[Discussion] Something I noticed in an old chapter....

[Moe22]

I don't think that is necessarily true. I'm sure there's instances where the fan translations were more accurate as well as instances where the Viz translations are, but in general the Viz translations are seen as the most accurate translations available.

Yeah, if anything I think the viz translations are better.

 

[Sarahmint]

Everyone (on a dif forum) was looking for the White Fang during Kabuto's Edo war. He never showed up.

 

[veggetta13]

nICE tHREAD.

I feel usually at the base Kakashi is quite underestimated by the fans gang, and I´m ok with it.

I agree, as I thought just the same when I read the part you mentioned. For most fanboys, on whatever side, this hasn´t proven enough for the fang, to be respected, shame, cuz Kakashi as well is such a rich, agile, and surprising character.
Most of the times u think: -nah, not enough chakra.- bUT who cares about the chakra when you´re as quick-minded as him in battle

 

[Kirin Rei]

Well, I've got the RAWs and the original goes as the following:

カカシは"木ノ葉の白い牙"と恐れられた天才忍者はたけサクモさんの 息 子 で ね。。。 -> Kakashi is the son of ''Konoha no Shiroi Kiba'', the feared genius ninja...

その親父さんの前では"伝説の三忍"の名前すらかすむほどだった。。。-> In front of/compared to his father, even the ''Legendary Sannin''s name could be outshone...

VIZ seems to have done a better job than me at phrasing it, but the basis seems accurate.

 

[MissShakra]

he reached jonin level before he aquired his sharingan! he was just as naturally talented as Itachi and Minato (both we know graduated the academy early and Itachi ranked quickly for his age) This is really interesting, i would love to know what the raw material says about it.
Kakashi had never passed a group of students because he was so difficult in the beginning, team 7 is his first actual team he accepted. He is able to use water, fire, earth, and lightening, hes badass!
im sure Sakumo was probably an extremely talented ninja and even up to par with the sannin.

 

[Founding Fire Shadow]

So I was reading one of my naruto volumes earlier today, specifically the Kakashi chronicles chapters, and I noticed this in chapter 240, where Minato is telling Obito about Kakashi's father, Sakumo Hatake

This is from the Viz translation, mind you "Kakashi's father is Sakumo, the genius ninja feared as the white fang of Konoha. In this time, the "three great shinobi"(sannin) of Konoha legend paled beside him."

Basically Minato is saying here that Sakumo was so strong he was considered even above the three sannin, Jiraiya, Orochimaru, and Tsunade. It is important to note he also said "In this time" meaning he's talking about the past, but regardless, while he was alive Sakumo was stronger than the sannin.

However, if you read the translation here on NB it says he "had respect on the same level as the legendary sannin"

Since I'm assuming the translation here on NB is a fan translation, I'd say that the Viz translations are more accurate most of the time since they are professionally done (I'm not knocking fan translations in any way, they are usually very well done and I greatly appreciate that people take time out of their lives to do them for us)


Anyway, this just got me thinking Sakumo must have been pretty beast for Minato to say that he is stronger than the sannin. Not hard to believe looking at Kakashi, who, while technically a Jounin, is probably stronger than just about any jounin out there.

Just something I found interesting. I'm not saying that it's conclusive evidence that white fang > sannin just showing that he was very powerful and at least in the same league as them, all of who are kage level.

What do you guys think? Is it possible that the Viz translation is less accurate in this instance and overhyped Sakumo, or that the Viz translations should always be trusted over fan translations?

I don't read Japanese, so it's impossible for me to get the raws and read it myself and decide. All I can do is guess haha

I own the english print of Kakashi Gaiden in Volume 27 & in it Minato states that the White Fang was held with as much or maybe even greater "esteem" than the Sannin, so more or less he was respected & renown just as much as they were if not more, does that mean he was greater or even on equal standards with the Sannin as far as power? No; fame does not equal power, many of the most powerful shinobi in ther series lack fame, more importantly we have no idea how the power of the Sannin 24 years ago compares to their power in recent chapters, so to judge his strength or Kakashi's potential compared to current characters on that statement alone would be foolish.shodaimeicon:

 

[Amaterasuice]

I say now that the sanin have gotten stronger, Sakumo=<The sanin.

But since people brought up Kakashi, he is high s-rank. He would beat several of the kages we've seen. Mei for example, and several others.

 

[Ero sennin jiraiya]

I own the english print of Kakashi Gaiden in Volume 27 & in it Minato states that the White Fang was held with as much or maybe even greater "esteem" than the Sannin, so more or less he was respected & renown just as much as they were if not more, does that mean he was greater or even on equal standards with the Sannin as far as power? No; fame does not equal power, many of the most powerful shinobi in ther series lack fame, more importantly we have no idea how the power of the Sannin 24 years ago compares to their power in recent chapters, so to judge his strength or Kakashi's potential compared to current characters on that statement alone would be foolish.shodaimeicon:

Here is the direct quote from my volume 27 "Kakashi's father is Sakumo, the genius ninja feared as the white fang of Konoha. In this time, the "three great shinobi" of Konoha legend paled beside him." Whether he is talking about popularity or actual battle strength is subjective. Since the word paled has a definition of "Feeble;Weak" or "to decrease in relative importance" I believe he was talking about battle strength.

