Remind me what exactly is the logic of Itachi fans who say that Yata can deal w/Kamui

[Torche]

Madara and Sasuke did it without rikudou chakara. Obito's chakara levels have been shown to be on par with pre-jinchuuriki Madara's. He was able to summon/control the gedou mazou, control 7 bijuus, shoot Madara level fire styles, help control the juubi and still fight with Naruto, Kakashi and Guy and the shinobi alliance all in one day. He has enough chakara to manifest perfect susanoo.

Yeah, but they had EMS... The rest is irrelevant.

 

[BLAZE]

Madara and Sasuke did it without rikudou chakara. Obito's chakara levels have been shown to be on par with pre-jinchuuriki Madara's. He was able to summon/control the gedou mazou, control 7 bijuus, shoot Madara level fire styles, help control the juubi and still fight with Naruto, Kakashi and Guy and the shinobi alliance all in one day. He has enough chakara to manifest perfect susanoo.

Large Chakra reserve is not wuts needed to manifest PS

 

[AlphaScythian]

Logic and itachi fans together?

 

[-immortal-]

Read this
Ty and Lord Gobble Rules

Dat mangafax dat databook that kishimoto

 

[Xlad]

Alternate ending :

Itachi totsuka blitzes

Your sig just made me

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[chaos control]

Yeah, but they had EMS... The rest is irrelevant.

Large Chakra reserve is not wuts needed to manifest PS

It is what is needed. Tell me, what does rikudou chakara grant? It grants large and powerful chakara reserves. With said chakara, Kakashi was able to use PS with just normal mangekyou sharingan. If it was true that large chakara reserves weren't sufficient and that you needed EMS, then Kakashi wouldn't have been able to manifest it (because you just said that large chakara reserves were insufficient and that you need EMS. Rikudou chakara grants large chakara reserves, but it does not grant EMS.)

Furthermore, Indra used PS without EMS. How was he able to use it? It was because of his large and powerful chakara reserves.

 

[Torche]

Logic and itachi fans together?

Spoiler

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XD

OT: Interesting thread.

 

[chaos control]

Dat mangafax dat databook that kishimoto

That manga, that outdating, that kishimoto.

 

[Torche]

It is what is needed. Tell me, what does rikudou chakara grant? It grants large and powerful chakara reserves. With said chakara, Kakashi was able to use PS with just normal mangekyou sharingan. If it was true that large chakara reserves weren't sufficient and that you needed EMS, then Kakashi wouldn't have been able to manifest it (because you just said that large chakara reserves were insufficient and that you need EMS. Rikudou chakara grants large chakara reserves, but it does not grant EMS.)

Furthermore, Indra used PS without EMS. How was he able to use it? It was because of his large and powerful chakara reserves.

Rikudou chakra throws the little logic Naruto has out the window. You know, souls going into a "host" body. Hagoromo essentially "travelling through time". Hagoromo's spirit manifesting in the normal realm, etc. :|

 

[Chazzi]

Logic and itachi fans together?

We are logic itself.

 

[-immortal-]

That manga, that outdating, that kishimoto.

Chaos controll. I see your point. But is kishimoto's hypefull DB not correct then?

 

[End of Days]

Spoiler

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It has been so long since I made this but its still relevant

 

[BLAZE]

It is what is needed. Tell me, what does rikudou chakara grant? It grants large and powerful chakara reserves. With said chakara, Kakashi was able to use PS with just normal mangekyou sharingan. If it was true that large chakara reserves weren't sufficient and that you needed EMS, then Kakashi wouldn't have been able to manifest it (because you just said that large chakara reserves were insufficient and that you need EMS. Rikudou chakara grants large chakara reserves, but it does not grant EMS.)

Furthermore, Indra used PS without EMS. How was he able to use it? It was because of his large and powerful chakara reserves.

Becoz he inherited Rikudo chakra from his father

Why didn't Obito used PS to save Kakashi and himself from kaguya's attack

Logic and itachi fans together?

