Tobirama was a hypocrite

[NarutoKage2]

Tobirama says this:

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'From now on we're going to use democracy', a page before he says the people of the village and the fire country/feudal lords should decide the hokage.
Yet years later, he turns around and does this:

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I don't see a poll from konoha's citizens there. What a hypocrite.

 

[valandil988]

Heh good one, obviously Tobirama's thought processes have changed somewhat...

 

[Machiko]

I hadn't noticed, and I agree.

 

[NarutoKage2]

Heh good one, obviously Tobirama's thought processes have changed somewhat...

How convenient for him to want a poll when an uchiha was about to be made hokage only.....this whole war in the current arc can be blamed on him.

 

[spike2068]

How convenient for him to want a poll when an uchiha was about to be made hokage only.....this whole war in the current arc can be blamed on him.

or on madara being a crybaby lol

 

[Draxus]

Not really.

As 1st hokage obviously Hashirama decided the rule should be that the Hokage endorses the next one. Tobirama respecting his dead brothers wishes kept the tradition going.

 

[izzy89]

Yet years later, he turns around and does this:

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I don't see a poll from konoha's citizens there. What a hypocrite.

i mean, they were being attacked...and it was short notice. it's not like tobirama could leave and go back to the village and say "hey, let's vote for a hokage real quick so i can go back and sacrifice myself for you guys :0)"

 

[valandil988]

Hmm, I suppose you could argue that Tobirama is making that decision because they are currently at war and that he is currently Hokage unlike Hashirama. They were deciding who became the "Shodai" Hokage there wasn't a "line" of succession.

But I guess one of the founders recommending the other should count more than what everyone else who are getting carried along for the ride wants lol....

 

[izzy89]

Not really.

As 1st hokage obviously Hashirama decided the rule should be that the Hokage endorses the next one. Tobirama respecting his dead brothers wishes kept the tradition going.

This as well.

 

[NarutoKage2]

or on madara being a crybaby lol

Hashirama came to madara asking to form an alliance, madara had no problems dying on the battlefield. Dont twist facts simpleton. And im actually anti uchiha lol.

Not really.

As 1st hokage obviously Hashirama decided the rule should be that the Hokage endorses the next one. Tobirama respecting his dead brothers wishes kept the tradition going.

Fail. When did hiruzen endorse tsunade?
Anyway, thats irrelevant. If you make a rule and dont follow it, it shows either weak will or no character, aka hypocrisy.

 

[izzy89]

Hashirama came to madara asking to form an alliance, madara had no problems dying on the battlefield. Dont twist facts simpleton. And im actually anti uchiha lol.


Fail. When did hiruzen endorse tsunade?
Anyway, thats irrelevant. If you make a rule and dont follow it, it shows either weak will or no character, aka hypocrisy.

1. Madara is still a petty bitch. 2. the elders endorsed Jiraiya WHO IN TURN endorsed Tsunade...so that's a fail on your part.

 

[NarutoKage2]

i mean, they were being attacked...and it was short notice. it's not like tobirama could leave and go back to the village and say "hey, let's vote for a hokage real quick so i can go back and sacrifice myself for you guys :0)"

No, but going into a high risk mission he could've asked the elders of the fire country to hold a poll if he failed to return. Its called thinking ahead.

1. Madara is still a petty bitch. 3. the elders endorsed Jiraiya WHO IN TURN endorsed Tsunade...so that's a fail on your part.

Madara rapes 99.99 % of narutoverse mid diff includin tobirama, esp in his current form.
No shit sherlock and how was that endorsement democratic?

 

[Giest]

Fail. When did hiruzen endorse tsunade?

Last time I checked, Hiruzen was dead and there was a gap between then and when Tsunade became Hokage. How was he going to nominate a sucessor when he was dead? Plus, in his last moments, the latest time he could have, he was a bit concerned with fighting Oro and sealing the Edo kages to endorse someone to follow him.

Also, this situation you bring up in the OP is totally different from the original situation. When Tobirama nominated Hiruzen, they were in the middle of a battle zone. How was he going to get the opinion of the village then? It just wasn't possible.

No, but going into a high risk mission he could've asked the elders of the fire country to hold a poll if he failed to return. Its called thinking ahead.

They were at war, and there was no time to be wasted polling for a new Hokage. That would only weaken the village, something Tobirama definitely didn't want.

However, Tobirama did test to see who the best Hokage would be. He measured Hiruzen to be worthy because Hiruzen said he would be the decoy and sacrifice himself for the team. This obviously shows he'd do the same for the village so it's not like Tobirama just chose Hiruzen randomly.

 

[izzy89]

No, but going into a high risk mission he could've asked the elders of the fire country to hold a poll if he failed to return. Its called thinking ahead.


Madara rapes 99.99 % of narutoverse mid diff includin tobirama, esp in his current form.
No shit sherlock and how was that endorsement democratic?

1. yeah...madara is a badass character...but he has the personality of a female on permanent pms.... 2. my point is not about the appointing of a hokage being democratic...it's actually the opposite. there have been only TWO times where we have seen a (interim) hokage elected (hashirama and danzo). EVERYONE else has been chosen by the former hokage besides hiruzen...because he died. his decision was then left up to the elders. so...again....where is the hypocrisy????

 

[NarutoKage2]

Last time I checked, Hiruzen was dead and there was a gap between then and when Tsunade became Hokage. How was he going to nominate a sucessor when he was dead? Plus, in his last moments, the latest time he could have, he was a bit concerned with fighting Oro and sealing the Edo kages to endorse someone to follow him.

