It's mad funny you chastised me for attempting to discredit Zoro in a thread that has nothing to do with him, and then you try to downplay Law when NO ONE brought up Law.
Now let's go back to the topic at hand which is the discussion around the current chapter and predictions for the future chapters
I know it was boring since there were no plot development but at least it gives the possibility of Carrot being a future strawhat and leave us discussions perspectives around what happened to the revos
Zoro's status as first mate does indeed relate to this chapter and the discussion in it, as the topic was "Will Carrot be a member?" Someone said she'd have no role, and I said neither does Zoro. If Zoro isn't first mate, then it stands to reason Carrot can join with no role, as current member Zoro has none.
I'm not wrong considering Oda himself uses his characters to imply that. You're free to remain delusional though
And i'm not downplaying Law. I don't care if you're mad about it, as it's a fact that Zoro is stronger than him but as mentioned it was the end of the off-topic thing.
As for Carrot's role in the crew, obviously she'd have one. You can't compare her to Zoro that Oda developed as Luffy's firstmate whether you like it or not and don't even try to discuss this because we're not going anywhere with this. That's why i'd better discuss about other topics like what happened to Baltigo
Look what wiki has to say about Rayleigh personality
In the past, he was shown to have been impatient with the antics of the younger crew members, and took the position of crew disciplinarian very seriously. However, he has changed his personality in his older years, becoming much more relaxed.
Rayleigh didnot thought twice before jumping in the sea which was full of Sea king(showing he doesnot care about anything very much like Zoro)
And he doesnot care who is his opponent as shown when he fought Kizaru.
It's funny that some of what Barto says is exaggerated except for the part that fits your argument. Convenient. The fact that Barto goes off of what the WG pumps out in their newspapers, which has been shown time and time again to skew the truth, if not outright lied, and has demonstrated that his credibility is faulty.
And if we really wanna get into his first mate shit, I'm sure someone can pull up the scan of Usopp saying he's the vice captain and Luffy going "Yeah sure whatever" and immediately dismissing it, showing Luffy doesn't give a shit about vice captains and second in commands, and if there was one, the closest is Usopp.
Exaggeration is part of human nature like people use to describe there kings/heroes as Conqueror of 7seas, Champion of xyz battle, slayer of demons etc that is how people use to give intro of there favourites.
Barto was present at Loguetown. He exaggerated that Lightning part and said Gods in Heaven helped Luffy(something like that).
Barto sayin Zoro slaughter everyone was a way to describe his hero.
but Barto sayin Zoro is VC shows the pirate mentality in OPverse and how they see SH crew hierarchy.
Nobody sees Ussop as VC material(It took some time for Barto to realise he was Sogeking. so that point is moot). Nobody sees Nami as FM either. She cant decide whether to stay in Dressrosa or not.
Atleast Zoro has his opinion like "leave Sanji", Focus on Kaido" & Ussop must appologise before joining again.
I dont know where u got the idea that Nami is Rayleigh of this gen.Its absurd. Rayleigh was top tier guy. Nami is not even a fighter to be honest.
How many very very serious situations has Zoro taken control and given orders? Pretty much every major fight is a very very serious situation, and the Strawhats each just do their own thing when it happens. Oda made it clear in Enies Lobby with Sanji's words: There are things you can do that I can't, and there are things I can do that you can't. We survive by doing it together.
If we take Usopp leaving and everyone agreeing to get him back and forget the fight,all the SH's or some didn't but most did listen to Luffy untill Zoro shut their mouth.Zoro acts like 2nd commander and he is and I believe Oda thinks so too.Who the **** is possible to yell at Nami and shut her mouth? Sure they work together and they work amazing as a team,but let's talk real.Zoro joined first and he surely is the 2nd in command and I'm sure Luffy thinks so too since he has huge respect for Zoro.Zoro is the one who handles the very very serious in crew things.
