Dude I addressed this, hashi didn't use any jutsus until his mokujin hopped off the head of his SS statue as shown in that very scan you posted. It wasn't until he did this that he started using jutsus, & once he did SS didn't move again.
SS didn't have to move. It already held Kurama and Mokujin played its part.
Guruguru used Mokutun: Sashiki even with SS still being used
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I don't know why one won't be able to use other Jutsus. Even SS can function on its own considering Oro restricted Guruguru to the point where he said he couldn't move
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and SS on its own did this
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Madara uses Wood dragon and other Mokutun constructs and yet can still use Susanoo
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. Why exactly won't one be able to use another jutsu?
SS didn't have to move. It already held Kurama and Mokujin played its part.
Guruguru used Mokutun: Sashiki even with SS still being used
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I don't know why one won't be able to use other Jutsus. Even SS can function on its own considering Oro restricted Guruguru to the point where he said he couldn't move
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and SS on its own did this
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Madara uses Wood dragon and other Mokutun constructs and yet can still use Susanoo
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. Why exactly won't one be able to use another jutsu?
Already established how keeping up won't be a problem.
-Obito and Madara already fell for Naruto's clone feint, and they were directly facing Naruto the whole time standing on the Juubi. So don't say everyone is wrong and I'm right because I use facts dumbass lmao
Doesn't mean he could've moved it if he wanted to, he hopped off the statue to put kurama to sleep, why didn't he just imbue the SS hand that grabbed kurama with the seal? Same exact situation unless it's stated somewhere that this can't be done.
Guruguru used Mokutun: Sashiki even with SS still being used
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I don't know why one won't be able to use other Jutsus.
Don't compare a much smaller, much weaker SS to the one that hashi used, not nearly as much chakra was put into this one.
Also mokuton isn't sentient, it didn't move of it's own accord, if anything SZ was responsible for that. & Just because he couldn't move doesn't mean that he still couldn't control his jutsu.
Madara uses Wood dragon and other Mokutun constructs and yet can still use Susanoo
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. Why exactly won't one be able to use another jutsu?
Madara wasn't throwing around multiple mokuryuus to take care of naruto was he? He only used one, yeah sure he can maintain susanoo while doing this but that doesn't mean hashi can use multiple versions of his high-level mokuton.
Itachi was able to maintain his susanoo up until the very moment that he died, therefore using it in conjunction with other jutsus isn't surprising considering how easily it can be maintained.
Irrelevant. You claim Obito won't lose track of the original Hashirama by having his eyes on him the whole time. The same principle would apply with Naruto, but Obito lost track of him. The fact that wood clones and shadow clones have different properties is irrelevant. Not to mention, when Obito travels with his s/t Jutsu he enters Kamui, so he can't keep eyes on the original Hashirama by default. Try again.
Already established how obito can track enemies through obstructions such as mokuton.
I expect this kind of logic from a mediocre Obito fan lmao. Obito had trouble warping Gai when Gai was on the offense. Obito is not entering the wood construct before clones are already sprouted from Hashirama's back. Even if Obito was he still won't be warping anyone that easily considering he had trouble with Gai and it took him a bit to warp two fodders Fu and Torune.
You claim Obito won't lose track of the original Hashirama by having his eyes on him the whole time. The same principle would apply with Naruto, but Obito lost track of him.
What this means is that obito knows exactly what's going on outside in the real world during his warp, otherwise he would never be able to warp on a flat surface or find the people that he's warping behind. Therefore saying that obito will lose track of hashi because he warps to his dimension is beyond retarded.
Obito only attempted to warp gai once & that was while fighting gai head-on, much less effective than the warp from behind that nearly managed to capture the fastest hokage alive if not for prep. Obito would be an idiot to try & warp hashi head-on & that's why I said he needs summons in order to win in the first place.
Besides, that was only one exchange between them. That time they were jumping on boulders which was clearly disadvantageous for obito, seeing as they can jump from rock to rock to activate his intangibility. [
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] On a flat surface we see how the situation changes. Obito warps away gai's nunchaku
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, & if those were his hands instead of his weapons then gai would be gone.
Btw don't go on saying that gai was trying to get his weapons warped on purpose, he had no idea that obito would catch them & why would he sacrifice his weapons if he could help it?
Obito is not entering the wood construct before clones are already sprouted from Hashirama's back.
Bullsh*t, literally the second that construct goes up obito will start to warp, meaning he gets behind hashi before the clones get formed thanks to the feat below.
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Only in your little fanfic world is hashi managing to pull off two jutsus before obito says hi.
Even if Obito was he still won't be warping anyone that easily considering he had trouble with Gai
When trying to warp the best taijutsu user in the manga head-on of course he's most likely gonna fail, yet nearly warping the fastest ninja alive, & warping in & out of a jutsu before a sensor can sense trumps any head-on speed feat that gai can do bar 8G.
and it took him a bit to warp two fodders Fu and Torune.
The only reason why obito lost his arm was because he has to touch in order to warp & he simply didn't care about something he can replace, goes to show how seriously he was taking the fight & how little he thought of danzo's dogs.
Doesn't mean he could've moved it if he wanted to, he hopped off the statue to put kurama to sleep, why didn't he just imbue the SS hand that grabbed kurama with the seal? Same exact situation unless it's stated somewhere that this can't be done.
