1. All Uchiha could use Izanami/Izanagi. Kishi retconed it to be an Uchiha-wide tech to increase its history within the clan.
2. Apparently awakening Rinnegan healed the right eye's blindness.
3. Eternal light only applied to MS techs, not forbidden techs like Izanami/Izanagi.
Not only are you absolutely stupid when it comes to teh questions in your thread, but also this statement you just made is stupid. Fillers are not cannon? So what? Do you really think Kishi would allow animators and the studios to just recreate his story, especially extremely important flashbacks that rounds out the entire story? You and everyone else who believes that is stupid, to sit up here and say "fillers aren't cannon" thinking Kishi wouldn't play a role in how those fillers are told and put together. Even if he is a damn consultant, he has a huge role in how these fillers play out.
the one who's an idiot is the one who believes that every filler is canon, it would be contradicting if it were true, because a few episodes before when obito went against Konan he explained how he had senju and Uchiha DNA which allowed him to use izanagi, look for yourself.
You seem to misunderstand my reason for this thread, it's because I saw that the last few chapters are kinda ruining something that I've been into since I was 9. I just hate it when he doesn't keep the story straight.
1. Izanagi and Izanami can preformed by any Uchiha. Itachi stated that Izanami was created to counter the over use of Izanagi by the Uchiha.
2. Awakening the Rinnegan and/or Hashirama's healing abilities healed the eyes' blindness.
3. "Never ending light" is a claim that one will never lose its light through the jutsus granted to you by unlocking the Mangekyou Sharingan. However, Izanagi can be used without the Mangekyou as well. Izanagi is not a jutsu of the MS.
the one who's an idiot is the one who believes that every filler is canon, it would be contradicting if it were true, because a few episodes before when obito went against Konan he explained how he had senju and Uchiha DNA which allowed him to use izanagi, look for yourself.
I never said I believed fillers were canon in the first place. I said the people who sit there and discredit valuable information in fillers ABOUT the MAIN story line are stupid only because they are not canon. "fillers are not canon" is one of the dumbest comments someone can make to discredit information in those fillers. If you really believe Kishi would let the studios do whatever they want to anything related to the main story line then, like I said, you are stupid. You mean to tell me the studios are pulling all of that information out of their asses and just making it all up? Get real.
Oh my god, can YOU read? I just said everything in the in these last few chapters are whats making the plot holes, how can KAGUYA's character be mention only a few chapters ago, and she's already here, when Madara's character was mention almost at the beginning of the shippuden series, and it took kishi all the way, until after the war started to show him entirely? Seems like he brought her in too fast for it not to create plot holes, also Madara's story took the entire series to tell, when hers took only a few chapters, so of course there would be mistakes, because of him hurrying to show her face without giving us much backstory, so how about next time you read a little more, and instead of just accepting plot holes, because then things become confusing.
I never said I believed fillers were canon in the first place. I said the people who sit there and discredit valuable information in fillers ABOUT the MAIN story line are stupid only because they are not canon. "fillers are not canon" is one of the dumbest comments someone can make to discredit information in those fillers. If you really believe Kishi would let the studios do whatever they want to anything related to the main story line then, like I said, you are stupid. You mean to tell me the studios are pulling all of that information out of their asses and just making it all up? Get real.
Yeah that's exactly what I'm saying, if it wasn't in the manga, then it's not considered canon. Studios can, and do make up things, even though they try and stay as close to the main storyline as possible, but sometimes mistakes do happen, and that's when you get plotholes because if senju DNA weren't needed then danzo, and obito wouldn't have stated that it was required which was also in the manga if you read those chapters... So my questions still have not had an answer, or is it everything those 2 said was wrong, and everything itachi said was right?
2nd. If Madara's right sharingan had lost it's light how was he able to not only awaken the rinnegan in both eyes, but we did we not see him with both sharingan when he fought the against alliance?
I truly feel like Madara is a better villain the she is, after all this time we found out that Madara was the one to put everything into play, then all of the sudden, black zetsu was controlling everything behind the scenes,
REALLY! black zestu? It just seems too "out of the blue" for me. :eww:
What does your disdain for Kaguya and Black Zetsu have to do with plot holes?
