Most tactical battle in Naruto?

[shelke]

Shikamaru is smarter man. I'm not going to argue this. The rest of your post is irrelevant given that it's your opinion and i'll respect that.

Orochimaru's opinion is Orochimaru's opinion as well. Just as he said Sasuke would surpass Madara.

Unless, "surpass" meant breaking the cycle and not dying. He has still not surpassed him.

How? By his own admission and the display of feats he isn't. What do you mean? An opinion that involved Orochimaru himself is just an opinion? A character admits he is below him and his feats back it up, and you say it is null and void. A character admits he got outsmarted, you claim it's not factual. Are you intentionally being obtuse?

What 'surpass'? What are you talking about?

 

[Your Creepy Stalker]

Shikamaru VS tayuya. had good strategy, at least until temari used the greatest of tactics, "Overwhelm the enemy with a massive attack and defeat them in one shot"

 

[To Whatever]

How? By his own admission and the display of feats he isn't. What do you mean? An opinion that involved Orochimaru himself is just as opinion? A character admits he is below him and his feats back it up, and you say it is null and void. A character admits he got outsmarted, you claim it's not factual. Are you intentionally being obtuse?

What 'surpass'? What are you talking about?

When did Shikamaru state this by the way. And yes, it's still an opinion on your part. Shikamaru is canonically smarter and has more tactical prowess than Sasuke does. What's the closest Sasuke has gotten to doing what Shikamaru has done during the immortal arc?

His tactic against Killer Bee with the team he leads resulted in disaster.

 

[shelke]

When did Shikamaru state this by the way. And yes, it's still an opinion on your part. Shikamaru is canonically smarter and has more tactical prowess than Sasuke does. What's the closest Sasuke has gotten to doing what Shikamaru has done during the immortal arc?

His tactic against Killer Bee with the team he leads resulted in disaster.

In part one, so yeah, it holds far more water than the fiction you are throwing around. How and where? Got any feats to back this up?

Sorry, it was lack of information. That has nothing to do with battle tactics. Still reaching and fishing for ridiculous excuses as usual. When Sakura and Ino's father completely outsmarted Shikamaru during Pein invasion. One deduced the code faster and the other reached the 'location conclusion' faster, which he actually dismissed like a complete idiot.

So, what feats are we talking about here? They aren't better than Izanagi breakdown and outsmarting Root division's Head, Deidara, Madara's Limbo deduction and plan, lure for Orochimaru, Haku's tech break down etc. Not by any stretch of imagination. Bring them out. I'll wait.

 

[To Whatever]

In part one, so yeah, it holds far more water than the fiction you are throwing around. How and where? Got any feats to back this up?

Sorry, it was lack of information. That has nothing to do with battle tactics. Still reaching and fishing for ridiculous excuses as usual. When Sakura and Ino's father completely outsmarted Shikamaru during Pein invasion. One deduced the code faster and the other reached the 'location conclusion' faster, which he actually dismissed like a complete idiot.

So, what feats are we talking about here? They aren't better than Izanagi breakdown and outsmarting Root division's Head, Deidara, Madara's Limbo deduction and plan, lure for Orochimaru, Haku's tech break down etc. Not by any stretch of imagination. Bring them out. I'll wait.

In part 1? Where Shikamaru didn't yet realize Asuma's teaching and was lazy as shit? Sakura herself is smarter than Sasuke especially in regards of things such as that. Shikamaru overlooking one thing doesn't take anything away from him.

You're still doing nothing but spouting opinion. He outsmarted him with Karin's help and it doesn't take a genius to realize Lightning counters doton. Deduction of limbo when you can see it isn't impressive in the least. The rest are impressive but's overshadowed by shikamaru.

You're free to look up the scans yourself, I don't feel like arguing opinions. Afterall, you did say i'm "reaching"


Sasuke leading his team has no little to no planning and almost gets people killed. The KB fight and summit siege being a prime example.

Opinions are opinions and they differ from yours.

 

[shelke]

In part 1? Where Shikamaru didn't yet realize Asuma's teaching and was lazy as shit? Sakura herself is smarter than Sasuke especially in regards of things such as that. Shikamaru overlooking one thing doesn't take anything away from him.

You're still doing nothing but spouting opinion. He outsmarted him with Karin's help and it doesn't take a genius to realize Lightning counters doton. Deduction of limbo when you can see it isn't impressive in the least. The rest are impressive but's overshadowed by shikamaru.

