Proof Bansho tenin > Susanoo

[Draphsin]

gaaras used the sand under madaras feet to pull him out. you dont have any idea on how bansho tenin works. nagato is the epicenter. he acts as a magnet. he raises his hand to show the direction he wants to pull something from. he doesnt manipulate the gravitational field around someone specifically. he has never shown the ability to bansho tenin someone through an object. susano is in front of the user. susano will be affected, not the person behind it.

Bansho tenin can control two different masses at once, assuming susanoo has a mass, nagato can easily differentiate between and control both susanoo and its user

 

[BlacLord™]

In theory, yes.

But you'd have to pull the whole Susano'o in towards them, Bansho Ten'in has only shown the ability to pull towards the user, never move around whatever is being pulled freely, which would be necessary in order to get them out of Susano'o, leaving the other option of just pulling the whole thing with them inside, which isn't going help you anyway.

The first scan of Gaara pullling Madara out was only possible due to lightening his sand anyway, making it fast enough to do so.

 

[Lightbringer]

Ill highlight the distortion in the susanoo to give you a better picture of what im talking about

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Those waves in the picture indicate that the user can be individually pulled out from susanoo's chakra, you see those same distortions

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, when danzo pierced sasuke's susanoo. Point is if the susanoo is stationary, then the user can be pulled out if he's unaware of it.



Gaara's sand was lightened, that's why he needed to pin down susanoo, because one measly sand grapple wasnt going to be enough. If the user's mass id being controlled, then there's no need to pin it down

The susanoo emits a constant aura within the encasing....it's not the susanoo skeleton itself.

 

[AlphaScythian]

Bansho tenin can control two different masses at once, assuming susanoo has a mass, nagato can easily differentiate between and control both susanoo and its user

Well i can only agree to one thing is that bansho tenin can be used to pull susanoo around, dont know what good will come out of it.
And if user is attached to susanoo with his chakra it complicates the effort of pulling him out of susanoo, as it becomes one. u cant drag naruto out of his chakra cloak for example.

 

[lordmadarauchiha]

I have a question what will the user be pulling on the susanoo or the susanoo user

 

[KidGamer65]

Lmao, people actually agree with this? Gaara needing to hold down the Susanoo to pull Madara out proves this whole notion wrong. The manga scan you posted also proves this wrong but somehow you misinterpreted it. Kakashi says Pain can push and pull things from HIS center not other individual's center of gravity, Nagato is a magnet and he pulls things towards him. Thus if Nagato uses BT to try and pull someone out of Susanoo all he will end up doing is pulling the whole Susanoo towards him.

BT isn't pulling a Susanoo user from their Susanoo.

Bansho tenin can control two different masses at once, assuming susanoo has a mass, nagato can easily differentiate between and control both susanoo and its user

No. That's not how Bansho Tennin works at all. It simply pulls things towards Nagato and it can pull multiple objects. He will still only be pulling the Susanoo towards him not the user out of it.

 

[Brooks]

Re: Proof Bansho tenin > Susanoo??

OF course it was dependant on chakra, Hence why the other path went out of action because he needed the chakra from the other paths since he had split his own chakra into Six parts

More chakra put into a jutsu = More power.

As of kakashi resisting bansho tenin, Does it really look like Pain/Nagato was really putting that much effort into it?. Naruto withstood a shinra tensei, Yet it did this to boss summons

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Kakashi also took a few shinra tensei's, yet one from pain broke almost everybone in Bosses body and Ko'ed the other two toads, yet kakashi tanked a few.

The strength of both Bansho tenin and shinra tensei depends on how much chakra he wants to use at that Given Time, If Pain can push it with shinra tensei, He should be able to pull it if he uses the exact same force.

If he used a Bansho tenin with the exact same level of force he used to crush the leaf he can pull something the size of a complete susanoo, It isn't even that large.

What makes you think Pain wasn't putting that much effort into it? the fact Pain said i will finish Kakashi now or you will become more trouble to me shows that Pain was putting to effort to kill Kakashi as fast as he could.

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^Pain: "Failing to kill someone like you would mean trouble for me in the long run".