Actually, this was foreshadowed. Kaguya has been built up for two arcs now. The shinigami and Kimimaro resemble her. What's more, Kimimaro's clan is named after her. Black Zetsu's birth has been vaguely explained throughout the series. Madara stated he was his will but did not state he was created through yin yang release unlike how he initially believed the white zetsus were. Black Zetsu also knew of the Totsuka Blade and Yata Mirror somehow. He continually recorded battles through reasons and means unknown. Hashirama felt his presence at the valley of the end, where both he and Zetsu first appeared at the start of part 2. People thought it strange that Hagoromo would leave blueprints to Rinnegan and IT and blamed him for everything, yet he stated the meaning somehow became lost while I maintained that he either did not write the whole stone or that someone had altered it, which they already had considering Madara's story was etched into it. Black Zetsu also stated he was the land, mirroring the Shinju's power and title. Neither he nor the white zetsus physically resembled Hashirama even though Madara described them as clones of him like the Hashirama statue in the mazou and attached to Obito's body.
If Kaguya was going to be the final villain, we should've had some indication before black zetsu just stabbed the main villan, or so we thought, in the chest out of nowhere, and the way Madara went out was just a horrible way for someone of his importance to go out,
Please stop bringing your bias into this. Plot holes and your disdain for the direction of the plot are completely different things. We did have indication. Kaguya was stated by Hagoromo to be more powerful than him and tried to destroy the world. He also did not state how she was defeated or what happened to her. Kaguya's nine tomoe eye appeared in the Shinju flower and spoke to Madara, telling him mto absorb her. He then stated "so this was the shinju" and her face was shown, stating "everything will become one." Afterward, when IT was cast, her face was shown enveloping the moon and sky. Black Zetsu possessed the double Kamui, which Madara earlier was unable to outspeed and he touched the ground, which was stated to be Black Zetsu's territory while Madara also stated he could not move through all of this.
I really hope Madara isn't dead, Because no matter what he's still my favorite character, and is the whole reason I started liking naruto in the first place, way back when naruto, and sasuke were standing on his head, at the final valley. =D[/CENTER]
Hashirama's cells and the Gedo Mazou likely restored it eventually.
That may have played a part in its regeneration as well.
Plot holes are subjective.
What does your disdain for Kaguya and Black Zetsu have to do with plot holes?
Actually, this was foreshadowed. Kaguya has been built up for two arcs now. The shinigami and Kimimaro resemble her. What's more, Kimimaro's clan is named after her. Black Zetsu's birth has been vaguely explained throughout the series. Madara stated he was his will but did not state he was created through yin yang release unlike how he initially believed the white zetsus were. Black Zetsu also knew of the Totsuka Blade and Yata Mirror somehow. He continually recorded battles through reasons and means unknown. Hashirama felt his presence at the valley of the end, where both he and Zetsu first appeared at the start of part 2. People thought it strange that Hagoromo would leave blueprints to Rinnegan and IT and blamed him for everything, yet he stated the meaning somehow became lost while I maintained that he either did not write the whole stone or that someone had altered it, which they already had considering Madara's story was etched into it. Black Zetsu also stated he was the land, mirroring the Shinju's power and title. Neither he nor the white zetsus physically resembled Hashirama even though Madara described them as clones of him like the Hashirama statue in the mazou and attached to Obito's body.
Please stop bringing your bias into this. Plot holes and your disdain for the direction of the plot are completely different things. We did have indication. Kaguya was stated by Hagoromo to be more powerful than him and tried to destroy the world. He also did not state how she was defeated or what happened to her. Kaguya's nine tomoe eye appeared in the Shinju flower and spoke to Madara, telling him mto absorb her. He then stated "so this was the shinju" and her face was shown, stating "everything will become one." Afterward, when IT was cast, her face was shown enveloping the moon and sky. Black Zetsu possessed the double Kamui, which Madara earlier was unable to outspeed and he touched the ground, which was stated to be Black Zetsu's territory while Madara also stated he could not move through all of this.
Everything you just said was bullsh*t, eating something doesn't give you it's DNA, plot holes aren't subjective, because personal influence doesn't make contradictions in a story, you're just making excuses for things that don't make sense, also it's my thread, so if I want to show my point of view, I'm going to, I don't care if you think I'm being bias, or not.
Wrong. Whatever edible thing you eat becomes metabolized into your blood stream, whether it is fully digested or not. Upon eating Hashirama's flesh, Madara also injested his blood and chakra. Further on, there is also nothing that suggests Madara had not already infused senju DNA into himself.
Then debunk those "excuses" or are we done here since you appear to be close minded to your own beliefs and interpretations no matter what anyone and anything else says.
