinobi can perform superhuman physical feats.
Yet Naruto wasn't able to make it at least budge...and
definitely won't be able to lift that tanto.
Now for one second put you bias and dumbness aside and see fact that is ces does same what's bolded [punches;kicks;elbows;fissure from figure and lifting] but on far larger level than normal ninja's do.And it is chakra control.Is base naruto being able to cause fissure by a punch nope so why will he be able to lift bunta's blade
Yeah that's what your logic says and yeah I know its asinine and makes no sense at all
Deva leveled Konoha with 3 distinct craters and all the other ninjas + debris were sent to the
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If you re-read, you'll see i am not talking about her travelling from debris section to Deva. I'm talking about travelling from the edge of the innermost crater (which we clearly see) to Pain.
Naruto is right there in front of Deva's feet and Deva's right hand where she came from is clearly in the panel.
How stupid can you be.yes gentle fist is a requirement so is insane chakra control lmao
Next argument will be what since sasuke can use firebal jutsu he would be automatically be able to do every fire jutsu despite how differently they are used
No dude it just means shape transformation does not mean chakra control above jounins
Your insane chakra control statement makes no sense considering normal control of the released chakra is only what is needed. Tenten's statement about Jounin is a testament to the fact they can only release chakra from their hands and feet not from their whole body because of their lack of gentle fist. Not that CE Neji's cc is > Jounin.
You're telling me if regular Jounin could use gentle fist, they wouldn't be able to do rotation because CE Neji's control is > theirs :lol..
How many Jounin have we seen use shape transformation though. Again [
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]. The next level of difficulty is S. And we know techniques in that range are used mostly by Shinobi that are > Jounin. Orochimaru, Tsunade and so on.
And again, the fact P1 Naruto and Konohamaru can do shape transformation doesn't mean it isn't a more difficult aspect of cc considering Rasengan is supposed to be done by oneself. You don't see Jiraiya, Minato or Kakashi using clones to do it.
It just makes a difference something her jutsu is mistaken for.Its superhuman strength which DB repeteadly say it is just not natural one
Why won't it becoz she does not have.The lines explicitly means her strength is chakra based a jutsu that tsunade herself uses to punch;kick and lift aka 1st databook
Again, these make no sense. No where in Sakura's db is it claimed she has strength of any form :lol The two pages in db3 point out the fact it is an application of med ninjutsu where chakra is concentrated in the fist and not strength of any kind.
"But contrary to how it may look" means it is not strength in any form.
This exactly whats cherry picking is.Explicitly ignoring the new databook and the same databook that this is from and even first databook and then going on like broken record .This is what it is something you want to deny since it doesn't fit you argument lmao
What cherry picking? Not only are you pushing Tsunade's db for Sakura, you're ignoring the one of Sakura herself where Kishi does call it strength but goes on to explain what it really is.
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Now for one second put you bias and dumbness aside and see fact that is es does same what's bolded [punches;kicks;elbows;fissure from figure and lifting] but on far larger level than normal ninja's do.And it is chakra control.Is base naruto being able to cause fissure by a punch nope so why will he be able to lift bunta's blade
How does 'your ces' do what's bolded on a larger level when what is bolded is literally Chakra enhancement of strength? :lol If its on a larger level, that would mean more chakra would be required and surely you won't tell me Sakura has more chakra than Naruto?
Base Naruto can't even pull off what self nerfed early p2 Sakura did when looking for Kakashi no matter how much he enhances his strength because he isn't concentrating chakra in the fist :lol
we don't know how great she is with thus we can't give her a jutsu just like shizune can't be given CES
No thats not it lol.. I said because Tsunade can do this doesn't mean Sakura can do it. You then brought Hiashi as comparison and i said its not the same because despite it not being stated, Hiashi cannot teach what he himself doesn't know and he is the only main branch character we've seen teach :lol
I am not even gonna bother lmao can't you understand what said.seriously.hint hint bold
Naruto looks towards the side of Deva's right arm and Hinata comes from that direction [
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]. I accepted travel from debris section was off panel but Hinata cannot fly or teleport so she's not magically jumping from debris section to Deva :lol She has to get to the innermost crater first before proceeding to Deva. And we clearly see Deva's right arm and said direction she came from to the edge of the crater in view on panel [
Your insane chakra control statement makes no sense considering normal control of the released chakra is only what is needed. Tenten's statement about Jounin is a testament to the fact they can only release chakra from their hands and feet not from their whole body because of their lack of gentle fist. Not that CE Neji's cc is > Jounin.