If we take Usopp leaving and everyone agreeing to get him back and forget the fight,all the SH's or some didn't but most did listen to Luffy untill Zoro shut their mouth.Zoro acts like 2nd commander and he is and I believe Oda thinks so too.Who the **** is possible to yell at Nami and shut her mouth? Sure they work together and they work amazing as a team,but let's talk real.Zoro joined first and he surely is the 2nd in command and I'm sure Luffy thinks so too since he has huge respect to Zoro.
So yelling at the Strawhats one time about one incident in 3 years of running together and 20 years of manga means he commands the crew enough to be vice captain? Okay.
Also, when Usopp asked to be the captain if Luffy can't be, Luffy said "Yeah sure whatever." That shows Luffy doesn't care about who's 2nd in command, so no, he def doesn't think Zoro is.
lol you're the second person to call me this, and the second person I have to tell that I actually like Zoro. I just like him for what he is, instead of sucking him off for fanboy delusion.
So yelling at the Strawhats one time about one incident in 3 years of running together and 20 years of manga means he commands the crew enough to be vice captain? Okay.
Also, when Usopp asked to be the captain if Luffy can't be, Luffy said "Yeah sure whatever." That shows Luffy doesn't care about who's 2nd in command, so no, he def doesn't think Zoro is.
Well there aren't many situations to do so anyways but when it happens it's Zoro who leads the topic not Sanji or Nami...which you should consider...
@bold can you show me when that happened I don't remember something like that? I just remember Usopp saying like it's official that he is the vice- captain...
Well there aren't many situations to do so anyways but when it happens it's Zoro who leads the topic not Sanji or Nami...which you should consider...
@bold can you show me when that happened I don't remember something like that? I just remember Usopp saying like it's official that he is the vice- captain...
Can you also give an example of Zoro leading the pack ? Because I do remember Sanji leading the Curlybrow pirates to Zou and and G5 on Punk Hazard. Sanji doesn't shy away from the leadership role, but Zoro is more like a back seat driver who only steps in if something goes wrong.
Well there aren't many situations to do so anyways but when it happens it's Zoro who leads the topic not Sanji or Nami...which you should consider...
@bold can you show me when that happened I don't remember something like that? I just remember Usopp saying like it's official that he is the vice- captain...
Can you also give an example of Zoro leading the pack ? Because I do remember Sanji leading the Curlybrow pirates to Zou and and G5 on Punk Hazard. Sanji doesn't shy away from the leadership role, but Zoro is more like a back seat driver who only steps in if something goes wrong.
Okey thanks for clearing that up...well I have few minds on this.First...Luffy is a no brainer,he never looks in a discussions with a serious face and this response of Luffy is just whatever,but when it comes to real thing he is relaying more one Zoro than Usopp xd Words =/= actions,I don't see SH's taking Usopp seriously on serious moments since he is always just chicken...Usopp just isn't fit for that role.In the other hand you have Zoro who is clearly 2nd strongest in the SH's and has the authority in SH's.
I don't recall good,might be wrong but Sanji was asking for permission he was just giving a suggestion in what he could do which was later allowed by Luffy,when did Zoro ask for permission to Luffy on something? Zoro clearly acts like someone who is 2nd in command and he fits the job.Same how Rayleigh was to Roger.Joined first,was 2nd strongest etc etc.Not the first time Oda did parallels on Zoro and Rayleigh...Luffy and Roger...
Zoro is the most loyal to Luffy.He was willing to die for his captain when Kuma attacked him and values captain dreams before his own dream.He respects Luffy and he puts him to ground at times.I can't give you manga panels since I'm not able to do so atm but in situations like when Usopp left the crew Zoro was the one who lead the main role above Luffy.Sanji just followed his words.Same goes when Kuma attacked SH's.Sanji seen what is Zoro willing to do for his captin and then Sanji wanted to do the same...Zoro is the leader others are just followers.
And yeah I know there isn't an official confirmation who is the 2nd in command but if you ask me...it's Zoro anyday.
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Hence even Bartolomeo says the same who represents One Piece fans :bdpf:
Okey thanks for clearing that up...well I have few minds on this.First...Luffy is a no brainer,he never looks in a discussions with a serious face and this response of Luffy is just whatever,but when it comes to real thing he is relaying more one Zoro than Usopp
List all of the situations where this has happened.
xd Words =/= actions,I don't see SH's taking Usopp seriously on serious moments since he is always just chicken...Usopp just isn't fit for that role.In the other hand you have Zoro who is clearly 2nd strongest in the SH's and has the authority in SH's.