If you don't care for other people's opinions, why make a discussion thread? Bias is important in a debate as it effects objectivity and judgement and the plain and simple matter is, your disdain for Madara's defeat has absolutely nothing to do with the topic.
Wrong. Whatever edible thing you eat becomes metabolized into your blood stream, whether it is fully digested or not. Upon eating Hashirama's flesh, Madara also injested his blood and chakra. Further on, there is also nothing that suggests Madara had not already infused senju DNA into himself.
Plotholes are incredibly subjective as they are subject to misinterpretation, expanded content and critical thinking.
Then debunk those "excuses" or are we done here since you appear to be close minded to your own beliefs and interpretations no matter what anyone and anything else says.
If you don't care for other people's opinions, why make a discussion thread? Bias is important in a debate as it effects objectivity and judgement and the plain and simple matter is, your disdain for Madara's defeat has absolutely nothing to do with the topic.
If Madara had infused Hashirama's chakra before then, why doesn't the manga state it? You're just making stuff up, also ingesting something still doesn't give you it's d.n.a., no matter what you eat you're d.n.a. will not merge together with it's. Whatever interpretation someone may have, it still doesn't make plot holes in a story, that's the work of the writer.
It's not that I don't care for others opinion, it's just that I'm entitled to have my own, also you keep saying validate or debunk, when you haven't shown any validation yourself, explaining why you might have the opinions you do... Until you do, everything you say is irrelevant.
Lol I didn't say Hashirama. I said it's a possibility he may have infused another Senju's DNA into himself at once point. Itachi stated many Uchiha abused Izanagi. It's just critical thinking.
Incorrect. As I stated, plot holes are subject to the reader's interpretation and comprehension. What you may call a plot hole may be the furthest thing from one depending on the full information regarding the issue whether it is revealed later or already revealed. You are mixing plotholes up with inconsistencies.
As am I. And getting angry, calling "everything I said bullshit" what's more without even attempting to debunk it after I spent my time elaborating, using data and remaining objective neither supports your standpoints nor leaves a positive impression of you onto others.
Wrong. I stated he had Hashirama's flesh and thus his blood in his bloodstream. This is validation.
I then went on to say Hashirama's DNA may have restored his eye since he literally placed it into his chest to heal his wounds while Obito's eye never lost its eye and was on the hashirama clone half of his body. These are validations.
I stated plot holes are subject to interpretation and expanded content. This is validation.
I explained all the forshadowings of Black Zetsu and Kaguya. Some subjective, others written in black and white and conclude that your bias towards Madara was off-topic and subject to clouded judgement, which is a core concept of bias. This is validation.
Your validation? "Everything you just said is bullshit and just excuses!" I see no objectivity or validation in that. Only insults and ranting.
Actually, not everything I stated was opinion. Many parts were direct references from the manga. That's how I work you see. I don't make opinions without giving any evidence.
And playing the "I know you are but what am I game" doesn't support your standpoint either.
Lol I didn't say Hashirama. I said it's a possibility he may have infused another Senju's DNA into himself at once point. Itachi stated many Uchiha abused Izanagi. It's just critical thinking.
What am I making up? Everything I've stated until now is based on data and facts.
Right, just like blood diseases don't carry over to offspring or partners.
Incorrect. As I stated, plot holes are subject to the reader's interpretation and comprehension. What you may call a plot hole may be the furthest thing from one depending on the full information regarding the issue whether it is revealed later or already revealed. You are mixing plotholes up with inconsistencies.
As am I. And getting angry, calling "everything I said bullshit" what's more without even attempting to debunk it after I spent my time elaborating, using data and remaining objective neither supports your standpoints nor leaves a positive impression of you onto others.
Then perhaps you should do it.
Wrong. I stated he had Hashirama's flesh and thus his blood in his bloodstream. This is validation.
I then went on to say Hashirama's DNA may have restored his eye since he literally placed it into his chest to heal his wounds while Obito's eye never lost its eye and was on the hashirama clone half of his body. These are validations.
I stated plot holes are subject to interpretation and expanded content. This is validation.
I explained all the forshadowings of Black Zetsu and Kaguya. Some subjective, others written in black and white and conclude that your bias towards Madara was off-topic and subject to clouded judgement, which is a core concept of bias. This is validation.
Your validation? "Everything you just said is bullshit and just excuses!" I see no objectivity or validation in that. Only insults and ranting.
Actually, not everything I stated was opinion. Many parts were direct references from the manga. That's how I work you see. I don't make opinions without giving any evidence.