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[Zealous Sparks]

By hype, Yata would negate Kamui.

 

[chaos control]

Rikudou chakra throws the little logic Naruto has out the window. You know, souls going into a "host" body. Hagoromo essentially "travelling through time". Hagoromo's spirit manifesting in the normal realm, etc. :|

Nevertheless, it still did not give Kakashi EMS and you have no manga or databook proof that EMS is actually required to manifest PS. That was the assumption because before seeing Indra and Kakashi do it, Madara and Sasuke (2 EMS wielders) were the only ones seen doing it and they were only seen doing it after getting EMS.

However:

1. We never actually saw Madara fight with just normal MS so we don't know what he could and couldn't do before getting EMS. Heck, we don't even know Madara's other mangekyou techniques besides susanoo.

2. While it is true that Sasuke never did it until getting EMS, that is because even using the most basic susanoo hurt Sasuke's body, vision and chakara reserves when he was just using normal MS. Basically, Sasuke didn't have the chakara and physical durability to do it with normal MS. This does not mean that someone who does have the chakara and durability can't do it just because Sasuke couldn't. Obito's mangekyou never took a toll on Obito's body until he started using double kamui in the fight against Kaguya (and that was to warp through dimensions which is a chakara taxing feat). Furthermore, half of Obito's body is made of Hashirama's cells. Obito most definitely has the strength and chakara to manifest it.

 

[chaos control]

Becoz he inherited Rikudo chakra from his father

Why didn't Obito used PS to save Kakashi and himself from kaguya's attack

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Why didn't he use PS to save himself from Kakashi's attack? It is because he was drained from opening dimensions which took tons of chakara. Plus he wanted to sacrifice himself so that he could atone and so that he could see Rin.

 

[Beatrix]

It is not enough just to figure it out. You have to actually be able to counter it. Kakashi and Naruto were only able to figure it out in the first place because Kakashi himself had kamui. Itachi doesn't have kamui, nor does he have a speedy space time jutsu like ftg to do what Minato did, nor does he have a jutsu that can make 5 minutes of explosion like Konan did. He couldn't counter it.

So because he doesn't possess a technique you've seen used against Obito in the manga/anime - means it is impossible for him to counter it? Because Kishi hasn't shown you that it's possible, you take that as fact that it can't be done?

That just shows you can't think for yourself.

 

[chaos control]

So because he doesn't possess a technique you've seen used against Obito in the manga/anime - means it is impossible for him to counter it? Because Kishi hasn't shown you that it's possible, you take that as fact that it can't be done?

That just shows you can't think for yourself.

In a manga it does mean that he can't counter it until shown otherwise. In fact, the whole "Itachi has intelligence" argument is null and void. A lot of opponents have intelligence. Danzo's guards, Fu and Torune were root members, so they had to have intelligence. Yet they failed horribly at figuring out kamui. Yamato has intelligence, but he didn't figure it out when that 8 man squad fought Obito either.

Just because someone has intelligence doesn't mean that you can automatically assume that they would be able to figure it out. That is why you have to wait until further notice.

Furthermore, arsenal is a key factor. Even if Itachi deduces the mechanics behind Kamui, that still doesn't mean that he has something to counter it in his arsenal. It is just like how part 1 Sasuke's sharingan was able to see Lee's kick coming, but that still didn't mean that he was able to dodge it.

Deduction is only half the story. Arsenal is the other half. I am saying that from what we have seen from Itachi's arsenal, he doesn't have anything that counters kamui (even if he does figure out the mechanics).

Plus, people bring up Itachi's intelligence as if Obito is some uneducated 5 year old. Obito is smart too. You act as if Itachi can be the only smart one in the battle.

 

[Brünhild]

Blazing Storm soloed the thread. OP can try to discuss or modify the semantics of his post, but nothing will change the facts.

 

[Rikodou Mode]

If TSB isn't immune to Kamui then nothing is. FACT