Was Jiraya even that useful?

[The Western Wheel]

jiraiya was more like his philosophical teacher, a parent that showed him the way, someone to protect him.

THIS, and to see how he would fare with his control with the BIJUU in him... so kinda a big deal, yes.

 

[AGoodBoy]

yes he was useless. Apart from a sub-par fight with pein and an anticlimactic death to show why jiraiya was a sanin, he wasn't useful.

 

[Aenigma]

I cannot even. You do realize training is not everything, right? Naruto could be as powerful as he wanted, but without the beliefs that he has he wouldn't be the same character. That's what Jiraiya instilled in him during that training period as well. What Jiraiya taught Naruto has gone to the core of the series, to the very morals of it. Jiraiya influenced so much stuff in this story, so...Why does it even matter that Naruto didn't come back with a ton of new Jutsus and crazy strength? If he had, imagine how OP he would be right now. It was so that he could still have time to learn during Shippuden.

 

[ethan201222]

I cannot even. You do realize training is not everything, right? Naruto could be as powerful as he wanted, but without the beliefs that he has he wouldn't be the same character. That's what Jiraiya instilled in him during that training period as well. What Jiraiya taught Naruto has gone to the core of the series, to the very morals of it. Jiraiya influenced so much stuff in this story, so...Why does it even matter that Naruto didn't come back with a ton of new Jutsus and crazy strength? If he had, imagine how OP he would be right now. It was so that he could still have time to learn during Shippuden.

i love jiraya and what he did with naruto im only stating that we still faced the same naruto from part one early on in part two that's all

 

[Aenigma]

i love jiraya and what he did with naruto im only stating that we still faced the same naruto from part one early on in part two that's all

Yeah, I know, and I agree with you that Naruto didn't get much physical training, but I am just trying to say that that is not the only type of training that matters and that Jiraiya served a higher purpose as a character apart from just teaching Naruto techniques.

 

[Pervy Wrath]

I cannot even. You do realize training is not everything, right? Naruto could be as powerful as he wanted, but without the beliefs that he has he wouldn't be the same character. That's what Jiraiya instilled in him during that training period as well. What Jiraiya taught Naruto has gone to the core of the series, to the very morals of it. Jiraiya influenced so much stuff in this story, so...Why does it even matter that Naruto didn't come back with a ton of new Jutsus and crazy strength? If he had, imagine how OP he would be right now. It was so that he could still have time to learn during Shippuden.

Sounds like my post

 

[Aenigma]

Sounds like my post

Sorry...It is coincidence..I don't often read many of the following posts if I am just going to post my own opinion regarding the OP.

 

[shelke]

Jiriya instilled Morals in Naruto? Naruto was already down the path of 'I will never back down' from the very start. Everything he told him about giving up on Sasuke and being realistic didn't get through. He maybe a decent teacher, but he sure as well wasn't good that transferring his philosophies.

 

[Aenigma]

Jiriya instilled Morals in Naruto? Naruto was already down the path of 'I will never back down' from the very start. Everything he told him about giving up on Sasuke and being realistic didn't get through. He maybe a decent teacher, but he sure as well wasn't good that transferring his philosophies.

I'm not even talking about his "never back down" thing...it was something they shared, but you're right, Naruto already believed that. What Jiraiya passed on to Naruto was the whole idea about peace and stuff...how Jiraiya first failed with getting Nagato to end the cycle but he entrusted Naruto to do it.

 

[shelke]

I'm not even talking about his "never back down" thing...it was something they shared, but you're right, Naruto already believed that. What Jiraiya passed on to Naruto was the whole idea about peace and stuff...how Jiraiya first failed with getting Nagato to end the cycle but he entrusted Naruto to do it.

That I believe was Naruto's own philosophy to save everyone and be a hopelessly idealistic ninja. His teacher played little role here. I would call Orochimaru and Tsunade far better teachers, as their students accomplished a lot, especially Orochimaru, who clearly prodded Sasuke and Kabuto into becoming better ninjas than they already were.

Even in terms of ninja skills, Jiriya taught little to Naruto. I for one didn't see much improvement in him. Yes, he could control his tailed form, but who is to say that it couldn't have been accomplished by Yamato and Kakashi? Rasangan and bait and switch techniques were back to haunt her. In terms of over all progression, he's clearly far behind the other two Sanin with his Student.

 

[Adebayo]

jiraiya was the best, dont insult my favourite character. he was very useful.
- provided the info for nagatos' takedown
- best sensei naruto could ever have, naruto is where he is today thanks to jiraiya
- he was minatos' sensei
- helped konoha convince tsunade to be hokage when they needed one desperately
- author of kakashis' favourite novel
- did a lot of intel work for konoha.
so, yes, jiraiya was very useful

 

[Horus]

Oh Dear Lord!!!

