DRSM Madara vs DMS Kakashi

[Brother Numpsay]

The white one is the clone. Madara is the black one.

Just Re read the scenarios again so yea, Point taken. Welp Im bored of continuing defending him. So im dropping out. Maybe Ill hear better arguments from someone else.

 

[wael reda]

Kakashi wins comfortably even if his PS isn't superior
First of all ,kamui snipe GG ,madara has zero chance to evade it unless you think this version of madara is much faster than Rikudo chakra mode naruto's top speed ,as rikudo chakra enhanced DMS's kamui was proved to be fater than this naruto

kamui raiki can end this too ,kakashi will phase through all madara's defenses with a high speed ,then cut his head off ,sm non jin madara won't handle this speed if kaguya couldn't
Madara's PS's head gets warped away with kamui snipe ,it doesn't matter how strong it is ,kamui snipe ends it ,not to speak about kamui's ability to bypass transparent avatars like susano
There are other ways for Kakashi to destroy madara's PS ,for example he can get so close with his PS to madara's PS ,then fire kamui shurukins which would most likely hit madara's PS from this close distance
Or kakashi can simply add kamui power to his PS sword (just like he did with his PS 's shurukins) then one touch from this sword to madara 's PS would be over to madara's PS
SS gets cut in half with PS or kakashi can just fly over it with his PS out of its range ,other mocktun jutsus don't deserve to be mentioned in fight of this level ,the same goes for all riningan abilities except for deva path's abilities and limbo
CT gets destroyed by PS with ease ,ST gets tanked with PS
Limbo is the only threat but it would be useless thanks to PS
Kakakshi wins this easily

 

[Torche]

Maddy negs with Limbo. :| Kakashi can't see it nor sense it. :|

 

[Holy God]

I have already won my argument against another member on this subject. I'll take on anyone else that somehow thinks Kakashi wins.

 

[Holy God]

Kakashi wins comfortably even if his PS isn't superior
First of all ,kamui snipe GG ,madara has zero chance to evade it unless you think this version of madara is much faster than Rikudo chakra mode naruto's top speed ,as rikudo chakra enhanced DMS's kamui was proved to be fater than this naruto

kamui raiki can end this too ,kakashi will phase through all madara's defenses with a high speed ,then cut his head off ,sm non jin madara won't handle this speed if kaguya couldn't
Madara's PS's head gets warped away with kamui snipe ,it doesn't matter how strong it is ,kamui snipe ends it ,not to speak about kamui's ability to bypass transparent avatars like susano
There are other ways for Kakashi to destroy madara's PS ,for example he can get so close with his PS to madara's PS ,then fire kamui shurukins which would most likely hit madara's PS from this close distance
Or kakashi can simply add kamui power to his PS sword (just like he did with his PS 's shurukins) then one touch from this sword to madara 's PS would be over to madara's PS
SS gets cut in half with PS or kakashi can just fly over it with his PS out of its range ,other mocktun jutsus don't deserve to be mentioned in fight of this level ,the same goes for all riningan abilities except for deva path's abilities and limbo
CT gets destroyed by PS with ease ,ST gets tanked with PS
Limbo is the only threat but it would be useless thanks to PS
Kakakshi wins this easily

"Kamui snipe GG"? Sending him to Kamui is not winning. Kakashi would have to go there to finish him. He'd also think that he won, yet get hit by multiple Limbo clones that he didn't know were there if this isn't in the beginning.

Kaguya could react to the speed, she just had nothing to defend with. Madara can react and the instance Kakashi materializes to hit Madara, Limbo will be so close to him that Kakashi would get roflstomped, even if he manages to damage Madara.

I don't believe there is any proof that Kamui can teleport a part of an object. He only did that for the "Gedo Mazo" for example, because it was summoned and interfered with the warping.

This is possible, yes. Since it's a method, there is nothing to "counter".

Does his Susano'o even have a sword? If that was even possible though, it would only teleport and area of what it touches, not the entire thing. At that distance where sword contact is even possible, Madara could slash away at Kakashi too. His sword would have to join the original dimension before being able to attack.

