Frog Kata is SO overrated

The Necromancer

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I see. I'll explain on what happened below a little bit in more detail on why I think this happend, and what actually happened.


Going to explain below



Alright the ash infused chakra smokescreen did not really seem to be of an attack, but merely a way to push everyone away from him. That was clearly evident to the point of the lower panel where all those who held a Kyuubi cloak were being forced backwards, but it did not really damage them at all. It was more or less like a tiny explosion in that sense, of pushing them backwards.

There really is no clear indication as for why the Kyuubi cloak would be less powerful than the one holding it's own against the ash cloud. Other than the fact of Kurama's chakra being low? Naruto was KCM at that time, probably meaning that Kurama's chakra was more durable and potent, than the one in SM. Again this is just speculation of course. It could just be a inconsisenty.

The only person who was really damaged from the chakra cloud fell faced down, but it happened off-panel so for all we know he could have hit his head on the ground with so much concussive force, he fainted. Whereas Madara stands above him and taking in the Kyuubi's chakra with his left foot.


The only possibly reason for as to why Sasuke could have tanked that would be some sort of fire resistance to the heat. Whether that is possible or not, we have to some conclusion because at that time Kishimoto placed a technique onto Sasuke to remove his Sage Mode. Or something on those lines.

What do you think?
I would prefer not to make any conclusion. Just as with Eyeless Susano'o, I hate having to use technicalities and speculations to explain things in the manga that Kishi clearly did not think of himself.

I guess this could be the start of a conclusion, but I'm just going to leave it at inconsistency. That's just me.
 

lndra

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I would prefer not to make any conclusion. Just as with Eyeless Susano'o, I hate having to use technicalities and speculations to explain things in the manga that Kishi clearly did not think of himself.

I guess this could be the start of a conclusion, but I'm just going to leave it at inconsistency. That's just me.
I agree. If it came up again then we could actually debate about it, right now it is just another one of his "I don't give a ****" moments.
 

Nagi

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Remember this wasn't normal Madara. Kabuto made changes to his body. Madara at that point had the strong body power of the first hokage.
He didn't have hashirama's senjutsu chakra in that moment. unless you wanna say that blind Madara with no senjutsu chakra is stronger than SM Naruto, I rest my case.
 

shadowcb

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wwhatttt? You better look at that shit again.
No you need to take another look. Like I said if he would have aimed the jutsu at his ground and not at Naruto than Sasuke would have been hit because he was facing Sasuke before he used the jutsu. The flames wouldn't have knocked Naruto back because the jutsu would have been going away from Naruto and towards Sasuke. In fact, Madara would have hit his own arms that were in front of him so he had to turn away from Sasuke and his arms to use the jutsu and not injury himself.
 

lndra

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He didn't have hashirama's senjutsu chakra in that moment. unless you wanna say that blind Madara with no senjutsu chakra is stronger than SM Naruto, I rest my case.
Right. He still had Hashirama's cells, not to mention the whole scene was bizarre because Madara used a Rinnegan Path with his eyes gone, and located Hashirama while being "blind".

Not excluding the fact that he hit Naruto and Sai while knowing their positions at the same time. Madara is just too OP
 

Nagi

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No you need to take another look. Like I said if he would have aimed the jutsu at his ground and not at Naruto than Sasuke would have been hit because he was facing Sasuke before he used the jutsu. The flames wouldn't have knocked Naruto back because the jutsu would have been going away from Naruto and towards Sasuke. In fact, Madara would have hit his own arms that were in front of him so he had to turn away from Sasuke and his arms to use the jutsu and not injury himself.
Read it again or watch the anime. That was a escape jutsu. you aim at the ground to escape from 360 degree targets. Stop giving naruto special treatment.
 

shadowcb

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He didn't have hashirama's senjutsu chakra in that moment. unless you wanna say that blind Madara with no senjutsu chakra is stronger than SM Naruto, I rest my case.
Im talking blind Madara at 100% plus the 1st hokage body power raised him above his prime. Kabuto made to his body. It's one of the reason he had the 1st hokage face on his chest and could use SM.

