How I would have constructed the final antagonist (The Kaguya/Madara debacle)

[SkyGodHorus]

With a one-dimensional personality, and few words, I can agree now that Kaguya was not handled as well as I had hoped and that it probably would have been better for Madara to remain the final villain. However, I mostly enjoyed the choreography of the fight with her as well as her techniques.

With this, how would have written the conclusion to the final arc would be Kaguya taking on that rabbit bijuu form of hers and then Madara absorbing her and the two becoming harmonized like Naruto was with Kurama, while black zetsu just..well..went away lols and Kaguya taking his place. This would also relate Naruto more to Madara in the battle.

I would have made either Hamura or Kaguya the one who rewrote the tablet. Kaguya to insure her revival in case she fell to Hagoromo and Hamura or Hamura for either revenge against his brother for becoming the god of shinobi over him and being born with the rinnegan, or possibly having a change of heart in regards to peace.

And as far as Madara and Kaguya's differing ideals go, I would have had Madara's mind become totally consumed with the Shinju's power, discarding his goal to bring peace to the world and instead wanting to completely destroy and remake it. This would have explained why Kaguya wanted all the chakra back as well. IT would still be used, except that in this scenario Madara, thanks to Kaguya would now know the truth behind it.

This way, Madara is still the main antagonist and we still get to see the full power of the Rinnegan as well as Kaguya's power, and possibly a more dimensional and sinister personality with her.

 

[Seventh Sama]

I don't think madara's the kind of guy who would share his power with somebody but this sounds better than what we got.

 

[Tantalus Thief]

I like the idea of Hamura being jealous of Hagoromo since we barely know anything about it.

 

[SkyGodHorus]

I don't think madara's the kind of guy who would share his power with somebody but this sounds better than what we got.

He kind of already did dude. When he absorbed Kaguya, he entrusted himself to her.

 

[Ansatsuken]

Yes I like your idea, and for me the most important and satisfying moment is when most powerful characters or villain can show their full potential and not being nerf like actual manga plot.

I dont care if Kaguya/Madara lose in the end to Naruto and Sasuke, but when they lose without showing their true power, just hype is not enough for me.

 

[HeavenlyFlames]

What would also be cool, is if they had Jashin finish off Kaguya. We haven't seen this guy, and Kishi could have thought of tons of possibilities of appearances and abilities to suit this character. And, this "Jashin "would be the last person you'd expect to pop up.:hyper:
OT: Enjoyed your idea.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

But then Infinite Tsukuyomi wouldn't be objectively bad, which was Kaguya's purpose.

 

[SkyGodHorus]

But then Infinite Tsukuyomi wouldn't be objectively bad, which was Kaguya's purpose.

....How would IT not be bad..? Lols.

 

[Your Creepy Stalker]

Kaguya wasn't really the main villain in her arc though, Black Zetsu was. Kaguya was there to be black zetsu's muscle.

 

[Your Creepy Stalker]

....How would IT not be bad..? Lols.

Well, it gets rid of world hunger, disease, death, war, and various other Apocalyptic horsepersons. The white zetsu thing was just to make naruto turn out to have been right all along. But in the real world, Madara/Obito would have had all the support they wanted.

 

[Torche]

Both unrestricted Kaguya or unrestricted final Madara wreck team 7, them "harmonizing" is ludicrous.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

....How would IT not be bad..? Lols.

Many people said the idea being immortal and living in enteral bliss to be appealing.

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It was stated by Hagoromo that the tree keeps people alive and this was supported by Madara using that tree by the Gedo Mado to keep himself from dying of old age. Even the databook confirms this.

Tsukuyomi (無限月読, Mugen Tsukuyomi)

A Kekkei Mōra/Genjutsu used by Madara and Kaguya. The rightmost lines are really blurry so it's a bit hard for me to read, but it basically says that the user approaches the full moon and opens the Rinne Sharingan, which is reflected on the surface of the moon, shining light onto the surface of the earth which plunges everyone into an eternal sleep.

→ Divine: Deep Forest Emergence is then used on the helpless victims to let the Divine Tree capture them with its roots, so that it can steal their Chakra for eternity.

Well, it gets rid of world hunger, disease, death, war, and various other Apocalyptic horsepersons. The white zetsu thing was just to make naruto turn out to have been right all along. But in the real world, Madara/Obito would have had all the support they wanted.

And eliminating a possible scenario that could wipe out humanity.

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Obito and Madara never mentioned to the Allience that the their plan made people live forever. Obviously because everyone would have accepted IT with open arms.

 

[Dondaime Hokage Naruto]

I enjoyed your reading your thread and I believe this would have been better...

 

[SkyGodHorus]

Well, it gets rid of world hunger, disease, death, war, and various other Apocalyptic horsepersons. The white zetsu thing was just to make naruto turn out to have been right all along. But in the real world, Madara/Obito would have had all the support they wanted.

They would not have been able to take it anyway because conflict is the human condition. The IT would eventually drive them crazy. That's how it worked in the matrix, that's how it would work here, especially since they were all against it.

Oh, and this have nothing to do with IT lols. IT would still be done, it would just leave everyone in check so that they could get them all at once.

Many people said the idea being immortal and living in enteral bliss to be appealing.

