DA's Simple Tier List

[Thesaurus]

Oh, they'd both lose. But it's probably around mid diff at the easiest. Mid-high diff at the hardest. It's enough for him to narrowly get into Tier 7, but he can't go 2 tiers above them. Especially when the only person in Tier 6 (Sasuke, B doesn't belong as we both agree) would obliterate him with minor effort once he used his full power. He'd have to be able to beat them low diff if he wanted to go 2 tiers above them.



Not sure why he needs one when he's been stated and portrayed to one up Tobirama when it comes to speed. Tier 7 is good. I can agree that Tier 8 is a bit low.



Lmao, I figured as much.

True, true.

Speed as in Hirashin and Shunshin wise. His reaction feats and ability to think swiftly are still beyond that of Minato's if you compare them side by side. Tobirama's much quicker to act in all situations.

I think tier 9 can be split into 3 different tiers, the power levels vary tremendously, from 3rd Raikage to Kakuzu.

 

[Ghost in the Shell]

Tier 9:

- War Arc Gaara
- MS Sasuke (Danzo Fight)
- Mortal Itachi
- Kisame
- Kakuzu (<- This guy gets some shitty matchups in this tier though)
- Deidara
- Sasori
- Danzo
- Muu
- Ohnoki
- Third Raikage
- Second Mizukage
- SM Jiriaya
- Orochimaru
- Edo Tensei Hiruzen

 

[DrProof]

They all belong. Sasori easily competes, Deidara & Kakuzu have to work for it though.

 

[KidGamer65]

True, true.

Speed as in Hirashin and Shunshin wise. His reaction feats and ability to think swiftly are still beyond that of Minato's if you compare them side by side. Tobirama's much quicker to act in all situations.

I think tier 9 can be split into 3 different tiers, the power levels vary tremendously, from 3rd Raikage to Kakuzu.

Hiraishin wise? That's determinant on your reaction speed and reflexes. If Minato's Hiraishin is considered faster, then it means that he has faster reaction speed than Tobirama.

List those situations. Don't remember any scenarios where their reaction speed could be compared.

How would you split up Tier 9?

 

[Thesaurus]

Hiraishin wise? That's determinant on your reaction speed and reflexes. If Minato's Hiraishin is considered faster, then it means that he has faster reaction speed than Tobirama.

List those situations. Don't remember any scenarios where their reaction speed could be compared.

How would you split up Tier 9?

Rather it takes longer to execute whatever mechanism is needed to initiate Hirashin [

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]. At least from my interpretation of that scan.

When I said quicker to act I meant mindfully quicker, as in always ready for anything, unlike Minato. Only thing I can think of is this [

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] right now. Minato in disbelief while Tobirama has already initiated a counter attack.

Tier 9 in my opinion could become:
Sandaime Raikage
Zetsu Orochimaru (presumed capability to have some form of SM with his fit body)
Mu and Onoki
Itachi/Sasuke
Gaara
Kisame

Then a tier below it as 9.5 going
SM Jiraiya
Sasori
Kakuzu
Deidara
Danzo
Second Mizukage
Edo Tensei Hiruzen

There's a clear power difference between the two.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

Rather it takes longer to execute whatever mechanism is needed to initiate Hirashin [

You must be registered for see links

]. At least from my interpretation of that scan.

When I said quicker to act I meant mindfully quicker, as in always ready for anything, unlike Minato. Only thing I can think of is this [

You must be registered for see links

] right now. Minato in disbelief while Tobirama has already initiated a counter attack.

Tier 9 in my opinion could become:
Sandaime Raikage
Zetsu Orochimaru (presumed capability to have some form of SM with his fit body)
Mu and Onoki
Itachi/Sasuke
Gaara
Kisame

Then a tier below it as 9.5 going
SM Jiraiya
Sasori
Kakuzu
Deidara
Danzo
Second Mizukage
Edo Tensei Hiruzen

There's a clear power difference between the two.

Disgraceful to place SM Jiraiya in the same tier as Sasori, Kakuzu, and Deidara

 

[LuckyMan]

Rather it takes longer to execute whatever mechanism is needed to initiate Hirashin [

You must be registered for see links

]. At least from my interpretation of that scan.