Not really though. Considering he had had to hold Kurama in place first and then use it. If he wanted to, he could but yeah I think the aim was to restrict Kurama first
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and then use it.
Surely one can use other Jutsus through the Statue
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Hashirama not doing so through SS doesn't mean he couldn't .
This simply means that SS isn't SZ's full power & he has room to use other jutsus while using it.
It doesn't matter though. It's the same jutsu but a weaker one. The thing is, SS is a Mokutun construct. If Guruguru can use other jutsus while SS is being used, that means other jutsus can be used while SS is being used as well. It doesn't have to be full power. I can't remember Hashirama talking about it being taxing enough for him not to use other jutsus.
Don't compare a much smaller, much weaker SS to the one that hashi used, not nearly as much chakra was put into this one.
Also mokuton isn't sentient, it didn't move of it's own accord, if anything SZ was responsible for that. & Just because he couldn't move doesn't mean that he still couldn't control his jutsu.
Doesn't matter if it was smaller. The bold makes sense but still considering he could use another jutsu while SS was in use, I see no reason why Hashi can't.
Also, he used different jutsus with different chakra natures at the same time through SS. So he basically used different jutsus at a time through a Mokutun construct which is basically a jutsu as well.
Susanoo =/= mokuton.
Madara wasn't throwing around multiple mokuryuus to take care of naruto was he? He only used one, yeah sure he can maintain susanoo while doing this but that doesn't mean hashi can use multiple versions of his high-level mokuton.
Itachi was able to maintain his susanoo up until the very moment that he died, therefore using it in conjunction with other jutsus isn't surprising considering how easily it can be maintained.
Honestly, I'm confused. He was controlling Mokuryuu and at the same time pulled out/was controlling Susanoo. Meaning he was controlling a Mokutun construct and another jutsu at a time. You're basically saying one can't control 2 Mokutun jutsu but one can control a Mokutun jutsu and another jutsu. Where's it implied in the manga? I showed you a scan of SS being in use and Guruguru using another Mokutun jutsu so yes it's possible to use 2 Mokutun jutsus at a time like Hashi as well did while still holding Madara's PS sword
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Using Mokujin and Mokuryuu
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alongside with wood clones which were with the others
], he had enough time to summon Manda and hide inside him. Though Hashirama witnessed Kyuubi's Bijuudama going off, he had enough time to use the Hobi no Jutsu, in order to create a shield tanking the point-blank explosion with no difficulty.
Great now show me a scan of Obito successfuly warping Minato or Naruto. He did the same thing here:
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A fodder with no intel reacted to him. Get out of here with your kamui wank.
What this means is that obito knows exactly what's going on outside in the real world during his warp, otherwise he would never be able to warp on a flat surface or find the people that he's warping behind. Therefore saying that obito will lose track of hashi because he warps to his dimension is beyond retarded.
Yet you think he keeps track while he's insisde Kamui? Lmao. The second Hashirama makes wood clones Obito will lose track of the original in a fight. It's BS to think otherwise. How can you keep track of multiple targets moving all at once?
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Seriously? Blocking the line of sight isn't even necessary I'm merely humoring you since you think Obito will keep track of the original Lol and you still say blocking the line of sight won't work because Obito will still find a way to see. He only needs to block the LoS for ONE second to lose track of the original.
Konans papers are made up of/controlled via chakra yet obito managed to grab her among the obstruction without a problem, being hidden is useless.
The difference is Hashirama only needs to block the LoS for a second, that way Obito will definitely lose track of the original. And it only takes a second to block the Los as seen when Danzo sprouted mokuton to block a Susano arrow. Do the math.
Obito only attempted to warp gai once & that was while fighting gai head-on, much less effective than the warp from behind that nearly managed to capture the fastest hokage alive if not for prep. Obito would be an idiot to try & warp hashi head-on & that's why I said he needs summons in order to win in the first place.
Bold: Minato had no intel on Kamui whatsoever, and the fight would have been a whole lot easier if Minato had used a shadow clone, and EVEN EASIER if Minato had access to multiple shadow clones.
Bullsh*t, literally the second that construct goes up obito will start to warp, meaning he gets behind hashi before the clones get formed thanks to the feat below.
If you think Obito wins this fight in less than a minute, than you're just one of those idiot Obito fans that should be avoided. With full intel, Hashirama will make clones at the start. Try again.
Only in your little fanfic world is hashi managing to pull off two jutsus before obito says hi.
Lol, I agree. Too bad the first jutsu with intel would be Mokuton clones which would render Obito's Kamui worthless after that. You're in the fanfic world. By feats and portrayal saying Obito > Hashirama is a joke.
Madara says Hashirama is the strongest while fully being aware of Obito (his student) and his Kamui.
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Kabuto says Hashirama is the strongest, while fully being aware of Obito(his partner) and his Kamui/Rinnegan.
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Hashirama finally admits inferiority to Obito, as the Juubit jin. Which means anything before that, Hashirama was superior to.
This match up is a win based on conditions since there are so many 1 shotters on Team Akatsuki.
Akatsuki always wins if they have intel on each other's abilities. There are endless 1 shotted Combos that screws Hashi.
Akatsuki loses every time if they have no intel on each other's abilities. It will be every man for himself when Hashi sends wood up everyone's ass.
Now what really matters is Manga intel, because it's the most realistic.