 

[ethan201222]

jiraiya was the best, dont insult my favourite character. he was very useful.
- provided the info for nagatos' takedown
- best sensei naruto could ever have, naruto is where he is today thanks to jiraiya
- he was minatos' sensei
- helped konoha convince tsunade to be hokage when they needed one desperately
- author of kakashis' favourite novel
- did a lot of intel work for konoha.
so, yes, jiraiya was very useful

No one denies that jiray DID A LOT..im just saying he failed in showing us how he improved naruto at any large scale in the early part two

 

[Aenigma]

That I believe was Naruto's own philosophy to save everyone and be a hopelessly idealistic ninja. His teacher played little role here. I would call Orochimaru and Tsunade far better teachers, as their students accomplished a lot, especially Orochimaru, who clearly prodded Sasuke and Kabuto into becoming better ninjas than they already were.

Even in terms of ninja skills, Jiriya taught little to Naruto. I for one didn't see much improvement in him. Yes, he could control his tailed form, but who is to say that it couldn't have been accomplished by Yamato and Kakashi? Rasangan and bait and switch techniques were back to haunt her. In terms of over all progression, he's clearly far behind the other two Sanin with his Student.

I don't think Naruto showed much motivations other than "I will be Hokage, I will be equal to Sasuke (and then "I will bring Sasuke back"), I will never give up." before he met Jiraiya...but okay. I guess he did say that stuff to Neji about breaking "set" fates, and how he and Sasuke shouldn't break their bonds and how they should stay friends, but that is not exactly the same. That deals with more personal aspects of it, but Jiraiya showed him how it was all a cycle of war and stuff..and that he should end it. All the dialogue Naruto said about peace and stuff during the Pein fight is what Jiraiya showed him. That was one of the main points of that arc.

I can agree that Orochimaru did better training Sasuke and to some extent Kabuto (but I'd say Kabuto's main powerups came more from just taking advantage of Oro and what he'd done) though.

 

[SonicBoom]

Jiraiya was very useful. He was an essential piece in Naruto's growth.

 

[shelke]

I don't think Naruto showed much motivations other than "I will be Hokage, I will be equal to Sasuke (and then "I will bring Sasuke back"), I will never give up." before he met Jiraiya...but okay. I guess he did say that stuff to Neji about breaking "set" fates, and how he and Sasuke shouldn't break their bonds and how they should stay friends, but that is not exactly the same. That deals with more personal aspects of it, but Jiraiya showed him how it was all a cycle of war and stuff..and that he should end it. All the dialogue Naruto said about peace and stuff during the Pein fight is what Jiraiya showed him. That was one of the main points of that arc.

I can agree that Orochimaru did better training Sasuke and to some extent Kabuto (but I'd say Kabuto's main powerups came more from just taking advantage of Oro and what he'd done) though.

Naruto showed these unrealistic principles - as you mentioned yourself - before he trained with Jiraiya. He simply pushed him more in this direction, and in my opinion, did worse than good. This isn't the way the cycle of hatred can be broken by consistently protecting Konoha, when its establishment should be tried for crimes against many a nation. If Naruto truly wants to bring peace and end the cycle, it's to eliminate the concept of subjugation which the village still practiced to this day with Hyuuga clan. The government doesn't seem to intervene as it's self-serving. When he found out about Sasuke's past, he didn't seem to be bothered about Village's injustices, but seemed to focus himself on Tobi's manipulation which turns out was a completely true anecdote. He never asked or assured Sasuke that he would assure him justice, in the same way he assured Nagato nothing.

This isn't justice or peace; it's self-serving Non-sense. That as long as the Village remains free from harm, regardless of how many lives it ended or wronged, it's all idealism in Naruto's world. Jiraiya should have corrected this stance, but teaching Naruto the actual phenomenon of Peace, that how clan's can get justice or find equality knowing that the perpetrators met their just fates. This is how true peace can be achieve, not the rainbows Jiraiya hurled him into. He turned him into a nutty zealot.

 

[Adebayo]

No one denies that jiray DID A LOT..im just saying he failed in showing us how he improved naruto at any large scale in the early part two

oh, but he was very essential in narutos' development, here's a list
- taught naruto chakra proper chakra control
- taught naruto the rasengan, which is the basis of all jutsu naruto uses, his rasen shurken, oodama rasengan, planetary, are all upgrades of base rasengan. and without base rasengan, they wud all be impossible
- still on the rasengan, bcos of the rasengan, naruto is able to use the ultimate jutsu of the tailed besat- TBB
- all the talk no jutsu naruto uses on his opponentes to bring convince them and bring them to the light i.e nagato. jiraiya is the inspiration and foundation for all that talk
- naruto is the character he his today bcos of jiraiya
so jiraiya did play a big part in narutos' development. but really, i dont see why u shud base a characters' usefulness on the effects he/she had on the development of another character, just saying. naruto improvement or not, jiraiya was a boss, and was useful. nuff said

 

[Neezy]

Are you stupid really!
Jiraya was like freeking useful, if it wasn't for him Naruto wouldn't even know rasengan
and sage mode and have u seen how many times Naruto has used rasengan and sage mode!
Dude pain was defeated because jiraya fought him and gathered all that data from him in one fight and
fought all six pains at once alone even though he died, go kill yourself for even asking a question like DAT.

 

[Zetsueno]

Well - His skills as a ninja barely improved compared to that of Sasuke. But, as person, his idealisms became more vast..