Is it so hard to believe the father of Kakashi was really strong? Look at Kakashi, he's the top jonin in the leaf currently and he was their strongest asset in part 1 besides Hiruzen, the hokage, and the Tsunade and Jiraiya both who had left the village a while ago.(though they were still allies of the leaf)

I don't know why your volume would have worded it differently unless they have more than one edition. Either way, I said I didn't think this was conclusive evidence that Sakumo > sannin, it's basically just saying in Minato's opinion he was stronger than them. My guess would be he was on the same level, maybe a little stronger, but after he died all of the sannin got stronger and in their primes are surely stronger than Sakumo, but he was still strong regardless.

Well, I've got the RAWs and the original goes as the following:

カカシは"木ノ葉の白い牙"と恐れられた天才忍者はたけサクモさんの 息 子 で ね。。。 -> Kakashi is the son of ''Konoha no Shiroi Kiba'', the feared genius ninja...

その親父さんの前では"伝説の三忍"の名前すらかすむほどだった。。。-> In front of/compared to his father, even the ''Legendary Sannin''s name could be outshone...

VIZ seems to have done a better job than me at phrasing it, but the basis seems accurate.

Thanks for that. I can't read japanese so it would be impossible for me to judge which translation would be most accurate. My belief is that he was talking about how strong Sakumo was, not just his fame, though I suppose it could be argued either way.

 

[Founding Fire Shadow]

Here is the direct quote from my volume 27 "Kakashi's father is Sakumo, the genius ninja feared as the white fang of Konoha. In this time, the "three great shinobi" of Konoha legend paled beside him." Whether he is talking about popularity or actual battle strength is subjective. Since the word paled has a definition of "Feeble;Weak" or "to decrease in relative importance" I believe he was talking about battle strength.

Is it so hard to believe the father of Kakashi was really strong? Look at Kakashi, he's the top jonin in the leaf currently and he was their strongest asset in part 1 besides Hiruzen, the hokage, and the Tsunade and Jiraiya both who had left the village a while ago.(though they were still allies of the leaf)

I don't know why your volume would have worded it differently unless they have more than one edition. Either way, I said I didn't think this was conclusive evidence that Sakumo > sannin, it's basically just saying in Minato's opinion he was stronger than them. My guess would be he was on the same level, maybe a little stronger, but after he died all of the sannin got stronger and in their primes are surely stronger than Sakumo, but he was still strong regardless.


Thanks for that. I can't read japanese so it would be impossible for me to judge which translation would be most accurate. My belief is that he was talking about how strong Sakumo was, not just his fame, though I suppose it could be argued either way.

Viz does print more than one edition as laster editions are often revised, for example the english prints will have past errors edited out, like A's arm returning or Minato on the Hokage monument before he actually became Hokage, not to mention sometimes the english prints will adapt changes from the anime, in my original copy of Volume 1, the Scroll of Seals is attributed to Minato like it was in the anime, although in the original manga & recent chapters it is known to have been Hashirama's, which the later prints of Volume 1 also acknowledge, so maybe that is why our prints have differences...Either way I agree Sakumo was indeed an elite shinobi & at one time was at least comparible to the Sannin, I was just pointing out that these comparisons were based off of much younger & less developed versions of the Sannin than the ones we know of currently, especially in Orochimaru's case, furthermore fame is generally not a accurate indicator of strength as Kabuto's Edo shinobi often demonstrated as Hanzo once a match for the combined efforts of the Sannin proved to be far less than the what the current Sannin are capable of while the 3rd Raikage proved to be among the greatest of shinobi; we have seen a lot of elite shinobi with varying levels of fame & power, but without any known notable skills of unique order attributed to Sakumo, he just does not add up, even Kakashi for all his genius would have been dead a long time ago without the Sharingan or Minato's aid for that matter.shodaimeicon:

 

[Kirin Rei]

Thanks for that. I can't read japanese so it would be impossible for me to judge which translation would be most accurate. My belief is that he was talking about how strong Sakumo was, not just his fame, though I suppose it could be argued either way.

The actual word used to describe the Sannin's names in comparison to Sakumo's is かすむ(kasumu), which means dim(dimmed,dimmer).

It says, word to word; ''In front of Kakashi's father, even the Legendary Sannin's names could be dimmed.''

その親父さんの前では... (Sono oyaji-san no mae de wa...) -> In front of his father's...
..."伝説の三忍"の 名前... (...''densetsu no sannin'' no namae...) -> ...the name of the ''legendary sannin''...
...すらかすむほどだった. (...sura kasumu hododatta.) -> ...even could be dimmed.

 

[ultshinobi]

too bad the white fang killed sasoris parents

 

[ultshinobi]

but that doesn't mean hes evil and even if he was kakashi is awesome alone without his dad

 

[ultshinobi]

You must be registered for see links

 

[ultshinobi]

is neji really dead though