You're free to look up the scans yourself, I don't feel like arguing opinions. Afterall, you did say I'm "reaching" :roll eyes:


Sasuke leading his team has no little to no planning and almost gets people killed. The KB fight and summit siege being a prime example.

Opinions are opinion and they differ from yours.

Yeah, sorry, still has nothing to do with your assumption that Sasuke is less smart, when Orochimaru's statement alone bury's this argument into the ground. He admits he isn't as smart and talented. You finding leeways for it is hilarious as hell, when the character doesn't agree with you.

He did? When? Karin added nothing to the deduction. Now you are are just throwing stuff out of your ass just for the sake of it. Even Itachi made a big deal out of Izanagi, and it was a modified one to boot. Sasuke knew nothing about this Kinjutsu, yet he came out on top by not only defeating modified Izanagi, but Danzo as well. Heck, Obito disagrees with you with a clear-cut statement. Jesus, this guy. Talk about being anti-Sasuke as to deny blatant manga scans.

And? What does that have anything to do with the tactics? Tactics ARE based on information. He was five steps ahead of Deidara. What good did Shikamaru do? Oh wait, he outsmarted a guy with an IQ of a gibbon. Three claps for him, when he fell flat on his face during Pein arc and Sakura and Ino's father did the actual job. How smart. Much wow. When where his smarts were actually needed, he fell out like a clown. But no, he's so much smarter.

Shikamaru saw everything and made a plan as well. Nothing impressive about seeing things, right? Limbo deduction has jack to do with seeing Limbo, but how it actually operates. Madara disagrees with you there as well.

You started this discussion, not me. Yet you have nothing to show me other than 'oh no, man ... opinions'. Every single character, including Shikamaru, Orochimaru, Danzo, Obito, Madara, Chee, Deidara, Kakashi ... all disagree. So no, the only person giving opinions here is you, not me.

 

[To Whatever]

Yeah, sorry, still has nothing to do with your assumption that Sasuke is less smart, when Orochimaru's statement alone bury's this argument into the ground. He admits he isn't as smart and talented. You finding leeways for it is hilarious as hell, when the character doesn't agree with you.

He did? When? Karin added nothing to the deduction. Now you are are throwing stuff out of your ass just for the sake of it. Even Itachi made a big deal out of Izanagi, and it was a modified one to boot. Sasuke knew nothing about this Kinjutsu, yet he came out on top by not only defeating modified Izanagi, but Danzo as well. Heck, Obito disagrees with you with a clear-cut statement. Jesus, this guy. Talk about being anti-Sasuke as to deny blatant manga scans.

And? What does that have anything to do with the tactics? Tactics ARE based on information. He was five steps ahead of Deidara. What good did Shikamaru do? Oh wait, he outsmarted a guy with an IQ of a gibbon. Three claps for him, when he fell flat on his face during Pein arc and Sakura and Ino's father did the actual job. How smart. Much wow. When where his smarts were actually needed, he fell out like a clown. But no, he's so much smarter.

Shikamaru saw everything and made a plan as well. Nothing impressive about seeing things, right? Limbo deduction has jack to do with seeing Limbo, but how it actually operates. Madara disagrees with you there as well.

You started this discussion, not me. Yet you have nothing to show me other than 'oh no, man ... opinions'. Every single character, including Shikamaru, Orochimaru, Danzo, Obito, Madara, Chee, Deidara, Kakashi ... all disagree. So no, the only person giving opinions here is you, not me.

Oro's statement is an opinion.

What you're saying is an opinion.

If you want scans, look it up fam. I'm not about to argue with someone like you over a finished manga. go take a break, come back and realize what you're doing.


lol @ using part 1 opinions and the opinions of others that were proven wrong.

 

[shelke]

Oro's statement is an opinion.

What you're saying is an opinion.

If you want scans, look it up fam. I'm not about to argue with someone like you over a finished manga. go take a break, come back and realize what you're doing.

lol @ using part 1 opinions and the opinions of others that were proven wrong.

That is plain old bull-shit. The only one with an opinion ... is you. And it's fiction at that. Calling manga's statements of praise for characters that follow feats nothing but opinions is some hardcore nonsense.

Shikamaru isn't smarter. The manga backs it up.

 

[Bad Touch Yakushi]

Shikamaru VS Kin

Girl knocked herself the f*ck out due to simply not being aware of her surroundings. Genius.

You must be registered for see images

 

[1000 Chirping Birds]

Shikamaru VS Kin

Girl knocked herself the f*ck out due to simply not being aware of her surroundings. Genius.

