Asuma VS 100 % Kisame (Kenjutsu only)

[EZQ]

Spoiler

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Lmao, real niggas already know who wins this.

When there are scans of Asuma parrying with the same man who was shown to do all that then we know the answer to this fight is not as obvious as it seems

 

[NarutoX28]

Kisame absolutely dominates.

Asuma doesn't have the speed or reflexes to bypass Kisame's guard, especially when he has Samehada.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

When there are scans of Asuma parrying with the same man who was shown to do all that then we know the answer to this fight is not as obvious as it seems

I don't think Kishimoto was planning for Kisame to play such a pivotle role in the manga back when he was first displayed back in part one. His part two feats and hype doesn't add up with his feats and hype in part one.

Anyways, at the very best one could claim based on their encounter alone (and ignoring part two CQC feats) that they're relatively equal in CQC. That is not sufficient enough in Asumas case, since he'd also would have to get past Kisames durability, pain resistancy, and healing capabilities - which is nearly impossible given Samehadas chakra absorption. It's not a stomp match, but Asuma doesnt' stand a chance at winning.

 

[Beans2]

Well hidan is also superior to Kisame in CQC so that comparision isn't completely relevant. Kisame never tossed around Killer Bee, it's just Kisame is a terrible matchup for chakra cloack users. They can't even get close to him because they're giving their chakra to him on a silver plate.

Samehada is never gaining the size it did against Killer Bee against an opponent who doesn't expell chakra constantly. The size of samehada was pretty much everything when it came to CQC against bee, since it had more range it could intercept Bee's lariat, and could e used as a shield.

The answer is not that obvious as you make it sound. I'd use as refernce Kisame vs Gai more than Kisame vs KB.

Hidan isn't superior to Kisame in close combat. Kisame has superior reactions, faster striking speed, a much better weapon, and is physically much much stronger.

As for Kisame never tossing around V1 Killer Bee, what do you call this?

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Thats funny cause Kisame himself got outdone by Asuma in CQC. The only thing that speaks for is Hidan being above both in Taijutsu. Not the other way around.

But if you're simply talking about overall winning the fight, you're right. If you're trying to throw shade based on taijutsu? Kisame was only "tossing" around Killer Bee due to Samehada's properties and KB being the perfect matchup not because he is better than Killer Bee in taijutsu....because he isn't.

Kisame's impressiveness doesn't come from him out doing someone in Taijutsu it comes from his strength and the ability to drain the enemy's chakra.

Kisame got outdone by Asuma in CQC? You serious bruh?

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Kisame wounded Asuma and was about to maul him until Kurenai

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by putting Kisame in a genjutsu. If you're referring to

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, that's not "outdoing" Kisame. That's managing to scratch him, only because Kisame didn't realize the range of his weapon was extended by the chakra on Asuma's blade. Kisame had already dealt Asuma a much more serious injury.

Hidan is not even in Kisame's league in CQC. Call me back when Hidan can react quickly enough to defend against three high-speed attacks coming at him at once (Narutobase is missing the scan unfortunately, but go

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then scroll down to pages 13-14.) Nor can Hidan react to this at point blank range:

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As for the taijutsu part... Close quarters combat =/= taijutsu. Never argued for Kisame having better taijutsu, but with Samehada he easily beats Asuma in close combat.

 

[EZQ]

Hidan isn't superior to Kisame in close combat. Kisame has superior reactions, faster striking speed, a much better weapon

Hidan kept up with Kakashi and even pressured him, with his chyte broken, which didn't allow him to use unorthodox movements like against Asuma. Hidan's sunshin has better feats than Kisame's, and Kisame has good mental reactions but his physicall reactions are not far away from Hidan's given the feats against Kakashi.

and is physically much much stronger.

True

As for Kisame never tossing around V1 Killer Bee, what do you call this?

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I call it Kisame absorbing Bee's chakra who was literally saying hey take all my chakra from just putting your sword close to me. Any physycall attack from bee got weakened because he couldn't even use his v1 cloak effectively. Kisame is a bad matchup for cloaled fighters.

Kisame was just fast enough to put samehada were it was supposed to be so KB entered the absortion range by himself, if there was a scan of Kisame actually outspeeding Bee then i'd say Kisame is that much superior to Asuma in CQC.

EDIT:

To add in Hidan's favour, it's canon that Asuma can react physically to Kisame's striking speed, but couldn't completely react to Hidan's unorthodox attacks, which combined to his fast sunshin would make up for his not so high striking speed.

If i were any shinobi, i would rather face Kisame on a CQC fight and not hidan, except if i'm a chakra cloack user.

 

[NarutoX28]

Well, Kisame could literally overpower Base Gai in Taijutsu despite Gai having his own unorthodox fighting style that pressured War Arc Obito.

 

[Chaosmark101]

Well, Kisame could literally overpower Base Gai in Taijutsu despite Gai having his own unorthodox fighting style that pressured War Arc Obito.

Gai improved though. Inb4 EZQ

 

[NarutoX28]

Gai improved though. Inb4 EZQ

Kisame also improved. :lol

 

[AkatsukiSwag]

What Mr. Butcher fails to realize is that they both got hits on each other due to the lack of inel on each other's abilities.

Asuma didn't know about sharkskin and got his arm shredded.

Kisame didn't know about chakra blade extended range and got his cheek cut.

If they were to fight again asuma's range gets absorbed and he gets clipped.

Except Kisame's hit had close to nothing to do with his taijutsu skills....because

1.Asuma successfully blocked Kisame's strike
2.The only reason Asuma even blocked was because he was protecting Kurenai.

Lol so if you could actually read and even follow your own arguments maybe this wouldn't be so tough on you.

