My Tier List.
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Inert Brian
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Tiers 1-2: Agree
Tier 3: If that is DMS Kakashi then Tier 3 is fine. I recommend specifying that. If it's war arc, then he needs to drop quite a bit. Base Rikudo Naruto should drop a tier if DSM Kabuto stays at Tier 4.
Tier 4: We've had this discussion on my final 10 (which is outdated, I agree with what you said on there + that was before 692).
DSM Kabuto deserves to be in Tier 3 if Rikudo Base Naruto is. He has Madara who can spam meteors, Deidara who can use C3/4/(maybe C0), Nagato who has village busting Shinra Tensei (and that was even done with just six paths of pain), plus everyone else who has power that stacks overall.
Tier 5: Rinne Tensei Madara should move up a tier. He could neg-low diff Oro and his edos. This guy solo'd and sealed the bijuus within a chapter.
Tier 6: Spot on
Tier 7: Agree
Tier 8: Tier 8 seems to conflict with what you said about placing characters based on overall skill. Six paths of pain's versatility easily puts them in Tier 7. He already village busted + made a CT that rivaled Kurama's size.
Edo Itachi needs to move up as well, he's already insanely skilled in Tai(fought on par with KCM Naruto)-Nin(Amaterasu, the spirit weapons)-and Genjutsu + Sharingan Jutsu like Izanami/Izanagi. I should also add that he kept himself composed against KB, although he stayed on the defensive in their little battle.
You put MS Obito a tier below Rinnegan Obito w/o bijuu....MS Obito is better because he has Izanagi, they should be in the same tier.
7G Gai could possibly move up a tier. But I think he can still fit in 8.
Tier 9: Jiraiya should move up 1 tier. His Taijutsu is good enough, His Ninjutsu allows him to sneak attack with tricks like his barrier, Frog Song can be amazing in an environment that allows him to hide. Hanzo should go in this tier.
Tier 10: Deidara should move up a tier, he only lost to Sasuke because of lightning style and Sharingan. C4 and flight are such OP techniques. I also can't see how Sakura and Tsunade could be in the same tier as him. He would demolish them.
Tier 3: If that is DMS Kakashi then Tier 3 is fine. I recommend specifying that. If it's war arc, then he needs to drop quite a bit. Base Rikudo Naruto should drop a tier if DSM Kabuto stays at Tier 4.
Tier 4: We've had this discussion on my final 10 (which is outdated, I agree with what you said on there + that was before 692).
DSM Kabuto deserves to be in Tier 3 if Rikudo Base Naruto is. He has Madara who can spam meteors, Deidara who can use C3/4/(maybe C0), Nagato who has village busting Shinra Tensei (and that was even done with just six paths of pain), plus everyone else who has power that stacks overall.
Tier 5: Rinne Tensei Madara should move up a tier. He could neg-low diff Oro and his edos. This guy solo'd and sealed the bijuus within a chapter.
Tier 6: Spot on
Tier 7: Agree
Tier 8: Tier 8 seems to conflict with what you said about placing characters based on overall skill. Six paths of pain's versatility easily puts them in Tier 7. He already village busted + made a CT that rivaled Kurama's size.
Edo Itachi needs to move up as well, he's already insanely skilled in Tai(fought on par with KCM Naruto)-Nin(Amaterasu, the spirit weapons)-and Genjutsu + Sharingan Jutsu like Izanami/Izanagi. I should also add that he kept himself composed against KB, although he stayed on the defensive in their little battle.
You put MS Obito a tier below Rinnegan Obito w/o bijuu....MS Obito is better because he has Izanagi, they should be in the same tier.
7G Gai could possibly move up a tier. But I think he can still fit in 8.
Tier 9: Jiraiya should move up 1 tier. His Taijutsu is good enough, His Ninjutsu allows him to sneak attack with tricks like his barrier, Frog Song can be amazing in an environment that allows him to hide. Hanzo should go in this tier.
Tier 10: Deidara should move up a tier, he only lost to Sasuke because of lightning style and Sharingan. C4 and flight are such OP techniques. I also can't see how Sakura and Tsunade could be in the same tier as him. He would demolish them.
