Who would've won if Naruto and Sasuke fought at this level?

[KidGamer65]

Hashirama obviously has some way to counter Genjutsu since he's faced Madara many times, & even defeated him, but it's not like Naruto has faced multiple Sharingan users who used Genjutsu on him which he was able to counter each time himself.

Just your baseless assumption. :lol. Though you've pretty much confirmed my point. The double standards are amazing.

Genjutsu was shown to easily defeat those who couldn't counter, & Naruto himself can't counter. Keep in mind Sasuke even managed to get Danzo in Genjutsu without him even noticing until Sasuke revealed it, despite Danzo having decades of experience, known Uchiha all his life, and even had Sharingan for years, including Shisui's Ultimate Genjutsu. He was fully aware of Uchiha Sharingan Genjutsu, still got caught, yet Naruto doesn't?

Doesn't reply to a thing that I stated, mainly because we are talking about Naruto here, not Danzo. Different people with different movesets and abilities. Expect an actual counter when you can form one yourself that isn't baseless wank for your favorite character. K?

 

[Warlocks]

Sage Naruto
never seen any1 use Genjutsu on Sage Naruto

 

[Warlocks]

MS Sasuke can win hear. Naruto before he learn how to control and befriend Kurama dont have speed on Raikage level to dodge Ama at that point.

lol so you are saing sage naruto cant dodge Ama good then what are his sensing ability for

 

[To Whatever]

It depends on more than that. How would Naruto win?





If you payed enough attention then you would have noticed i did it both ways, hence talking about how long Sage Mode last, how Sasuke could counter Flying RS, which Naruto can only be done in SM, etc....if i didn't give him prep time then i would never have mentioned that because it would be irrelevant.

Besides, should we always give Naruto prep time advantage & not Sasuke? That's one sided. If Naruto gets prep time then so does Sasuke, which means he preps up Kirin.



He doesn't need MS to defeat SM Naruto. Sharingan Genjutsu is enough, as i mentioned in my first comment, which suppousedly was based on an unexpected meeting.

Im not talking about giving prep-time. I'm simply stating that this is SM Naruto VS MS Sasuke. At no point did the OP state they'd be starting in base which is what allowed you to make up your own scenarios.


He needs MS to fight SM Naruto. You're either underrating Toad Sage Mode or overrating Sasuke's genjutsu prowess.

 

[Ansatsuken]

lol so you are saing sage naruto cant dodge Ama good then what are his sensing ability for

For sensing any movements and not a chakra build up.

 

[Warlocks]

That requires prep time.



Susano'o Arrows were too fast for Danzo & Kakashi to physically dodge, which forced them to used Wood style/ Izanagi/ Kamui to counter.

Wood

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Izanagi

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Kamui

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Besides, he can only make a few clones in SM, & required two in order to help himself form a RS.

you think sm naruto slower then Danzo & Kakashi :wut:
sm naruto dodge 3rd raikage fastest attack or am i wrong

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[The Demon Hawk]

MS Sasuke > SM Naruto

 

[Warlocks]

The Toads were able to perform that jutsu due to the battlefield, which gave them a place to hide. For one, a battlefield was never given for this battle, so we don't know if they'll have a place to prep & two, you mention their Genjutsu yet not Sasuke's, which is far more convient then there's considering all it requires is eye contact, & they'll instantly be caught, Naruto along with his old toad buddies.

You know what's not instant? Their Genjutsu.

Naruto is not faster than Kakashi, SM Naruto has no speed feats, the only time Naruto was ever fast was with the Kyuubi's chakra. & he can't make a thousand clones if he uses Sage Mode, he can only make a few..i've already posted the pages in my first comment above.

now i know shouldn't have taken you seriously

 

[The Demon Hawk]

Naruto if he can use elder toads. Sasukle has no counter on sound genjutsu.

He can simply avoid getting caught in one. It requires prep time.

Naruto would win but it all depends on who runs out of chakra first

Sasuke has the dominant arsenal here. He'll most probably win. It really has nothing to do with who runs out of chakra first, because MS Sasuke and SM Naruto are not even.

Peak MS Sasuke would slaughter any Naruto who isn't War Arc.

It's about SM Naruto (not limited to any specific time period).

Well yeah, in a canon scenario. But in a hypothetical scenario he'd wreck.

MS Sasuke vs. Danzo can beat Pain Arc Naruto too though. High diff tho.

@bold Mid diff IMO. 3T Sasuke w/CM can have an even match against Pain Arc SM Naruto. MS Sasuke mid diffs, and he doesn't even need to go full MS power.

