Agree with your post except on one account. Minato really shouldn't be faster than Naruto in KCM. Their reaction feats where about equal, and Sasuke was keeping up with them in footspeed as well as reactions. (Though the former 2 have a faster Shunshin)
Minato wouldn't get faster with BM either. There were multiple times he synced with Kurama and his cloak still stayed as KCM. Naruto is the only one that gets that benifit. Though the fanfictional BSM boosts his speed up a pretty good amount.
Totally forgot about that, but while we're on the subject. How do we know that BM is faster than KCM? They are considered to be the same state when it comes to databooks, except one looks difference since Naruto uses that form with Kurama Mode. Not to mention they've both been paralleled to Minato and they both make the same flash. And if it is faster, by how much?
Totally forgot about that, but while we're on the subject. How do we know that BM is faster than KCM? They are considered to be the same state when it comes to databooks, except one looks difference since Naruto uses that form with Kurama Mode. Not to mention they've both been paralleled to Minato and they both make the same flash. And if it is faster, by how much?
There's not much that definately proves that Naruto's BM cloak is faster than KCM, but there are a bunch of small hints. Like his speed feats seem much more impressive but don't have anything easy to quantify. Plus I find it hard to believe that SM alone would have boosted his KCM speed to the point where he could keep up with Juubito.
Although If they have the same speed then your scaling with BSM still stands. Sasuke isn't blitzing Minato either way
The length of the time he had Susanoo isn't going to change how his chakra would grow. Madara and Adult Sasuke are most likely the in same age range, so they've lived the same amount of years and had the same amount of time for their chakra to develop. Madara's chakra has always been humongous and has always been the strongest in his clan.
I'm suggesting he's more proficient with it given he can manifest a sole head of PS. And Madara and Sasuke have the strongest chakra because they are Indra's reincarnates. Kyuubi stated Sasuke's chakra is just as powerful as Madara's. Only difference was quantity, but I'd presume after 12 years they are roughly equal.
Yes. I agree that regular Bijuu Dama is tanked by Sasuke's Susanoo. Flash Bijuu Dama alone isn't doing "slight" damage. Let alone with Senjutsu. We already saw what a regular RSM Bijuu Dama and equal Chidori did to Sasuke's Susanoo at VoTE. Downscale and you get EMS Sasuke. Flash Bijuu Dama would do much more damage, and Senjutsu Flash BD would do even more. What Sasuke took at VoTE was low end moderate damage. What he would take from Minato's BD is high end moderate damage. Upscale to EMS Madara's Susanoo and the damage would still be moderate, but nowhere near as bad as it was for EMS Sasuke's. So yeah, it won't smash it, but more than one will smash it.
Since when is Minato adept enough with SM to fuse Senjutsu with his Kurama avatar? He needed Naruto to add his Senjutsu chakra to the Rasengan [
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]. So suggesting Minato will start off with a SM avatar is rather fallacious given he didn't even do that versus a Juubi Jin. So Flash Bijuu Dama is certainly not doing damage on the level you are suggesting.
Lmao. Why would that stop Minato from using it more than once? Hell, not only has Sasuke never been able to teleport an attack coming right at him away, even if he did that, it'd hit Minato's Avatar then he'd teleport it right back since he can warp things that touch his chakra. Whether it's to a marking on the field or a marking far away doesn't matter. Either Sasuke takes the damage like planned, or Minato escapes the blast altogether.
What do you mean? I am suggesting every time Minato attempts Flash Bijuu Dama Sasuke Ameno's it onto Minato mid-preperation. Sure, he can teleport it away because it's linked to his chakra, but there's no reason to assume Kunai's will be present in the battlefield since 1 PS shockwave destroys the entire ground, just like 1 PS shockwave destroyed the entire Mokuton forest Madara created. Minato cannot spam Flash Bijuu Dama. I don't know where this argument is coming from anyways.
Uh, no. You can say that about leveling up the eyes, but not about maturing your chakra. Not only is there no basis for this, Indra has his father's chakra. There is no getting close to that without getting Hagoromo's chakra yourself.