I see Akatsuki taking this because Manga intel = Obito knows every Akatsuki member's abilities. Obito just has to send Itachi in to kamui world. Then have him reappear using Amaterasu. Unless you're telling me Hashi is as fast as Ay, who still barely dodged and only dodged because he saw Sasuke's eye bleeding. Don't give me this wood clone bullshit some of you above are spouting. Sharingan sees through it, and Pain has Rinnegan sensing.
So overall since Manga intel is the most realistic condition, Akatsuki wins.
so Hashirama's genjutsu, absolutely none of his Mokuton techs, base fighting abilities, and restorative powers gives him a solid shot at soloing Akatsuki huh?
so Hashirama's genjutsu, absolutely none of his Mokuton techs, base fighting abilities, and restorative powers gives him a solid shot at soloing Akatsuki huh?
Akatsuki wins against any form of Hashirama of course
I know hashirama is great and all, but there is no way in hell he is beating all members of akatsuki.
If Hashirama summons the SS, obito can warp the whole akatsuki with himself away and is able to appear right behind hashirama on top of the SS together with his crowd.
Or he only let out nagato who uses large scale ST hundred meters above the SS, so he is save from hashirama and SS still would take damage (i don't think the SS is bigger than konoha)
After that the akatsuki will kill him easy.
Or deidara uses C0 while his crew is chilling in the kamui land.
No way hashirama (any form) wins against all of them, this is just fanboyism !
Not really though. Considering he had had to hold Kurama in place first and then use it. If he wanted to, he could but yeah I think the aim was to restrict Kurama first
I thought I just went over this? SZ's SS =/= Hashi's SS. Just because SZ can use jutsus along with SS doesn't mean that hashi can.
SS is hashirama's full power, he can't do anything better than create that massive statue. If we go by your logic & say that he can do anything else on top of shinsuusenju then you're treading into fanfiction territory.
Can sasuke cover his PS in amaterasu? Can Itachi use tsukuyomi with a complete susanoo active? Can nagato cast any jutsus while using CT? Can kisame use GSB inside his water dome? Exact same case here. The feats of a character stop when they shows us the most that they can do all at once. According to the manga hashi can't do anything else once he's created SS, all of his focus & concentration is put into that jutsu, if you say he can do anything more then we might as well start giving everyone feats at full power that haven't been shown in the manga [AKA, fanfic].
It doesn't matter though. It's the same jutsu but a weaker one. The thing is, SS is a Mokutun construct. If Guruguru can use other jutsus while SS is being used, that means other jutsus can be used while SS is being used as well.
That's irrelevant because I never said that SS specifically prevents you from using jutsus, merely that you can't control it & then use any large-scale jutsus simultaneously. The fact that the SS hashi uses is his full power is also one of the reasons why he can't do anything else while controlling it.
& As for the SZ example, he used the statue as a medium to perform his jutsu, the jutsu was part of the statue which is why it was using the seals. This is hardly a valid comparison to controlling two separate jutsus simultaneously with your own body. If hashi can give us feats of using jutsus through his statue then sure he can do it no problem [& I'm not saying he can't], however he didn't. Therefore suggesting that he can do something similar to SZ is still speculation, we don't know if he can or can't do it so the conclusion you have to come to is that he can't.
It doesn't have to be full power. I can't remember Hashirama talking about it being taxing enough for him not to use other jutsus.
We never heard madara say that PS was taxing on him but we don't see a 2nd madara kage bunshin fighting along with him at the VoTE, so he can't use clones while maintaining his full power. Naruto never complained about his BM being taxing, but he isn't creating hundreds of clones like he normally could.
This is simply about what hashirama at full power has shown us. Now maybe if the mokujin could move on top of the statue instead of having to jump off, & maybe if hashi used the seal to put kurama to sleep through SS, then an argument can be made that SS isn't hashi's full power& that he can do more, but that isn't the case.
It does though, because the difference in size shows us just how much more chakra hashi put into his jutsu. As I said SZ's SS isn't his full power, therefore he can use another jutsu on top of that.
Also, he used different jutsus with different chakra natures at the same time through SS. So he basically used different jutsus at a time through a Mokutun construct which is basically a jutsu as well.
Can SZ do anything while he's using SS & casting those 5 natures simultaneously? Like for example can he use his
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while performing the aforementioned feat? No because that's the most that he can do all at once, that was his most impressive feat so saying he can do anything better or in addition to that would again be fanfic, & that's the same case we're discussing here with hashi. Can he do more in addition to SS? No, why? Because he didn't show us he could, & that's how feats work.
& Before you mention it, yeah feats do work on an absence of evidence basis because without that rule we'd have fanboys going crazy saying that characters can do things that they've never shown us in the manga. Now if someone can somehow prove that a character can do more than what they showed us at full power then yes, that would override the absence of evidence, but that's not the case here.
Honestly, I'm confused. He was controlling Mokuryuu and at the same time pulled out/was controlling Susanoo. Meaning he was controlling a Mokutun construct and another jutsu at a time.
Yes he did, madara has also performed katon whilst in susanoo, genjutsu in susanoo, & even used deva path in susanoo. Susanoo doesn't use any handsigns in order to cast & control, but mokuton does.
You're basically saying one can't control 2 Mokutun jutsu but one can control a Mokutun juts and another jutsu.