Right, cause hiruzen had noooooo idea that oro might attack the village. Did you even read the chapter where he spoke to Anko about Oro and how he was probly stronger than him?? Lol he should've prepared a successor or a fair method of succession, he already knew he might die w/e oro attacked. Don't ask noobish questions.

Also, this situation you bring up in the OP is totally different from the original situation. When Tobirama nominated Hiruzen, they were in the middle of a battle zone. How was he going to get the opinion of the village then? It just wasn't possible.



They were at war, and there was no time to be wasted polling for a new Hokage. That would only weaken the village, something Tobirama definitely didn't want.

However, Tobirama did test to see who the best Hokage would be. He measured Hiruzen to be worthy because Hiruzen said he would be the decoy and sacrifice himself for the team. This obviously shows he'd do the same for the village so it's not like Tobirama just chose Hiruzen randomly.

Again the war did'nt just happen out of the blue like the situation with minato's death. He knew in advance how tough things would become, don't forget he almost died once before while fighting kinkakau and ginkaku before, between then and that ambush scene, there was more than enough time to start the selection process for a new hokage. The conditions deteriorated gradually not all of a sudden until war broke out. Are you saying tobirama was too dumb to anticipate he might DIE in a war???

1. yeah...madara is a badass character...but he has the personality of a female on permanent pms.... 2. my point is not about the appointing of a hokage being democratic...it's actually the opposite. there have been only TWO times where we have seen a (interim) hokage elected (hashirama and danzo). EVERYONE else has been chosen by the former hokage besides hiruzen...because he died. his decision was then left up to the elders. so...again....where is the hypocrisy????

Lol
Hypocrisy:The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness.
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If Tobirama says from now on we're going to use democracy, and then does'nt use it himself, it means he as a person is a hypocrite. Because he acts like he believes in democracy to his brother, yet shuns it himself.

And why are you calling madara a bitch, and not tobirama? Tobirama was made into a hoe by kinkaku and ginkaku, not to mention more recently into an edo one by oro when he got his ass restrained after trying to act tough. He also took a long ass time to act as the decoy cuz he was afraid like a bitch lol.

 

[izzy89]

Lol
Hypocrisy:The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness.
Source:

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If Tobirama says from now on we're going to use democracy, and then does'nt use it himself, it means he as a person is a hypocrite. Because he acts like he believes in democracy to his brother, yet shuns it himself.

And why are you calling madara a bitch, and not tobirama? Tobirama was made into a hoe by kinkaku and ginkaku, not to mention more recently into an edo one by oro when he got his ass restrained after trying to act tough. He also took a long ass time to act as the decoy cuz he was afraid like a bitch lol.

ha....smh. stating the definition doesn't change my point. you're pretty much calling everyone within the konoha power structure a hypocrite for assuming that konoha decided to use DEMOCRACY EVERY SINGLE TIME A NEW HOKAGE WAS TO BE APPOINTED....and OBVIOUSLY if you make a simple inference...that is NOT the case. LIKE I STATED the only time DEMOCRACY WAS USED was with the 1st and with danzo...it's safe to assume that the fire country ALLOWED the current hokage to appoint a successor to avoid situations where a new hokage would have to be chosen in times of danger/war (i.e. the example you gave in your original post). so even though tobirama said "we will use democracy from now on", doesn't mean he had the final say so in the matter...he wasn't even a kage when he made this statement so it really means nothing. AGAIN i ask....WHERE IS THE HYPOCRISY?

 

[SkylineGTR]

You're basing your judgement on something Tobirama said while his brother was the Hokage at the time.

Just because Tobimara said let us vote as a democracy doesn't mean that his brother, the Hokage, had to follow it.

Calling Tobirama a hypocrite and the rest of the village one too is pointless when Tobirama had no real influence on the successor after his brother.

 

[izzy89]

You're basing your judgement on something Tobirama said while his brother was the Hokage at the time.

Just because Tobimara said let us vote as a democracy doesn't mean that his brother, the Hokage, had to follow it.

Calling Tobirama a hypocrite and the rest of the village one too is pointless when Tobirama had no real influence on the successor after his brother.

This. Skyline, we see eye to eye....couldn't have said it better.

 

[Founding Fire Shadow]

You're basing your judgement on something Tobirama said while his brother was the Hokage at the time.

Just because Tobimara said let us vote as a democracy doesn't mean that his brother, the Hokage, had to follow it.

Calling Tobirama a hypocrite and the rest of the village one too is pointless when Tobirama had no real influence on the successor after his brother.

Hashirama was not Hokage at the time, they were discussing who would become the first Hokage, Hashirama held authority in the village due to the respect he had earned as the founder of the village not because he had been officially appointed to the position. shodaimeicon:

 

[Draxus]

Hashirama was not Hokage at the time, they were discussing who would become the first Hokage, Hashirama held authority in the village due to the respect he had earned as the founder of the village not because he had been officially appointed to the position. shodaimeicon:

Exactly and once Hashirama became hokage he probably decided that from then on Hokage's should endorse the next, and Tobirama carried on the tradition.

Even if the OP is right and it was purely Tobirama's decision to do that, you can't call someone a hypocrite for changing their minds about an idea several years later. The definition of hypocrite is someone who says one thing but does another at the same time. By your definition we are all hypocrites unless we kept the same ideals and beliefs we had since we were 8