I don't recall good,might be wrong but Sanji was asking for permission he was just giving a suggestion in what he could do which was later allowed by Luffy,when did Zoro ask for permission to Luffy on something?
Sanji had to ask Luffy permission because the course of action he needed to take would officially start a war with a Yonko and was a major deviation from the established plan. Sanji asking Luffy permission was Sanji showing respect for Luffy's status as Captain, something Zoro would definitely approve of. If being first mate to you means disregarding what your captain wants and altering the course of the crew without making sure he's okay with it and fighting Yonko without his say, then Zoro wouldn't even want to be first mate. What you are describing as "first mate" is mutiny.
When Kuma gave them the ultimatum of giving Luffy up or dying, they all chose death. Every Strawhat would die for each other and Luffy. Every time they choose to fight against the enemy of the arc instead of running away, they're putting their lives on the line for Luffy and their adventure. This is not unique or special to Zoro by any measure whatsoever.
He respects Luffy and he puts him to ground at times
I can't give you manga panels since I'm not able to do so atm but in situations like when Usopp left the crew Zoro was the one who lead the main role above Luffy
"Situations like Usopp?" You mean the Usopp situation because that has been the ONLY situation where this has happened. The next time Zoro tried it, Luffy said "**** off" and went ahead and left for Whole Cake Island.
Sanji just followed his words.Same goes when Kuma attacked SH's.Sanji seen what is Zoro willing to do for his captin and then Sanji wanted to do the same...Zoro is the leader others are just followers.
Sanji has taken initiative before. On Alabasta, he took the initiative to trick Crocodile while on the phone.
In Dressrosa, he took the initiative to lead the charge against the Big Mom Pirates. Also in Dressrosa, he was the one that took the initiative to make Viola an ally, something that came into play to help the crew several times in the arc. Especially when Usopp needed help sniping Sugar, something that prevented Luffy, who was about to touch Sugar himself while crouching next to her, from being turned into a toy.
On Enies Lobby, he took the initiative to close the gates, which created the whirpools that ended helping the Strawhats.
When they went onto the Ark Maxim, Sanji took the initiative to destroy the inside of the ship a bit.
He took the initiative to save Tashigi and G-5 from Vergo, which got them allies and a group to take in the children from Punk Hazard, since they damn sure couldn't.
He also took the initiative to go with Bege's crew and took control the situation, sparing the weaker Strawhahts from a battle they probably wouldn't have survived.
It was also Sanji's words that inspired Usopp into using his sniping skills to save Robin.
Things that ended up helping the Strawhats in the long run.
And yeah I know there isn't an official confirmation who is the 2nd in command but if you ask me...it's Zoro anyday.
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Hence even Bartolomeo says the same who represents One Piece fans :bdpf:
List all of the situations where this has happened.
2nd Strongest=/=first mate.
The authority? What authority?
Sanji had to ask Luffy permission because the course of action he needed to take would officially start a war with a Yonko and was a major deviation from the established plan. Sanji asking Luffy permission was Sanji showing respect for Luffy's status as Captain, something Zoro would definitely approve of. If being first mate to you means disregarding what your captain wants and altering the course of the crew without making sure he's okay with it and fighting Yonko without his say, then Zoro wouldn't even want to be first mate. What you are describing as "first mate" is mutiny.
The Strawhats are all equally loyal to Luffy. Exactly zero of them are more loyal to Luffy than the others.
When Kuma gave them the ultimatum of giving Luffy up or dying, they all chose death. Every Strawhat would die for each other and Luffy. Every time they choose to fight against the enemy of the arc instead of running away, they're putting their lives on the line for Luffy and their adventure. This is not unique or special to Zoro by any measure whatsoever.
Same as the rest of the crew.