Most high tiers who aren't Uchiha don't have a Dojutsu or a being that lets them break Genjutsu. If I used this nonsense logic, I'd be running around here saying nonsense like "Madara neg diffs Hashirama because lol Genjutsu".

Having Genjutsu=/=Being able to land it.

LOL, WTH? Just because "having genjutsu =/= being able to land it" does not give you the right to remove genjutsu as a defeating factor. The chances are low, but not non-existent. If he lands it, it's neg to low diff.

Naruto and Sasuke have clashed several times during the manga.

Hospital rooftop
VOTE 1
Oro Hideout
Five Kage Summit bridge
VOTE 2


And not once has Sasuke ever used or tried to use genjutsu on Naruto. In fact, Sasuke has only ever used genjutsu in battle when he gets desperate. E.g Deidara, Bee, Danzo.

It's not something Sasuke is liable to use, even though he has it.

Sasuke not using genjutsu =/= Sasuke not being able to use genjutsu

Fighting from long range and can sense the entire battlefield with Sage Mode alone? Yeah, not happening. EMS Madara vs. Hashirama, who wins? :lol. Don't use "Sasuke has Genjutsu so he automatically wins" as an argument when you won't do the same for EMS Madara and Hashirama.

He included genjutsu as a defeating factor, not that Sasuke automatically wins with it.

Plus, where is the proof that Hashirama did not fell victim of genjutsu because Madara was unable to land it on him? If I say, Hashi had a counter to genjutsu, how'll you prove me wrong?

Just your baseless assumption. :lol. Though you've pretty much confirmed my point. The double standards are amazing.

So how's your assumption not baseless?

you think sm naruto slower then Danzo & Kakashi :wut:
sm naruto dodge 3rd raikage fastest attack or am i wrong

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Just because he has the reflexes to dodge 3rd Raikage's attack doesn't mean he's as fast as him in foot speed...

 

[SatanicGod]

Naruto and Sasuke have clashed several times during the manga.

Hospital rooftop
VOTE 1
Oro Hideout
Five Kage Summit bridge
VOTE 2


And not once has Sasuke ever used or tried to use genjutsu on Naruto. In fact, Sasuke has only ever used genjutsu in battle when he gets desperate. E.g Deidara, Bee, Danzo.

It's not something Sasuke is liable to use, even though he has it.

Hospital roof= Sasuke didn't even have Sharingan genjutsu at the time
VOTE1 - same as hospital roof
Oro Hideout- he did even better, he peered into his subconscious and suppressed Kyubi from giving Naruto more power
Kage Summit- Sasuke was freaking half blind, so his genjutsu would be horrible considering how it's been stated that you need to have a very detailed image of your surroundings in order to replicate it in the genjutsu. So how will the genjutsu be effective?
VOTE 2- He already had a run in with a Perfect Jin, he knows how that would work out

 

[Naruto X Hunter]

Just your baseless assumption. :lol. Though you've pretty much confirmed my point. The double standards are amazing.



Doesn't reply to a thing that I stated, mainly because we are talking about Naruto here, not Danzo. Different people with different movesets and abilities. Expect an actual counter when you can form one yourself that isn't baseless wank for your favorite character. K?

Okay, Hashirama didn't have a counter to Genjutsu yet somehow survived against Madara. He must have never used it then...

Sasuke & Naruto have been my top two favorite characters ever since i got into the story 10 years ago, but i'm not giving Naruto immunity to Genjutsu.

Yes, Naruto & Danzo are different, that's the point unlike Naruto, Danzo was very experienced with Genjutsu, still got caught without even noticing.

Naruto's only counter would be not looking into Sasuke's eyes.

Against Itachi right before he went to fight Sasuke, dude got caught in Genjutsu in an instant from looking into Itachi's eyes, despite knowing of his powers. Let's not forget how he used Rasengan on Nagato because he forgot he could absorb jutsu...yet he's suppoused to fight Sasuke a whole battle without looking in his eyes at all?

No chance of any slip ups?

Sure. If Naruto has Genjutsu casted on him, he's finished.

Sage Naruto
never seen any1 use Genjutsu on Sage Naruto

Poor excuse, & Sasuke has other ways to win. Genjutsu is one of the ways he can win.

Im not talking about giving prep-time. I'm simply stating that this is SM Naruto VS MS Sasuke. At no point did the OP state they'd be starting in base which is what allowed you to make up your own scenarios.