No have you seen many jounins releasing chakra from their whole body nope.only high level ninja's have done it aka Raikage 3rd and 4th or hebi sasuke they are above jounin tiers.or in others cases jinchuriki's that uses bijuus chakra
You're telling me if regular Jounin could use gentle fist, they wouldn't be able to do rotation because CE Neji's control is > theirs :lol..
neji was a prodigy in mastery of gentle fist accepted by everyone out there.you scrambling means nothing
How many Jounin have we seen use shape transformation though. Again [
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]. The next level of difficulty is S. And we know techniques in that range are used mostly by Shinobi that are > Jounin. Orochimaru, Tsunade and so on.
lemme guess anyone who uses water dragon or water shark jutsu which exluding kage tier shinobi's include zabuza and part 1 kakashi;a good load of samurai's [
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].Part 1 naruto or kid konohamaru using rasengan.Even chakra scalpel is shape transformation since it transforms chakra into small blade
Great dragon fireball;Black panther then we have good load of wind release jutsu being transformed into blade.Temari did it in part 1 lel. we have Golem jutsu or doton wall or doton fist
.
Sasuke multiple chidori variants and list goes on and on and on
All of these exluding KKG users like haku that transforms his kkg to make Ice needles;Mirrors or dome.Or nara's shadow possesion :lol
And again, the fact P1 Naruto and Konohamaru can do shape transformation doesn't mean it isn't a more difficult aspect of cc considering Rasengan is supposed to be done by oneself. You don't see Jiraiya, Minato or Kakashi using clones to do it.
my sides
Rasengan is pinnacle of shape manipulation before its variants were involved meaning whatever you excuse for it be performing it is the best feat of shape manipulation :lol
Again, these make no sense. No where in Sakura's db is it claimed she has strength of any form :lol The two pages in db3 point out the fact it is an application of med ninjutsu where chakra is concentrated in the fist and not strength of any kind.
kakashi knows its chakra control and still called it strength.You beating around bush will change nothing
What cherry picking? Not only are you pushing Tsunade's db for Sakura, you're ignoring the one of Sakura herself where Kishi does call it strength but goes on to explain what it really is.
Are you stupid to realise both use same jutsu :lol i can't why are pushing DB explanation Tsunade's chakra based strength on sakura's chakra based strength that she learnt from tsunade
Next what why are you using tsunade's regeneration or seal discription's in DB 2 for sakura :lmao
no no you should say why are you using sasuke's fireball entry to define itachi or obito's fireball or neji 64 palms to define hinata's 64 palms
yeah and read next part
"As for Superhuman Strength,It is more important to have courage and ability to asses the situation".
lmao acts like that part does not exist
How does 'your ces' do what's bolded on a larger level when what is bolded is literally Chakra enhancement of strength? :lol If its on a larger level, that would mean more chakra would be required and surely you won't tell me Sakura has more chakra than Naruto?