What he said. Asuma would win, though probably sustaining injury

 

[BenjerminGaye]

What he said. Asuma would win, though probably sustaining injury

Don't quote me.

 

[AkatsukiSwag]

Don't quote me.

Its a debate style thread, grow up. I quoted you to make a point

 

[BenjerminGaye]

Its a debate style thread, grow up. I quoted you to make a point

 

[Chaosmark101]

Kisame also improved. :lol

Yes, Kisame improved, but not quite on the level that Gai had improved. On Turtle Island Kisame found himself

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after being found by KCM Naruto whom had never even used this new transformation before, &

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.
While, the fruit of Gai's improvement allowed him to pressure Obito an MS user in taijutsu with his nunchaku [

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],[

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], & In the war,

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[NarutoX28]

Yes, Kisame improved, but not quite on the level that Gai had improved. On Turtle Island Kisame found himself

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after being found by KCM Naruto whom had never even used this new transformation before, &

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.

I'm not sure how that's fair.

Not only was Kisame unaware of how powerful Naruto had become, but he was severely weakened, to the point where he could hardly move and could only hobble off within his sword. He went from being effortlessly trashed to Base Gai, to effortlessly blocking Base Gai's hits once he absorbed a little bit of chakra. He was substantially weakened, so I'm not sure why people present this as evidence.

While, the fruit of Gai's improvement allowed him to pressure Obito an MS user in taijutsu with his nunchaku [

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],[

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], & In the war,

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And again, I refuted why using KCM Naruto as an example is pointless. But even then, KCM Naruto clearly didn't use Shunshin here and Obito was an opponent who had abilities that could counter KCM Naruto's own speed such as Kamui that can allow Obito to effortlessly phase through KCM Naruto's own attacks if need be. Furthermore, KCM Naruto attempted to utilize a strategy to bypass Obito's own Kamui and counter-attack when Obito solidified. In order to do that, he had to properly time his attacks and utilizing his Shunshin when he doesn't have the speed to react properly using his own Shunshin speed (Ei vs. KCM Naruto being a good example of that) is contradictory to that.

So Gai outperforming KCM Naruto against Obito to represent Kisame's inferiority is meaningless because not only was Kisame weakened, but KCM Naruto never used Shunshin at all in the first place. Have KCM Naruto engage Kisame in CQC and Kisame easily parries. KCM Naruto's normal speed hasn't been shown to be anything too impressive.

 

[Chaosmark101]

I'm not sure how that's fair.

Not only was Kisame unaware of how powerful Naruto had become, but he was severely weakened, to the point where he could hardly move and could only hobble off within his sword. He went from being effortlessly trashed to Base Gai, to effortlessly blocking Base Gai's hits once he absorbed a little bit of chakra. He was substantially weakened, so I'm not sure why people present this as evidence.

Because Kisame wasn't weakened, he was

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. & Kisame was literally protected within Samehada, he was only weakened when it

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Take a look at the 2nd panel specifically & compare the sudden drop in mass. Kismet was not weakened. He attempted to flee as per his own words of not being confident enough to face 2 jinchuriki's & a mouton user but didn't in time.

And again, I refuted why using KCM Naruto as an example is pointless. But even then, KCM Naruto clearly didn't use Shunshin here and Obito was an opponent who had abilities that could counter KCM Naruto's own speed such as Kamui that can allow Obito to effortlessly phase through KCM Naruto's own attacks if need be. Furthermore, KCM Naruto attempted to utilize a strategy to bypass Obito's own Kamui and counter-attack when Obito solidified. In order to do that, he had to properly time his attacks and utilizing his Shunshin when he doesn't have the speed to react properly using his own Shunshin speed (Ei vs. KCM Naruto being a good example of that) is contradictory to that.

Shunshin would have been pointless anyways as activating Kamui is faster than KCM Naruto's shunshin.

So Gai outperforming KCM Naruto against Obito to represent Kisame's inferiority is meaningless because not only was Kisame weakened, but KCM Naruto never used Shunshin at all in the first place. Have KCM Naruto engage Kisame in CQC and Kisame easily parries. KCM Naruto's normal speed hasn't been shown to be anything too impressive.

Seriously doubt the bold, when KCM Naruto was matching Edo Itachi in CQC. & KCM Naruto's normal speed is on par with EMS Sasuke's.

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How is that not impressive?

 

[Curse Mark]

When there are scans of Asuma parrying with the same man who was shown to do all that then we know the answer to this fight is not as obvious as it seems

Asuma barely blocked one blow. It was a one-handed sword slash that still broke through his guard.

 

[Draegod]

Asuma barely blocked one blow. It was a one-handed sword slash that still broke through his guard.

When he

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his soon to be

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? But when he was solo and injured he no diff

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while cannonly

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!

DO any of you read the manga? To think that sword would ever hit Asuma is the most foolish thing when its fact he couldn't canonically when solo.

 

[Lord Tywin]

Where the fuck is Toshit and his barking ass?

 

[EZQ]

Asuma barely blocked one blow. It was a one-handed sword slash that still broke through his guard.

Nope. Asuma dodged several strikes. He only got outperformed when he tried to block (because Kisame is stronger). But when he tried to dodge he managed perfectly.

 

[Draegod]

Nope. Asuma dodged several strikes. He only got outperformed when he tried to block (because Kisame is stronger). But when he tried to dodge he managed perfectly.

He was never out preformed. He for a fact last second stepped in front of Kurenai and blocked his would be blow (speed), held his ground despite his monster strength, and Since Kisame couldn't over power him blocking he opp't to pull back and shred asuma since he had the element of surprise. Kisame was out matched in that CQC so he then opp't to use ninjutsu which Kakashi then shat on.