He said it's chakra power was so strong that he almost lost himself, but if he had such a boost in chakra potency, then you would see it in his speed and strength too and not just his Ninjutsu.
Although I agree that there's no noticeable power boost that I recall, I'd still assume if it became his eye then the power within it would transfer to him too, as do its constituent jutsu.
He doesn't need to teleport himself around. If Sasuke scatters his Kunai with Hiraishin (they won't be destroyed) then that just gives him a clear counter to when and if Sasuke decides to use Ameno to warp BD back to him.
How would they not be destroyed by a PS shockwave that can slice mountains like they are butter? But anyways, he can't spam Flash Bijuu Dama, so the notion that Minato is at an advantage against Sasuke every time he teleports a Flash Bijuu Dama away is false. What will he do once he no longer can use Flashi Bijuu Dama? Teleport around? Because he sure as hell won't have any method to scratch his PS.
-It's implied that he meant potent/menacing chakra.
-He said eyes with such chakra and power and then compared him to Madara.
-Stated it was superior to his own.
Stop denying manga facts. Kyuubi stated chakra AND power. How can power be sinister? Let alone superior in being sinister? Makes no sense. Not to mention he said it's comparable to madara's, not equal to.
Stop denying manga facts. Kyuubi stated chakra AND power. How can power be sinister? Let alone superior in being sinister? Makes no sense. Not to mention he said it's comparable to madara's, not equal to.
You do know that Kurama senses emotions right? He sensed his emotions and said it's sinister. His chakra was sinister. Sinister means cold and evil. Meaning his chakra was as cold as Madaras at that point of time. Don't know what your point is here.
You do know that Kurama senses emotions right? He sensed his emotions and said it's sinister. His chakra was sinister. Sinister means cold and evil. Meaning his chakra was as cold as Madaras at that point of time. Don't know what your point is here.
Dude, emotion sensing has absolutely nothing to do with his statement. That is completely out of context. Statement 1=eyes with such power. Statement 2=and chakra even more powerful then my own. Statement 3=not at all unlike Madara aka he's comparing them.
ANYWAYS, this is completely irrelevant as they both have the same maximum potential chakra-potency wise, both of them being Indra reincarnates. So even if that statement was never made in the first place, one can insinuate Sasuke would be at the same level once he reaches his age both being prodigies, both being PS users and both being Indra's reincarnates with the same Chuko Tomoes.
Dude, emotion sensing has absolutely nothing to do with his statement. That is completely out of context. Statement 1=eyes with such power. Statement 2=and chakra even more powerful then my own. Statement 3=not at all unlike Madara aka he's comparing them.
ANYWAYS, this is completely irrelevant as they both have the same maximum potential chakra-potency wise, both of them being Indra reincarnates. So even if that statement was never made in the first place, one can insinuate Sasuke would be at the same level once he reaches his age both being prodigies, both being PS users and both being Indra's reincarnates with the same Chuko Tomoes.
Smh. He says eyes with such power, and chakra even more sinister than my own. Meaning when he was talking about power, he meant eye power. Why would he compare his eye power to his own? Kurama has no dojutsu.
You said this:
''Kyuubi stated Sasuke's chakra is just as powerful as Madara's''
And I said this:
''He didn't state that Sasuke's chakra is more powerful or as powerful, but sinister.''
Sorry Apex, but Kurama referred to the evil in Sasuke's chakra relative to Madara's. Sasuke's Chakra doesn't even compare to Madara's when Madara has far superior chakra thanks to having a far superior dojutsu than Sasuke.
Kurama's Chakra is considered to be one of the strongest in the entire manga. Do you seriously believe an undeveloped Uchiha would have one of the strongest Chakras in the manga?
Smh. He says eyes with such power, and chakra even more sinister than my own. Meaning when he was talking about power, he meant eye power. Why would he compare his eye power to his own? Kurama has no dojutsu.
