Does Indra have Rikudou Chakra?

[SenseiSama]

So he also had the Sage's Eyes as well.

I didn't know Indra's Sharingan was a Rinnegan in disguise.

Indra's Sharingan is a devolved Rinnegan so the term "Sage's eyes" still make sense

 

[WalksInShadows]

Obito never stated it, so quit making things up.

so let me get this straight: Obito never said the words "the Elder was born with the Sage's "eyes"....and was gifted with his powerful chakras and spiritual energy" to Naruto. Yeah, i totally made that up, right? It's not like you or anybody else would ever find those words anywhere in Ch. 462, right?

Wait, what?

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It's referred to being possessed as a ghost with Ashura's spirit shown as being a part of Naruto. Madara was Indra's Transmigrant and thus, had his spirit as well.

Databook even mentions the same thing:



Hell, didn't Naruto just state that he could sense Indra inside of Sasuke? Clearly, Indra's spirit existed in Indra's Transmigrants as well, so what's your point here?

yeah, now read the next chapter where Hagoromo says "he mixed Indra's chakra with Ashura's chakra....and that brought out my chakra. That's how he awakened the Rinnegan." Either you've been doing some selective reading, you have interpreted that info badly, or your math is bad. Hagoromo couldn't make it any plainer what he meant by that.

 

[shelke]

You're cherrypicking certain statements that Obito stated which Hagoromo never confirmed.

If we cannot acknowledge that Ashura inherited something from Hagoromo, then you cannot acknowledge that Indra's chakra grew weaker. Even if it grew weaker, what does that have anything to do with being unable to awaken the Rinnegan? Indra and his Transmigrants still possesses Hagoromo's Yin and Yang Energy, only that their Rinnegan would be weaker as a result if they had his chakra.

I know and her chakra was split between the two boys. Even then, Hagoromo never inherited the Juubi's chakra whereas Ashura and Indra inherited both components of Rikudou's chakra as stated in both the Manga and Databook.

Sage's Chakra is both composed of his Yin and Yang Energy. If Indra only inherited his Yin Energy, how did he have Rikudou's Chakra? By that same logic, he'd have the Sage's Yang Energy which Obito and the Databook confirms that this was something Ashura and the Senju inherited.

Look at the scan above. Hogoromo's chakra was only inherited by Indra. That's all I need to know. The body automatically is associted with the physical energy.

You are saying the Sage is incorrect? All right, there is nothing to debate here then.

 

[NarutoX28]

Indra's Sharingan is a devolved Rinnegan so the term "Sage's eyes" still make sense

No, that would apply to the EMS and MS which are clearly evolved forms of the 3T Sharingan. Like the Databook states, it's an entirely different Dojutsu and if it requires Ashura's KKG, then Indra does not have the Sage's Eyes.

 

[NarutoX28]

Look at the scan above. Hogoromo's chakra was only inherited by Indra. That's all I need to know.

You are saying the Sage is incorrect? All right, there is nothing to debate here then.

I stated why Hagoromo stated what he said.

The context of the entire chapter supports my argument more than yours.

But I guess there is nothing to debate then. I still respect your opinion nonetheless.

 

[SenseiSama]

No, that would apply to the EMS and MS which are clearly evolved forms of the 3T Sharingan. Like the Databook states, it's an entirely different Dojutsu and if it requires Ashura's KKG, then Indra does not have the Sage's Eyes.

It's different dojutsu that comes from the RinneSharingan like Hagoromo's Rinnegan, all of them are related through DNA. Kaguya's dojutsu genes were passed on to both of them hence why you can say Indra had the Sage's eyes.

 

[NarutoX28]

It's different dojutsu that comes from the RinneSharingan like Hagoromo's Rinnegan, all of them are related through DNA. Kaguya's dojutsu genes were passed on to both of them hence why you can say Indra had the Sage's eyes.

The Rinnegan is the Sage's Eyes.

If Indra did not have his Rinnegan, then he simply didn't have the Sage's Eyes.

 

[SenseiSama]

The Rinnegan is the Sage's Eyes.

If Indra did not have his Rinnegan, then he simply didn't have the Sage's Eyes.

Lol I don't want to get into this argument again but as I've said many times before, he inherited the Rinnegan genes but wasn't born with one because he didn't have enough of the Sage's Yang energy.

Likewise, Hagoromo inherit the RinneSharingan genese but he didn't have the Shinju's power to unlock one. Sasuke and Madara's eyes were able to evolve into a Rinnegan because Indra inherited the genes for Hago's dojutsu.

 

[NarutoX28]

Lol I don't want to get into this argument again but as I've said many times before, he inherited the Rinnegan genes but wasn't born with one because he didn't have enough of the Sage's Yang energy.