Kakashi is not cutting something that took multiple tailed beast bombs and Susano'o slashes, in half. What's flying going to do? He'll have to come close if he ever wanted to do any damage. Madara could easily send a multitude of projectiles to intercept Kamui Shurikens.

Chibaku Tensei would be used as a distraction, not an offensive strategy. Perfect Susano'o also isn't just walking away from a Shinra Tensei. It'll definitely be pushed back or fall over.

Limbo can easily open holes in Perfect Susano'o if it was able to blow away Tailed Beasts.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

He began the process of izanagi during when he was alive still bein active till death not after izanagi is a some what a time/delay techinque obito stated how long one can use izanagi meaning it continous

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Wouldnt that mean it was activated for days?

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delayed activation. It's the same thing itachi did to sasuke

 

[Lariatoo]

Madara wins.

 

[Pragmatic]

Where is this translation? Also i wan the link, not just an image, because you might photoshop it. Obito didn't imply anything. That's a bad assumption.

Not to mention that Kakashi's PS is far stronger.

I doubt he'd photoshop anything

Madara's PS was compared to the Bijuu if you think Kakashi's is better because it can use Kamui techniques you're sadly mistaken

Madara's chakra level makes Kakashi look like an infant

 

[BenjerminGaye]

I doubt he'd photoshop anything

Madara's PS was compared to the Bijuu if you think Kakashi's is better because it can use Kamui techniques you're sadly mistaken

Madara's chakra level makes Kakashi look like an infant

Madara's the one who gave it that hype...
he says it destroys all creation but we know that's bs.

Kakashi's is superior due to rikudou chakra.

 

[wael reda]

"Kamui snipe GG"? Sending him to Kamui is not winning. Kakashi would have to go there to finish him. He'd also think that he won, yet get hit by multiple Limbo clones that he didn't know were there if this isn't in the beginning.

Kaguya could react to the speed, she just had nothing to defend with. Madara can react and the instance Kakashi materializes to hit Madara, Limbo will be so close to him that Kakashi would get roflstomped, even if he manages to damage Madara.

I don't believe there is any proof that Kamui can teleport a part of an object. He only did that for the "Gedo Mazo" for example, because it was summoned and interfered with the warping.

This is possible, yes. Since it's a method, there is nothing to "counter".

Does his Susano'o even have a sword? If that was even possible though, it would only teleport and area of what it touches, not the entire thing. At that distance where sword contact is even possible, Madara could slash away at Kakashi too. His sword would have to join the original dimension before being able to attack.

Kakashi is not cutting something that took multiple tailed beast bombs and Susano'o slashes, in half. What's flying going to do? He'll have to come close if he ever wanted to do any damage. Madara could easily send a multitude of projectiles to intercept Kamui Shurikens.

Chibaku Tensei would be used as a distraction, not an offensive strategy. Perfect Susano'o also isn't just walking away from a Shinra Tensei. It'll definitely be pushed back or fall over.

Limbo can easily open holes in Perfect Susano'o if it was able to blow away Tailed Beasts.

What!!? Kakashi wont warp madara's whole body ,he would just warp his head to the other dimension ,this is a winning, isn't it !!? Lol

Ofc,kamui snipe can warp part of objects ,kakashi warped diedra's arm ,kakashi also said that he would warp gedo's head

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that means he can warp part of object ,doesn't it?Lol

Yes kakashi's PS has a sword

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,and no ,kamui added PS sword wont just warp the part it touchs ,one kamui shurukin was able to warp something close to kakashi's PS's size, though the shurukin itself is just as size as kakashi's PS's head while the sword is much bigger than that ,
So once kakashi's PS sword touchs madara's PS ,it would warp huge part of it ,enough to destroy it
madara can block kamui shurukins with anything but he wouldn't be able to do that if kakashi got so close to madara's PS ,then fired the kamui shurukins from small distance
Kakashi can also use kamui snipe to warp madara's PS's head
Whatever kakashi doesn't need to destroy madara's PS , he can just snipe madara's head while he is standing inside his susano as kamui snipe can bypass transparent avatars like susano ( as I said before )
Proof:Kakashi warped the hachibi though he was inside naruto's kiyubi avatar which was surrounding himself totally with his tails

