Current Goku stats

Son Wukong

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Care to give me all your DB facts(Manga and DB). It seem like you're talking out of your ass here.

Other thing, Movies(Cooler, Broly, Janimba etc) is non-canon.

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Because of this you think the realm is quadrant size bla, bla, bla........

And that universe system only can be apply for DB story and not Natural universe story(its including universe physic) like Marvel, DC etc where they doesnt have any specific/identified form of existance
Beerus was going to destroy the Kaioshin Realm when he got pissed over something that was trivial. The Kaioshin realm is 10 percent the combined space of the Universe, the Afterlife which is as big as the Universe, and the Makai which has an unknown size. So Beerus can easily bust 20 percent of the Universe by itself.
 

Ansatsuken

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Beerus was going to destroy the Kaioshin Realm when he got pissed over something that was trivial. The Kaioshin realm is 10 percent the combined space of the Universe, the Afterlife which is as big as the Universe, and the Makai which has an unknown size. So Beerus can easily bust 20 percent of the Universe by itself.
That sound correct for Beerus capability

The one who's actually bs here is Lokid lol.
Exactly :bdpf:
 

Son Wukong

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Well Fat Buu wasa confirmed Universe Buster and for all buus in dbz it has been explicitly stated theu can cause destruction on a universal level. This is very plausible as super Buu could create dimensional rifts. Beerus was at a time weaker than Buu but he was still God of Destruction with enough power to wipe out the kaoishin realm.
The kaoishin realm is a mini universe/dimension bigger than a quadrant of the mortal universe. I believe they were Solar level far before cell as cooler said he could destroy the sun,the spirit bomb that failed to kill Frieza was powered by four suns(king kai noted how suns are assets to spirit bombs). In Friezas first form he could destroy a planet with ten times earth's gravity and his final form is nearly two hundred times stronger in the namek saga so cooler saying he could destroy a sun is plausible. Cell simply had an attack with a area of effect that matched the solar system but its potency is likely far beyond and could likely destroy more if the universe was condensed. Id switch Gokus flight and combat speed as ge can react wayyy faster than his flying speed(likely due to popos training) Gotenks was the first to show lightspeed travel but piccolo showed light speed attacks in early z.Broly ravaged a quadrant of the universe with less than super perfect cells power and its obvious he destroyed solar systems. In the guide book it shows how the universe is formed similar to ours but it jusy has different terminology.
Galaxy refers to quadrant but there are still "countless galaxies" in each quadrant. Kid Buu was at least able to wipe out two quardants as Beerus could destroy the kaoishin realm. At most kid buu could destroy the whole universe as elder kaoishin said that if buu wasn't beat he'd make the universe go "pop" . i have all the scans on my phone and i do constant research so please take my word for it. If kid buu can't destroy the universe Buuhan definitely can.
Now time to use all this to show how strong Goku is.
Gotenks moved ftl before the guidebook said he surpassed vegeta and co. And its obvious he reacts immensely faster. Gotenks improved in the time chamber and his ss3 form is child plays to Gohan.
Vegito made buuhan (someone who spanks kid buu the speculated universe buster) look like a child with a fraction of his true power but still would lose to suppressed Beerus.
Ssg Goku contended with a Beerus who shows way more power than needed to defeat Vegito and now Goku is greater than 70% Beerus. Atleast70 times stronger than universal threats and dimension rifters.
Concentrated attacks are yhe strongest so i think its bad to measure dbz power with area of effect as weakened frieza popped earth like a balloon but stronger attacks only left craters. When gotenks and buu ripped through dimensions it shouldve been obvious universal claims were plausible. Using the fact thst the kaoishin dimension is almost as big as a fourth of the universe but Super buu isnt nearly as strong as a tenty of beerus's current strength after training for millions of years with whis should make it obvious beerus is over universe busters in combat. The fact that new universes are being introduced should make it obvious. Namek was introduced after a planet buster was and the kaioshin dimension was introduced after buu was introduced. Beerus can wipe out the after life and mortal universe.
Goku is far beyond multi solar and past dimension rifting in attack potency his area of effect is unknown as goku doesn't aim to destroy.
Superman took am attack strong as 15 suns and it didn't destroy the moon so its obvious attacks can be a certain level without much catastrophe especially with martial arts.
Before anybody brings up the forty ton incident bukujitsu makes lifting nearly impossible according to the guidebook and Gokus bukujitsu was known as inferior to piccolo(who could fly with weights and goku could barely fly but goku was still stronger)
Goku before the god boost had enough force extered through his fist to displace a large portion of king kais planet with ten times gravity and condensed mass. When people on dbz forums did calculation they put his strength at white star level.




