The Problem With Sasuke As A Villain

FearxDeath

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This is so true, each villian so far has had his own kind of prestige. They either wanted to watch the world burn or used people as a means to an end to accomplish their own goals. Pure Eviel! Cold, Heartless, Despicable people that you love to hate.

The problem isnt that Sasuke isnt strong, the problem is that Sasuke isnt respected. When talking about main characters it is the journey and not the destination. That is what is called character development. But Sasuke is development gone awry. He has litterally stumbled his way to the top: He killed Itachi a HUGE fan favorite, and not only did he kill itachi, but he did so out of what can only be called a child like ignorance. Itachi then gives him power and... you know what. I think thats just it, Sasuke doesnt deserve his power.

1) As a genin he didnt want any friends but this was forced on him when he joined team Kakashi, which ironic enough allowed him to befriend Naruto and thus access the Sharingans Tomies.

2) Orochimaru gave Sasuke alot of power thinking he would take his body.

3) Itachi then gives Sasuke his eyes.

4) Obito transplants Itachis eyes for him and gives him information and a target, killer bee, to hone his skills.

5) Went from Incomplete Susano to Semi-Perfect Susano just from fighting the kages, not sure how that works on top of which he couldnt defeat them without Suigestsu and Jugo.

6) Couldnt defeat Danzo without Kurina or Obito.

7) He needed Taku to defeat Killer Bee and even then he hurt Kurina, and even then he didnt even capture Killer Bee... If anything you could say he was defeated by Killer Bee... hmm...

7) Even to fight Obito he needed to infused his Susano with Jugo's senjutsu chakra.

8) Got stuck in different dimension, needed Obito and the gang to rescue him.


Its almost like the Ultimate Irony that throughout the Manga Naruto preachings teamwork and depending on each other, yet it always seems like everyone is counting on Naruto to do something. Then we turn around and look at Sasuke who preaches solitude and working through ones own strength AND YET I cant recall a single one of his feats that didnt directly rely on someone else helping him critically. When Naruto goes into a fight we think, how the hell is he going to win, and yet he comes out on top. While Sasuke he is always more or less bragging about how strong he is, he cant seem to get anything done without alot of help.

Naruto > Pain
Sasuke < Killer Bee

Pain < Killer Bee? If not then Why does Sasuke need help beating someone weaker than the person Naruto Solo'd.

This is even foreshadowed at the very begining when Orochimaru first appears in the Valley of Death I think its called, and Sasuke is so scared he cant move and Naruto fights Orochimaru and calls Sasuke a wimp.

If Sasuke had defeated Danzo on his own then perhaps this would be different. And the fact of the matter is Kurina wasnt really needed. All she did was point out that Danzo's sharingans were closing and let Sasuke bite her. All of which could have been taken out of the story, perhaps kishi is purposely making sasuke out to constantly rely on others, again as some kind of ultimate irony.
 
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senjusana

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We all know that neither Naruto nor Sasuke is going to die in that fight. Not even Kakashi or Sakura since we have seen their designs for the Last Movie.
And Sasuke is just a troubled teenager who is a FV for his own personal reasons.So it doesn't give much of an impact.We all know his backstory and flashbacks.
 

Meowazziel

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I dont find these comparisons completely fair.

All the other people you mention (Pein, Orochimaru, Madara, Tobi/Obito) are shown as adults.
Than you say with Sasuke, it comes off as teen angst, however he is the only one in your comparison, who is actually still a teen.
Besides, its not just teen angst. The guy saw his father and mother getting killed in front of his eyes, by his brother.
He had to live with believing his brother killed the whole clan for testing his ability. Than much later as a teen, he got to know the truth, how it was a mission from Konoha and how the Uchiha planned a coup.

Thats not something the average teen experiences, nor the average teen in Konoha in the Naruto universe.
Calling it just teen angst, would be trivialising what Sasuke has experienced and the effects it had on him.

Maybe if you compared Pein/Nagato as a teen, Oro as a teen, Madara as a teen, with Sasuke as a teen, your opinion on the whole thing would look different. Although they grew up in different times, so maybe not.

I do agree that Sasuke does not make for a good villain.
He is indeed not intimidating nor threatening.
He comes off as someone with issues. As someone who is unstable and confused.
As someone who doesnt really know what he is doing.
Not really as someone who has made up his mind with some sort of villain goal.
His goals change constantly throughout the series. From one extreme to the other as well.
Atm he wants to start a revolution, but he does not seem to have thought it through very well.
He gets overrun by his emotions, which does not allow him to see straight anymore imo.
He believes in his current plan for the ninja world but is blind to all the flaws in it.

Knowing about the new Naruto movie, gives one info about the outcome of Sasuke's battle.
That does kinda suck a bit indeed. Although its kinda cool in a way too.
I am still interested to how the battle will look like and what will happen, even though I know the endresult for a bit already.
 

SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO

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I dont find these comparisons completely fair.