He had already combined his chakra and the 1st chakra together and that would have given him Sage chakra.
 

Nagi

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Right. He still had Hashirama's cells, not to mention the whole scene was bizarre because Madara used a Rinnegan Path with his eyes gone, and located Hashirama while being "blind".

Not excluding the fact that he hit Naruto and Sai while knowing their positions at the same time. Madara is just too OP
His sensing ability is on point. The mofo knew that hashirama was on the way to the battlefield. Despite having Hashirama's cells, that shouldn't have made him stronger than SM Naruto in term of raw strength. Unless you wanna say hashirama's cells shit on SM Naruto.
 

Heisenberg Wannabe

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I don't get the people saying Naruto wasn't using Frog Kata there. It is a fighting style, not something requires activation. If you have SM and Frog Kata training, than it means you could use it any moment, but as we seen against Madara it is really an overrated style. All it gives is a danger sensing which didn't helped against a blind man.

And Sasuke fought the SM Madara unlike Naruto and he fend himself quite well. He had a sword yes, but Naruto had invisible Natural energy which increases his hitting range.

Obviously this Frog Kata is overrated.
 

Zlatán

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"manhandled"

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I was talking about Deva Pain, even konohamaru can give them a rough time...

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who is manhandling whom seems pretty clear.
Naruto fighting a already weakened and exhausted Pain counts as manhandling now ? Naruto was lucky enough Kurama weakened Pain for him

Otherwise he would have gotten manhandled like last time

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Nagi

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Im talking blind Madara at 100% plus the 1st hokage body power raised him above his prime. Kabuto made to his body. It's one of the reason he had the 1st hokage face on his chest and could use SM.

He had already combined his chakra and the 1st chakra together and that would have given him Sage chakra.
unless you wanna say 1st hokage's body power is stronger than SM naruto, I rest my case.
 

shadowcb

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What special treatment. Fire jutsu causes destruction. He might have used to to escape, but that doesn't' change what the jutsu is design for. I have read that manga several times and the manga supports my claim. If he used it the way you claim Sasuke would have been hit, but he wasn't. Madara even stated he didn't want to hurt Sasuke.
 

shadowcb

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unless you wanna say 1st hokage's body power is stronger than SM naruto, I rest my case.
Not saying that at all. Im saying Madara reached a knew level because he had both his power and 1st hokage's power. That's what the manga shows. Kabuto even made a big deal about it when Madara first entered the battlefield.
 

lndra

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I don't get the people saying Naruto wasn't using Frog Kata there. It is a fighting style, not something requires activation. If you have SM and Frog Kata training, than it means you could use it any moment, but as we seen against Madara it is really an overrated style. All it gives is a danger sensing which didn't helped against a blind man.

And Sasuke fought the SM Madara unlike Naruto and he fend himself quite well. He had a sword yes, but Naruto had invisible Natural energy which increases his hitting range.

Obviously this Frog Kata is overrated.
His sensing ability is on point. The mofo knew that hashirama was on the way to the battlefield. Despite having Hashirama's cells, that shouldn't have made him stronger than SM Naruto in term of raw strength. Unless you wanna say hashirama's cells shit on SM Naruto.
It is not the fact whether or not Sage Mode is better than Hashirama at that time, it is on Naruto's scale. He had just finished defeating Obito, while simulanteously drawing out both his and Kurama's chakra, handing it out to each individual member of the shinobi alliance. Not to mention he crafted a Bijuu-Sized Rasenshuriken before landing near Madara's position. He obviously was not at his best, otherwise he would have been able to react to that speed and movement,

SM Naruto has great feats in close combat. I do not really have to draw them all out, here is a small example:
 

Nagi

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What special treatment. Fire jutsu causes destruction. He might have used to to escape, but that doesn't' change what the jutsu is design for. I have read that manga several times and the manga supports my claim. If he used it the way you claim Sasuke would have been hit, but he wasn't. Madara even stated he didn't want to hurt Sasuke.
That jutsu did a 360 degree hit. It's a escape jutsu. Not a damage jutsu. Naruto was charging forward to him. That jutsu is a fire and wind release put together. it was enough to push naruto, who was charging forward, back. Sasuke, who was already standing a firm ground, could withstand the blast.
 