You said this:
''Kyuubi stated Sasuke's chakra is just as powerful as Madara's''
And I said this:
''He didn't state that Sasuke's chakra is more powerful or as powerful, but sinister.''
Sorry Apex, but Kurama referred to the evil in Sasuke's chakra relative to Madara's. Sasuke's Chakra doesn't even compare to Madara's when Madara has far superior chakra thanks to having a far superior dojutsu than Sasuke.
Kurama's Chakra is considered to be one of the strongest in the entire manga. Do you seriously believe an undeveloped Uchiha would have one of the strongest Chakras in the manga?
Ok. Once again, doesn't change anything. Kurama's chakra is still weaker then Sasuke's, and yes, I do believe one of the strongest chakra's in the manga can be inferior to that of an 'underdeveloped' Uchiha who is Indra's reincarnate. Not that it matters, because it is implicative that Sasuke having his EMS for ~14 years would mature him enough to the point to were his chakra potency is roughly equal to Madara's; same with chakra quantity. So it's basically an EMS Madara with Enton and a Rinnegan vs BM Minato.
Useless arguing this as it is interpretable in different ways. Which is why I added the second part of my post.
Ok. Once again, doesn't change anything. Kurama's chakra is still weaker then Sasuke's, and yes, I do believe one of the strongest chakra's in the manga can be inferior to that of an 'underdeveloped' Uchiha who is Indra's reincarnate. Not that it matters, because it is implicative that Sasuke having his EMS for ~14 years would mature him enough to the point to were his chakra potency is roughly equal to Madara's; same with chakra quantity. So it's basically an EMS Madara with Enton and a Rinnegan vs BM Minato.
How is it an assumption that two Indra reincarnates both of which possessing Choku Tomoe would end up being roughly equal to on another chakra-potency wise? It's implicative.
Edit: Especially since they are parallels and share many identical abilities and traits.
How is it an assumption that two Indra reincarnates both of which possessing Choku Tomoe would end up being roughly equal to on another chakra-potency wise? It's implicative.
I didn't say it's a fact, I said it's implicative. You can choose not to believe it and I couldn't care less. It's my personal opinion that EMS Sasuke would be as powerful as EMS Madara 10 years+ from the point of vote, if not more powerful. He has Rinnegan here too, which adds quite a bit to his power in this fight.
War Arc Sasuke was keeping up with a Naruto and Minato who didn't use Shunshin. His top speed is on par with Naruto's regular foot speed w/o Shunshin, and he was only reacting as fast as these guys. Has jack shit to do with his actual movement speed.
Also them having a faster shunshin is irrelevant because its not like a blitz argument is ever going to happen furthermore this is adult Sasuke name a ninja who was at the peak of their speed at 17 years old you cant so Sasuke would be much faster than Minato.
KMC Naruto's foot speed without shunshin is pretty impressive and we've seen Sasuke use his shunshin in susanoo to counter's juubito's attack which im sure is just a fast and if not faster than V2 Ei top speeded punch.
Get me proof that Adult Sasuke would be faster than BSM Minato. Ameno does need striking speed to be effective, if it didn't, then Kaguya would've gotten tagged by Sasuke, twice. Smh. End of story, please don't try and ignore Manga evidence by claiming some "plot" bullshit or whatever you'd foolishly try to claim.
Give you proof is that he was near Minato's speed as a teenager his speed along with everything else in his arsenal increase furthermore as i said at vote we saw sasuke blitz rsm without boost that would be a stronger bsm naruto im pretty sure Adult Naruto if you take away his chakra who'd be much faster than bsm naruto actually im positive, That being Said adult Sasuke would still be able to blitz that naruto like he did at vote making him much faster than Bsm Minato easily.
But did you not see the Madara scan Kishi chose not to let Sasuke use amenotijikara in that way same as he made Kaguya not use the ice dimension when she was about to sealed even though Sasuke can break it it would not be broken faster in the time that she could hop through a dimension portal also why did she not use her hair spikes again? We can say that about alot of things in the manga but in a versus thread they're going to use them abilities Sasuke has shown multiply times where he makes contact the moment he warps himself or objects.