Yes, Naruto withstood the shinra tensei, but had 1,000 clones bracing him if not more....did the toads have the much of defense as Naruto had?

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When did Kakashi take a few shinra tenseis?

Bansho tenin and shinra tensei are two different techniques which aren't the same power...now matter how much Chakra Pain uses on Bansho tenin...the end result won't change for the sample the user of the Susanoo doesn't have the strength to break same thing that tanked Karin which was made of natural energy and Natural Energy has more power than Natural Chakra.

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[Brooks]

Bansho tenin can control two different masses at once, assuming susanoo has a mass, nagato can easily differentiate between and control both susanoo and its user

Lol, so it's time make things up now?

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^The Bansho tenin has the ability to pull and push things from it's center.

Would you like to prove what you just said with a Manga scan?

 

[Exaar]

Re: Proof Bansho tenin > Susanoo??

What makes you think Pain wasn't putting that much effort into it? the fact Pain said i will finish Kakashi now or you will become more trouble to me shows that Pain was putting to effort to kill Kakashi as fast as he could.

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^Pain: "Failing to kill someone like you would mean trouble for me in the long run".

If Deva path wanted to kill kakashi as fast as he could be wouldn't simply used a shinra tensei on the level the 1Shoted 3 Boss level toads.

Yes, Naruto withstood the shinra tensei, but had 1,000 clones bracing him if not more....did the toads have the much of defense as Naruto had?

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It doesn't matter if he had clones to Stop the bush back, If it was the Same level as the one that hit the toads, the Force of it hitting his body should've atleast broken most of his bones.

When did Kakashi take a few shinra tenseis?

First one

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Second one

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Assuming there was a third one that Ko'ed other ninja around him and left kakashi trapped

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Bansho tenin and shinra tensei are two different techniques which aren't the same power...now matter how much Chakra Pain uses on Bansho tenin...the end result won't change for the sample the user of the Susanoo doesn't have the strength to break same thing that tanked Karin which was made of natural energy and Natural Energy has more power than Natural Chakra.

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The power of both techs varies depending on how much chakra he puts into then, of course the more chakra he used the stronger the forces, it's works the same way with any Ninjutsu, Why do you think kisames B-Ranks jutsu's were so huge.

If nagato and create the Force to Push, he can create the exact same Force to Pull, The more chakra he uses the greater the forces he can exert. Simple really.

Shinra tensei/Chibaku tensei >>>>> Kirin.

Natural energy isn't always better

 

[taladagah]

i agree... but cant the susanoo user just cast another susanoo again :/

maybee but it probly would take a fair amout of chakra for two unless a edo

 

[SIR HERDERP PRESIDERP SDO]

I agree..being able to control gravity is a very dangerous power.

And electromagnetism like Magneto

 

[VongolaX]

Banshou tenei does pull the user and his susanoo which is correct. Then after he is pull susanoo, what to you think would happen to the guy using
repulsive/gravity force? Remember what Naruto did when nagato pulled Naruto?

The susanoo user will be pointing it's huge sword at the user

 

[Frikid]

So Gaara's sand if powerful enough to bust through an incomplete susanoo?. Guess it's not such a strong defense after all if mere sand can break through it.

If you read the manga, you would notice, that gaara also used the sand under madara's susano . Basically it was an attack from inside and outside altogether which made the susano collapse .

i guess the argument is over in my favour since you don't have anything to contribute?

 

[Exaar]

If you read the manga, you would notice, that gaara also used the sand under madara's susano . Basically it was an attack from inside and outside altogether which made the susano collapse .

i guess the argument is over in my favour since you don't have anything to contribute?

it's tanked Raikages Punches, It tanked raikages liger bomb, it's tanked Tsunades punches, It's tanked Kirin, Yet you think a double sided attack from sand is enough?. L o l.

Anyway, the sand Inside wasn't for attacking, It was to grab madara, The sand on the outside was Pinning susanoo down not attacking it.

 

[shelke]

So the immense pull of the Chibaku Tensai's core that was literally changing the trajectory of the landscape -

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couldn't pull Itachi out of his Susano'o, but Bansho Tenin can?