No I'm saying that one cant control a mokuton jutsu & another large-scale jutsu simultaneously, unless of course you're using the first jutsu as a medium like in the SZ example. Susanoo is an exception since it's been shown that you can use practically any jutsu in conjunction with it [not PS], but mokuton was not portrayed to be that way.
Your logic is suggesting that someone like kakashi can use something like
As I said, your logic is suggesting that someone like kakashi can use the two jutsus I mentioned simultaneously. I already explained how susanoo is an exception & there are always going to be some, but in this case mokuton is just a regular jutsu so it shouldn't be excluded from following the same rules unless proven otherwise.
I showed you a scan of SS being in use and Guruguru using another Mokutun jutsu so yes it's possible to use 2 Mokutun jutsus at a time
Hardly a large scale jutsu he used, he simply created a small branch & expanded it slightly, it's not like he was controlling it like he was with SS or like hashi with mokuryuu. Even if that was the case, it would only take a second to expand it where as it would take much more concentration & time to control two constructs such as the golem/ryuu or SS/jukai kotan.
like Hashi as well did while still holding Madara's PS sword
He still didn't control those hands at the same time that he used hotei. He grabbed the sword with the first pair of hands & then used hotei to sprout & control the other hands, he didn't need to control the first pair anymore because when hashi finishes controlling his current mokuton construct it stays locked in that place. So once the sword was grabbed hashi was clear to summon & control more mokuton.
The clones didn't do anything significant jutsu-wise which is what I stated in the first place. If hashi uses SS & summons clones, then those clones become useless seeing as they've never been shown to fight on a significant level while hashi uses his large-scale jutsus.
Hashi can't control two large-scale mokuton constructs simultaneously, & he can't use clones to remedy this problem because they've never been shown to fight on the same level as the original did, in base, against madara.
Why? I only brought in those scans to counter your point. Is obito's vision obstructed when he warps to the kamui dimension? No it's not as shown through the scans I posted.
He did the same thing here:
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A fodder with no intel reacted to him. Get out of here with your kamui wank.
Again with the idiotic posts, I never brought those two scans to try & prove kamui's superiority in a certain aspect, I was doing it to prove your idiocy wrong. Now as for those fodders who did nothing to obito in the first place, I can't believe you even used them as an example to try & downplay kamui, lel.
I already posted how it takes less than a couple of seconds to warp these two, & how trying to warp someone head-on is much more challenging than using a distraction or warping from behind.
You know what the really funny thing is? In the very first scan you posted, it was obito who immediately had the opportunity to warp fu, but what did he do? He appears from underground facing away from him.
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Obito was so confident in his abilities that he allowed himself to be open for attack & completely missed the opportunity to end fu instantly on purpose.
As I said, he thought nothing of these fodders, he tore his own arm off & practically laughed at the fact, he phased behind fu facing away from him. Using these fools in your example to try & downplay kamui is the epitome of being a hater, seriously how low can you get at this point?
Lol First of all that was madara asking that question & not obito.
Secondly, BM naruto was standing right in front of them, even before they saw the clone. [
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Furthermore, they both already knew that a clone was active. [
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& Finally, madara was using the rinnegan which lacks the same precognition that obito had, so if he lost track of the original then that's his shortcoming for not having better eyes suited for such a thing.
Actually one more thing, obito wasn't even concerned with actively trying to hunt down naruto, he immediately wanted to start IT. [
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] Madara was the one who wanted to play around & obito had no interest in trying to figure out which fly was the real one, with that much power it most likely didn't even matter to him in the first place.
So again, bad example. There's no proof that obito was even trying to track the real naruto, let alone lose track of him in the proccess.
Yet you think he keeps track while he's insisde Kamui? Lmao. The second Hashirama makes wood clones Obito will lose track of the original in a fight. It's BS to think otherwise.
Who said anything about obito keeping track of multiple targets? All he has to do is make sure not to lose the one casting the jutsu, & since obito can spot someone among obstructions then tracking hashi as he creates his clones & jumps away will be more than easy enough.
Of course this is all assuming hashi can even create his clones before obito says hi, or rather obito + deidara + nagato + etc.
Seriously? Blocking the line of sight isn't even necessary I'm merely humoring you since you think Obito will keep track of the original
Lol Humoring me? Laughable. Simply put, you were proven wrong.
Lol and you still say blocking the line of sight won't work because Obito will still find a way to see. He only needs to block the LoS for ONE second to lose track of the original.
That's right the jinton did, & here is where it gets fun. It took two panels for onoki's jinton to activate, & obito was nowhere near sasuke during that time, yet he still managed to teleport inside the jutsu & save him. So if the mokuton takes only two panels to activate, then what does that tell you? That it's still more than enough time for obito to warp behind hashi & take away his last moments in the real world, or just obliterate him via deidara.
Manga facts speak for themselves, if hashi tries to perform a jutsu that takes two panels or more to activate, then obito comes in for the warp & he will always be successful. To deny that is to deny the manga directly.
Bold: Minato had no intel on Kamui whatsoever, and the fight would have been a whole lot easier if Minato had used a shadow clone, and EVEN EASIER if Minato had access to multiple shadow clones.
Well then it's too bad that minato doesn't have feats to support him teleporting a bijuudama while using clones then isn't it? Because he still had to save konoha & himself.
& Besides, you think obito would've been toying around if minato knew his ability?
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, these are things that he's never been shown to do while warping. That, coupled with the fact that he didn't warp as fast as he normally does, proves that he wasn't fighting seriously.