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That means kakashi can warp madara even if he is inside PS

Kamui raikeri enables kakashi to attack with raikeri while he is intangible ( databook explaination),kakashi would phase through all madara's defenses and phase through madara's body himself while he is cutting his head with raikeri ,so limbo won't be able to touch kakashi while he is attacking madara with raikeri
And once madara dies ,his limbo will disappear
Limbo can do nothing to PS ,blowing away bijus doesn't mean it can do a crack to kakashi 's PS ,devapath blowed away 3 boss toads with ST ,does that mean this ST can do anything to PS !!?Lol not to speak about how limbo would reach a flying PS

Yes ,kakashi can fly over SS with his PS ,then he can snipe madara's head with long range kamui

Kakashi wins easily

 

[King Of Pop]

What!!? Kakashi wont warp madara's whole body ,he would just warp his head to the other dimension ,this is a winning, isn't it !!? Lol

Ofc,kamui snipe can warp part of objects ,kakashi warped diedra's arm ,kakashi also said that he would warp gedo's head

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that means he can warp part of object ,doesn't it?Lol

Yes kakashi's PS has a sword

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,and no ,kamui added PS sword wont just warp the part it touchs ,one kamui shurukin was able to warp something close to kakashi's PS's size, though the shurukin itself is just as size as kakashi's PS's head while the sword is much bigger than that ,
So once kakashi's PS sword touchs madara's PS ,it would warp huge part of it ,enough to destroy it
madara can block kamui shurukins with anything but he wouldn't be able to do that if kakashi got so close to madara's PS ,then fired the kamui shurukins from small distance
Kakashi can also use kamui snipe to warp madara's PS's head
Whatever kakashi doesn't need to destroy madara's PS , he can just snipe madara's head while he is standing inside his susano as kamui snipe can bypass transparent avatars like susano ( as I said before )
Proof:Kakashi warped the hachibi though he was inside naruto's kiyubi avatar which was surrounding himself totally with his tails

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That means kakashi can warp madara even if he is inside PS

Kamui raikeri enables kakashi to attack with raikeri while he is intangible ( databook explaination),kakashi would phase through all madara's defenses and phase through madara's body himself while he is cutting his head with raikeri ,so limbo won't be able to touch kakashi while he is attacking madara with raikeri
And once madara dies ,his limbo will disappear
Limbo can do nothing to PS ,blowing away bijus doesn't mean it can do a crack to kakashi 's PS ,devapath blowed away 3 boss toads with ST ,does that mean this ST can do anything to PS !!?Lol not to speak about how limbo would reach a flying PS

Yes ,kakashi can fly over SS with his PS ,then he can snipe madara's head with long range kamui

Kakashi wins easily

Kakashi wins comfortably even if his PS isn't superior
First of all ,kamui snipe GG ,madara has zero chance to evade it unless you think this version of madara is much faster than Rikudo chakra mode naruto's top speed ,as rikudo chakra enhanced DMS's kamui was proved to be fater than this naruto

kamui raiki can end this too ,kakashi will phase through all madara's defenses with a high speed ,then cut his head off ,sm non jin madara won't handle this speed if kaguya couldn't
Madara's PS's head gets warped away with kamui snipe ,it doesn't matter how strong it is ,kamui snipe ends it ,not to speak about kamui's ability to bypass transparent avatars like susano
There are other ways for Kakashi to destroy madara's PS ,for example he can get so close with his PS to madara's PS ,then fire kamui shurukins which would most likely hit madara's PS from this close distance
Or kakashi can simply add kamui power to his PS sword (just like he did with his PS 's shurukins) then one touch from this sword to madara 's PS would be over to madara's PS
SS gets cut in half with PS or kakashi can just fly over it with his PS out of its range ,other mocktun jutsus don't deserve to be mentioned in fight of this level ,the same goes for all riningan abilities except for deva path's abilities and limbo
CT gets destroyed by PS with ease ,ST gets tanked with PS
Limbo is the only threat but it would be useless thanks to PS
Kakakshi wins this easily

bold is nothing but fanfics, he never showed to put kamui in his sword. its one thing to list it as one of hes possible abilities, but to be outright using it in a debate like is a fact is plain silly no offense.