All the other people you mention (Pein, Orochimaru, Madara, Tobi/Obito) are shown as adults.
Than you say with Sasuke, it comes off as teen angst, however he is the only one in your comparison, who is actually still a teen.
Besides, its not just teen angst. The guy saw his father and mother getting killed in front of his eyes, by his brother.
He had to live with believing his brother killed the whole clan for testing his ability. Than much later as a teen, he got to know the truth, how it was a mission from Konoha and how the Uchiha planned a coup.

Thats not something the average teen experiences, nor the average teen in Konoha in the Naruto universe.
Calling it just teen angst, would be trivialising what Sasuke has experienced and the effects it had on him.

Maybe if you compared Pein/Nagato as a teen, Oro as a teen, Madara as a teen, with Sasuke as a teen, your opinion on the whole thing would look different. Although they grew up in different times, so maybe not.

I do agree that Sasuke does not make for a good villain.
He is indeed not intimidating nor threatening.
He comes off as someone with issues. As someone who is unstable and confused.
As someone who doesnt really know what he is doing.
Not really as someone who has made up his mind with some sort of villain goal.
His goals change constantly throughout the series. From one extreme to the other as well.
Atm he wants to start a revolution, but he does not seem to have thought it through very well.
He gets overrun by his emotions, which does not allow him to see straight anymore imo.
He believes in his current plan for the ninja world but is blind to all the flaws in it.

Knowing about the new Naruto movie, gives one info about the outcome of Sasuke's battle.
That does kinda suck a bit indeed. Although its kinda cool in a way too.
I am still interested to how the battle will look like and what will happen, even though I know the endresult for a bit already.

That's not an excuse, Naruto is also a teenager but he displayed maturity beyond his years, Sasuke on the other hand is still a brat.
 

Naruto X Hunter

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Biased.When he said he wanted to kill the kages.Are you saying he didn't look intmidating? Thats one of the best panels in story.
 

Naruto X Hunter

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That's not an excuse, Naruto is also a teenager but he displayed maturity beyond his years, Sasuke on the other hand is still a brat.

Biased.I wonder how you would feel if you had your whole family massacred.
 

Tennis Robot

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Biased.When he said he wanted to kill the kages.Are you saying he didn't look intmidating? Thats one of the best panels in story.

Sasuke looked like he was really trying to convince Naruto to give up without a fight. I think he's afraid.
 

Honord Sage

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Sasuke is the James Dean of the Manga Rebel without a cause,just give Him a leather bicker jacket and see the movie.
 

Meowazziel

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That's not an excuse, Naruto is also a teenager but he displayed maturity beyond his years, Sasuke on the other hand is still a brat.
But Naruto is not a villain. Your comparison was about villians.
Nor do I try to give Sasuke an excuse. I do care about having things in the right context though.

Besides if two people experience hardships through life and they both get out of it differently, that doesnt have to mean (can, but doesnt have to) that one of the two is weaker so to speak, because their hardships were different, so how they can deal with it, can be different as well. Two hardships being both hardships, doesnt make them the same or affect someone the same. On top of it all, they were born different persons too. Its a combination of personality and environment.

Even taking all the differences into account, I do believe that Naruto would manage to survive better in Sasuke's shoes though. Anyway, I rather leave Naruto out of this discussion, because he is not among the villains.

What I wanted to point out is that Pein/Nagato and were not as mature as a teen as they were as an adult.
Besides they were born in a time where you had to mature quick (no village, constant wars), where kids couldnt be kids and teens couldnt be teens. Oro and Obito were born in a village though, but also in wartime.

While Sasuke was born in a different time, where the village tryed to let kids grow up, without being thrown into wars or fights they couldnt handle. Therefore missions with ranks were made. Not that Sasuke had an easy life (nor has Naruto, compared to other classmates), but the village tryed for his generation, to create a mission environment. That you get missions that are suited for you, rather than be thrown into wars that are over your head.

So comparing them (Madara, Pein/Nagato, Obito, Oro) to Sasuke doesnt feel that right to me, if you dont take into the discussion, that Sasuke is from a different time than they were.
 

HyuugaHeir

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Just ponder on this if you cant accept the manga as it is now..

Sasuke and Naruto took down different paths. Of course now they have different ideals...

Naruto may be on the right side and Sasuke on the wrong. But the latter did it with pureness....

Make the most out of this.
 

AMIan

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Orochimaru isn't that scary. He's just really creepy.
 

Benjamin King

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I hope people on this base don't justify genocide...An argument for Sasuke being a villain can be made. Evil is determined by the cause of destruction and bad. What Sasuke is doing is a perfect example of villain.

-By killing the Gokage, he's creating hatred between the 5 nations and himself.
-By killing the Bijuu, he's acting like a judger of creature's rights.

In terms of character, yes, Sasuke isn't on par with top villains we had; as his character seems to be rather a brat with sad background. In terms of power, he's very intimidating. But then again, power isn't what overall makes up a villain.​
 
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lucario14

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There's no problem. Look how popular this thread is, people just can't stop talking about sasuke. He might not be the best villain but he's the most talked about which makes naruto popular and therefore $$$ for Kishimoto.
 

alex211527

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so it is the same for Sakura because people talk about her all the time too :)))
 
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