Ki Potency:post Universal/dimension rifting
Ki area of effect: At least greater than Broly's which could take many galaxies throughout a "galaxy"(quadrant).
Speed:Beerus's speed feat in super where he appeared behind a gas giant after destroying a planet was calculated to be 500 times the speed of light which makes sense if you think about the difference between him and Gotenks. Goku is likely above this as beerus was likely suppressed.
Combat speed/reaction speed:Massively faster than his travel speed as when goku was mach 28 in saiyan saga but piccolo and him had attacks that could near instantly reach space with pls less than a thousand.
Goku punched whis's hair in rof manga and it was referred to as a "close one" from tge fastest creature in the universe ,Whis.


This is all plausible as Gotenks was a dimension rifter faster than light who could compete with a universal destroyer or atleast dimension destroyer.
Goku is tiers above.
Unless he lets his gaurd down

Durability:Only post dimension rifters and Gods can hurt him now. Its better to use potency than area of effect.
Good research but the majority of feats you've used is non canon or a filler scene bro.
 

TimothyTheTomato

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Care to give me all your DB facts(Manga and DB). It seem like you're talking out of your ass here.

Other thing, Movies(Cooler, Broly, Janimba etc) is non-canon.

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Because of this you think the realm is quadrant size bla, bla, bla........

And that universe system only can be apply for DB story and not Natural universe story(its including universe physic) like Marvel, DC etc where they doesnt have any specific/identified form of existance

Shaking the realm(Afterlife realm, Kai realm etc) from power up do not mean all DB characters that able to performed it could bust the universe.

And not all Dimension is size of natural universe especially in fiction. Franklin Richard can create a small universe(Pocket dimension) on the palm of his hand but still a universe

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Ansatsuken

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[/SPOILER]
How they know Buu can destroyed the universe when he never shown that feat before? What I just saw here is mere statements. At least they(Kaio, Goku etc) need to shows Kid Buu destroyed the universe once(flashback) and universe is fixed/created back using unknown method.

This kind of thing need feats because its above/beyond planet buster. Universe is not celestial body like Suns/planets. Although we never saw Goku bust a planet but he can according to scaling from frieza.

Statement couldn't help your case here.
 

TimothyTheTomato

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Good research but the majority of feats you've used is non canon or a filler scene bro.
Only cooler and broly but they kinda made sense
Remember how king kai said the solar systems big sun would make the spirit bomb strong .
Namek has three stars in it's system and frieza lived.
So is it impossible to say he could destroy a sun.
Gotenks moved ftl
Cell games goku reacted mfl
Gokus ki is more than enough to rip through dimensions by a factor of over 100
Buu could destroy the universe
Early age beerus could destroy the kaoishib realm
The Broly movie may be noncannon but Akira mostly wrote it. He should be OK for a reference point but okay I won't use him.
Only filler I used was goku and Frieda mountain collapsing but it isn't that impressive anyway.
More cannon feats can include moon busting super Kamehamehas in db and piccolo tanking a stronger one.
Raditz dodging Special beam cannon
I can support travel speed <combat with gokus speed on snake way and his fighting style incorporating popos"clear your soul then move fast as lightning " training for combat
Frieza destroying a planet with ten times earth gravity,planet vegeta, in his first form
Frieza kicked away vegetas planet buster
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TimothyTheTomato

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How they know Buu can destroyed the universe when he never shown that feat before? What I just saw here is mere statements. At least they(Kaio, Goku etc) need to shows Kid Buu destroyed the universe once(flashback) and universe is fixed/created back using unknown method.

This kind of thing need feats because its above/beyond planet buster. Universe is not celestial body like Suns/planets. Although we never saw Goku bust a planet but he can according to scaling from frieza.

Statement couldn't help your case here.
Akira Toryama is stating it through the characters repeatedly. These statements are based of power sensing.
We know cell can destroy a solar system cause he said. Akira wouldn't have this repeated more than once if it was bullshit.
Come on son
Three characters said it and you think it's bullshit.
Ripping through dimensions is the nessacary feat.
 

TimothyTheTomato

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Beerus is definitely Galaxy+ level, we don't know whether he could one shot the Kaioshin realm or not, so its all speculation. Buu should be solar system+ level. Dimensional feats are unquantifiable, and the scene where he was going to destroy the universe was a filler.
In an Interview Akira said Beerus sealed Elder Kaoishin away as an alternative to destroying the realm so no it's not speculation. This was confirmed in super.
Az eleon obviously down plays dbz and should just leave cause he's denying simple explicitly stated shit like Akira need to lie about his characters or something.
Dimensional feats show potency
Busting shows area of effect
If Buus ki is that potent is Kaioshin Piccolo And Gokus statement really that hard to believe
 

Ansatsuken

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Akira Toryama is stating it through the characters repeatedly. These statements are based of power sensing.
We know cell can destroy a solar system cause he said. Akira wouldn't have this repeated more than once if it was bullshit.
Come on son
Three characters said it and you think it's bullshit.
Ripping through dimensions is the nessacary feat.
I can believe Cell ability to bust Solar system because it is within reach even without feat.