Itachi is being pulled towards CT core along with his Susano'o -

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and

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- just like trees, debris, and everything else. BT's pull is no where near the gravitational force of CT's core.

Your argument is invalid from the start.

 

[Brooks]

Re: Proof Bansho tenin > Susanoo??

If Deva path wanted to kill kakashi as fast as he could be wouldn't simply used a shinra tensei on the level the 1Shoted 3 Boss level toads.




It doesn't matter if he had clones to Stop the bush back, If it was the Same level as the one that hit the toads, the Force of it hitting his body should've atleast broken most of his bones.



First one

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Second one

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Assuming there was a third one that Ko'ed other ninja around him and left kakashi trapped

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The power of both techs varies depending on how much chakra he puts into then, of course the more chakra he used the stronger the forces, it's works the same way with any Ninjutsu, Why do you think kisames B-Ranks jutsu's were so huge.

If nagato and create the Force to Push, he can create the exact same Force to Pull, The more chakra he uses the greater the forces he can exert. Simple really.

Shinra tensei/Chibaku tensei >>>>> Kirin.

Natural energy isn't always better

You keep bring this 3 toads up, but the fact is Pain wanted Kakashi dead and the reason why he couldn't use the Chibaku tensei on that level was simply because the other Paths had the 90% of his power.

Okay, since you want to go by likely then it was stated that Kakashi used Clone before knowing the enemies ability which likely that Kakashi might have used Clones to tank that Shinra Tensei.

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[Exaar]

So the immense pull of the Chibaku Tensai's core that was literally changing the trajectory of the landscape -

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couldn't pull Itachi out of his Susano'o, but Bansho Tenin can?

Itachi is being pulled towards CT core along with his Susano'o -

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and

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- just like trees, debris, and everything else. BT's pull is no where near the gravitational force of CT's core.

Your argument is invalid from the start.

It didn't pull Naruto or Bee either, It was purely Plot no Jutsu.

When he used it on naruto the first time, he had enough time for 1 TBB befor getting sucked up into it

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In the part your talking about, Naruto, Bee and Itachi were casually gliding upwards, while Tree's and Rocks about the same size as the ones they were standing on were getting sucked up much quicker, While having a nice little chit chat about how naruto survived it last time and how to counter it, Then had enough time for Bee to Go bijuu mode and form a TBB, Naruto to create a RS and itachi to form his attack

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If it's pull is strong enough to Rip tree's from the ground, it should've been strong enough to pull 3 light weights of a chunk of rock that should've been traveling faster than it was.

 

[Penguin]

Agreed! Swamp of the Underworld the Susano'o user can also drown him.

 

[shelke]

@Exaar They are being pulled in along with the debris. This is hardly plot no jutsu. Is this even an argument? The point is CT's pull is much more powerful and BT and it was unable to draw Itachi out of his Susano'o. It was moving along him. This argument is again supported with Danzo's wind technique that was strengthened tenfold by Baku's suction, enough to crack Susano'o, but it never pulled or drove him out of it.

This makes two arguments in its support, making this thread nothing but a half-hearted assumption.

 

[Exaar]

Re: Proof Bansho tenin > Susanoo??

You keep bring this 3 toads up, but the fact is Pain wanted Kakashi dead and the reason why he couldn't use the Chibaku tensei on that level was simply because the other Paths had the 90% of his power.

Okay, since you want to go by likely then it was stated that Kakashi used Clone before knowing the enemies ability which likely that Kakashi might have used Clones to tank that Shinra Tensei.

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I'm pretty sure it was the real one that tanked the first shinra tensei, Otherwise it would've most likely of Poofed right away.

The first clones that we see kakashi used was after the first Shinra tensei and he was Hiding in the rubble that it created

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Hell even Choji and his father tanked one with No damage what so ever

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As i said, if he wanted him dead, One shinra tensei would've been enough, I'm not sure where you got the other paths had "90%" of his power from.

Even if they did, He could still 1shot kakashi with it, Soon after his power returned he effortlessly flung them toads around with a shinra tensei like they were nothing.

It's clear that he can easily controll the level of forced he can Create with shinra tensei, He can also do the same with Bansho tenin, i see no reason why not since they both work through the creation of forces.