Doesn't matter. If he had the Rinnegan's genes, but didn't have the Eyes, he simply didn't inherit the Sage's Eyes at all. The Sharingan isn't considered the Sage's Eyes whereas the Rinnegan is. There's a distinction between the two.

Likewise, Hagoromo inherit the RinneSharingan genese but he didn't have the Shinju's power to unlock one. Sasuke and Madara's eyes were able to evolve into a Rinnegan because Indra inherited the genes for Hago's dojutsu.

Sasuke and Madara were able to evolve into a Rinnegan due to obtaining the Yang component of Hagoromo's Chakra. In Sasuke's case, it was because Hagoromo gave him both Yin and Yang.

 

[shadowcb]

I have been reading this thread and the problem is there is confusion with Indra's "power chakra". Some people believe Indra's power chakra = Hagoromo's chakra and that's wrong. Remember, chakra is created from combining spiritual energy and physical energy together (spiritual energy + physical energy = chakra). Since neither sons obtained both Hagoromo's spiritual energy and physical energy that means neither son possess their father's charka.

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When the manga states Indra obtained his father's powerful chakra it's specifically talking about the strength/power of his chakra. In other words Indra's chakra was powerful like his father's chakra. While Ashura's chakra was not powerful like his father's chakra. Powerful chakra doesn't equal Hagoromo's chakra.

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Since neither brother possessed Hagoromo's chakra Madara had to combined his chakra while he was Indra's reincarnation with Hashirama's chakra while he was Ashura's reincarnation to obtain Hagoromo's chakra. Spiritual energy + physical energy = chakra. Indra's chakra contained the Hagoromo's spiritual energy and Ashura's chakra contains Hagoromo's physical energy.

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Hagoromo's spiritual energy + Hagoromo's physical energy = Hagoromo's chakra.

 

[SenseiSama]

Doesn't matter. If he had the Rinnegan's genes, but didn't have the Eyes, he simply didn't inherit the Sage's Eyes at all. The Sharingan isn't considered the Sage's Eyes whereas the Rinnegan is. There's a distinction between the two.



Sasuke and Madara were able to evolve into a Rinnegan due to obtaining the Yang component of Hagoromo's Chakra. In Sasuke's case, it was because Hagoromo gave him both Yin and Yang.

You're just proving my point, once he gained Ashura's Yang energy his eyes evolved. Evolution occurs through DNA, the Sharingan of Indra's transmigrant evolved into the Rinnegan because Indra inherited the genes for Hagoromo's KKG.

Because the genes he inherited were for Hagoromo's dojutsu Obito says the elder son inherited his eyes, the statement was meant to be ambiguous not literal.

 

[NarutoX28]

You're just proving my point, once he gained Ashura's Yang energy his eyes evolved. Evolution occurs through DNA, the Sharingan of Indra's transmigrant evolved into the Rinnegan because Indra inherited the genes for Hagoromo's KKG.

No, Hagoromo stated that Madara's chakra evolved and awakened the Rinnegan because his own Chakra mixed with Ashura's.

Genes determine what chakra you possess which is reflected by your Dojutsu, so if Indra didn't possess the Rinnegan, he simply didn't have his chakra or genes. It's really as simple as that.

Because the genes he inherited were for Hagoromo's dojutsu Obito says the elder son inherited his eyes, the statement was meant to be ambiguous not literal.

Then that would mean we also cannot take his statement of Indra inheriting his "powerful chakras" literally.

 

[NarutoX28]

I have been reading this thread and the problem is there is confusion with Indra's "power chakra". Some people believe Indra's power chakra = Hagoromo's chakra and that's wrong. Remember, chakra is created from combining spiritual energy and physical energy together (spiritual energy + physical energy = chakra). Since neither sons obtained both Hagoromo's spiritual energy and physical energy that means neither son possess their father's charka.

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Hagoromo's spiritual energy + Hagoromo's physical energy = Hagoromo's chakra.

Exactly. It's really as simple as that.

 

[Holy God]

You're just proving my point, once he gained Ashura's Yang energy his eyes evolved. Evolution occurs through DNA, the Sharingan of Indra's transmigrant evolved into the Rinnegan because Indra inherited the genes for Hagoromo's KKG.

Because the genes he inherited were for Hagoromo's dojutsu Obito says the elder son inherited his eyes, the statement was meant to be ambiguous not literal.

Indra does not carry the genetics for the Rinnegan, Hagoromo does. When you combine Indra's and Ashura's DNA it creates Hagoromo's chakra which carries his bloodline limit, the Rinnegan. If Madara or Sasuke were simply given chakra by Hashirama or Naruto, they wouldn't awaken the eye.