He needs MS to fight SM Naruto. You're either underrating Toad Sage Mode or overrating Sasuke's genjutsu prowess.

I based everything i said off the manga. I even posted the pages about Naruto, & the speed of Susano'os arrows.

Naruto has 2 RS per SM, & needs 2 clones to help him make an RS, which needs to be thrown from a distance. Sasuke is very fast. Hebi Sasuke has 4.5/5 in speed in the 3rd databook which covers up to chapter 403.

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He's fast enough to dodge RS, & at the very most he can block it with Full Susano'o, which should be able to handle it.

I'm not overrating his Genjutsu either. You're underestimating it & falsely assuming Naruto can counter.

 

[SIR UZMAKIMADARA]

SM Naruto wrecks mid diff.I have already proved 1000 of times why SM naruto is superior than MS Sasuke.

IF Danzou's weak ass wind style jutsu can open up susanoo then Sasuke has no counter against the most powerful wind technique a.k.a FRS.

SM Naruto's Frog kata can wreck sasuke which sasuke can't even detect

 

[Pukkake Pokayo]

How long did Sasuke keep susano up?
Does Naruto get SM clones?
Frog song rekts
SM has a natural aura (which frog kata consists of) to block ama.
Naruto also has plenty of decoys to tire Sasuke out.
FRS>Chidori

 

[Naruto X Hunter]

How long did Sasuke keep susano up?
Does Naruto get SM clones?
Frog song rekts

He used it extensively against Danzo, & you're acting as if he needs to use Susano'o the whole time. The question that needs to be asked is how long can Naruto main SM? You should actually read through threads before posting. I explained things in my first comment, & included the pages.

Naruto has 2 RS per SM, & needs 2 clones to help him make an RS, which needs to be thrown from a distance. Sasuke is very fast. Hebi Sasuke has 4.5/5 in speed in the 3rd databook which covers up to chapter 403.

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He's fast enough to dodge RS, & at the very most he can block it with Full Susano'o, which should be able to handle it.

He'll only need Susano'o briefly at most.

SM Naruto wrecks mid diff.I have already proved 1000 of times why SM naruto is superior than MS Sasuke.

IF Danzou's weak ass wind style jutsu can open up susanoo then Sasuke has no counter against the most powerful wind technique a.k.a FRS.

SM Naruto's Frog kata can wreck sasuke which sasuke can't even detect

Danzo specifically aimed for the weak spot, & was it a fully formed Susano'o? I don't remember.

Read what i said to Pokayo, i've already countered what both of you guys said on the first page.

 

[Chaosmark101]

Waiting for ChaosMark101 to counter me ^__^, & hey Gabba.

Oh trust me, I would have yesterday had Narutobase allowed me to log in. I will later once I'm not with friends.

(Pro tip: genjutsu is a non factor when SM Naruto can fight with his eyes closed)
Susanoo Arrows are dodged, & Amaterasu is countered by smoke bombs.

MS Sasuke's saving grace here is his V4 Susanoo

 

[Prometheus 2000]

How is it wank when without the Kyuubi's assistance, Naruto has no counter to High Level Genjutsu?

Please keep in mind that Naruto's capable of dispelling Genjutsu and he's not as vulnerable to like you're implying. This was made obvious within the series. Itachi, the best Genjutsu user in the series, acknowledged Naruto's skill when it came from dispelling Genjutsu. Naruto may have failed, but the fact is he's capable of dispelling it without Kurama.

Another thing you're not considering is the fact Naruto knows that not to look at the Sharingan when fighting against Uchiha. This was made clear when he encountered Itachi and Itachi only got the drop on him because Naruto didn't know that Itachi could use Genjutsu with a finger.

Lastly, MS Sasuke's Genjutsu wasn't on Itachi's level as described by Danzo. More evidence that suggests that Naruto's capable of overcoming it.

So given the fact that Naruto's capable of dispelling Genjutsu combined with the fact he knows not to look at the Sharingan directly, I highly doubt Sasuke would win with it.

 

[Naruto X Hunter]

Oh trust me, I would have yesterday had Narutobase allowed me to log in. I will later once I'm not with friends.

(Pro tip: genjutsu is a non factor when SM Naruto can fight with his eyes closed)
Susanoo Arrows are dodged, & Amaterasu is countered by smoke bombs.

MS Sasuke's saving grace here is his V4 Susanoo

When Sasuke charged at Kakashi, activated Susano'o, & launched an Arrow, Kakashi, who is known to be fast, only had enough time to use Kamui as a counter, yet Naruto would be able to pull out and throw spoke bombs?