By the way, I can go ahead & say that the fight would've been easier for obito too if he simply summoned kurama to aid him, the distraction was all that he needed.
If you think Obito wins this fight in less than a minute, than you're just one of those idiot Obito fans that should be avoided.
Still sticking to the ad homenim fallacy are we? That's okay, you can disregard my argument based on your irrelevant beliefs all you want, doesn't change the cold hard facts that prove you wrong.
With full intel, Hashirama will make clones at the start. Try again.
Lol First you say that he'd be using clones after he creates the hobi, now you're saying he creates them at the start of the fight? Make up your mind. But regardless, changing the time that hashi decides to use his clones doesn't change what happens to him in the end.
As shown in the konan & TSB examples, obito keeps track of hashi just fine. & As shown in the jinton example, hashi still gets warped away if he attempts to use a jutsu lasting longer than two panels, or multiple jutsus in succession.
Mokuton clones which would render Obito's Kamui worthless after that.
Stupid post, so obito can't warp a prepped C-0 on top of hashi? He can't warp multiple akatsuki members to take down each clone from behind? Your wank is too strong buddy, just because hashi uses clones doesn't mean that kamui is rendered useless, it's still the most useful jutsu on the field.
You're in the fanfic world. By feats and portrayal saying Obito > Hashirama is a joke.
According to your logic then, itachi & kabuto are invincible, hiruzen is also the god of shinobi, a single PS slash can wipe out all creation/whoever sees it dies, sasuke is the strongest character, & etc. I can go on forever.
Hype is for children who resort to using it after feats sh*t on their argument. Hype without feats = empty hype. Obito's feats [or should I say the entirety of akatsuki's feats] > Hashi's feats
But in any case this isn't just obito vs hashi anyways, shows how much you spite the guy, lmao. This is the entirety of akatsuki. Hashi may be "the strongest character" according to madara & kabuto's hype, but that doesn't mean he can kill the entire shinoobi world if they were to team up against him [your logic]. He's fighting several shinobi who can possibly kill him in one hit, I'm sure kabuto & madara didn't think of that when praising him.
& If you really want to believe in hype then how about the hype that had the world thinking obito was madara? Only a shinobi of madara's caliber would be able to make people think it was him in the first place. That's more than enough hype to put just an MS obito on madara & hashirama's level at the very least, so don't bring that sh*t up again unless you have feats.
Why? I only brought in those scans to counter your point. Is obito's vision obstructed when he warps to the kamui dimension? No it's not as shown through the scans I posted.
You're an idiot. Of course it's obstructed. How can he see what's going on when he's inside Kamui? Does he have a Tv inside the dimension showing him what's going on? It's obvious he's able to tell where someone is when he comes out because he is a sensor. That's not helping him when he's fighting a user that can use clones. Gtfo.
Again with the idiotic posts, I never brought those two scans to try & prove kamui's superiority in a certain aspect, I was doing it to prove your idiocy wrong. Now as for those fodders who did nothing to obito in the first place, I can't believe you even used them as an example to try & downplay kamui, lel.
I already posted how it takes less than a couple of seconds to warp these two, & how trying to warp someone head-on is much more challenging than using a distraction or warping from behind.
Less than a couple seconds? Wipe the cum out of your mouth it took him much longer than that to warp these two.
You know what the really funny thing is? In the very first scan you posted, it was obito who immediately had the opportunity to warp fu, but what did he do? He appears from underground facing away from him.
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Obito was so confident in his abilities that he allowed himself to be open for attack & completely missed the opportunity to end fu instantly on purpose.
Don't care about your excuses. Fact is it took him panels to warp these two fodders with no Intel On Kamui.
As I said, he thought nothing of these fodders, he tore his own arm off & practically laughed at the fact, he phased behind fu facing away from him. Using these fools in your example to try & downplay kamui is the epitome of being a hater, seriously how low can you get at this point?
I'm not a hater. I'm just not a wanker like you. These fodders didn't even have Intel. Can't argue with manga facts.
Lol First of all that was madara asking that question & not obito.
Secondly, BM naruto was standing right in front of them, even before they saw the clone. [
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Furthermore, they both already knew that a clone was active. [
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& Finally, madara was using the rinnegan which lacks the same precognition that obito had, so if he lost track of the original then that's his shortcoming for not having better eyes suited for such a thing.
Actually one more thing, obito wasn't even concerned with actively trying to hunt down naruto, he immediately wanted to start IT. [
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] Madara was the one who wanted to play around & obito had no interest in trying to figure out which fly was the real one, with that much power it most likely didn't even matter to him in the first place.
So again, bad example. There's no proof that obito was even trying to track the real naruto, let alone lose track of him in the proccess.
Lol, I just realized kakashi with Obito's same eye has lost track of Naruto, who was right in front of him. So enough with the "Obito won't lose track of the original" wank. Hell even Kaguya with her sharinnegan lost track of Naruto. That wank is disgusting.
Lmao. This post is hilarious. "Wood rider to disagree" Lol.
You're acting like I think hashirama is unique in this respect. Anyone with multiple bunshin would cause Obito to lose track of the original, not just hashirama.
You're saying Obito absolutely won't and that he's unique in this aspect since Madara, kaguya, kakashi, sasuke have all lost track of the original clone user.
You're the Kamui wanker here not me.