 

[wael reda]

bold is nothing but fanfics, he never showed to put kamui in his sword. its one thing to list it as one of hes possible abilities, but to be outright using it in a debate like is a fact is plain silly no offense.

No,it isn't fanfic ,kakashi was able to add kamui power to the shurukins which are one of susano's weapons and they are made of susano's chakra ,so there is no reason makes me think he can't do the same with susano's sword
What you are saying is like saying sasuke can put chidori in his PS's but he cant put it in his PS's sword just because he didn't ,it is like saying naruto can use yoton RS but he can't use yoton Rasengan just because he didn't , it is like saying sasuke can't use PS's enton shurukins just because he didn't ,or it is like saying sasuke can use amatrasu while he is inside v2 susano like he did against Danzu but he can't use it while he is inside higher versions of susano ,or it is like saying kakashi can put raikeri in kunai but he can't put it in a sword
Or it is like saying madara and sasuke can surround the kiyubi with PS but they can't do the same with the hachibi or any other biju
,or like saying sasuke can't put chidori in a kunai because he never did ,
I gave you some examples for many things that naruto,sasuke and kakashi can surely use but with your logic they can't because they didn't

 

[King Of Pop]

No,it isn't fanfic ,kakashi was able to add kamui power to the shurukins which are one of susano's weapons and they are made of susano's chakra ,so there is no reason makes me think he can't do the same with susano's sword
What you are saying is like saying sasuke can put chidori in his PS's but he cant put it in his PS's sword just because he didn't ,it is like saying naruto can use yoton RS but he can't use yoton Rasengan just because he didn't , it is like saying sasuke can't use PS's enton shurukins just because he didn't ,or it is like saying sasuke can use amatrasu while he is inside v2 susano like he did against Danzu but he can't use it while he is inside higher versions of susano ,or it is like saying kakashi can put raikeri in kunai but he can't put it in a sword

I gave you some examples for many things that naruto,sasuke and kakashi can surely use but with your logic they can't because they didn't

i dont care whether theres a possibility of him being able to do it but thats what it remains, a possibility. you cant use it in a debate if not theres perfect license of doing the same with other characters. for example sasuke use rinne shift a rinnegan jutsu with ps hence the possibility of him using other rinnegan jutsus with it, you dont see folks using ps shinra tensei or ps bansho tenin in a debate concerning sasuke do you? hypothetical abilities are nice and all but it shoudlnt cross a limit. so yes it is indeed fanfic nothing more.

 

[Sennin of Logic]

Kakashi wins. His susanoo is made out of rikkudo chakra. Limbo won't be able to pass through rikkudo chakra to attack Kakshi. Therefore, it just becomes a one-sided slaughter against Madara.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

i dont care whether theres a possibility of him being able to do it but thats what it remains, a possibility. you cant use it in a debate if not theres perfect license of doing the same with other characters. for example sasuke use rinne shift a rinnegan jutsu with ps hence the possibility of him using other rinnegan jutsus with it, you dont see folks using ps shinra tensei or ps bansho tenin in a debate concerning sasuke do you? hypothetical abilities are nice and all but it shoudlnt cross a limit. so yes it is indeed fanfic nothing more.

Fanfic or not nothing in madara's arsenal can stop kamui raikiri or kamui snipe.

And that's a fact. Jack.

 

[King Of Pop]

Fanfic or not nothing in madara's arsenal can stop kamui raikiri or kamui snipe.

And that's a fact. Jack.

Lol chill bro, already stated my opinion on the match back at the first page

not seeing how kakashi loses, how the hell does madara beat him? limbo is irrelevant near ps, sure he cant see or sense them but they cant do jack to him when he is ps so they are a non factor, ps slash negs any mokuton and with rikudous chakra boost means ss gets diced as well, or has its parts warped with kamui shuriken, he warped kaguyas ash bone portal in a split sec before she could acess it, madara gets his ass warped or gets cut apart with kamui raikiri.

he stomps for sure. i just had to address that small aspect in wael redas post.