When I said quicker to act I meant mindfully quicker, as in always ready for anything, unlike Minato. Only thing I can think of is this [

You must be registered for see links

] right now. Minato in disbelief while Tobirama has already initiated a counter attack.

Tier 9 in my opinion could become:
Sandaime Raikage
Zetsu Orochimaru (presumed capability to have some form of SM with his fit body)
Mu and Onoki
Itachi/Sasuke
Gaara
Kisame

Then a tier below it as 9.5 going
SM Jiraiya
Sasori
Kakuzu
Deidara
Danzo
Second Mizukage
Edo Tensei Hiruzen

There's a clear power difference between the two.

Didnt Minato say before that scan that he would just take the blast with him but Tobirama clone appeared and did it for him?

 

[Thesaurus]

Didnt Minato say before that scan that he would just take the blast with him but Tobirama clone appeared and did it for him?

Minato was reaching for it [

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], but was far slower than Tobirama coming from where he had just self-exploded. That would mean Tobirama was much quicker to act, no?

Disgraceful to place SM Jiraiya in the same tier as Sasori, Kakuzu, and Deidara

Is it really now? Deidara has a chance. I'd be inclined to say even Sasori does have an ever so slight chance. Everyone in the tier above beats him barring Kisame.

 

[Dying Soldier]

SM Jiraiya quite literally shitsmacks Sasori into the next dimension.

He also beats Orochimaru, Mu, Onoki, Gaara, and Kisame in that tier of yours.

 

[LuckyMan]

Minato was reaching for it [

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], but was far slower than Tobirama coming from where he had just self-exploded. That would mean Tobirama was much quicker to act, no?

Not necessarily, in the end Minato would have done what Tobirama did and got the blast away.

Base Minato has already been hyped and portrayed over Tobirama in speed throughout the series and the idea that KCM Minato would act slower than him is whacky.

 

[DrProof]

SM Jiraiya quite literally shitsmacks Sasori into the next dimension.

He also beats Orochimaru, Mu, Onoki, Gaara, and Kisame in that tier of yours.

No .

 

[Thesaurus]

Not necessarily, in the end Minato would have done what Tobirama did and got the blast away.

Base Minato has already been hyped and portrayed over Tobirama in speed throughout the series and the idea that KCM Minato would act slower than him is whacky.

I agree with you, Minato would've been capable of doing the same. My point is that Tobirama did it much faster and he wsn't even close to them.

Still happened, which is what matters at the end of the day.

SM Jiraiya quite literally shitsmacks Sasori into the next dimension.

He also beats Orochimaru, Mu, Onoki, Gaara, and Kisame in that tier of yours.

My list is under the assumption that Oro has presumably achieved his SM as Zetsu/fit body was the only requirement he needed for it to happen. Mu would literally erase his existence, same with Onoki. Both of them just fly and nuke him. Gaara is the winner imo, and Kisame would lose because SM Jiraiya being a horrendous match-up. Not gonna debate you on Sasori, you probably know nothing about him anyways.

 

[KidGamer65]

Rather it takes longer to execute whatever mechanism is needed to initiate Hirashin [

You must be registered for see links

]. At least from my interpretation of that scan.

Thinking is all that is needed. All that means is that clone's reaction speed is too slow, or maybe clones need to use handsigns (Saw Minato do that a couple of times)

Not to mention that only applies to clones.

When I said quicker to act I meant mindfully quicker, as in always ready for anything, unlike Minato. Only thing I can think of is this [

You must be registered for see links

] right now. Minato in disbelief while Tobirama has already initiated a counter attack.

Oh. Lol

Tier 9 in my opinion could become:
Sandaime Raikage
Zetsu Orochimaru (presumed capability to have some form of SM with his fit body)
Mu and Onoki
Itachi/Sasuke
Gaara
Kisame

Then a tier below it as 9.5 going
SM Jiraiya
Sasori
Kakuzu
Deidara
Danzo
Second Mizukage
Edo Tensei Hiruzen

There's a clear power difference between the two.

Sasori, Kakuzu and Deidara don't even belong in any of these tiers. They need to move down. Hiruzen too probably. Other than that, I can agree.