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all those are instances of him warping right into his opponent or friend no striking speed needed Minato is diced up.
Just because the Manga is in still pictures, doesn't mean that he teleported Madara to his attack. Sasuke thrust forward, Naruto thrust foward, and Madara was teleported and then hit. Do you realize how dumb you sound? That's because no one who reads the Manga correctly would argue that Sasuke w/ PS and a regular Rinnegan w/o no special chakra would win.
No only you would say that Sasuke does not win you're a joke EMS Madara would defeat BSM Minato or Naruto yet someone clearly above that level would lose. Also how is this a counter to my post your desperately trying to pick apart what happened in the scan Sasuke clearly teleported Madara into his attack
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Sasuke clearly tells Naruto to aim at him meaning he indeed warped Madara right at the moment of impact limited to no striking speed able to dodge or block and what are you even talking about manga still and pictures? Madara was clearly warped into the attack even Madara was looking shocked about what Sasuke means when he tells Naruto to aim at him and he was still in the exact same shock position when he was hit with the combo. your attempt at deny logic is not good at denying logic.
Read the Manga pal. Not only did Naruto react to Sasuke, Sasuke had to use a fireball to distract and occupy the guy just so he could have a better chance at blitzing him.
A fireball to distract the best sensor in the series? No Naruto can see through his sensory abilities i dont need to post the scan for you to know that furthermore Naruto can make chakra arms in cloak to block a simply chidori he was blitz plain in simple do i need to bring older post from you stating the same thing because we know how inconsistent you are.
Not to mention your attempt to downscale is pathetic. If you take away Hagoromo's Senjutsu from Naruto and Hagoromo's chakra from Sasuke, you are left with a Naruto w/ no Senjutsu, BM Naruto, and EMS Sasuke. If EMS Sasuke had Ameno, if he used a distraction he'd be able to tag BM Naruto, but BM Naruto would still react. BSM Naruto would react even faster and not be tagged. BSM Minato is faster than BM Naruto and BSM Naruto considering he's always been faster. Give them the same buffs and the faster one isn't debatable. So nice job ignoring Manga fact.
Why would Naruto be left with no senjutsu? Considering he had it way before he ever meet hagoromo from the toads your logic is not making since again with this distraction nonsense child please slap yourself if you're believing the best sensor can be distracted by a fire ball that's not even the size of a chakra hand. You cannot react to something that warps you right into the attack or warps an attack right on to you that simply i'll use Juubito as an example he's a juubi jin level sensor yet was caught off guard multiply times with Tobirama's jutsu
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There is no doubt that Juubito has the speed and reaction to counter a ftg plus attack but why did he get hit so many times with his because no striking speed was required he countered it later with chakra arms because he knew where they would be coming from Sasuke's jutsu is like that except he can hit you from the front back side top and bottom making they're 0 counters to it that simple. So Minato reacting is impossible. To shit on the rest of your dum post This is adult Sasuke who's is much faster than his teenage self so its still goodnight for Minato.
If EMS Sasuke can't tag BM Naruto w/o him reacting, he won't tag Minato who is faster than BSM Naruto. Minato either reacts and counters or he throws a Kunai behind Sasuke and blitzes him with Hiraishin. You are going to have to prove that Adult Sasuke is so much faster that he'll bridge the gap between BM Naruto, BSM Naruto, and BSM Minato, cause when Naruto got Senjutsu, he went from being blitzed by Juubito to tracking Juubito and reacting.
Do not try to overestimate the boost of a sage mode that did not stop him from bring nearly blitz by Madara which adult Sasuke should be faster than also Juubito blitz km Naruto he never went against bm Naruto until he activated sage mode with his cloak so you saying going from being blitz to tracking and reacting is irrelevant. How is Minato faster than BM Naruto his cloak did not change upon his avatar usage they're the same speed or Naruto is faster. Throwing a kunai behind Sasuke and blitzing him really do you think he's going up against base naruto or somebody? Minato throws his kunai warps out of it goes in for the stab his chest gets ran through by Sasuke kusangi just like what happen to a much faster Madara it it will pierce his sword pierced a must stronge cloak in Adult Naruto
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that little plan or idea needs to be thrown out the window. Furthermore Minato does not even have the striking speed to catch Sasuke off as a teen he was able to read juubito's movements who is much above Minato as an adult he comfortably dodges his attack then kills him.
