[Question] Teach vs Fujitora

[Netferarri]

We haven't even seen Fujitora's full feats yet. :|

 

[ziggyZ]

If that's the case, BB can take on 2 Admirals in the same damn time and he'd still win.

Hahahahahahahahahaha, Akainu alone would High DIFF him, lol.

 

[Red Swag]

Hahahahahahahahahaha, Akainu alone would High DIFF him, lol.

not sure about that. akainus punches wont work.

If that's the case, BB can take on 2 Admirals in the same damn time and he'd still win.

nope. no one can take on 2 admirals at the same damn time. maybe dragon. but no.

the easiest is akainu due to his fighting style, bb will just block all his punches then counter with wb's power etc.

bb will probably have the hardest time with kizaru and loose.

 

[ziggyZ]

not sure about that. akainus punches wont work.

Yes they would, Akainu's CoA is levels greater than BB's, meaning BB won't be able to nullify his magma and thus Akainu may very well be able to burn him.

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

Yes they would, Akainu's CoA is levels greater than BB's, meaning BB won't be able to nullify his magma and thus Akainu may very well be able to burn him.

BB can nullify Akainus magma though. And THEN use a Gura Gura no Mi Punch to the face.

All the EX/Admirals with Logia powers are too reliant on their DF. BB is roughly equal in strength but because he can nullify their powers they'll get stomped by him as they don't know how to fight without their Logia powers.

However Fujitora is a paramecia and knows how to fight without a Logia power. He would be more difficult to fight than Kuzan,Borsalino and Sakuzaki

 

[ziggyZ]

BB can nullify Akainus magma though. And THEN use a Gura Gura no Mi Punch to the face.

Unless he covers his magma with great CoA and in turn BB won't be able to nullify his DF.

All the EX/Admirals with Logia powers are too reliant on their DF. BB is roughly equal in strength but because he can nullify their powers they'll get stomped by him as they don't know how to fight without their Logia powers.

Show me where it says they can't. 'Cause you're making it out that they're just like Ace/Caribou. And there's no chance Admiral-classed people don't know how to fight with pure Haki, albeit they possess OP'd as hell Logia fruits.

 

[Fujitora]

My money is on Blackbeard.

 

[NarutoBestFanboy]

The only people that can beat BB now are Yonkou and overpowered marines like Garp and Akainu. BB was fighting almost on par with the fleet admiral after taking whitebeard devil fruit. I would say BB takes this.

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

Unless he covers his magma with great CoA and in turn BB won't be able to nullify his DF.

Show me where it says that Haki can counter the Yami Yami no Mi's absorbtion and nullification powers.

Show me where it says they can't. 'Cause you're making it out that they're just like Ace/Caribou.

Fujitora is the first admiral we have seen to use SKILL in combat instead of just raw power. The original three at MF were entirely dependant on their devil fruits. The only two differences between Caribou/Ace and Kuzan/Borsalino/Sakuzaki is that the admirals have stronger devil fruits and are capable of using haki.

Haki cannot block one of Whitebeards punches which is why any logia user gets stomped by Blackbeard (if they're dependant on their fruit) regardless of if they're stronger than him or not (I think Sakuzaki is superior in strength but WB is the perfect anti-logia fighter.

And there's no chance Admiral-classed people don't know how to fight with pure Haki, albeit they possess OP'd as hell Logia fruits.

Their devil fruits are OP. Which is why they're dependant on them.

 

[ziggyZ]

Show me where it says that Haki can counter the Yami Yami no Mi's absorbtion and nullification powers.

Haki counters DF's in general. So last I checked, the Yami Yami no Mi is a DF.

Fujitora is the first admiral we have seen to use SKILL in combat instead of just raw power.

No he hasn't, he's just dropped meteors and opened holes in the ground.

The original three at MF were entirely dependant on their devil fruits.

No they weren't. They combined their Haki to defend against WB's quake-punch.

