Naruto's Speed is nothing for Sasuke

[Johndoesknowall]

I wasn't interpreting it as sasuke was stronger than Naruto, I apologize if it seemed like I did. I was trying to state that even with sasuke's eye's, he still wouldn't be able to react to naruto because of chakra cloaks and the chakra manipulation of frog fu. Naruto's speed along with those abilities still give sasuke a problem.

I see your point, Your right Sasuke wouldn't be able to react in a taijutsu way, but with amaterasu/kagetsuchi and susanoo he would.

 

[Seventh Sama]

No, it was made to prove the Naruto's speed doesn't matter to Sasuke Sharingan.

It got off subject quite nicely though. :snick:



This thread wasn't made to say sasuke was stronger overall or was going to beat Naruto but was made to prove that Naruto's speed isn't worth much to sasuke Sharingan.

Read the title

I'll be realistic, sasuke could read naruto's movements but it isn't going to be a walk in a park. especially if naruto has multi shadow clones going full speed at sasuke.

 

[Johndoesknowall]

I'll be realistic, sasuke could read naruto's movements but it isn't going to be a walk in a park. especially if naruto has multi shadow clones going full speed at sasuke.

I'll take this aswell.

 

[AlphaScythian]

There wasn't a need to say stronger, that's a given. How does being stronger going to change the fact that It got heavier? The add weight would still hold it down, it is armor afterall or are you telling me a person weighting 140lb can't jump higher than that same person who gains weight of 230lb? PS is far larger and heavier than leg Susanoo. Of course the added weight adds power, but takes away from speed and mobility.

Thats retarded logic. PS get proportionally stronger as well it so it can propel itself fine. A bigger guy then me, heavier by default if he has same body proportions then he is both faster stronger and can jump higher then me. Dont fool yourself.

He can use Full BM size chakra arms

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, would be something like this

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. Sasuke would need to see where the clones are, he was having trouble keeping up with 1 faster person but if Naruto's clones all move at the speed at V1 A as he shown to be able to easier than he can at full speed then they can move around the field and trying to keep track of them all would be hard.

The biggest chakra arms he has done so far are these that were used vs bijus, but its not really arms but tails transformed into hands it not enough to surround PS and easily chopped off.

How many BM clones could naruto do again? Just about 2 i think, cuz i dont remember KCM clones doing good arms. And even if sasuke gets surrounded by clones its best tactical choice to brake the ring and keep most of them at range. Ay only blitzed sasuke cuz he got off sight, its hard to do in case of greater initial distance then 2m as it was with Ay vs sasuke.

Also cutting the chakra arms would work but not if the chakra arms catches the sword

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Yeah dude sorry, simple swords were never any good vs chakra.

 

[DeathandHealing]

Ok let me end this right now.

#1 Speed. Sasuke can pick up speed but who says he has any shot against current naruto? You forget seeing something and reacting are 2 dif things. Who says Sasuke can move at the speed needed to defend against it?
We all can see light can we not? we still can't move at the speed of light or faster than it. PS can't move as fast so it would have No real chance at defending against Naruto.

#2 I Clearly remember the Only reason Sasuke as a kid was able to fight back against kid naruto was because he could read his movements. WRONG Sasuke was able to read where he was going because Narutos chakra exerted in the direction he was about to push. Almost like How Juubito was able to sense Sasuke about to use the flames on him. He sensed the chakra build up.

But heres where that WONT work. Naruto has SAGE CHAKRA. Sasuke CANT read that or even see/sense it! Even if sasuke used Juugo that wouldn't give him the power to read Sage power. Naruto would simply have to attack like he normally does in the Kyuubi cloak powered with Sage jutsu and not use the full body 9 tails mode. Sasuke would not be able to read his movements quick enough to lift an arm before a fist met his face.

#3. Anyone remember the music video by Aqua times for the 10th naruto whatever? The one with Sasuke fighting sage naruto and they were going hand to hand? ( Naruto was using Asuma's Blade he was given ) That whole scene was just BS. Sasuke doesn't have enough strength in his arms to simple go hand to hand with sage mode like that. The moment he tried to block an attack from Naruto should have been the moment his arms and sword were broken.

 

[Johndoesknowall]

Ok let me end this right now.

#1 Speed. Sasuke can pick up speed but who says he has any shot against current naruto? You forget seeing something and reacting are 2 dif things. Who says Sasuke can move at the speed needed to defend against it?
We all can see light can we not? we still can't move at the speed of light or faster than it. PS can't move as fast so it would have No real chance at defending against Naruto.