But you need to take into consideration characters knowledge. Energy sensing? Energy sensing cant be the determinant. Also the context of the words "destroying the universe" from Toriyama POV/idea as writer.

I think he meant Kid Buu will destroy all Galaxies inside the universe=to destroying the universe as no galaxies left inside vast space and time.

Ripping through dimension doesnt mean Buu can destroying a universe. Obito open up a hole on Kaguya's dimension, do you think he can destroy the universe?
 

TimothyTheTomato

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I can believe Cell ability to bust Solar system because it is within reach even without feat.

But you need to take into consideration characters knowledge. Energy sensing? Energy sensing cant be the determinant. Also the context of the words "destroying the universe" from Toriyama POV/idea as writer.

I think he meant Kid Buu will destroy all Galaxies inside the universe=to destroying the universe as no galaxies left inside vast space and time.

Ripping through dimension doesnt mean Buu can destroying a universe. Obito open up a hole on Kaguya's dimension, do you think he can destroy the universe?
Obito isn't in dbz wtf. The dimensional rip but from sheer volume and intensity of ki. Enough energy to blast through space time without any telaportation.
They talked of his universal destruction as something spontaneous .
 

TimothyTheTomato

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Beerus was going to destroy the Kaioshin Realm when he got pissed over something that was trivial. The Kaioshin realm is 10 percent the combined space of the Universe, the Afterlife which is as big as the Universe, and the Makai which has an unknown size. So Beerus can easily bust 20 percent of the Universe by itself.
Elder Kaoishin said Beerus was weaker than super buy when he mentioned the person who sealed him away in the buy saga. Since than Beerus has been training with whis for five billion plus years and surpassed vegito. 20% is the bare bare minimum
 

Ansatsuken

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Obito isn't in dbz wtf. The dimensional rip but from sheer volume and intensity of ki. Enough energy to blast through space time without any telaportation.
They talked of his universal destruction as something spontaneous .
It same like what Obito did. Buu just created a hole between Time Chamber Dimension and Reality dimension by shouting. He rip open the dimensional wall that connecting Time Chamber dimension and Reality dimension.

Obito open up a portal by creating a hole between Kaguya's core dimension and other dimensions using Kamui. He literally rip open the dimensional wall that connected two dimensions together. Obito not teleported there

In the end the hole itself is closing.

What, you think that can be qualified as Universe busting power?

Many people in fiction has bust a hole between two dimensions. Check Bastard manga.
 

TimothyTheTomato

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It same like what Obito did. Buu just created a hole between Time Chamber Dimension and Reality dimension by shouting. He rip open the dimensional wall that connecting Time Chamber dimension and Reality dimension.

Obito open up a portal by creating a hole between Kaguya's core dimension and other dimensions using Kamui. He literally rip open the dimensional wall that connected two dimensions together. Obito not teleported there

In the end the hole itself is closing.

What, you think that can be qualified as Universe busting power?

Many people in fiction has bust a hole between two dimensions. Check Bastard manga.
It'd be the same if it was caused by Chakra amount. But in naruto it's caused by space time techniques. Goku knows instant transmission cause he was taught it not cause he was strong. Both Gotenks and Buu did it cause of their power. But one can't learn i.t because of power or speed. Gotenks couldn't do it till he transformed cause he needed the power
 
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Son Wukong

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That's called unquantifiable feat abuse. Dimensions can be as big as a universe or as small as a room. Gotenks and Buu demonstrated their ability to rip a small hole in that dimension, but its impossible to quantify that feat. there is no translating that into a decernable strength level, so it's moot.
 
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Son Wukong

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Yes Buu can destroy the Universe OVERTIME. Kid Buu demonstated chain reaction destruction only (planet by planet). I'm not lowballing him to be planet level cuz that's obviously not his full potential. He could probably one shot multi solar systems.
 

Son Wukong

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I don't know why people even try to classify this as a "power" feat. It's just dimensional travel and completely unquantifiable in terms of energy requirements.
 

Son Wukong

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That Gotenks feat isn't FTL. He circled the Earth 5 times in a second. That's not even light speed that's relativistic. Light could go around the Earth 7.5 times in one second. Although, I do agree that Gotenks currently is FTL if scaled.
 

Son Wukong

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It same like what Obito did. Buu just created a hole between Time Chamber Dimension and Reality dimension by shouting. He rip open the dimensional wall that connecting Time Chamber dimension and Reality dimension.

Obito open up a portal by creating a hole between Kaguya's core dimension and other dimensions using Kamui. He literally rip open the dimensional wall that connected two dimensions together. Obito not teleported there

In the end the hole itself is closing.

What, you think that can be qualified as Universe busting power?

Many people in fiction has bust a hole between two dimensions. Check Bastard manga.
This ^
 
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