Sasuke out moves RS which needs to be thrown from a distance. He doesn't even need Susano'o to block it.

Please keep in mind that Naruto's capable of dispelling Genjutsu and he's not as vulnerable to like you're implying. This was made obvious within the series. Itachi, the best Genjutsu user in the series, acknowledged Naruto's skill when it came from dispelling Genjutsu. Naruto may have failed, but the fact is he's capable of dispelling it without Kurama.

Another thing you're not considering is the fact Naruto knows that not to look at the Sharingan when fighting against Uchiha. This was made clear when he encountered Itachi and Itachi only got the drop on him because Naruto didn't know that Itachi could use Genjutsu with a finger.

Lastly, MS Sasuke's Genjutsu wasn't on Itachi's level as described by Danzo. More evidence that suggests that Naruto's capable of overcoming it.

So given the fact that Naruto's capable of dispelling Genjutsu combined with the fact he knows not to look at the Sharingan directly, I highly doubt Sasuke would win with it.

You should read threads fully before commenting.

Itachi was going easy on Naruto, Sharingan Genjutsu is on another level, as i stated above, Hebi Sasuke had a 4/5 in Genjutsu in the 3rd databook which covers up to chapter 403, MS Sasuke's Genjutsu is ofcourse better considering he has more power.

Sasuke's Genjutsu is weak compared to Itachi, who as you said is the best, but in general, Sasuke's Genjutsu is great. Also, i've already mentioned how later on when meeting Itachi again, Naruto still looked into his eyes, & was caught in Genjutsu easily, and i also mentioned how Naruto used Rasengan on Edo Nagato because he forgot he could absorb Jutsu.

It's possible Naruto could slip up, and look into Sasuke's eyes during battle. He hasn't trained to fight people with his eyes closed.

 

[Prometheus 2000]

- Danzou Giant Baku Multiplied the 4 Wind attacks that opened Susano'o back.

- Frog Kata use Senjutsu chakra and the Sharingan gives chakra colour /color.



- He has tried but never dispelled any genjutsu, not even Itachi base genjutsu.

Did you read everything else I said?

 

[Prometheus 2000]

I'm not getting involve the who'd win discussion that's going on, just correcting a few people with incorrect facts.

Your incorrect fact was about Naruto dispelling genjuts, so I informed you on the topic,

I see, but I acknowledged that Naruto failed to dispel Itachi's Genjutsu lol. That's Itachi's best skill and given that Sasuke is 'worlds apart' in comparison I honestly don't see why Naruto wouldn't be able to dispel it if it takes effect, especially since he knows the method of dispelling Genjutsu. This was before he learned better chakra control too.

 

[King of the Heavens]

He can simply avoid getting caught in one. It requires prep time.



Sasuke has the dominant arsenal here. He'll most probably win. It really has nothing to do with who runs out of chakra first, because MS Sasuke and SM Naruto are not even.



It's about SM Naruto (not limited to any specific time period).



@bold Mid diff IMO. 3T Sasuke w/CM can have an even match against Pain Arc SM Naruto. MS Sasuke mid diffs, and he doesn't even need to go full MS power.



LOL, WTH? Just because "having genjutsu =/= being able to land it" does not give you the right to remove genjutsu as a defeating factor. The chances are low, but not non-existent. If he lands it, it's neg to low diff.



Sasuke not using genjutsu =/= Sasuke not being able to use genjutsu



He included genjutsu as a defeating factor, not that Sasuke automatically wins with it.

Plus, where is the proof that Hashirama did not fell victim of genjutsu because Madara was unable to land it on him? If I say, Hashi had a counter to genjutsu, how'll you prove me wrong?



So how's your assumption not baseless?



Just because he has the reflexes to dodge 3rd Raikage's attack doesn't mean he's as fast as him in foot speed...

"Sasuke has the dominant arsenal here. He'll most probably win. It really has nothing to do with who runs out of chakra first, because MS Sasuke and SM Naruto are not even."

No he does not lightning is countered by wind techniques and naruto just needs to dodge the fire techniques. Sage Mode Naruto can fight with his eyes closed so Genjutsu don't work there and when it comes to taijutsu naruto just needs to frog Kata which sasuke can't sense or see and its game over the only thing that would work for him is susanoo. Sasuke couldn't handle a blind kabuto using sage mode and he didn't use genjutsu on him because he was told not to bother and Ems sasuke couldn't handle sage mode madara who was also blind coudn't even land a attack on any of them. So i don't see him doing anything different here other plot