Haki cannot block one of Whitebeards punches

Again, the Admirals did so. Also, WB gave everything he had to beat the absolute **** of Akainu, which involved him striking Akainu with his strongest quake-punch - but what happened? Akainu survived it all and continued to walk.
Furthermore, who did the Admiral's fight to make them use their Haki? No one, 'cause their opponents were pretty much unworthy for it: and even if they were Top TIER (Marco, Vista, etc), those fights didn't even go for long. Thus they didn't have the need to fight with anything other than their DF's were sufficient enough. After-all, your claim is the same as saying: everything Doffy, Mihawk, Hancock (etc) showed at the war, is the limit of their prowess. And any one with half-a-brain would know that's not the case.

which is why any logia user gets stomped by Blackbeard (if they're dependant on their fruit) regardless of if they're stronger than him or not (I think Sakuzaki is superior in strength but WB is the perfect anti-logia fighter.

Magma is greater than ice, yes? So explain why Akainu & Aokiji's fight ended more than a few days and not a few hours. It's because Aokiji knows how to fight with Haki alone, meaning all Admirals do. Hence they won't get beat against BB - especially not as easily as the popular belief is.

Their devil fruits are OP. Which is why they're dependant on them.

The only fights you've seen them in, are the ones which they had no need to go all-out in.

 

[P3ĮÑ]

Fujitora Summons meteors GG

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[Red Swag]

Fujitora Summons meteors GG

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bb destroys it with wb's power

Yes they would, Akainu's CoA is levels greater than BB's, meaning BB won't be able to nullify his magma and thus Akainu may very well be able to burn him.

whitebeards punches didnt work against teach.

 

[ziggyZ]

whitebeards punches didnt work against teach.

Because WB's Haki was poor due to his age (as evident when he stabbed Aokiji and when he failed to use CotSK when Ace was about to be executed), thereby BB was able to nullify the quakes with his DF.
So your point?

 

[Red Swag]

Because WB's Haki was poor due to his age (as evident when he stabbed Aokiji and when he failed to use CotSK when Ace was about to be executed), thereby BB was able to nullify the quakes with his DF.
So your point?

how did you know that?

aokiji purposely made a hole in his stomach.

 

[Kuzan]

how did you know that?

aokiji purposely made a hole in his stomach.

His haki was a little weaker due to his health, but I do agree with what you said.

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

Haki counters DF's in general. So last I checked, the Yami Yami no Mi is a DF.

Haki actually increases an impact and allows you to harm Logia users and Paramecia users like Luffy.

No he hasn't, he's just dropped meteors and opened holes in the ground.

That's a lot more than Akainu who only seems to know how to fire magma fists

No they weren't. They combined their Haki to defend against WB's quake-punch.

And? Of course they knew haki. But they used their devil fruits way too much to not be dependant on them.

Again, the Admirals did so.

All three of them combined....

Also, WB gave everything he had to beat the absolute fvck of Akainu, which involved him striking Akainu with his strongest quake-punch - but what happened? Akainu survived it all and continued to walk.

Sakuzaki imo is the most durable character in OP. Said punch caused Sakuzaki to cough up blood. Hence he couldn't block it.

Furthermore, who did the Admiral's fight to make them use their Haki? No one, 'cause their opponents were pretty much unworthy for it:

Marco,Whitebeard,jozu,Ace (Akainu used Haki otherwise he wouldn't have hit Ace : Vista would've been worthy)

and even if they were Top TIER (Marco, Vista, etc), those fights didn't even go for long.

Don't see the significance here....

Thus they didn't have the need to fight with anything other than their DF's were sufficient enough.

That sentence needs restructuring...

After-all, your claim is the same as saying: everything Doffy, Mihawk, Hancock (etc) showed at the war, is the limit of their prowess. And any one with half-a-brain would know that's not the case.

You've clearly misinterpreted what I've been saying...

Magma is greater than ice, yes? So explain why Akainu & Aokiji's fight ended more than a few days and not a few hours.

Because the gap in power between their devil fruits was so slim. I believe their Haki was on the same level (Sakuzaki and Kuzans).

It's because Aokiji knows how to fight with Haki alone, meaning all Admirals do.

I just gave you a reason which dispels your claim of the Admirals knowing how to fight without devil fruit powers.

Hence they won't get beat against BB - especially not as easily as the popular belief is.
The only fights you've seen them in, are the ones which they had no need to go all-out in.

Marco was admiral tier.
WB was above them : of course they needed to go all out
Rayleigh was also admiral tier.

Blackbeard only needs to punch them once he has grabbed them : it would mean they cannot use their powers and would therefore be unable to counter him.