Da Best Ever

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Yea cause Sasuke is really the talkative person that complains so often during a fight..
half his panel time consisted of
...
Or are u suggesting Sasuke is more durable than SM Naruto who can fall in a ravin that is full of spikey rocks and brush it of like nothign happened?

Sasuke is one of the most durable characters.

He took liger bomb which darui said no one has ever survived

He also took a karate chop from Ay to the neck and took it like aG.

He took chojuro big ass chakra sword

He took having every cell in his body hurting from ms usage

And much more he's not soft.

Nor does he often complain about pain only ms pain related problems.
 

Heisenberg Wannabe

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It is not the fact whether or not Sage Mode is better than Hashirama at that time, it is on Naruto's scale. He had just finished defeating Obito, while simulanteously drawing out both his and Kurama's chakra, handing it out to each individual member of the shinobi alliance. Not to mention he crafted a Bijuu-Sized Rasenshuriken before landing near Madara's position. He obviously was not at his best, otherwise he would have been able to react to that speed and movement,

SM Naruto has great feats in close combat. I do not really have to draw them all out, here is a small example:
Madara wasn't at the best conditions either. He is an Uchiha, he relied on his eye sight for his entire life and at that moment he was blind. He didn't had Hashirama's SM either. Don't try to make it look like Naruto was the only one who wasn't at his best. Madara was at worst condition and still owned everyone except Sasuke.

Than he gets Hashirama's SM, and Sasuke kicks in. Sasuke gave much better fight against SM Blind Madara while Naruto got one shotted by Blind Madara.
 

Nagi

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It is not the fact whether or not Sage Mode is better than Hashirama at that time, it is on Naruto's scale. He had just finished defeating Obito, while simulanteously drawing out both his and Kurama's chakra, handing it out to each individual member of the shinobi alliance. Not to mention he crafted a Bijuu-Sized Rasenshuriken before landing near Madara's position. He obviously was not at his best, otherwise he would have been able to react to that speed and movement,

SM Naruto has great feats in close combat. I do not really have to draw them all out, here is a small example:
Sage mode supposedly make the user like 10 times stronger right? You can't really be that tired and be in sage mode at the same time. He may not been at his best, but he was at a level where he could easily whoop some kage level shinobi ass without breaking a sweat. Naruto knew that he was dealing with madara. So letting his guard down is not possible unless he is that dumb.

I'm not knocking him down. I'm just saying frog kata is overrated and his sage mode is not all that. Just stop giving him so much credits. Everybody gotta lose sometimes.
 

lndra

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Sasuke is one of the most durable characters.

He took liger bomb which darui said no one has ever survived
Was that before or after Taka ran to his rescue and had to save his life before he died?

He also took a karate chop from Ay to the neck and took it like aG.
Susano'o*

He took chojuro big ass chakra sword
What?

He took having every cell in his body hurting from ms usage
Itachi did too. Hell he was dying, which makes the feat less credible.
 

Da Best Ever

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Not saying that at all. Im saying Madara reached a knew level because he had both his power and 1st hokage's power. That's what the manga shows. Kabuto even made a big deal about it when Madara first entered the battlefield.

Kabuto said that for edo madara. Hashirama upon seeing madara come back alive said... " oh no he's gotten his previous powers now" which means edo tensei restricted and limited madara physically which is why he immediately wrecked naruto and sai in .0000001 seconds
 
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