#2 I Clearly remember the Only reason Sasuke as a kid was able to fight back against kid naruto was because he could read his movements. WRONG Sasuke was able to read where he was going because Narutos chakra exerted in the direction he was about to push. Almost like How Juubito was able to sense Sasuke about to use the flames on him. He sensed the chakra build up.

But heres where that WONT work. Naruto has SAGE CHAKRA. Sasuke CANT read that or even see/sense it! Even if sasuke used Juugo that wouldn't give him the power to read Sage power. Naruto would simply have to attack like he normally does in the Kyuubi cloak powered with Sage jutsu and not use the full body 9 tails mode. Sasuke would not be able to read his movements quick enough to lift an arm before a fist met his face.

#3. Anyone remember the music video by Aqua times for the 10th naruto whatever? The one with Sasuke fighting sage naruto and they were going hand to hand? ( Naruto was using Asuma's Blade he was given ) That whole scene was just BS. Sasuke doesn't have enough strength in his arms to simple go hand to hand with sage mode like that. The moment he tried to block an attack from Naruto should have been the moment his arms and sword were broken.

1. Read the thread.

2. Sasuke doesn't need to chase or move to counter Naruto, that's what Susanoo and amaterasu/kagetsuchi is there for. He can use the techniques instantly in different variations.

3. I agree, he can not go hand to hand with Naruto like that.

 

[xxSAGExx]

We don't have to proof of PS but we do have proof of complete standing susanoo doing it.

It' doesn't matter who helped Sasuke when he was hurt. Sasuke's attack soloed Bee.

I didn't see where it said it was to much for Obito. Also it goes back to my point of over time the sharingan will be improve to be able to read and follow.

Yes Sasuke did take some damage but in the end Sasuke wasn't the one who ran and hid at the end.

Also I never said sharingan would be enough to beat anyone. I just stated that it wouldn't loose to speed. Sasuke could have seen every move from Bee but at that moment but did not have the right moves to counter or attack.

Complete Susanoo is lighter than PS tho so we can't base what one can do for the other when their power, weight and overall mobility are different. It does matter, Sasuke didn't solo him, he needed help setting up to use that jutsu or else it wouldn't have happened since he would have died long before then if 1 on 1. The Sharingan is a tool but like most tools there's a limit to what it can do, it wouldn't just keep getting better. For EMS to get better it would become the Rinnegan, 3 Tomoes sight increased as it leveled up to EMS. Manga has shown for the Sharingan's weakness to be speed, this is shown with Lee to Sasuke, Guy to Kakashi/Itachi (not fight but Itachi knew not to take him lightly), Bee to Sasuke, A to Sasuke, and Minato to Obito. It's just that many people aren't that fast enough to counter the Sharingan.

Proof of making new arms

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Proof of weapons: Arrows or sword,

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Naruto has to take a little time to prepare a tbb that would affect his susanoo. In that time sasuke could just amaterasu him.

Not really since Sasuke can manipulate the amaterasu on his susanoo into his susanoo hand and reuse it. He would just manipulate the amaterasu and wouldn't have to put it out. Also a hand strong enough to counter susanoo will have to be strong and naruto would use up alot of chakra summoning them to be that strong. You were right there are alot of counters each could use, so basically we'll have to see the fight and what will happen.

Sasuke can also summon susanoo beside him and use it to shoot multiple amaterasu's with the orb and the other two arms can shoot arrows while sasuke shoots amaterasu himself. (Theory though)

But Sasuke manipulating the Amaterasu would juts take chakra and focus just like the Chakra arms for Naruto and Naruto never shown to use a lot of chakra doing it since he's only manipulating the chakra. I do hope the fight happens after a time skip so they'll both be at their strongest and maybe Sasuke can combine fire and lightning for blue fire/red (inferno) lightning and Naruto gets a 2nd element and learns jutsu for both wind and that element and combine them if possible. Some other jutsus depending on if Sasuke gets Rinnegan and if Naruto gets other Bijuus or just full Kurama.

Im sorry if naruto gives this same chakra to juubito, will it make him stronger 7x - 10x times or weaker? Wont it actually decrease overall power if you mix your chakra with inferior one?
Here

Spoiler

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karin states that his chakra is even darker colder then CM2. Note that in viz scan it says more "intense". After getting itachi eyes he felt even more power, kurama however claimed his chakra to be more sinister then it's own since after time skip. I dont view that chakra given more then little stamina boost.