Who said anything about obito keeping track of multiple targets? All he has to do is make sure not to lose the one casting the jutsu, & since obito can spot someone among obstructions then tracking hashi as he creates his clones & jumps away will be more than easy enough.
Amusing coming from the guy that says obitos visual prowess > everyone else's.
Okay let's do the math, this will be fun. :heh:
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That's right the jinton did, & here is where it gets fun. It took two panels for onoki's jinton to activate, & obito was nowhere near sasuke during that time, yet he still managed to teleport inside the jutsu & save him. So if the mokuton takes only two panels to activate, then what does that tell you? That it's still more than enough time for obito to warp behind hashi & take away his last moments in the real world, or just obliterate him via deidara.
You don't even know where Obito was at the time. How did he even know Sasuke was in danger? Don't try to use this scan while saying "Obito was nowhere near Sasuke at the time" we don't even know what happened. Obviously he was around, unless you think Obito is psychic.
Manga facts speak for themselves, if hashi tries to perform a jutsu that takes two panels or more to activate, then obito comes in for the warp & he will always be successful. To deny that is to deny the manga directly.
Um, no you moron. The clones will be out already. I said Hashirama can sprout Mokuton like Danzo to block the Los to make sure Obito loses track of the original since you think Obito can somehow keep track of the original among so many clones lmao.
Well then it's too bad that minato doesn't have feats to support him teleporting a bijuudama while using clones then isn't it? Because he still had to save konoha & himself.
Obito doesn't have feats using DMS. Hell he was alive for panels and couldn't even manifest a Susano rib cage, yet you think it's common sense Obito can do everything kakashi did? Ok we've established you're a hypocrite too.
& Besides, you think obito would've been toying around if minato knew his ability?
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, these are things that he's never been shown to do while warping. That, coupled with the fact that he didn't warp as fast as he normally does, proves that he wasn't fighting seriously.
Again, don't care about your excuses. Minato had no Intel on Kamui either. With Intel, minato would have ended the fight much sooner. There are very few that can take on Kamui without Intel. Mimato was one of them.
By the way, I can go ahead & say that the fight would've been easier for obito too if he simply summoned kurama to aid him, the distraction was all that he needed.
Except he did summon Kurama, and minato was distracted worrying about the village. He still lost.
Still sticking to the ad homenim fallacy are we? That's okay, you can disregard my argument based on your irrelevant beliefs all you want, doesn't change the cold hard facts that prove you wrong.
I haven't seen any facts from you. Speculation is all you have. That Obito can keep track of an original clone user despite this never being done before. How Obito knows what's going on while warping. How Obito can see through obstructions. Which I gave a valid reason for. He's a sensor.
Lol First you say that he'd be using clones after he creates the hobi, now you're saying he creates them at the start of the fight? Make up your mind. But regardless, changing the time that hashi decides to use his clones doesn't change what happens to him in the end.
If Konan had used multiple wood/shadow clones he wouldn't have known which was the original. Try again.
& As shown in the jinton example, hashi still gets warped away if he attempts to use a jutsu lasting longer than two panels, or multiple jutsus in succession.
When he couldn't even warp two fodders? Lmao. Hashirama is a sensor himself. Haven't even mentioned Sage Mode and how it can easily react to Kamui. But with clones, it's not needed
Stupid post, so obito can't warp a prepped C-0 on top of hashi? He can't warp multiple akatsuki members to take down each clone from behind? Your wank is too strong buddy, just because hashi uses clones doesn't mean that kamui is rendered useless, it's still the most useful jutsu on the field.
What feats? Has he ever succeeded in anything? Didn't he always want to become hokage? Did he? Don't be mad Hashirama's feats and hype out shadow that failures now Lol
According to your logic then, itachi & kabuto are invincible, hiruzen is also the god of shinobi, a single PS slash can wipe out all creation/whoever sees it dies, sasuke is the strongest character, & etc. I can go on forever.
Hype is for children who resort to using it after feats sh*t on their argument. Hype without feats = empty hype. Obito's feats [or should I say the entirety of akatsuki's feats] > Hashi's feats
Obitos feats? What feats again? --It was actually Madara who was the cause of akatsuki
-Tobi used madaras name to scare the 5 great nations into an alliance (there is even a scan on this)
-According to Madara and Black Zetsu all Obito did was fail
-if it weren't for Hashirama's cells Obito would be blind by 14. I guess by your logic Obitos feats are Hashirama's?
But in any case this isn't just obito vs hashi anyways, shows how much you spite the guy, lmao. This is the entirety of akatsuki. Hashi may be "the strongest character" according to madara & kabuto's hype, but that doesn't mean he can kill the entire shinoobi world if they were to team up against him [your logic]. He's fighting several shinobi who can possibly kill him in one hit, I'm sure kabuto & madara didn't think of that when praising him.
SS would wreck them all except intangible Obito. It isn't that Hashirama > all of akatsuki. It's that Hashirama has the firepower to put them down idiot.
Madara with PS would do the same. Everyone dies except Obito. If anyone is the hater it's you
& If you really want to believe in hype then how about the hype that had the world thinking obito was madara? Only a shinobi of madara's caliber would be able to make people think it was him in the first place. That's more than enough hype to put just an MS obito on madara & hashirama's level at the very least, so don't bring that sh*t up again unless you have feats.