 

[Thesaurus]

Thinking is all that is needed. All that means is that clone's reaction speed is too slow, or maybe clones need to use handsigns (Saw Minato do that a couple of times)

Not to mention that only applies to clones.

They should be identical in terms of abilities to the original caster. It's never been suggested that physical attributes or mental ability degrades with clones. The only viable plausibility would be the Hirashin jutsu itself having some form of chakra moulding requirement or initiation that limits a clone. And ye, pretty sure I was the one who sent you the 8 or so scans of Minato using hand seals to initiate Hirashin a few month back lmao.

And true, it only applies to clones, but that would still mean Hirashin speed is irrelevant to reaction speed

Sasori, Kakuzu and Deidara don't even belong in any of these tiers. They need to move down. Hiruzen too probably. Other than that, I can agree.

Ye, they'd take the place of the people in tier 10, and all other tiers drop. And I disagree on Deidara, he's pretty damn op. He'd beat Danzo/2nd Mizukage/Hiruzen if he didn't have regen/Sandaime Raikage and SM Jiraiya.

 

[KidGamer65]

They should be identical in terms of abilities to the original caster. It's never been suggested that physical attributes or mental ability degrades with clones. The only viable plausibility would be the Hirashin jutsu itself having some form of chakra moulding requirement or initiation that limits a clone. And ye, pretty sure I was the one who sent you the 8 or so scans of Minato using hand seals to initiate Hirashin a few month back lmao.

And true, it only applies to clones, but that would still mean Hirashin speed is irrelevant to reaction speed

Makes sense.

Irrelevant? No. It's still a major factor as the user has to active the technique first. Though it's not the only factor.

Ye, they'd take the place of the people in tier 10, and all other tiers drop. And I disagree on Deidara, he's pretty damn op. He'd beat Danzo/2nd Mizukage/Hiruzen if he didn't have regen/Sandaime Raikage and SM Jiraiya.

He doesn't beat Jiraiya. He gets shitstomped by the Raikage. Hiruzen has a strong chance of defeating him. He beats the Mizukage due to a terrible match up, and Danzo is iffy. But I wouldn't be surprised if Deidara pulled the win.

 

[Thesaurus]

Makes sense.

Irrelevant? No. It's still a major factor as the user has to active the technique first. Though it's not the only factor.

I phrased that badly, I meant that the activation speed delay is what differs Tobirama's Hirashin speed from Minato's Hirashin speed. Tobirama still has superior reaction feats from what was shown, and you could say he was literally the only person who was actually effective against Juubito. Minato was only ever shown failing against Juubito.

He doesn't beat Jiraiya. He gets shitstomped by the Raikage. Hiruzen has a strong chance of defeating him. He beats the Mizukage due to a terrible match up, and Danzo is iffy. But I wouldn't be surprised if Deidara pulled the win.

Jiraiya's summons get flattened if they ever try to reach him in the air. C3 easily one shots this match-up. With no intel or Dojutsu C4 isn't being escaped or understood. C1 is too fast for Jiraiya too. I don't see how Raikage ever reaches Deidara in thei air. If Sandaime tries to blitz from the get-go Deidara can substitute with a Nendo Bunshin/go under ground and pop out somewhere behind him to go in air. C3 or C4 would easily end this. Hiruzen wins since he isn't sealable. No regeneration he'd get stomped.

 

[Bogard]

DMS Kakashi belongs to tier2 imo. I also find the tier5 useless since i think Edo Madara/Edo Hashirama can belong to tier4. I'd place Edo Nagato in tier6. If Rinnegan Obito is with Paths, i'd place him in tier4. I'd place Zabuza in tier11(too underrated. I fail to see how Darui is higher). Other than that, it seems okay

 

[TRE MERCER]

Tier 2 is completely irrelevant and you did it because of your love of Naruto.
​

 

[Dęvîa Puęrî]

single rinnigan jj madara would beat rinnigan sasuke (the tier 2 one) naruto is needed to defeat the guy...

 

[Zexion~]

Disgraceful to place SM Jiraiya in the same tier as Sasori, Kakuzu, and Deidara

Except that both Kakuzu and Deidara have a chance to beat him? Deidara does more times than not?

#SaltyorNah