 

[Holy God]

What!!? Kakashi wont warp madara's whole body ,he would just warp his head to the other dimension ,this is a winning, isn't it !!? Lol

Ofc,kamui snipe can warp part of objects ,kakashi warped diedra's arm ,kakashi also said that he would warp gedo's head

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that means he can warp part of object ,doesn't it?Lol

Yes kakashi's PS has a sword

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,and no ,kamui added PS sword wont just warp the part it touchs ,one kamui shurukin was able to warp something close to kakashi's PS's size, though the shurukin itself is just as size as kakashi's PS's head while the sword is much bigger than that ,
So once kakashi's PS sword touchs madara's PS ,it would warp huge part of it ,enough to destroy it
madara can block kamui shurukins with anything but he wouldn't be able to do that if kakashi got so close to madara's PS ,then fired the kamui shurukins from small distance
Kakashi can also use kamui snipe to warp madara's PS's head
Whatever kakashi doesn't need to destroy madara's PS , he can just snipe madara's head while he is standing inside his susano as kamui snipe can bypass transparent avatars like susano ( as I said before )
Proof:Kakashi warped the hachibi though he was inside naruto's kiyubi avatar which was surrounding himself totally with his tails

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That means kakashi can warp madara even if he is inside PS

Kamui raikeri enables kakashi to attack with raikeri while he is intangible ( databook explaination),kakashi would phase through all madara's defenses and phase through madara's body himself while he is cutting his head with raikeri ,so limbo won't be able to touch kakashi while he is attacking madara with raikeri
And once madara dies ,his limbo will disappear
Limbo can do nothing to PS ,blowing away bijus doesn't mean it can do a crack to kakashi 's PS ,devapath blowed away 3 boss toads with ST ,does that mean this ST can do anything to PS !!?Lol not to speak about how limbo would reach a flying PS

Yes ,kakashi can fly over SS with his PS ,then he can snipe madara's head with long range kamui

Kakashi wins easily

I'm going to disregard any of your "snipe" sayings because there isn't sufficient evidence of it being possible. Kakashi was able to only get Deidara's arm because he couldn't use the technique properly.


Your sword argument is also nullified by logic. He's able to use Kamui Shurikens because they leave him. If he's holding the object, part of his Susano'o would get caught in the warp area as well.

Even if Kamui Shuriken was able to take out Perfect Susano'o, it's always possible to erect a new one or not at all. Large wood-style, fire-style, and Six Path techniques can be used to damage and distract until Kakashi can no longer hold the Perfect Susano'o himself. I hope you know he doesn't have unlimited chakra.

Limbo can definitely open Perfect Susano'o. If you can't accept at least this, you're in denial.

I would need very heavy proof of Kakashi being able to attack people without being in the same dimension as them. If that was possible, he could have finished Kaguya as if she was nothing.

Now for you to counter something of mine. How does Kakashi stop a Perfect Susano'o covered Kurama? It's too much to teleport, and it blows away Kakashi's Perfect Susano'o. It can shoot enough projectiles to counter any Kamui Shuriken and cast catastrophe as well.

 

[TRE MERCER]

This thread still lives?

 

[wael reda]

i dont care whether theres a possibility of him being able to do it but thats what it remains, a possibility. you cant use it in a debate if not theres perfect license of doing the same with other characters. for example sasuke use rinne shift a rinnegan jutsu with ps hence the possibility of him using other rinnegan jutsus with it, you dont see folks using ps shinra tensei or ps bansho tenin in a debate concerning sasuke do you? hypothetical abilities are nice and all but it shoudlnt cross a limit. so yes it is indeed fanfic nothing more.

Your example is completely different from what I am talking about ,you are talking about different abilities,sasuke's using rinningan jutsu with PS is completely different ability from using another rinningan jutsu with PS ,it is another whole process ,this is like saying that kakashi was able to put kamui warping power in part of PS ,so he can put kamui intangible power in part of PS ( 2 different process)

While kakashi's adding kamui power to ps shrukens which is made from PS chakra and kakashi's ps holding it with its hand is the same as kakashi adding kamui power to PS sword which is made from Susano chakra as well and kakashi's ps holding it with its arm too Lol
As I said before ,madara and sasuke surrounded the kiuybi with PS ,is that restricted just to kiuybi (fox with nine tails),or they can surround any other biju as well ?
The same goes for kakashi ,his ability isn't restricted for just this susano's chakra which is formed in shurukins's shape ,why can't he add kamui power to another thing made of susano's chakra as well but in a different shape ( sword)!!?