"Situations like Usopp?" You mean the Usopp situation because that has been the ONLY situation where this has happened. The next time Zoro tried it, Luffy said "**** off" and went ahead and left for Whole Cake Island.
Sanji has taken initiative before. On Alabasta, he took the initiative to trick Crocodile while on the phone.
In Dressrosa, he took the initiative to lead the charge against the Big Mom Pirates. Also in Dressrosa, he was the one that took the initiative to make Viola an ally, something that came into play to help the crew several times in the arc. Especially when Usopp needed help sniping Sugar, something that prevented Luffy, who was about to touch Sugar himself while crouching next to her, from being turned into a toy.
On Enies Lobby, he took the initiative to close the gates, which created the whirpools that ended helping the Strawhats.
When they went onto the Ark Maxim, Sanji took the initiative to destroy the inside of the ship a bit.
He took the initiative to save Tashigi and G-5 from Vergo, which got them allies and a group to take in the children from Punk Hazard, since they damn sure couldn't.
He also took the initiative to go with Bege's crew and took control the situation, sparing the weaker Strawhahts from a battle they probably wouldn't have survived.
It was also Sanji's words that inspired Usopp into using his sniping skills to save Robin.
Things that ended up helping the Strawhats in the long run.
Urouge? The guy who's never interacted with the Strawhats? What the **** does he know about the crew's dynamic?
What authority? Well for f sakes you are reading One Piece as well you have seen how people react to Zoro speaking and Usopp speaking >_>
Sanji was doing a suggestion,Zoro is stating facts.
And you saying Luffy didn't care about Zoro's opinion ok..so why the F didn't Nami or someone said the same? Zoro again acted more mature of all of them there even though Luffy didn't listen.Does Luffy not listening make Zoro bad or something?
I mean literally I have never seen saying or even thinking that Sanji or Nami are first mates...
"2nd in command =/= first mate"
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"Essentially, the first mate is the one officer the captain must put full trust in and pick carefully. They are the captain's right-hand man and if the captain is not at hand on the ship or is otherwise incapacitated, the first mate is the next in line to take over the captain's job."
If that's not the same then alright <_<
I mean we have Bartolomeo and Urogue claming Zoro is first mate before Sanji and Nami.I mean Urogue never interacting with SH's would mean he could have said Franky is the first mate since he clearly couldn't have known yet he still said Zoro,got some research or something? Who knows.Bartolomeo claimed the same and he is a SH fapper xd
We can talk about this so much and neither will you nor I change my opinion.I see Sanji and Zoro speaking way different when talking about important things which was shown few times that Zoro is leading the main role and Sanji following.Zoro had nothing to do with Sanji leaving Dressrosa since he wasn't even there.
This is what I m trying to say. In OPverse pirates think Zoro is FM. Barto & Urogue both confirms it. I don't know why Riker is not accepting manga facts
This is what I m trying to say. In OPverse pirates think Zoro is FM. Barto & Urogue both confirms it. I don't know why Riker is not accepting manga facts
Even without that,there are many Rayleigh parallels with Zoro which would prove the same.Rayleigh was Rogers first mate,Zoro is Luffy's first mate.That's what I think.
Even without that,there are many Rayleigh parallels with Zoro which would prove the same.Rayleigh was Rogers first mate,Zoro is Luffy's first mate.That's what I think.
Bro I have already listed those in this page & last one(like both have scars in there body & eye, both are swordsmen, heavy drinker etc) but Riker thinks Nami is Rayleigh in this gen
Pretty much the same. Only notable moment is the Usopp situation, and while I grant you that one, that was years ago and a similar situation hasn't come since.
Sanji was doing a suggestion,Zoro is stating facts.
It's not the first time it's happened in the crew. Prime examples are whenever the crew doesn't wanna go to a particular island, and Luffy ignores it completely and doesn't take into consideration at all.
so why the F didn't Nami or someone said the same? Zoro again acted more mature of all of them there even though Luffy didn't listen.Does Luffy not listening make Zoro bad or something?