And playing the "I know you are but what am I game" doesn't support your standpoint either.
You need to debunk what I say before it becomes irrelevant, sir. Saying it's bs or an excuse doesn't validate that.
First off I'm am not at all angry, you said, that " everything you've said, has been based on facts"... What facts? Blood diseases can't carry on to your partner, only to your descendants, trust me, I know, I have sickle cell beta thalassemia, which is a blood disease, which I didn't get from my girlfriend, they cannot be passed on , you have to be born with them, the truth is you cannot transplant D.N.A. That's fact. Also besides kaguya, what have you referenced from the manga? Couldn't have been your "theories" because none of them were stated in the manga, eyes don't repair themselves just because you have senju DNA, because the manga never stated that, just because something's in your bloodstream doesn't mean it's merged with you DNA. Inconsistencies, and plotholes are the same thing, and there has been a lot of them since kishi mentioned kaguya only a few chapters ago, Madara was mention at the beginning of the series, so it's only common sense to think that he should've been the final villain, because kishi has spent all this time, giving us his entire backstory from childhood, but instead we get someone who we didn't even know existed until a few chapters ago, her story was rushed, and in doing so, kishi created a lot of potholes. Your just trying to make excuses for why they're there, which makes everything you say irrelevant.
Since it seems theres a lack of structure in the counter arguments to the points you made.
I will do so, because everyone is entitled to their opinions as most people forgetting when attempting to debate over Naruto
I will number them as you numbered your questions:
1. Izanagi does need senju DNA:
It was used by Uchiha before during missions, and Izanami was created to punish them.
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Danzo had senju DNA to help him manage the Sharingans and lengthen the Izanagi as much as possible:
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2. Rinnegan ''awoke'' both eyes:
In today's chapter we finally got to see the process of the Sharingan changing to the Rinnegan
As we see Madara sacrificed an eye for the Izanagi:
You must be registered for see images
However when the Rinnegan ''awoke'' this ''activated'' both eyes into not only working but working as the Rinnegan :
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[Mind you this activated when Madara was in old age, so the process took time]
3. The EMS is eternal in use, Izanagi is a sacrifice:
The Mangekyou Sahringan as we know loses it's light the more you use it:
You must be registered for see images
However those even without the MS are able to use Izanagi and still lose an eye, this is because it is a sacrifice and not an Mangekyou technique which causes the eye to deteriorate
[Addressing the other points]
Kaguya i believe was introduced in chapter 646 and was hinted out throughout since, [36 chapters is equivalent to an arc in most Mangas]
As for Black Zetsu, there has been many different questions in the Manga which he ties up:
1. Who did Hashirama briefly sense at the end of his fight with Madara
2. How did Madara survive if he ''died'' and the Konoha ninja arrived
3. Why did Hagoromo leave a tablet which encourages the Uchiha to do evil deeds for power
It ties up quite well
however, there are aspects which should have been written better
I respectfully disagree with your points and refute them, however i do understand what you mean
Since it seems theres a lack of structure in the counter arguments to the points you made.
I will do so, because everyone is entitled to their opinions as most people forgetting when attempting to debate over Naruto
I will number them as you numbered your questions:
1. Izanagi does need senju DNA:
It was used by Uchiha before during missions, and Izanami was created to punish them.
You must be registered for see images
Danzo had senju DNA to help him manage the Sharingans and lengthen the Izanagi as much as possible:
You must be registered for see images
2. Rinnegan ''awoke'' both eyes:
In today's chapter we finally got to see the process of the Sharingan changing to the Rinnegan
As we see Madara sacrificed an eye for the Izanagi:
You must be registered for see images
However when the Rinnegan ''awoke'' this ''activated'' both eyes into not only working but working as the Rinnegan :
You must be registered for see images
[Mind you this activated when Madara was in old age, so the process took time]
3. The EMS is eternal in use, Izanagi is a sacrifice:
The Mangekyou Sahringan as we know loses it's light the more you use it:
You must be registered for see images
However those even without the MS are able to use Izanagi and still lose an eye, this is because it is a sacrifice and not an Mangekyou technique which causes the eye to deteriorate
[Addressing the other points]
Kaguya i believe was introduced in chapter 646 and was hinted out throughout since, [36 chapters is equivalent to an arc in most Mangas]
As for Black Zetsu, there has been many different questions in the Manga which he ties up:
1. Who did Hashirama briefly sense at the end of his fight with Madara
2. How did Madara survive if he ''died'' and the Konoha ninja arrived
3. Why did Hagoromo leave a tablet which encourages the Uchiha to do evil deeds for power
It ties up quite well
however, there are aspects which should have been written better
I respectfully disagree with your points and refute them, however i do understand what you mean
Thank you, I wish everyone could be as respectful as you in their replies. However I'm assuming you know what I meant, when I said Kaguya's story was kind of rushed when compared to Madara's, and that we should've had more of her backstory before her appearance, because that left people asking question, like what's her true motive,what kind of person is she? Is she evil or misguided, and what does she hope to gain?
