Edo Hiruzen versus Mu

[TheAncientCenturion]

Lmao, really?

 

[LaizaHaizaSaizaSozaSozeK]

Naruto's entering a very dark place......

You know, bro.

 

[Ghost in the Shell]

What the ****..........

 

[Zexion~]

Damn he's banned? Got my lotion ready and everything >.>

 

[Mugen Onsa]

Could go either way. What happened? Did the clown who got banned post hentai or something?

 

[TheLostShinobi]

Mu is a tad bit to broken for me. In theory, he can kill almost any shinobi by turning invisible and doing 360 turtle island jinton no scope GG.

 

[DMT]

Hiruzen wins with high to extremely high diff , at my lowest estimation of him, and with low to mid diff at my highest estimation of him

 

[Ghost in the Shell]

Let me put up an argument for mah' ninja Sarutobi. Though I'm still not sure if he wins or not.

I have two pieces of evidence regarding Hiruzen's status as a sensor type who can track chakra. The first one is

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scan, very obvious. The second is his Telescope Technique.

NINJUTSU; Toomegane no jutsu (Telescopic Observation technique*)
User: Sandaime
Supplementary; Long range; Rank: A

Main text

A jutsu that uses a crystal ball to track a particular individual anywhere they are. There are a few restrictions about the person that is subjected to pursuit. The caster must know that person's chakra pattern. If someone can be targeted for pursuit, they may be miles and miles far away, the crystal ball will be able to confirm their position. As this jutsu is infallible for intelligence purposes, Sandaime Hokage uses it to maintain public order in the village.

If we go by this, then Hiruzen has been a sensor since part one considering that the execution of this technique is implied to require chakra sensory tracking abilities. Now this is besides his hightened senses that allowed him to track Hashirama and Tobirama in the Bringer of Darkness technique. We don't exactly know if Mu can hide his scent, though one may argue that since the databook says he erases his presence, then he erases his scent since it is part of his presence as well as his hype as the Null Man. I personally think that he does hide scent. Anyways, Hiruzen should know Mu's position the second he goes visible.

Countering Jinton, Keijuugan/Kajuugan no Jutsu, and invisible sword slash GG

- Making several shadow clones, summoning Enma, and having Enma

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himself to give each clone a replica Adamantine staff should end any notion of Mu figuring out who the real Hiruzen is through sensory abilities alone. These shadow clones can spread out throughout the area and try to track Mu's position.

- Remember that the area is Unraikyo (where Taka got shat on by Bee), so these clones can create a good amount of distance between themselves in order to detain any chance of a collateral damage Jinton.

- Hiruzen and his clones can surround themselves with Enma cages to prevent Mu from just sneaking up to them and stabbing them, or making them too heavy to move.

- The second Mu goes visible to use jinton, Hiruzen and clones can dispel the Enma cages at once (except for the Enma clone used to create the cages) whilst simultaneously forming

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to fire off large raiton spears at Mu's location, and this would take less prep than Jinton.

Mu's inability to touch Hiruzen/clones while invisible, and the fact that Hiruzen can track his chakra along with spreading his shadow clones all throughout the entire area so that Mu can't pick more than one off with Jinton at the same time gives Hiruzen a good chance to win here in my opinion.

Alternatively, if Enma can't clone himself that many times, then shadow clone users have been shown to be able to know where their shadow clone has been killed [

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], so Hiruzen just fire off large elemental streams where he senses that a clone has been stabbed by an invisible Mu.

 

[Icelerate]

If we go by this logic, Temari's also a sensor.

 

[Ghost in the Shell]

If we go by this logic, Temari's also a sensor.

Why? 10chars

 

[Icelerate]

Why? 10chars

Noticing a powerful chakra disappear means you can sense powerful chakra but that doesn't mean you're a sensor. Oro noted that the rest of them could sense chakra even though they aren't sensors. Temari felt powerful chakra such as FRS and TBB does this mean she's a sensor?

 

[LuckyMan]

Noticing a powerful chakra disappear means you can sense powerful chakra but that doesn't mean you're a sensor. Oro noted that the rest of them could sense chakra even though they aren't sensors. Temari felt powerful chakra such as FRS and TBB does this mean she's a sensor?

But Hiruzens overseeing jutsu requires him to know the chakra of the individual which means he must be able to sense them.

Also people underestimate Hiruzens speed. The fact he was able to partially evade the Jubito blitz and only got his shoulder cut at first is a speed feat. When you remember how Sasuke and Naruto were blitzed with no reaction at all and Hiruzen ducked and only got his shoulder cut at first, that's ranks him above Muu in the reflex and reaction area. Above a lot of characters because most cant even manage that.

 

[Icelerate]

I didn't read the other part of your post. Just the first evidence.

 

[Ghost in the Shell]

I didn't read the other part of your post. Just the first evidence.

If that is the case, five shadow clones and one or two elemental barrages when he's close enough does him in.

So do you think Hiruzen can win if he were a sensor? That's basically part of the basis for the argument I created. Tbh Hiruzen isn't sniffing him out from long distances. He has very intune senses like Kakashi but he isn't an Inuzuka nor does he have ninken.

 

[Zexion~]

That could just mean he had a sensor help him out.....need more concrete proof my man, the crystal ball thing that is.

 

[Ghost in the Shell]

That could just mean he had a sensor help him out.....need more concrete proof my man, the crystal ball thing that is.

That's just an assumption. Hiruzen uses the technique himself and

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we see him using it by himself. Plus it specifically says that the user himself must know the chakra of the person said user wishes to creep on.

 

[Zexion~]

That's just an assumption. Hiruzen uses the technique himself and

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we see him using it by himself. Plus it specifically says that the user himself must know the chakra of the person said user wishes to creep on.

Lol yes my man, but I mean doesn't Naruto contain the nine tails? Would think he'd be familiar with that if it counts. Idk im getting a more of a "user has to be familiar with who he wants to see" thing from the description but I can see your point as well easily.

 

[ARGUS]

Snce there is no manga indication or logical reasoning to claim that muus fission is 1/10000000000th of hiruzens shadow clones and katon is tiers and tiers above jinton as feats show, means that old dying hiruzen beats him, let alone edo hiruzen who not even Rikudo naruto or rinnegan sasuke could beat

Hiruzen no diff

 

[Amaterasu]

Tbh I see Mu wins without much difficulty, relly... He goes invisible, then flies and Jinton him...

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

So do you think Hiruzen can win if he were a sensor? That's basically part of the basis for the argument I created. Tbh Hiruzen isn't sniffing him out from long distances. He has very intune senses like Kakashi but he isn't an Inuzuka nor does he have ninken.

But he needs to get close to assassinate Hiruzen and his clones, coming in close would give Hiruzen the advantage and allow him to catch the scent. Jinton and if Hiruzen can dodge it is the question, which I am unsure of.