Its not my ces its tsunade and sakura's and if read the manga you will realise how
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Base Naruto can't even pull off what self nerfed early p2 Sakura did when looking for Kakashi no matter how much he enhances his strength because he isn't concentrating chakra in the fist :lol
what do you want to prove lmao.i will repeat it again
we don't know how great she is with it thus we can't give her a jutsu just like shizune can't be given CES
No thats not it lol.. I said because Tsunade can do this doesn't mean Sakura can do it. You then brought Hiashi as comparison and i said its not the same because despite it not being stated, Hiashi cannot teach what he himself doesn't know and he is the only main branch character we've seen teach :lol
yes they use the same jutsu exact same jutsu defined by databook stated by kakashi in manga
yes becoz your asinine logic applies to him aswell no matter how much you try to deny.@bold teach what exactly huh :lol
Naruto looks towards the side of Deva's right arm and Hinata comes from that direction [
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]. I accepted travel from debris section was off panel but Hinata cannot fly or teleport so she's not magically jumping from debris section to Deva :lol She has to get to the innermost crater first before proceeding to Deva. And we clearly see Deva's right arm and said direction she came from to the edge of the crater in view on panel [
^^^ believe now this is not hard to understand then
actually what he explained was not that hard to understand but then again you and your asinine logic :lol you are just a guy who gets Butthurt when people say Vaccum palm isn't blowing boulder away :lol
No have you seen many jounins releasing chakra from their whole body nope.only high level ninja's have done it aka Raikage 3rd and 4th or hebi sasuke they are above jounin tiers.or in others cases jinchuriki's that uses bijuus chakra
neji was a prodigy in mastery of gentle fist accepted by everyone out there.you scrambling means nothing
Raikage? Jinchuriki? Those are chakra modes.. Part 1 Chouji also manifests chakra wings in a mode of his iirc. And Chakra aura envelops Naruto when Kurama helps reopen his tenketsu. When Chakra is dense enough, it can be seen. Chouji increases the intensity of his chakra with pills, Raikage can charge the intensity of
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, and jinchuriki explains itself.
Btw, try to read what you're posting. CE Neji is a master of gentle fist despite not knowing air palm, wall palm, lion fists and having a rotation that was minuscule in comparison with Hiashi's...but because you're trying to prove a point you're putting CE Neji's cc on the same level as the Raikage's and Hebi freaking Sasuke?
lemme guess anyone who uses water dragon or water shark jutsu which exluding kage tier shinobi's include zabuza and part 1 kakashi;a good load of samurai's [
You must be registered for see links
].Part 1 naruto or kid konohamaru using rasengan.Even chakra scalpel is shape transformation since it transforms chakra into small blade
Great dragon fireball;Black panther then we have good load of wind release jutsu being transformed into blade.Temari did it in part 1 lel. we have Golem jutsu or doton wall or doton fist
.
Sasuke multiple chidori variants and list goes on and on and on
All of these exluding KKG users like haku that transforms his kkg to make Ice needles;Mirrors or dome.Or nara's shadow possesion :lol
my sides Rasengan is pinnacle of shape manipulation before its variants were involved meaning whatever you excuse for it be performing it is the best feat of shape manipulation :lol
not converted chakra techniques. Naruto uses chakra to make clones that can do the sexy jutsu. Does that count as shape transformation?
Chakra scalpel is like one of the few here that relates to what we're talking about and since your aim is to prove shape transformation wrt chakra isn't a big deal in regards to cc, then i'm sure you'll love to retract it since its an aspect of med ninjutsu that we both know requires cc that is well above average :lol
Bold..Rasengan is shape transformation not manipulation. Manipulation is making it bigger. And yes rasengan is the ultimate shape transformation technique but as kakashi said, [
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]. The key word is 'any' and again Naruto and Konohamaru being able to do rasengan early doesn't and would never change the fact that Shape transformation is a more difficult aspect of cc.
The fact they have to use clones to make it while pros like Jiraiya and Minato don't proves this.
Accumulating chakra and forming seals to activate a jutsu!
The physical and mental energies from 130 million body cells, that is, chakra, are accumulated, and by performing seals, this energy is converted into a jutsu. If this sequence is performed impeccably, the jutsu is activated.
To activate jutsu other than taijutsu, basic chakra conversion is needed.
To put it plainly, chakra is what fuels a jutsu. The mental and physical energies of a shinobi’s body are joined together into stamina, which is internally converted into chakra, the energy source for a jutsu’s activation. The efficiency of this conversion is influenced by the user’s skill. Being able to efficiently convert stamina means a possibility to cast an even larger number of jutsu. In addition, chakra can be used to temporarily trigger some physical abilities. Thanks to this, shinobi can perform superhuman physical feats.
I used to think the same way you do because of the word 'ces'...but that word is fan-made and wrongly assigned to what Tsunade does.