Nope, Naruto transform the chakra he gives to match the person's chakra and Kurama's chakra was only dark from his hatred but he wasn't consumed by it as Sasuke but his chakra is still overall stronger both in the abilities it possess and sheer volume. Give more than a little stamina boost? So you're saying Kakashi telling Shikaku that the chakra made his jutsu at least 3x stronger then comment how the chakra he just got was more and even stronger than what he had before was all a lie? That Hinata can knock a tail from the Juubi with nothing but a little stamina?

Thats retarded logic. PS get proportionally stronger as well it so it can propel itself fine. A bigger guy then me, heavier by default if he has same body proportions then he is both faster stronger and can jump higher then me. Dont fool yourself.
The biggest chakra arms he has done so far are these that were used vs bijus, but its not really arms but tails transformed into hands it not enough to surround PS and easily chopped off.

How many BM clones could naruto do again? Just about 2 i think, cuz i dont remember KCM clones doing good arms. And even if sasuke gets surrounded by clones its best tactical choice to brake the ring and keep most of them at range. Ay only blitzed sasuke cuz he got off sight, its hard to do in case of greater initial distance then 2m as it was with Ay vs sasuke.
Yeah dude sorry, simple swords were never any good vs chakra.

You call my logic retarded but what you say is just an assumption since we haven't seen PS jump like Leg Susanoo. Also V3 and PS size and form are way different so it's proportion would be different than if V3 size just increased. Naruto made the same size chakra arms in BM when he was fighting Obito, he can manipulate his chakra to increase or decrease his sizes as he shown when he made mini hands to make his mini FRS.

Naruto's in full BM was able to withstand a Juubi's blast at the cost of 6 tails, so saying PS can cut it's tail is even an assumption. PS sword can destroy a mountain while a tail for Kurama's can crumble mountains and cause tsunamis with a swing of the tail

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[Transcendence]

First of all, using Nardo's speed as example for Obito's speed difference on the air and ground is a mistake. Obito demonstrated at both aspects to be many times faster speed Nardo can generate. Second, Nardo himself lacks the capability to fly but rather jump on the air and this slows his speed because the gravity is pulling him slowly depending on how much force he put in for the jump. This does not apply for Juubito because he can defy the laws of gravity thanks to the Juubi's power and Rinnegan.

Moving on...This is the speed Juubito has shown both on ground and air.
Ground: [

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Air: [

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]

The difference is not massively as you imagine. Based on the presentations of the scans, they look equally.

Good point on the gravity, but you misconstrued my point about Naruto. My point was, on the ground his inherent speed and what he can generate is to the umpteenth more superior in terms of speed. And the concept of gravity in this case, while applicable, doesn't matter when Shinobi/people in this manga casually jump at inhumane heights, maintaining overall velocity. Using Naruto as a comparison, I mean Obito would be quite faster with the stability the ground offers. And as we have seen with Naruto, he is much faster on the ground.

 

[Bronze]

Good point on the gravity, but you misconstrued my point about Naruto. My point was, on the ground his inherent speed and what he can generate is to the umpteenth more superior in terms of speed. And the concept of gravity in this case, while applicable, doesn't matter when Shinobi/people in this manga casually jump at inhumane heights, maintaining overall velocity. Using Naruto as a comparison, I mean Obito would be quite faster with the stability the ground offers. And as we have seen with Naruto, he is much faster on the ground.

Superman on the air flying was capable of stalemating with Flash who was on the ground in battle of speed and in fact he won while flying. If we were to apply the same example to Obito's speed, it may in fact look equal. Its true that in the manga, gravity may not apply the same as in real world, however it doesn't flaw the fact that shinobi's speed on jump look slower because gravity is absorbing the force under their feet.

Take a look at these panels [

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] [

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].

Notice the incredible speed it took for Obito(at first link)on the ground and jumped and levitated on the air(second link) at almost instant.

Now looking at Nardo's:
[

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]. You can see the difference. Therefore, using Nardo's speed as example is inaccurate.

We also have more speed feats from flying Obito. Its hard to take judgement considering Masashi's inconsistency.

 

[AlphaScythian]

Nope, Naruto transform the chakra he gives to match the person's chakra and Kurama's chakra was only dark from his hatred but he wasn't consumed by it as Sasuke but his chakra is still overall stronger both in the abilities it possess and sheer volume. Give more than a little stamina boost? So you're saying Kakashi telling Shikaku that the chakra made his jutsu at least 3x stronger then comment how the chakra he just got was more and even stronger than what he had before was all a lie? That Hinata can knock a tail from the Juubi with nothing but a little stamina?

Oh yeah so now what? CM2 makes you more hateful, darker and colder chakra or is it related to intensity?
Hinata? lol Obito was conserving juubi's power.
Hashi clone too got kyubi chakra, did he say anything? did he do anything? Inferior chakra cannot enhance superior one.