Um no, tobi downplayed his strenght, Tsuchikage asked him if he's really Madara why was he using such tactics when he could have whatever he wants. Tobi replied "my injuries with the first hokage were too severe. I currently have little power."
Try again. Obito doesn't have any hype, or accomplishments.
Come on Drap, you know fully well he has. He's used more than on wood jutsu at the same time and so has Guruguru. You're saying Guruguru using SS and another technique was because that wasn't his strongest technique or because his is not as strong as Hashi's. This really doesn't matter at all.
Sasuke covered his Ribcage in Amaterasu and as well used Amaterasu while in Susanoo. Madara used a Genjutsu while in Susanoo as well so you're wrong here.
Kisame used GSB after casting a thousand shark and he had the sharks around during GSB.
He never controlled multiple mokuton constructs simultaneously.
You're saying Guruguru using SS and another technique was because that wasn't his strongest technique or because his is not as strong as Hashi's. This really doesn't matter at all.
He didn't summon his sharks while in the WD, meaning that it's the jutsu that most likely requires more concentration.
& kisame's sharks are actually a bit of an exception. [
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] According to the DB, kisame's sharks attack the enemy themselves, they act like real sharks, & kisame isn't controlling them but rather he simply creates them.
This means that once the sharks are summoned kisame doesn't have to concentrate on them anymore, thus explaining why they were still present during his GSB.
You're an idiot. Of course it's obstructed. How can he see what's going on when he's inside Kamui? Does he have a Tv inside the dimension showing him what's going on?
I'm the idiot yet you're the one blatantly denying the manga? Lol That's rich.
Idk how he knows what's going on, merely that he does. Do we know how hashi obtained SM? No, merely that he has it.
It's obvious he's able to tell where someone is when he comes out because he is a sensor. That's not helping him when he's fighting a user that can use clones. Gtfo.
Lmfao obito is a sensor now? I didn't know that? Scans? & Don't post
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one because the juubi grants you sensory abilities, hence why they were able to take out the HQ. [
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In any case, sensing still doesn't explain how obito is always able to teleport above ground. Not to mention the chakra connection between dimensions is cut off, meaning obito can't sense the outside world even if he has the ability, & they can't sense inside. [
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So nice try at making an excuse, but it's not going to work.
Less than a couple seconds? Wipe the cum out of your mouth it took him much longer than that to warp these two.
Lol Someone who isn't butthurt like you are wouldn't be fighting this desperately to try & downplay kamui, it's obvious that your hatred is making you QQ all over the place, stop trying to hide it.
@Bold: & I'm going to finally put that bullsh*t to rest. [
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"...confirms he is able to phase through solid objects", meaning they knew of his intangibility, hence why they needed to attack together.
& You need to go back to that fight & reread it, because obito didn't even attempt to warp fuu & torune until the scans I posted. He avoided their attacks & was fighting with his damn fists. [
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-
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] & Even then he wasn't even trying to hit them, torune confirmed that he was intangible the whole time & was simply going through the motions. [
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Get the f*ck out of here kid, you have no clue what the hell you're talking about & it's making you look absolutely retarded. No matter how many insults you try to throw at me you're still getting crushed when it comes to the dabete, so just stop, for your sake.
Lol, I just realized kakashi with Obito's same eye has lost track of Naruto, who was right in front of him. So enough with the "Obito won't lose track of the original" wank. Hell even Kaguya with her sharinnegan lost track of Naruto. That wank is disgusting.
Give me the scan stating he's a sensor, & I proved your bullsh*t wrong already but you chose to ignore everything I said, typical of a woodrider to disregard the points he can't address. Lol
Again, sensor. That won't help when clones are out.
You're acting like I think hashirama is unique in this respect. Anyone with multiple bunshin would cause Obito to lose track of the original, not just hashirama.
Proved how clones are useless, no need to indulge your fanfic.
You're saying Obito absolutely won't and that he's unique in this aspect since Madara, kaguya, kakashi, sasuke have all lost track of the original clone user.
, she would've picked up on obito's chakra & wouldn't have been concerned when sasuke disappeared. That's how I know he wasn't even in the room when the jutsu went off.
How am I supposed to know? I'm not kishi, however the fact is that he wasn't in the room.
Don't try to use this scan while saying "Obito was nowhere near Sasuke at the time" we don't even know what happened. Obviously he was around, unless you think Obito is psychic.
Karin failed to sense him, that's all the proof I need to shut this point down & comfortably say that obito wasn't near him.
Besides, it doesn't matter where he is in relation to the target he's warping to, the distance is irrelevant. He can travel a few feet just as fast as he can travel a hundred feet. [
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So where he was isn't important, the only thing that really matters is that obito wasn't in the room when sasuke nearly died.
Clones come out then obito focuses on the original.
I said Hashirama can sprout Mokuton like Danzo to block the Los to make sure Obito loses track of the original since you think Obito can somehow keep track of the original among so many clones lmao.
& I said that hashi isn't sprouting that mokuton before obito is already behind him, so it's not blocking obito when he's already going to be there by the time it's done.
His chakra, his eyes, his rikudou senjutsu, meaning the feats are his. Kakashi can't control obito's chakra better than he can especially since obito has displayed much better chakra control feats than him.
The facts support DMS obito having the feats that DMS kakashi used, nothing supports minato having the ability to use clones while using his barrier.