You must be registered for see images

yup this and him VS Tayuya

 

[To Whatever]

That is plain old bull-shit. The only one with an opinion ... is you. And it's fiction at that. Calling manga's statements of praise for characters that follow feats nothing but opinions is some hardcore nonsense.

Shikamaru isn't smarter. The manga backs it up.

Orochimaru and the people you mentioned are fiction and stating their opinion. It's all opinion.

And Shikamaru's is canonically smarter. I told you to take a break but it seems you didn't take my advice.

 

[shelke]

Orochimaru and the people you mentioned are fiction and stating their opinion. It's all opinion.

And Shikamaru's is canonically smarter. I told you to take a break but it seems you didn't take my advice.

No, he canonically, isn't. What are you arguing about anyway? Calling character statements opinion, then flipping it on the side and calling the other statements canon? Seriously, drink some water and slap your face a few times because that sounds stupid, as now you are simply whining.

 

[To Whatever]

No, he canonically, isn't. What are you arguing about anyway? Calling character statements opinion, then flipping it on the side and calling the other statements canon? Seriously, drink some water and slap your face a few times because that sounds stupid, as now you are simply whining.

I'm not calling anyone's opinion's statement. It literally states his IQ is 200. Who has been noted to have an IQ of 200 in the series other than his son? Shikamaru is smarter than Sasuke.

Stop trying to argue this.

 

[shelke]

I'm not calling anyone's opinion's statement. It literally states his IQ is 200. Who has been noted to have an IQ of 200 in the series other than his son? Shikamaru is smarter than Sasuke.

Stop trying to argue this.

So, now it is semantics? Opinions are statements at the end of the day. So? And there are many, many characters who have called Sasuke a rare prodigy. Many characters who have praised Itachi for the same reason. Has anyone said that Sasuke's IQ is less? No. Has anyone stated that Itachi's IQ is less? No, you have simply assumed it ALL by yourself for it to be some kind of manga fact. What a self-created liberty.

Is that all you have going for yourself; a ****ing IQ statement, when his sub-par feats are nothing to cry home about ... and no IQ comparison to go by? Stop posting fiction. Nothing indicates or supports that Shikamaru is smarter. The character dialogues, feats and overall pakage, all prove that Sasuke (and Itachi) are much smarter.

Your entire argument is ridiculous, when Shikamaru himself puts his own intelligence below Sasuke's.

 

[To Whatever]

So, now it is semantics? Opinions are statements at the end of the day. So? And there are many, many characters who have called Sasuke a rare prodigy. Many characters who have praised Itachi for the same reason. Has anyone said that Sasuke's IQ is less? No. Has anyone stated that Itachi's IQ is less? No, you have simply assumed it ALL by yourself for it to be some kind of manga fact. What a self-created liberty.

Is that all you have going for yourself; a ****ing IQ statement, when his sub-par feats are nothing to cry home about ... and no IQ comparison to go by? Stop posting fiction. Nothing indicates or supports that Shikamaru is smarter. The character dialogues, feats and overall pakage, all prove that Sasuke (and Itachi) are much smarter.

Your entire argument is ridiculous, when Shikamaru himself puts his own intelligence below Sasuke's.

That's a whole lot of Opinion. Stop replying back, I've been trying not to debate this with you given all your proof are opinions of characters rather than statements, facts and stats.

Shikamaru's intelligence has been a 5 since the start of the series.

Sasuke's been at a 2, 2.5, and a 3.5.

Deal with it, fam. You're comparing a primary tactician with an IQ over 200 to someone who falls behind him slightly and excels in areas that overshadows his. Like ninjutsu and chakra control for example.

Stop being a baby that shika is smarter.

 

[shelke]

That's a whole lot of Opinion. Stop replying back, I've been trying not to debate this with you given all your proof are opinions of fiction rather than stats.

Shikamaru's intelligence has been a 5 since the start of the series.

Sasuke's been at a 2, 2.5, and a 3.5.

Deal with it, fam.

You started this, not me, simply because YOU couldn't deal with another poster's opinion.

@Bold:

You must be registered for see images

Oh no, now it's the databook stats. But no actual manga feats, when going by stats Orochimaru never should have lost to Sasuke and called him a prodigy better than himself in his teenage, Asuma wouldn't have been steam rolled by Hidan, and Kakashi wouldn't have been pushed into a defensive stance at all etc. Oh no, those databook stats set in stone. Who cares about the feats and dialogues?

Every post more absurd than the last one; claiming that stats of fiction are fact, but the manga it supports is fiction. What kind of a paradoxically moronic statement is this? This guy sounds drunk!