Why would I give a **** what many people think? Many people are ****ing morons who don't even know who or what they are lols. Conflict is the human condition. If it were suddenly taken from people, they would lose their minds and civilization would collapse. Why? Because individualism, the very core of humanity would no longer exist in that we'd all be the same. Everyone happy, no worries, no sadness, no goals, no anxieties, no learning, NOTHING. And the very idea that it could work, even in fiction is complete and utter bullshit lols.

And I never said IT would be discarded in the first place so what the hell exactly are you mumbling about anyway?

It was stated by Hagoromo that the tree keeps people alive and this was supported by Madara using that tree by the Gedo Mado to keep himself from dying of old age. Even the databook confirms this.

No, actually it doesn't lols. And if you want to get literal, Madara stated he was immortal and would live forever after absorbing Kaguya, and with good reason considering she was the "god" tree, which constantly collected chakra and senjutsu from the world. It's stated int he databook the tree thrived from conflict and drank the blood from it in ancient times.

 

[MAN OF SIN]

especially since they were all against it.

Obito never explained the details of the IT to the Allience. All he said at that the Kage Summit Arc was that he was going to control the world. Nothing about ever lasting life and happiness. That's why they were against it.

Why would I give a **** what many people think? Many people are ****ing morons who don't even know who or what they are lols. Conflict is the human condition. If it were suddenly taken from people, they would lose their minds and civilization would collapse.

Lmao, you are talking some serious bullshit.

Why? Because individualism, the very core of humanity would no longer exist in that we'd all be the same. Everyone happy, no worries, no sadness, no goals, no anxieties, no learning, NOTHING. And the very idea that it could work, even in fiction is complete and utter bullshit lols.

The last thing IT does is get rid of individualism. Notice how their personalities were the still same.

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And I never said IT would be discarded in the first place so what the hell exactly are you mumbling about anyway?

Just saying that Kaguya's sole purpose in the manga was making IT objectively bad.

No, actually it doesn't lols. And if you want to get literal, Madara stated he was immortal and would live forever after absorbing Kaguya, and with good reason considering she was the "god" tree, which constantly collected chakra and senjutsu from the world. It's stated int he databook the tree thrived from conflict and drank the blood from it in ancient times.

I was talking about when Madara first met Obito. He was using a Tree by the Gedo Mazo similar to the God Tree to keep himself from dying of old age.

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So unlike the God Tree's origin in the databook, IT granting eternal life was supposed in the manga.

 

[SkyGodHorus]

First off, that is bullshit. Even if that was true people can have some sort of conflict in their dreams if they wanted.

No they wouldn't lols. It would completely contradict the notion of eternal peace. What is bullshit is your excuse that "Kishimoto had to change it to make it look bad" considering you have nothing to support it and when it was his plan all along considering everyone was against it and he based the concept off the matrix.

Obito never explained the details of the IT to the Allience. All he said at that the Kage Summit Arc was that he was going to control the world. Nothing about ever lasting life and happiness. That's why they were against it.

And then explained that he wanted to remake the world where there would be no conflict or shinobi. That was Obito's goal all along. He wanted peace because seeing his best friend stabbing his childhood crush traumatized him. And what exactly does Obito have to do with this lols? He didn't even know the properties of IT. He was just given the idea by Madara, who also didn't know fully about its properties. Why are we even having this discussion about IT when the goddamned topic is about Madara being the final antagonist and STILL using IT anyway?

What are you talking about? The last thing IT does get rid of individualism. Notice how their personalities are the still same.

You still don't get the meaning behind the white zetsus do you? Kishimoto did not create that concept to make it "convenient," he made it to parallel what the whole concept would do to people figuratively, as well as literally. They would all become like souless dolls. All the same, looking the same, never moving, all dreaming, all happy, carefree, etc. It's no different from being a drug addict or suffering from gold fever, just as it's no different from the first version of the matrix and a certain Ray Bradbury short story lols. It's a calamity to the human condition.

And I don't need your retarded links, Sin. I didn't ask for them and I've read the manga far more fluently than yourself it would seem.

Just saying that Kaguya's sole purpose in the manga was making IT objectively bad.

And my alternate scenario doesn't make it good.

I was talking about when Madara first met Obito. He was using a Tree similar to the God Tree to keep himself from dying of old age.

Which, like everything else you've stated so far is completely misconceived, muddled, pointless and off-topic. Are you done now?

 

[HiddenSound]

So... Madara absorbs Kaguya but Kaguya takes over his mind?

 

[SkyGodHorus]

So... Madara absorbs Kaguya but Kaguya takes over his mind?

No No No lols. They become harmonized like Naruto and Kurama and work together.

 

[HiddenSound]

No No No lols. They become harmonized like Naruto and Kurama and work together.

But then Madara discards his dream in favor of Kaguya's?

 

[SkyGodHorus]

But then Madara discards his dream in favor of Kaguya's?

Think of them as becoming one. He gains gods power and it corrupts his mind fully, which was already on the edge due to the stone and the power he had already stolen. She tells him the full properties of IT and that he now has the power not just to save the world, but to recreate it as he wishes. And honestly, this already felt foreshadowed to me since he called himself immortal after absorbing the Shinju and even followed Kaguya's ideal as he cast the IT, saying "we will finally become one."