Wrong. The panel below shows that Naruto hasn't lost a single tail. PS's slashes were tanked by Kurama's blades. Easily at that. Running a stream of Raiton down isn't going to give it PS Slash+Chidori's power. Do you even realize how stupid you sound right now? Chidori Katana is nowhere near as strong as Chidori, considering one pierced Ay and the other bounced off his damn neck.
The panel belows show nothing like that all we seen is naruto tails looking conjoined together for one big tail and you say that aswell nice try but hell no
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you can clearly see the 2 tails that countered his perfect susanoo slash are cut clean off and shorter than the others unless your grasping at straws so much you try disecting the manga panles. No one said it would be as strong as chidori without chidori stream it was cut the part of the tail it made contact with off so with it cuts clean through like butter.
Then there's the fact that Sasuke has only used Chidori or Raiton with PS after gaining Hagoromo's power. Stop using Rikudo Chakra Sasuke's feats in an attempt to prove your point.
Then there's the fact that Hagoromo's chakra does not give you new mastery over your abilities and combinations that comes with them furthermore this is adult sasuke without Hagoromo boost he gets all his feats his abilities are just scaled down to a level where he does not fodder everyone so your point is moot.
I just gave you proof read above you clown and like i said in that thread when i made you concede when your back against the wall your only argument is proof ***** get a new word its getting old.
Lol, are you dumb? How the hell is Sasuke going to hit Minato when he's flying that high? Do you even think before you post? Stop giving me Rikudo Chakra Sasuke feats please. I don't care for them since he lacks that chakra here.
As i said above Sasuke has all his feats just scaled down to reasonable levels that simple you even claim he has amenotejikara which is a just comprised of his rinnegan which is only possibly through Hagoromo's chakra you give him that but you try to give him his other abilities why because you know they'd be a problem even amenotejikara is a problem but you underestimated it. Him flying that high was in a response to you saying a charged bijuu dama would pose any sort of threat to sasuke you fuu furthermore turning him to chibaku tensei's core he can do form that high up so Sasuke can still whack him.
Considering i just spanked you and made you concede im feeling pretty good about going up against you i already explained what happens in the scenario as to why Sasuke would still spank him.
At the very best it'd be as strong as EMS Madara's, and even then there's no proof that it is. EMS Madara can handle regular Bijuu Dama from Minato, but anything larger than that starts to do damage, and a Senjutsu enhanced Flash Bijuu Dama does moderate damage. 2-3 of those and his Susanoo is finished. In the meanwhile, he can't even hurt Minato that badly due to Senjutsu enhanced Kurama Avatar.
Stop overrated BSM it literally has not shown anything better than bm in that's real shit Sasuke susanoo would be stronger than Madara's due to him having stronger chakra. You claim a flash bijuu dama would destroy a susanoo and he's where i shit on you with your own logic you claimed that Madara's Perfect susanoo is stronger than Sasuke's the one he used when they fought juubito becuse you said that was how strong Sasuke perfect susanoo would be and you scaled that to vote which sasuke susanoo at vote took only facial damage from a bijuu dama with a fairly large explosion so that would mean (going by your logic here) that sasuke susanoo from the juubito fight would equal Naruto's BSM Kurama and while Madara's was stronger than Sasuke's it would take even less damage from an attack you see your logic does not add up because your a very inconsistent person when your trying to help your own arguments.
Your delusional to think that perfect susanoo cannot hurt a bsm kurama when it was destroyed be a simply floor throwing Sasuke amenotejikara right on top of Minato's Avatar is cuts its head off like how he punched kurama's avatar at VOTE he does that but with his sword and a disection.