I think my only major disagreement is that Nagato should ve above KCM Naruto and Killer Bee, seeing that he easily beat both of them, even with Naruto's previous knowlege...
And Edo Itachi is = Killer Bee.
Besides that spot on list.
And Edo Itachi is = Killer Bee.
Besides that spot on list.
KidGamer65
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Done. Thanks.
-He has stronger Rasen Shuriken, much stronger in fact.
-He can merge with Ma and Pa while Pain Arc Naruto can't...even then his Sage Mode lasts much longer.
Those are the main reasons he's a tier higher.
Itachi has no business being a tier above people like Minato, Gai, Itachi and Gai. Not even as an Edo. He'd lose to most of the people in his current tier let alone a tier above, where everyone beats him, Killer B being the fight that is the highest difficulty. MS Sasuke during the Danzo fight shouldn't be up a tier either.
Ay was fighting against 5 of Madara's Susanoo clones, and the tiers are wide apart when it comes to strength. Ay isn't weak enough to warrant him a spot in the tier below, but I'd say he's hanging off the edge there.
I'll add Zetsu. Thanks. And no, Orochimaru doesn't go any lower than he is.
-He's not weaker than Sasori, he'd beat him mid-high diff at the highest.
-He'd definitely defeat Deidara. Flight isn't a reason for his victory as Oro can attack with Kusanagi despite Deidara's height. He's definitely not killing him any time soon due to Oral Rebirth. He'd either get outlasted or he'd outright be killed by Oro.
Hiruzen gave an Oro only using the fodder Edo Hokage as back up. He didn't take on Eight Branches, nor did Orochimaru use any of the jutsu he used against KN4. He'd handily beat anyone a tier below him.
With KCM Naruto? Killer B? Nagato?
Lol, I hope you're joking.
Kaguya was stated to be on a different level to Madara. She needs to be a tier above. Its either that Hagoromo moves up to her level or they all stay where they're at.
Thanks.
Yes, battle prowess.
@bold: Like who?
Lol...Hebi Sasuke any lower than 10? Lower than Deidara (Who he beat, even though he had the advantage) Lower than Choji?
Yeah, no.
MS Sasuke a tier below any of those guys, especially Danzo (who he beat) and Ay (Who isn't strong enough to take out Danzo fight Sasuke) is nothing but a joke..so I'll take it as one.
Jiraiya is already on the list, and MS Sasuke isn't going anywhere.
They've been added. Thanks.
I just assumed that everyone would know its DMS, but I'll add it just in case anyone gets confused.
Sure, I can add them if you really want me to.
Though Edo Itachi isn't losing to B if he doesn't use Bijuu Mode. He can't evade Amatersu in either form, he has to fight CQC making him vulnerable against Genjutsu, as we saw in the manga when he fought Sasuke and Itachi.
And B has no business being in the same tier as EMS Madara. He can't output anything strong enough to breach PS, and he can't take more than 2 of its sword slashes. Direct hits that is.
Either add Nagato to tier 6 too or replace him with EMS Sasuke. Hes certainly stronger than KCM and Bee combined. Way stronger actually. This was made painfully clear.[/QUOTE]
Thanks man, I'll add him.
Hiruzen? Hebi Sasuke? Kakuzu? Lol, how?
Thanks man..though 2 is too high for him.
I've specified that its DMS Kakashi in my edit. Base Rikudo Naruto would thrash Kabuto and Oro w/Edo Tensei, and he's overall stronger than any of their Edos combined considering he casually cuts the same tree everyone struggled to cut. And he was pressuring Juubi Jin Madara pre Shinju absorption.
Ok.
Nope. Not a chance. None of that even begins to compare to cutting the Shinju in half with one strike. Not to mention we still have all the other Bijuu abilities he used in Rikudo Senjutsu Mode. Madara's Meteors are garbage compared to CT, so I don't know why you'd mention them. Shinra Tensei is weaker than PS, So is C0 and C3, and C4 can be sensed and evaded.
Unless you think that they can pressure JJ Madara w/one eye pre Shinju..then they stay where they are.
I can move him up.