Another example,sasuke said he will add sage chakra to his chidori,give me one thing makes you think that he enhances his PS with sage chakra too ,with your logic ,his PS isnt enhanced with sage chakra and saying that is fanfic

Can you answer this questions ?

Can sasuke put chidori in kunai or this is a fanfic?
Can kakashi put raikeri in a sword or this is fanfic?
Can sasuke and madara the hachibi with thier PS or this is a fanfic ?
Can sasuke use PS's Benton shurukins or this is a fanfic ?

Are this a possible abilities or they surerly can use it!!?

 

[wael reda]

I'm going to disregard any of your "snipe" sayings because there isn't sufficient evidence of it being possible. Kakashi was able to only get Deidara's arm because he couldn't use the technique properly.


Your sword argument is also nullified by logic. He's able to use Kamui Shurikens because they leave him. If he's holding the object, part of his Susano'o would get caught in the warp area as well.

Even if Kamui Shuriken was able to take out Perfect Susano'o, it's always possible to erect a new one or not at all. Large wood-style, fire-style, and Six Path techniques can be used to damage and distract until Kakashi can no longer hold the Perfect Susano'o himself. I hope you know he doesn't have unlimited chakra.

Limbo can definitely open Perfect Susano'o. If you can't accept at least this, you're in denial.

I would need very heavy proof of Kakashi being able to attack people without being in the same dimension as them. If that was possible, he could have finished Kaguya as if she was nothing.

Now for you to counter something of mine. How does Kakashi stop a Perfect Susano'o covered Kurama? It's too much to teleport, and it blows away Kakashi's Perfect Susano'o. It can shoot enough projectiles to counter any Kamui Shuriken and cast catastrophe as well.

1-about kamui's warping part of object

I have already given you a clear scan from the manga shows kakashi's saying that he would warp the gedo's head ,and he would have done this ,if obito hadn't stopped him

Also kakashi's warping diedra's arm is a clear proof that kamui snipe can warp part of objects ,kakashi'a not being good at using kamui then doesn't matter ,it only means that if he had been good at using kamui then,he would have warped his head instead

Also kakashi was able to warp a part of JJ madara's TSB defense when he was fighting with 8 the gate gai

I wouldnt argue this point again unless you showed me a proof that he can't ( though manga already showed that he can)


2- about kamui sword warping kakashi 's PS:

No this isn't possible ,if this was true ,then kamui shurukins should have warped kakashi's PS' hands when kakashi's PS was holding them ,but this didn't happen

Once madar's PS gets destroyed by kamui sword,kamui shurukins or kamui snipe ,kakashi would end madara with PS's slash ,kakashi can end him with kamui raikeri or kamui snipe before even that

Yes kakashi's chakra is limited just like madara and any character including kaguya and naruto ,but kakashi will end madara long before this happens

3-about limbo opening a hole in PS:
Hachibi 's biju doma did for the hachibi much more damage than what limbo did to him ,yet full kiyubi's bijudoma was tanked easily by EMS's non complete PS which wasnt enhanced with rikudo chakra

So no,limbo have nothing to do to normal PS ,let alone rikudo enhanced PS


4-about kamui raikeri :
This jutsu wasn't explained enough in the manga ,so no one can be sure what is the working's mechanism of this jutsu ,but the fourth databook 's explanation for this jutsu is that kakashi attacks the enemy with raikeri in high speed while being intangible ,and the part of the enemy which touchs kakashi's raikeri gets warped to the other dimension,without kakashi's hand gets warped Lol,so don't worry ,kakashi's PS arm won't get warped with what the kamui sword warp


5-about madara covering kiyubi with PS:

This won't make any touchable difference as well ,kakashi would just warp madara's PS's head a long with kiyubi's head