Hell he was alive for panels and couldn't even manifest a Susano rib cage
Facts suggest he can, not my problem if you don't believe it. U_U
Again, don't care about your excuses. Minato had no Intel on Kamui either. With Intel, minato would have ended the fight much sooner. There are very few that can take on Kamui without Intel. Mimato was one of them.
Completely irrelevant, trying to hurt my feelings or something? Lmao, if obito returned to konoha with kamui he would've made hokage as shown in the flash-forward as well as in the parallels between him & naruto. Madara unfortunately manipulated him & cursed him, oh well that was out of his control.
Don't be mad Hashirama's feats and hype out shadow that failures now Lol
And as I said [but you seem to be too retarded to notice it], it takes a shinobi of madara's caliber in order to fool the world into believing that he was madara in the first place.
-According to Madara and Black Zetsu all Obito did was fail
How does stealing someone's DNA equate to that person gaining their feats? The mokuton feats are hashi's & that's it, just like how hashi gained FTW despite never showing it to us.
They all laugh at hashi as they fly out of it's range. C'mon don't forget one of the first arguments I presented, I'm not going to repeat myself if you're gonna keep ignoring posts that sh*t on you.
It isn't that Hashirama > all of akatsuki. It's that Hashirama has the firepower to put them down idiot.
Um no, tobi downplayed his strenght, Tsuchikage asked him if he's really Madara why was he using such tactics when he could have whatever he wants. Tobi replied "my injuries with the first hokage were too severe. I currently have little power."
He called madara a shell of his former self, that doesn't change the fact that he still fooled everyone into thinking he was madara.
Just because he called himself weaker than he used to be doesn't mean that he wasn't still put on madara's level. Nobody called him weak, he called himself weak.
Try again. Obito doesn't have any hype, or accomplishments.
If MS Obito is included, the Akatsuki win, albeit extreme difficulty. The entire Akatsuki will be slaughtered besides Obito, but Obito would probably be able to find the opening he needs to get behind of Hashirama and absorb him to end him there. Take out MS Obito and the Akatsuki get demolished. The only people who solo the Akatsuki on their own are Juubi Jins and Current Naruto/Sasuke. Anyone below that and they lose if MS Obito is in the mix.
I'm very disappointed in you. You call yourself an Obito fan and you're not even aware of his abilities? Yes, you are indeed the idiot.
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Your whole argument just went down the drain.
In any case, sensing still doesn't explain how obito is always able to teleport above ground. Not to mention the chakra connection between dimensions is cut off, meaning obito can't sense the outside world even if he has the ability, & they can't sense inside. [
- Did you forget Obito has mayfly and Hiding like a mole too?
- Sometimes he doesn't need to sense. Obito sees a person then uses Kamui to teleport close to them. In the scan you showed me of Obito popping out above Naruto, Naruto was standing still the whole time. The same thing happened with Fu
So nice try at making an excuse, but it's not going to work.
Lol, retard. The rest of your nonsense is irrelevant now.
g he can do it?
What obito did to catch konan trumps hashi's featless ability to lose an opponent who's tracking him.
Yet I haven't seen the scan which even implies he has sensory abilities without the juubi.
Kamui stops obito from dropping deidara on hashi? Lol No it doesn't.
Speculation.
What manga are you reading?
So? Karin is too, she couldn't sense obito's warp.
Hashi gets warped as he attempts to enter SM.
Well unfortunately he isn't outlasting the entire akatsuki.
Flight sh*ts on FTW & any mokuton that hashi may try to use.
Don't need to list them all, kamui's warp speed is more than enough.
Completely irrelevant, trying to hurt my feelings or something? Lmao, if obito returned to konoha with kamui he would've made hokage as shown in the flash-forward as well as in the parallels between him & naruto. Madara unfortunately manipulated him & cursed him, oh well that was out of his control.
More salt bro?
The feats that sh*t on hashi's. U_U
Madara caused akatsuki, but he didn't gather the members, the bijuu, or start a war.
And as I said [but you seem to be too retarded to notice it], it takes a shinobi of madara's caliber in order to fool the world into believing that he was madara in the first place.
More bullsh*t hype & obvious demoralization? Gtf outta here with your awful interpretation of scans.
Yeah obito most likely has hashi's DNA to thank for his eyes becoming even more powerful, so what's your point?
How does stealing someone's DNA equate to that person gaining their feats? The mokuton feats are hashi's & that's it, just like how hashi gained FTW despite never showing it to us.
So cool if you wanna give hashi
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feat that's fine by me, not like he's
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anyways. U_U
They all laugh at hashi as they fly out of it's range. C'mon don't forget one of the first arguments I presented, I'm not going to repeat myself if you're gonna keep ignoring posts that sh*t on you.
Derp, no he doesn't if he can't get anywhere near them idiot.
They all fly away again.
He called madara a shell of his former self, that doesn't change the fact that he still fooled everyone into thinking he was madara.
Just because he called himself weaker than he used to be doesn't mean that he wasn't still put on madara's level. Nobody called him weak, he called himself weak.
- Became the mizukage
- Formed akatsuki & aquired loyal & powerful subordinates.
- Solely responsible for a world war
- Caused the kyuubi incident
- Along with itachi, slaughtered the uchiha clan
- Fooled the world into thinking he was madara
- Became a juubi jinchuuriki
- Helped save the world from kaguya & in fact played a key role in her defeat