No, it doesn't. His jutsu are slow enough for anyone in tier 8 to counter and defeat him, not to mention they all have better feats. Example:
Rinnegan Obito was pressuring KCM Naruto, who is stated to be above Sage Mode Naruto, who pressured Pain, despite the lack of Deva. They are both above KN6 as well, who pressured Pain.
Killer B casually fires Mountain busters, and can use 4 at a time, and he can pretty much take anything Pain throws at him. He's more durable, more destructive, and he's a bigger threat to stronger people, so he's a tier above.
Nagato needs no explanation.
No. Fighting on par with KCM Naruto in Taijutsu doesn't mean much when KCM Naruto doesn't excel in Taijutsu. In a fight he'd get wrecked by him..and he'd get wrecked against the people Naruto has fought against.
Rinnegan Obito performed much better than MS Obito did in canon, and he has the Gedo Mazo, better than Izanagi.
The people in that tier have much better feats than he does. And some of them would wreck him in combat, so yeah, he can stay in 8.
Hanzo has been moved to Jiraiya's tier, but Jiraiya isn't going a tier above Kisame, Third Raikage and Sick Itachi. No way. In fact everyone above would take him mid diff at best.
He'd need C4 to beat them and the people in the same tier aren't as close apart as you think, and he doesn't beat anyone close to him on that tier easily enough to put him a tier above him. The tier above is filled with people near MS Sasuke's level. Deidara doesn't belong there.
B didn't use Bijuu Mode, and Naruto didn't use clones or Shunshin.
Nah. B would definitely beat him.And Edo Itachi is = Killer Bee.
Besides that spot on list.
Good list man, its alot like mine,, but i just want to address a few things
--Place JJ hagoromo at the same tier as Kaguya, with the sun and moon seal he can probably defeat kaguya and thhe gap between them really shouldnt be that vast
--I personally would put Nagato in the same tier as EMS sasuke,, their battle is pretty close, and nagato can beat most people in his tier anyways, bar Obito
--I would also put up RT Madara, the dude can beat anyone in his tier no more than mid diff, he belongs in the higher tier, and thats one of the only main flaws in ur list
--And realistically speaking i dont see thhe difference between MS Obito and RInnegan Obito w/o Bijuu, both of their moveset is revolved entirely around kamui, IMO they should be on the same tier
--konan should also be put in tier 10, she can give each of them a very good fight, and certainly belongs there, so can Lee, Darui, Kitsuchi and the ones that iicelerate mentioned
I would have liked you to have placings around each tier, i believe that wouldve made ur list even better
--Place JJ hagoromo at the same tier as Kaguya, with the sun and moon seal he can probably defeat kaguya and thhe gap between them really shouldnt be that vast
--I personally would put Nagato in the same tier as EMS sasuke,, their battle is pretty close, and nagato can beat most people in his tier anyways, bar Obito
--I would also put up RT Madara, the dude can beat anyone in his tier no more than mid diff, he belongs in the higher tier, and thats one of the only main flaws in ur list
--And realistically speaking i dont see thhe difference between MS Obito and RInnegan Obito w/o Bijuu, both of their moveset is revolved entirely around kamui, IMO they should be on the same tier
--konan should also be put in tier 10, she can give each of them a very good fight, and certainly belongs there, so can Lee, Darui, Kitsuchi and the ones that iicelerate mentioned
I would have liked you to have placings around each tier, i believe that wouldve made ur list even better
iNotorious
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KidGamer65
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Having the seals doesn't mean that he'd win. Though I guess Hagoromo can move up.
When PS comes out, it isn't close. And he doesn't beat the people in his tier at a low enough difficulty to warrant him moving up a tier.
Lol, I did...but I forgot to submit it, so I'll do that now.
Gedo Mazo.
I'll add them again.
You mean have them in order?
Thanks.