Now I'm going to be honest I didn't start reading the manga until after Naruto, and Sasuke had their battle at the bridge, but in the anime before the izanami filler, obito stated against konan, that he could use izanagi because he had both Uchiha, and Senju DNA, he also called danzo's form of izanagi "imperfect"? When Madara first went blind, he transplanted his brothers eyes, but even then, even though his original eyes weren't "sealed" away they were no longer useful, now when he used izanagi, without senju DNA, and his supposed eternal sharingan, was sealed away, yet they weren't rendered useless, like his original eyes? All this doesn't make sense to me, which is why I made this thread.
Thank you, I wish everyone could be as respectful as you in their replies. However I'm assuming you know what I meant, when I said Kaguya's story was kind of rushed when compared to Madara's, and that we should've had more of her backstory before her appearance, because that left people asking question, like what's her true motive,what kind of person is she? Is she evil or misguided, and what does she hope to gain?
Now I'm going to be honest I didn't start reading the manga until after Naruto, and Sasuke had their battle at the bridge, but in the anime before the izanami filler, obito stated against konan, that he could use izanagi because he had both Uchiha, and Senju DNA, he also called danzo's form of izanagi "imperfect"? When Madara first went blind, he transplanted his brothers eyes, but even then, even though his original eyes weren't "sealed" away they were no longer useful, now when he used izanagi, without senju DNA, and his supposed eternal sharingan, was sealed away, yet they weren't rendered useless, like his original eyes? All this doesn't make sense to me, which is why I made this thread.
No probz, I know what it's like trying to make a point and not being listened too on NB
Anyway, yes i agree fully Kishi definitely could have written Kaguya into the story better, to have done so he would have needed to have the Tablet's Story told earlier, [a good time IMO was when the Hokage's were resurrected and Sasuke could have used his new EMS to read the Tablet]
That being said, he did tie up many loose ends with the recent chapters, which begs the question if he seemingly had the idea in motion, why does it feel forced to a degree
I will probably chalk it down to the editors requesting the manga is drawn out longer to maximise revenue
First off I'm am not at all angry, you said, that " everything you've said, has been based on facts"... What facts? Blood diseases can't carry on to your partner, only to your descendants, trust me, I know, I have sickle cell beta thalassemia, which is a blood disease, which I didn't get from my girlfriend, they cannot be passed on , you have to be born with them, the truth is you cannot transplant D.N.A. That's fact.
I was referring to blood transfused diseases and actually, depending on its properties, the food you injest can cause cancer, which is a mutation of the DNA.
I've told you what I referenced from the manga twice. I'm done repeating myself and since you've insulted me and don't plan to acknowledge anything I say or link anyway, I won't be repeating myself a third time or be giving links.
So basically you're rejecting the fact that Uchiha abused Izanagi according to Itachi?
You're rejecting that Hashirama's DNA heals wounds while the gedo mazou sustains life?
You're rejecting that Kaguya was mentioned half way through the Juubi revival arc and was foreshadowed through info by Hagoromo and her own appearance no less to return?
You're rejecting that Black Zetsu appeared at the valley of the end even though Hashirama sensed him and he was shown to be there to take Madara's corpse?
You're rejecting that Black Zetsu was not created by yin yang release like Madara used on the white zetsu and hashirama clone even though he did not explain how he created him?
These are neither my opinions nor theories. They are established content and facts from the manga. Simply ignoring them, calling them bullshit, excuses, opinions, theories or whatever is ridiculous. You can't erase what has been said. If you want to deny it, fine, but again, that doesn't support your standpoint, much like your insults and bias.
Eyes are a part of ones anatomy, just like the organs Madara and Obito had healed from their Hashirama DNA and clone. They are flesh and blood and are subject to injury. Even the Rinnegan is flesh and destructible. They exist outside physical reality as you seem to be implying.