 

[ziggyZ]

Haki actually increases an impact and allows you to harm Logia users and Paramecia users like Luffy.

That's what basic CoA is for. So strictly speaking, if the basis of CoA is to allow a Logia to be hit, than a mastered form of it would allow one to negate DF's in general - similar to was SS does to DF users.

That's a lot more than Akainu who only seems to know how to fire magma fists

No it's not. Akainu's shown much more differentiated techs with his fruit in comparison to Fujitora's; he's shown to be able to create blazing meteors, he's shown to create a magma fist the size of an iceberg, he's also shown to be able to manipulate his arm in the form of a hound.

And? Of course they knew haki. But they used their devil fruits way too much to not be dependant on them.

Because they don't see the need for not using them. Especially if its much easier to use DF

All three of them combined....

But after they did so, they showed no exhausted expression, they were as calm as they normally are, meaning they didn't use that much willpower to defend themselves since it was a conjoint effort which itself was strong enough. Because why would you exhaust yourself doing something by yourself, when you can do that very thing with others which wouldn't require that much effort? So that was clearly their mindset. Therefore, this technically means that one of those Admiral's could defend against that attack by using equal amount of willpower.

Sakuzaki imo is the most durable character in OP. Said punch caused Sakuzaki to cough up blood. Hence he couldn't block it.

I don't understand; if he was durable, why'd he cough up blood? Also, why does that mean he couldn't block it?

Marco,Whitebeard,jozu,Ace (Akainu used Haki otherwise he wouldn't have hit Ace : Vista would've been worthy)

That's why I said: "and even if they were Top TIER (Marco, Vista, etc), those fights didn't even go for long" Meaning they used it, but not to their fullest extent since those fights were short with no real time to go all-out.

Don't see the significance here....

You would, if you read the preceding sentence with a little bit more attention.

That sentence needs restructuring...

Due to their fights against Top TIER opponents didn't last long, they didn't have the need to fight with anything other than their DF's, since that power was sufficient enough.

You've clearly misinterpreted what I've been saying...

No I haven't. You're suggesting that the Admirals aren't well-versed with Haki combat due to having OP DF's. Just as my post implies your point: Doffy has an OP as hell DF (controlling people with just the movement of his finger), so why would he need to possess great Haki? Hancock can turn people into stone by looking at them or touching them, so there's no need for her to be profound at Haki. Better yet, Mihawk is a swordsman and wields the strongest sword - so he shouldn't need to train for Haki.

Because the gap in power between their devil fruits was so slim.

Ice can never come near magma. Meaning the gap in their DF's were undoubtedly massive.

I believe their Haki was on the same level (Sakuzaki and Kuzans).

Your point?

I just gave you a reason which dispels your claim of the Admirals knowing how to fight without devil fruit powers.

No you didn't. You just said the gap in their DF's is small, but it isn't, and can never be anything but a large difference.

Marco was admiral tier.
WB was above them : of course they needed to go all out
Rayleigh was also admiral tier.

Yes, they needed to go all-out, but tell me, what life-&-death fight in OP (or any Shonen manga for that matter) has two people going all-out right off the bat? So if the dragged on and they didn't use anything other than their DF's, then you'd have a clear contention, but those fights were short, hence they thought that using their primary powers were good enough.

Blackbeard only needs to punch them once he has grabbed them : it would mean they cannot use their powers and would therefore be unable to counter him.

If B has it so easily to defeat someone, there's no chance anyone with a DF can beat him, meaning the protagonist beating him is a snowballs chance in Hell. Unless you account for CoA-mastery being able to exhibit features such as SS - the power to negate DF's. And I'm damn sure Admirals would be near that power of CoA.

 

[24 12 11 to troll]

That's what basic CoA is for. So strictly speaking, if the basis of CoA is to allow a Logia to be hit, than a mastered form of it would allow one to negate DF's in general - similar to was SS does to DF users.

Which is exactly why Akainu was clearly able to nullify Whitebeards fruit just in time before he punches him with the force of an earthquake tearing apart Marineford...

Spoiler

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No it's not. Akainu's shown much more differentiated techs with his fruit in comparison to Fujitora's; he's shown to be able to create blazing meteors, he's shown to create a magma fist the size of an iceberg,

They were all Magma fists... Same technique ; simply a different scale of attack.

he's also shown to be able to manipulate his arm in the form of a hound.