One touch and she got sealed,
but yeah, move him up
His PS lacks feats and has not shown any shockwaves, apart from that every attack gets absorbed,
nonetheless they are relatively on par with each other
and nagato can also beat him before he brings out PS,
either way, i hate debating this match, since there arent many feats to talk about, so i guess we'll stop at that
Cool
Im pretty sure that to control the Mazo, you need the Uchiha/Senju DNA but i see ur point, its possible that rinnegan is required to summon iit,
and MS Obito has shown to control the mazo
lmao ok
Yeah have them in order, that would improve ur list even more
Killua Zoldyck
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I heavily disagree on Tier 8. Most, if not all of those characters have not shown anything to suggest that they are an entire tier above many of the characters in Tier 9.
KidGamer65
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Your point? Naruto and Sasuke had the seals, but they couldn't beat her despite it requiring only a single touch.
His PS hasn't shown shockwaves cause it has no feats. A V3 Legged Susanoo enhanced by Naruto's chakra created shockwaves. Madara's Susanoo variants aren't so far above Madara's that Sasuke's would be incapable of creating any kind of shockwave.
Not to mention he can still set up for Kirin, which is GG as Nagato can't react.
No, they aren't. Nagato can't damage PS, nor can he block its attacks. That isn't on par.
If Sasuke is in trouble, all he needs to do is bring it out with a thought, so that isn't happening either.
Rinnegan is required to summon it. So its not in MS Obito's arsenal.
Too much thinking for me to do right now. Lol. Especially the lower tiers.
KidGamer65
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Hagoromo certainly has the means to land the seals,
and once he can get up close he can do it
@Bold - exactly, his PS lacks feats, which is why i dont seee the whole tier difference between the two
and if you are comparing sasukes senjutsu enhanced, kurama chakra enhanced to madaras normal V3, then that is wrong
madaras PS is still above sasukes, with 2 blades, double the size, and obviously higher DC
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which allows nagato more than enough time to repel with ST, similar to how it allowed itachi to activate susanoo, as both of their techniques revolve around their thoughtIf PS doesnt form any decent shockwaves (which it hasnt shown), then he can just absorb all its attacks and simply outlast sasuke,
He can kill him off quickly by pulling him through BT in the early stages and killing him with ningendo, or immobilising with shurado
madara also used a deva like power on sasuke to completely immobilise sasuke
either way, like i said, i dont like debating this match up since there is not enough feats and manga material to discuss about
Yes
Lmao, i personally consider ranking the top tiers not very hard, but i se ur point on the lower tiers Lol
KidGamer65
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Then she counters just like she did against Naruto and Sasuke. She warps away, goes to the ice dimension, freezes him and warps away. Or counter attacks with chakra fists or ash killing bones.
That isn't a logical argument. Saying his PS lacks feats, so its massively weaker than Madara's doesn't make sense.
I was clearly comparing his Kurama chakra enhanced V3 (This was before Senjutsu) to his PS. It can make shockwaves, no reason why his PS can't, unless you think that Susanoo is stronger than his PS.
True. But so much stronger that he'd drop from Madara's level to Nagato's level? So much stronger that Nagato can overpower it? Gonna need the proof, cause other evidence disagrees with that gap.
Not relevant in this fight. Less weapons doesn't equate to strength, it just means that Madara's can cut with double the power at once. Sasuke doesn't need that kind of power for Nagato.
Not relevant. Size=Strength was debunked when Sasuke's Rikudo PS was shown to be tiers above Madara's even though Madara's is much larger.
You say "obviously" but to this day, I have seen no logical argument that supports Madara's PS being much stronger than Sasuke's. Just "No feats"
Susanoo activates and stays active, so if he uses it before Kirin hits, then it doesn't matter. Shinra Tensei is a quick, not continuous, and a short burst of repulsive force. If he uses ST before Kirin hits him, ST won't hit Kirin, it'd activate, resolve, and then Kirin would slam
Except it can, so he dies. Mid diff.
Susanoo activates, Ningendo and Shurado are then rendered useless.
1. Madara=/=Nagato. Lets not go there.
2. That was Limbo.
There is enough manga material to discuss this match up. When anyone can show me Madara's Susanoo being so far above Sasuke's, that his PS would be so much weaker that it can't generate a shockwave, then I'll concede. Fair comparisons please.
Yeah, I didn't want to do the top tiers and then not do the lower tiers.