You call my logic retarded but what you say is just an assumption since we haven't seen PS jump like Leg Susanoo. Also V3 and PS size and form are way different so it's proportion would be different than if V3 size just increased. Naruto made the same size chakra arms in BM when he was fighting Obito, he can manipulate his chakra to increase or decrease his sizes as he shown when he made mini hands to make his mini FRS.

Yeah right. PS swing generates enough power to cut mountains, but it cannot jump, (nice one lol) PS cuts mountains yet that little piece of wood sasuke has cut is all tnx to almighty chakra naruto gave( another one).
I already covered how big chakra arms naruto has made and how many BM clones there were, saying he can make bigger, better, more cuz he has made less isnt evidence.

Naruto's in full BM was able to withstand a Juubi's blast at the cost of 6 tails, so saying PS can cut it's tail is even an assumption. PS sword can destroy a mountain while a tail for Kurama's can crumble mountains and cause tsunamis with a swing of the tail

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PS cuts mountains and another ones behind with mere shock wave. A tail crumbling one isnt good enough and wasnt even displayed in manga. Again, juubi was limited by obito and its different type of damage.

Your jokes are on fire thou

 

[Transcendence]

Superman on the air flying was capable of stalemating with Flash who was on the ground in battle of speed and in fact he won while flying. If we were to apply the same example to Obito's speed, it may in fact look equal. Its true that in the manga, gravity may not apply the same as in real world, however it doesn't flaw the fact that shinobi's speed on jump look slower because gravity is absorbing the force under their feet.

Take a look at these panels [

You must be registered for see links

] [

You must be registered for see links

].

Notice the incredible speed it took for Obito(at first link)on the ground and jumped and levitated on the air(second link) at almost instant.

Now looking at Nardo's:
[

You must be registered for see links

]. You can see the difference. Therefore, using Nardo's speed as example is inaccurate.

We also have more speed feats from flying Obito. Its hard to take judgement considering Masashi's inconsistency.

Hmm... I see your point. But using Superman as an example is a tad illogical. He's basically the king of "asspulls" in terms of power, so what he does isn't really in proper context.

 

[LolChidori]

I would think his only downfall here is stamina.

 

[Johndoesknowall]

Complete Susanoo is lighter than PS tho so we can't base what one can do for the other when their power, weight and overall mobility are different. It does matter, Sasuke didn't solo him, he needed help setting up to use that jutsu or else it wouldn't have happened since he would have died long before then if 1 on 1. The Sharingan is a tool but like most tools there's a limit to what it can do, it wouldn't just keep getting better. For EMS to get better it would become the Rinnegan, 3 Tomoes sight increased as it leveled up to EMS. Manga has shown for the Sharingan's weakness to be speed, this is shown with Lee to Sasuke, Guy to Kakashi/Itachi (not fight but Itachi knew not to take him lightly), Bee to Sasuke, A to Sasuke, and Minato to Obito. It's just that many people aren't that fast enough to counter the Sharingan.



But Sasuke manipulating the Amaterasu would juts take chakra and focus just like the Chakra arms for Naruto and Naruto never shown to use a lot of chakra doing it since he's only manipulating the chakra. I do hope the fight happens after a time skip so they'll both be at their strongest and maybe Sasuke can combine fire and lightning for blue fire/red (inferno) lightning and Naruto gets a 2nd element and learns jutsu for both wind and that element and combine them if possible. Some other jutsus depending on if Sasuke gets Rinnegan and if Naruto gets other Bijuus or just full Kurama.
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I understand what your saying about susanoo, and I will rely on the manga to go more into detail with it so we can clear this up.

I also know what you mean for saying that Sasuke didn't solo him because he wouldn't have even lived if it wasn't for his team. But I'm sure you can see it my way when I say that it was only his attack which stopped Bee, even if the team gave him time and saved his life, his attack did solo bee. Even though it was teamwork that led to it. So you could say teamwork aswell but you would have to keep it in a general sense. At that time Sasuke was protecting his team instead of his team protecting him.

Speed isn't really sharingans weakness. What usually happens is the person uses his speed to move away from sharingan's view. I stated anything in view of sharingan can be read over time, and in the course of battle the sharingan will be able to read and follow you no matter how fast you are.

The major weakness you're are getting at is how they use their speed. They use their speed to get out of the line of sight, which is a basis for beating a sharingan holder. Speed is basically a weakness for the holder of sharingan and not the sharingan itself. Sharingan would be able to keep up, but the person using it might not be able to.