Chakra enhanced strength is exactly what the part in bold in db1 refers to and there is no mention of requiring delicate chakra control. You adding that as a reason Naruto won't be able to do cbi is just wrong. Why? Because Sakura is able to do that by instantly collecting max chakra in her fists. Not because of strength. Kakashi's Sharingan can see chakra and he goes on to explain what it is...Chiyo and Sasori can't. That's why they call it strength because they don't know how it works and Kishi makes how it works clear.
It's hard to believe you keep calling me a troll and say i lack comprehension when you cannot understand this simple fact tbh :lol
(
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). And before you say "the chakra is covering her whole arm", please re-look and realize if it were covering her arm, it would have at the very least been drawn parallel to her forearm. Not that i need to mention that anyway as Kakashi, db2 and db3 make it clear chakra is concentrated in the fist.
You will now obviously go back to db2 and bring up lifting the tanto thing as usual but perfectly ignore the text before that says "she achieves a power of destruction bodily strength alone cannot achieve" And i will ask "how does lifting the tanto qualify as a power of destruction feat?" And you will ramble and bold the first part of the text that contains dodgy translation. What does "The challenge to common sense that" even mean?
Heavenly Foot of Pain (Tsuuten Kyaku)
Taijutsu, C-rank, Offensive, Close range
User: Tsunade
The heel swung down in anger makes the ground rumble in kind with an ultra-hard smackdown!!
All of her body’s outrageous strength is concentrated into her heel. Her stance crystallizes the body’s dynamics in a magnificent demonstration of the art of hand to hand combat. And when her heel swings downward, it’s as if a comet had fallen!! Nothing and no one could receive a direct hit and avoid pulverization.
The remainder of the impact smashed not only the ground, but the nearby rampart into tiny bits…!!
I will also point out the fact Sky leg has no mention of chakra in its jutsu description but you will give excuses that make no sense on why an important aspect of a supposed technique will not be mentioned in its description. One look at these three [
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]-[
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]-[
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] and it's easy to tell which one does the least damage to the ground despite having more momentum behind it. The third one is even accomplished by a self-nerfed user seeing as at that point she was still filling up the seal.
I would also mention Tsunade was able to lift that sword because of her natural strength and give the fact Jirobo carried what he did as an example since he's also a 5 in strength but you would mention arsha? fist that has no correlation to
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whatsoever.
Also pathetic liar? How so? I have said Kishi himself calls it strength in Sakura's db but goes on to explain what it really is [
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] (notice red arrow). Do you seriously expect him to re explain himself every-time despite making it clear there? If i did ask you when Tsunade uses her normal strength and when she concentrates chakra in her fist you wouldn't be able to answer because with the way you transpose Tsunade on Sakura, that would mean she never uses her natural strength at all.
And yeah i do speak more of my native language so perhaps my English is not on par with yours so can you please also tell me what "As for superhuman strength, it is more important to have courage and ability to assess the situation" means?
what do you want to prove lmao.i will repeat it again
we don't know how great she is with it thus we can't give her a jutsu just like shizune can't be given CES
lmao..i post a scan that says Med ninja's must have knowledge of creating medicines logically requiring chemistry and Sakura is supposedly a med ninja that has surpassed Shizune yet you still ask this? :lol Ok how about the fact Tsunade trained Shizune, has used poison when she poisoned Jiraiya in part 1 but poison fog can't be attributed as one of her techs? Don't bother answering though as I'm sure your answer will be as bogus as usual and i won't be replying back anyways.
Either you are blatant troll or you lack comprehension alltogether. Lemme break down what Kidgamer said
Look where naruto is facing in this panel.He is facing the part that lead to offpanel which he pointed with red lines
Now see where hinata appears from.Its around the direction naruto is facing
thus
^^^ believe now this is not hard to understand then
And..wow. This is ridiculous. Is Deva's right hand off panel? :lol Naruto clearly looks in the direction of Deva's right arm and Deva looks over his
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as well and that right arm + direction are clearly on panel in
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. And not only will you be unable to give a logical reason as to why she opts to leave his back/left hand side and move outside of his right arm, her position when she arrives flat out debunks this. But i'm not that surprised you said this though :lol
actually what he explained was not that hard to understand but then again you and your asinine logic :lol you are just a guy who gets Butthurt when people say Vaccum palm isn't blowing boulder away :lol