 

[To Whatever]

You started this, not me, simply because YOU couldn't deal with another poster's opinion.

@Bold:

You must be registered for see images

Oh no, now it's the databook stats. But no actual manga feats, when going by stats Orochimaru never should have lost to Sasuke and called him a prodigy better than himself in his teenage, Asuma wouldn't have been steam rolled by Hidan, and Kakashi wouldn't have been pushed into a defensive stance at all etc. Oh no, those databook stats set in stone. Who cares about the feats and dialogues?

Every post more absurd than the last one; claiming that stats of fiction are fact, but the manga it supports is fiction. What kind of a paradoxically moronic statement is this? This guy sounds drunk!

I started it to give my opinon. Not debate about it. You just want to be right. Just like how you took that L yesterday doing what you're did yesterday.

Orochimaru was defeated in the forest of death because he wasn't trying to kill. He was defeated part 2 because he was weakened.

Asuma and Hidan are close in stats with a 1 point difference. We're not talking about stats in that sense. Hidan has a 5 in stamina. Asuma has a 4. Asuma's intelligence is higher than than Hidan. these two things aren't up for debate.


Anyway, the databook supports the manga. I'm still waiting for the scans of Sasuke successfully leading a team, doing what he did against hidan & kakazu in both scenarios. Hell, even the crap he did in part one.





Stop relying on Orochimaru's statement as it's his opinion. He said he'd surpass Madara and still hasn't. If Orochimaru thinks Sasuke surpass himself when he was his age then that's his opinion. Sasuke said he was destined to win and ended up losing. Until you can do that, (Bring up scans that rival the above) then stop being a baby.


I edited my post btw. So it wasn't just stats.

 

[shelke]

I started it to give my opinion. Not debate about it. You just want to be right. Just like how you took that L yesterday doing what you're did yesterday.

Orochimaru was defeated in the forest of death because he wasn't trying to kill. He was defeated part 2 because he was weakened.

Asuma and Hidan are close in stats with a 1 point difference. We're not talking about stats in that sense. Hidan has a 5 in stamina. Asuma has a 4. Asuma's intelligence is higher than than Hidan. these two things aren't up for debate.

Anyway, the databook supports the manga. I'm still waiting for the scans of Sasuke successfully leading a team, doing what he did against hidan & kakazu in both scenarios. Hell, even the crap he did in part one.

Stop relying on Orochimaru's statement as it's his opinion. He said he'd surpass Madara and still hasn't. If Orochimaru thinks Sasuke surpass himself when he was his age then that's his opinion. Sasuke said he was destined to win and ended up losing. Until you can do that, (Bring up scans that rival the above) then stop being a baby.

I edited my post btw. So it wasn't just stats.

Why are you so upset (the other thread incident)? If you want to agree with a bunch of mentally challenged kids, be my guest. But given your ridiculous statements on the classification of fiction and non-fiction, you don't seem any better.

That still doesn't prove your crap nor does it have anything to do with it. He was lured into a trap. He agrees. The manga shows it. Why the **** should I believe your fiction? Is Orochimaru lying? Nips knows better. Orochimau was lying. He doesn't know any better, Nips does.

Yeah, right. That totally proves the nonsense you are posting. A point makes a huge difference in stats.

Yeah, that one time against a mentally retarded man such as Hidan. Is that ALL you have? Pretty much. So smart. Fails againt Sakura, looks like a clown against Ino's father. But nah, so much smarter.

This has jack to do with Orochimaru's comment on his own intelligence. Or the comments on a character's intelligence after feats. This has zero correlation whatsoever. So, you think you know MORE about Orochimaru's intelligence than himself? What the heck is this nonsense?

@Bold: Sasuke hasn't surpassed Madara? What are you smoking? I don't know whether you are just willfully absurd or a tactless troll, but, stop posting. This is too idiotic for words. Your posts and senseless, trollish and absurd. You just don't want to give where the credit it is due, and I have seen you pull this many times.

 

[ToshiZO]

No fight in the series touches Team 10/ Kakashi vs Hidan and Kakuzu.

And am I really seeing Sasuke being compared to Shikamaru?

Shikamaru had Kakashi defer to him. Kakashi........that feat alone makes any argument irrelevant. I can't name you any other character in this series whom Kakashi would take a backseat to, and let them handle all the planning/ tactics.

 

[shelke]

^ Yeah, you are seeing exactly that, because that was (one of) the dullest fights in the manga.