I never said it makes Zoro bad, but it shows a lack of authority. It shows that the Usopp thing has been the only situation where Zoro's outburst against Luffy really mattered and influenced his decisions. People paint Zoro like this adviser to Luffy, who is go-to guy for handling situations when it's happened ONCE out of TWO attempts, one of which ending in failure to stop Luffy.
Nami and Usopp have constantly warned Luffy against fighting Yonko. Robin also has advised Luffy multiple times.
I mean literally I have never seen saying or even thinking that Sanji or Nami are first mates...
There are people who think Chopper is a pet. There are people who think Luffy is 8 feet tall and fat. These things are automatically true just because people who don't know jack shit about the SHs think so?
"Essentially, the first mate is the one officer the captain must put full trust in and pick carefully. They are the captain's right-hand man and if the captain is not at hand on the ship or is otherwise incapacitated, the first mate is the next in line to take over the captain's job."
Did you even read my post? I said being the second strongest doesn't make you the first mate.
I mean we have Bartolomeo and Urogue claming Zoro is first mate before Sanji and Nami.I mean Urogue never interacting with SH's would mean he could have said Franky is the first mate since he clearly couldn't have known yet he still said Zoro,got some research or something? Who knows.
Urouge and Barto decide things for the crew now? Barto, the delusional, idiot and misinformed fanboy, and Urouge, who only has what he's heard from the newspapers(which call Chopper their pet) and what he's heard from the grapevine(which we've seen to be saying shit like Luffy is an 8-foot-tall monster and that he died at Marineford)? Oh yeah, real credible sources.
Bro I have already listed those in this page & last one(like both have scars in there body & eye, both are swordsmen, heavy drinker etc) but Riker thinks Nami is Rayleigh in this gen
This is what I m trying to say. In OPverse pirates think Zoro is FM. Barto & Urogue both confirms it. I don't know why Riker is not accepting manga facts
Pretty much the same. Only notable moment is the Usopp situation, and while I grant you that one, that was years ago and a similar situation hasn't come since.
What?
It's not the first time it's happened in the crew. Prime examples are whenever the crew doesn't wanna go to a particular island, and Luffy ignores it completely and doesn't take into consideration at all.
I never said it makes Zoro bad, but it shows a lack of authority. It shows that the Usopp thing has been the only situation where Zoro's outburst against Luffy really mattered and influenced his decisions. People paint Zoro like this adviser to Luffy, who is go-to guy for handling situations when it's happened ONCE out of TWO attempts, one of which ending in failure to stop Luffy.
Nami and Usopp have constantly warned Luffy against fighting Yonko. Robin also has advised Luffy multiple times.
There are people who think Chopper is a pet. There are people who think Luffy is 8 feet tall and fat. These things are automatically true just because people who don't know jack shit about the SHs think so?
There is no second in command.
Did you even read my post? I said being the second strongest doesn't make you the first mate.
Urouge and Barto decide things for the crew now? Barto, the delusional, idiot and misinformed fanboy, and Urouge, who only has what he's heard from the newspapers(which call Chopper their pet) and what he's heard from the grapevine(which we've seen to be saying shit like Luffy is an 8-foot-tall monster and that he died at Marineford)? Oh yeah, real credible sources.
Urogue and Barto don't but that's not the first thing it happened.
Chopper is different situation,he is a bloody animal with a devil fruit xd pet = animal
Nami and Usopp warn Luffy 'cause Nami and Usopp are the cowards of the crew and they don't want to do anything with a Yonko hence they always want shortcuts,Zoro does it for other reasons xd
Discussing this is pointless since neither will change our minds...I think Zoro is the first mate,you think he isn't and there's that...
Nami and Usopp warn Luffy 'cause Nami and Usopp are the cowards of the crew and they don't want to do anything with a Yonko hence they always want shortcuts,Zoro does it for other reasons xd
That's the not first time it happened since clearly Bartolomeo and Urogue said the same.So it's not just one time thing.
It's different.He's an ANIMAL with DF what could they else think he is? How could they know he is a medic xd Zoro is human so different reasons entirely.
But it's not just Yonko they are scared off...they are literally scared of anything that's why I don't gave them so much credit for that since literally they are complaining about everyone...