Actually, it's exactly like that. If you want to get literal, the "DNA" abbreviation was never used in Obito's description of Izanagi. Only Senju powers and abilities Or at least not in these two accepted translations. Furthermore, Danzo was able to detach the Hashirama clone from himself.
No, they are not. Inconsistencies are when something is vaguely explained and a minority do not understand it when it it elaborated again later on. Plotholes are concepts that completely contradict previously established concepts. They are subject to personal interpretation, expanded content left open descriptions however.
Again, what you are thinking of are inconsistencies, not plotholes. You have the two terms mixed up. And 35 chapters ago is not a few chapters age. 35 chapters and one and a half arcs or thirty-five chapters ago. Furthermore, regardless of the number, it doesn't erase her consistent foreshadowing.
so it's only common sense to think that he should've been the final villain, because kishi has spent all this time, giving us his entire backstory from childhood, but instead we get someone who we didn't even know existed until a few chapters ago, her story was rushed, and in doing so, kishi created a lot of potholes.
Your personal disdain for Madara's defeat is invalid to the topic. It has nothing to do with plotholes. At the time, Madara was dead. Kimimaro and the shinigami however were shown earlier than Madara. And the way I interpreted and as Kishimoto has foreshadowed, built up to and even outright stated, Sasuke will be the final villain.
I was referring to blood transfused diseases and actually, depending on its properties, the food you injest can cause cancer, which is a mutation of the DNA.
I've told you what I referenced from the manga twice. I'm done repeating myself and since you've insulted me and don't plan to acknowledge anything I say or link anyway, I won't be repeating myself a third time or be giving links.
So basically you're rejecting the fact that Uchiha abused Izanagi according to Itachi?
You're rejecting that Hashirama's DNA heals wounds while the gedo mazou sustains life?
You're rejecting that Kaguya was mentioned half way through the Juubi revival arc and was foreshadowed through info by Hagoromo and her own appearance no less to return?
You're rejecting that Black Zetsu appeared at the valley of the end even though Hashirama sensed him and he was shown to be there to take Madara's corpse?
You're rejecting that Black Zetsu was not created by yin yang release like Madara used on the white zetsu and hashirama clone even though he did not explain how he created him?
These are neither my opinions nor theories. They are established content and facts from the manga. Simply ignoring them, calling them bullshit, excuses, opinions, theories or whatever is ridiculous. You can't erase what has been said. If you want to deny it, fine, but again, that doesn't support your standpoint, much like your insults and bias.
Eyes are a part of ones anatomy, just like the organs Madara and Obito had healed from their Hashirama DNA and clone. They are flesh and blood and are subject to injury. Even the Rinnegan is flesh and destructible. They exist outside physical reality as you seem to be implying.
Actually, it's exactly like that. If you want to get literal, the "DNA" abbreviation was never used in Obito's description of Izanagi. Only Senju powers and abilities Or at least not in these two accepted translations. Furthermore, Danzo was able to detach the Hashirama clone from himself.
You must be registered for see images
You must be registered for see images
No, they are not. Inconsistencies are when something is vaguely explained and a minority do not understand it when it it elaborated again later on. Plotholes are concepts that completely contradict previously established concepts. They are subject to personal interpretation, expanded content left open descriptions however.
Again, what you are thinking of are inconsistencies, not plotholes. You have the two terms mixed up. And 35 chapters ago is not a few chapters age. 35 chapters and one and a half arcs or thirty-five chapters ago. Furthermore, regardless of the number, it doesn't erase her consistent foreshadowing.
No, a statue of Madara was shown at the end of part 1.
Your personal disdain for Madara's defeat is invalid to the topic. It has nothing to do with plotholes. At the time, Madara was dead. Kimimaro and the shinigami however were shown earlier than Madara. And the way I interpreted and as Kishimoto has foreshadowed, built up to and even outright stated, Sasuke will be the final villain.
You can't say they are excuses or irrelevant until you debunk them.
Sorry but everything you say is irrelevant, until you show me the manga pages that prove everything you just said. Also you're just assuming that was her foreshadowing, but I want more than your assumption, prove to me that kishi actually meant for those things to be forshadowing of her returned. Regardless of if obito actually said DNA or not, he contradicted what itachi's filler said, because none of those filler Uchiha were shown to have had either senju DNA or power. Just because Madara ate a piece of hashirama doesn't mean he had senju power, so Madara by what obito said couldn't have preformed the izanagi. Stop saying what I'm rejecting itachi's filler, when fillers aren't even canon, but everything obito said was actually canon. So again, everything you said is irrelevant.
