How many people really celebrate christmas

Marin

Anbu Operative 🎭
Veteran
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
4,796
Reaction score
503
Not to sound rude, but that post doesn't change much. It's pretty well known fact that Christmas was a Pagan holiday that Christians adopted into their own faith, and soon it became what we see today. With Santa, Snowmen, Red-nosed Reindeers, and Elves. No matter how you look at it, the celebration, regardless of how or why Christians themselves celebrate it, is not an authentic/genuine Christian holiday, as there is no mention of it in the Bible or other Christian sources.

Either you read really fast or you didn't read it.

I gave arguments of why Christmas isn't a pagan holiday. If you're claiming otherwise you should put your arguments to the table, instead of simply making a statement and letting it fly around with no given basis.

Also, just because something isn't explicitly ordered in the Bible, doesn't mean it's wrong, let alone pagan. Christmas is a commemoration of Christ's birth (in a similar way you commemorate great moments in your Prophet's life). Date, time of the year and things like that don't matter. As for the Santa, Elves and other things, they don't have anything to do with Christianity. They're elements of what people call secular/international Christmas (wich is a paradox at best) that are a part of cultural celebration rather than religious.
 

Made in Heaven

Legendary Shinobi 🐸
Supreme
Joined
May 30, 2013
Messages
31,444
Reaction score
2,201
Either you read really fast or you didn't read it.

I gave arguments of why Christmas isn't a pagan holiday. If you're claiming otherwise you should put your arguments to the table, instead of simply making a statement and letting it fly around with no given basis.

Also, just because something isn't explicitly ordered in the Bible, doesn't mean it's wrong, let alone pagan. Christmas is a commemoration of Christ's birth (in a similar way you commemorate great moments in your Prophet's life). Date, time of the year and things like that don't matter. As for the Santa, Elves and other things, they don't have anything to do with Christianity. They're elements of what people call secular/international Christmas (wich is a paradox at best) that are a part of cultural celebration rather than religious.

Those arguments are meaningless. Again, it doesn't if you and your family celebrate Christamas in honor of Prophet Jesus, the origin of the holiday is rooted in Pagan, aka non-Christian, celebrations. Twist and turn the reasoning to your heart's content, it won't change the history of the holiday. It is not an authentic Christian holiday. Plain and simple.

Never said that. But given that Prophet Jesus' disciples, who would logically be the best of Christians, didn't celebrate their leader's birthday, showcases that it is an innovation in the religion. Thus, celebrating it isn't something necessary or needed.

Actually, we don't commemorate any moments in Prophet Muhammad's life. There's only two celebrations, one celebrating the end of Ramadan, and the other celebrating the Pilgrimage season.

So when you celebrate Christmas, you don't involve yourself with Santa and Reindeers and other such things?
 

Marin

Anbu Operative 🎭
Veteran
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
4,796
Reaction score
503
Those arguments are meaningless. Again, it doesn't if you and your family celebrate Christamas in honor of Prophet Jesus, the origin of the holiday is rooted in Pagan, aka non-Christian, celebrations. Twist and turn the reasoning to your heart's content, it won't change the history of the holiday. It is not an authentic Christian holiday. Plain and simple.

Never said that. But given that Prophet Jesus' disciples, who would logically be the best of Christians, didn't celebrate their leader's birthday, showcases that it is an innovation in the religion. Thus, celebrating it isn't something necessary or needed.

Actually, we don't commemorate any moments in Prophet Muhammad's life. There's only two celebrations, one celebrating the end of Ramadan, and the other celebrating the Pilgrimage season.

So when you celebrate Christmas, you don't involve yourself with Santa and Reindeers and other such things?

I explained how Christmas is not rooted in paganism. It doesn't have anything to do with how I celebrate it. It's a fact.

I didn't say you celebrate it, I said commemorate. Speaking of wich don't you commemorate his travel from Meka to Medina? Muslims in my country do. Regardless, it was just an illustration to help show how it's not some sort of a big brithday party (not even sure Jews celebrated birthdays at the time) but rather a commemoration of a key moment in history.

And why would I do that?
 

Punk Hazard

Sage of Six Posts 🔮
Immortal
Joined
Apr 21, 2011
Messages
59,557
Reaction score
4,729
Reffer to my post above. Also, "everyone knows" is obviously false, otherwise we wouldn't be commemorating it. You're free to back it up.

He wasn't. Where Jesus was born is similar in climate to the US. Meaning, there's no way shepherds would have their sheep outside during the night in the middle of the winter.



 
Last edited:

Marin

Anbu Operative 🎭
Veteran
Joined
Dec 9, 2015
Messages
4,796
Reaction score
503
He wasn't. Where Jesus was born is similar in climate to the US. Meaning, there's no way shepherds would have their sheep outside during the night in the middle of the winter.




How do you know the place Jesus was born has the same climate as the US, let alone US after 2000 years? Not to mention a specific place of Jesus' birth isn't even historically established. Also, what do the sheepes have to do with anything?

Now about the articles you've linked...

The first one just lists statements without linking any sources. They don't specify wich holidays the Christians supposedly stole, they assume too many things without saying why exactly, and they raise the points wich I refuted in my longer post above. Not only that, but the people they quote assume that the Church invented Christmas to stop people from finding out that Jesus never existed, a Christ myth theory that has been proven wrong. (It's debatable wether such ideas were even present at the time.)

The second link leads to a Jewish blog. Now, when you do research on these things you don't rely on the sides who are in one way or another affiliated with the subject. You first look at the neutral/objective parties and see what they have to say, and only then go into individual sides to see their sides of the story. A jewish blog like this (wich doesn't go by the said criterium but I'll get to that) is biased. Now I'll tackle the core of the blog.

The central idea of the blog is that Christmas is a hijacked version of a Roman festival Saturnalia. First, they claim that the festival of Saturnia lasted on December 25th, wich is a lie. The festival was celebrated on December 17th, and only later, when the Julian Calendar was put in place, was it expanded to last until December 23. Nowhere does it say the festival lasted to 25th, as a matter of fact, Saturnalia served as a tie-in to the Winter Solstace, wich I've already dealt with in the post above, and even it doesn't fall on 25th but rather on 24th, so the author of the blog clearly flasified his information to make it seem like the exact date of Christmas.

Then, a historian by the name of Lucian is mentioned. The author claims that Lucian wrote about the terrible pracitces of Saturnalia, and asserts that these practices have been kept by the Christians in the early phases of what would later become Christmas. Now the lack of sources comes to light. The author, througt the blog, only gives sources to selected parts, but shows nothing when delivering the big statements like the one just said.

Afterwards, the author quotes a few other works, and adds his own assumptions to the basis of what has been sourced. This is the case when the blog gets to Puritans, who, contrary to the author, didn't ban Christmas due to it's "known pagan origin", but rather due to pagan customs. Various crimes commited by the Catholic Church officials are also mentioned but with a fabricated background of it all spamming from Saturnalia.

The blog mentions authors and their works, wich I can find virtually no reviews of, no articles what so ever (if you have info please share), is written in a highly militistic tone, especially visible in the last part where he calls out Christians as being a "curse to Torah".

In short, it's a biased blog, with much of it's info being unconfirmed, only partially true or downright false.
 
Last edited:

Yubel

Anbu Operative 🎭
Veteran
Joined
Apr 16, 2015
Messages
3,104
Reaction score
201
I only set new year resolutions, nothing else.
 
Top