Uhh... no he didn't?

Because they don't see the need for not using them. Especially if its much easier to use DF
But after they did so, they showed no exhausted expression, they were as calm as they normally are, meaning they didn't use that much willpower to defend themselves since it was a conjoint effort which itself was strong enough.

Doesn't change the fact the three of them combined had to stop Whitebeards punch.

Because why would you exhaust yourself doing something by yourself, when you can do that very thing with others which wouldn't require that much effort? So that was clearly their mindset. Therefore, this technically means that one of those Admiral's could defend against that attack by using equal amount of willpower.

They were incapable of doing it individually. Otherwise Akainu wouldn't have lost to Whitebeard.

I don't understand; if he was durable, why'd he cough up blood? Also, why does that mean he couldn't block it?

Durability is the capability of withstanding combat for a long time. Luffy is very durable but he got injured from one of Sentoumarus punches. The impact was too great to block and therefore Akainu was incapable of single handedly stopping Shirohige. By your logic admirals are on par with the Yonkou. Which is certainly not the case : the only one they can hurt is Teach : but even so... he would defeat them. You simply express extreme hate for him.

That's why I said: "and even if they were Top TIER (Marco, Vista, etc), those fights didn't even go for long" Meaning they used it, but not to their fullest extent since those fights were short with no real time to go all-out.

They were enemies. Of course they went all out ; otherwise they would not be deserving of their Admiral rank.

Due to their fights against Top TIER opponents didn't last long, they didn't have the need to fight with anything other than their DF's, since that power was sufficient enough.

Pretty sure you're saying this for arguments sake as you previously said that Marco was admiral tier , but now you're saying he's not. Be honest during a debate otherwise it's a sign you're losing.

No I haven't. You're suggesting that the Admirals aren't well-versed with Haki combat due to having OP DF's.

I'm saying they're not skilled in combat without their devil fruits. Which is why if they even touch Teach they will lose.

Just as my post implies your point: Doffy has an OP as hell DF (controlling people with just the movement of his finger), so why would he need to possess great Haki?

Busoshoku Haki: To strengthen his abilities. Harden his strings so they can cut. Kenboshoku haki needs no explanation.

Hancock can turn people into stone by looking at them or touching them,

Actually it's not as simple as that ; she has to apply her ability. She uses her Haki to hit Logia users (like she did against Smoker)

so there's no need for her to be profound at Haki. Better yet, Mihawk is a swordsman and wields the strongest sword - so he shouldn't need to train for Haki.

He would need to strengthen his blade to amplify his attacks? To hit Logia fruit users? So that Haki using swordsman don't cut through Yoru... Isn't that obvious? He clearly (going by logic) has incredible haki. He taught Zoro Busoshoku haki (even if this wasn't mentioned we can indirectly figure since he used it against Monet).

Ice can never come near magma. Meaning the gap in their DF's were undoubtedly massive.
Your point?

Depends actually. Ice can be present at 0 Kelvin. The coldest temperature possible.

No you didn't. You just said the gap in their DF's is small, but it isn't, and can never be anything but a large difference.

Learn about the properties of Ice.

Yes, they needed to go all-out, but tell me, what life-&-death fight in OP (or any Shonen manga for that matter) has two people going all-out right off the bat? So if the dragged on and they didn't use anything other than their DF's, then you'd have a clear contention, but those fights were short, hence they thought that using their primary powers were good enough.

Because there were so many fighters ; every time. Somebody intervened. TA-DAH!

If B has it so easily to defeat someone, there's no chance anyone with a DF can beat him

Actually I'm basing this off the fact the Admirals show no combat skills without their devil fruits. Paramecia and Zoan users would be better suited for fighting Blackbeard as their body remains the same as their original form.

meaning the protagonist beating him is a snowballs chance in Hell. Unless you account for CoA-mastery being able to exhibit features such as SS - the power to negate DF's. And I'm damn sure Admirals would be near that power of CoA.

You're wrong. All there is for Luffy to do is power up to a Yonkous level in strength by increasing his Haki.

 

[Dr Strangelove]

Teach, mid - easy diff imo.

 

[Kuzan]

Teach, mid - easy diff imo.

There is virtually nobody that easy diffs an Admiral, the only exception I can think of is Whitebeard and even that is debatable.