Zabuza Momochi and Asuma Sarutobi vs Sound 4

ShaneEyyy · Oct 27, 2013

dkdankong said:
Having an open mouth in the genjutsu world =/= actually opening his mouth IRL.

Ok obviously my regular countering jutsu argument isn't working so I'll end this debate right now:

The thread states that Zabuza and Asuma are going through a forest, trying to assassinate the Sound 4. Zabuza is the ultimate assassin, he will track the Sound 4 down. He wasn't the leader of the Hidden Mist Assassination Unit for nothing. Due to the Sound 4 not consisting of any sensor ninja, once Zabuza locates them, he will make Water Clones and assassinate them all at once before Tayuya even has the time to play her flute. He has shown twice to make multiple Water Clones when dealing with multiple opponents so this is his likely move.

True, Kidomaru may set up detective spider strings, however, those strings just notify that the enemy is coming. Zabuza is still moving so Kidomaru or the others won't know his exact spot, which is their downfall.

Again, they have no knowledge on Zabuza's Silent KIlling, which is the main cause of their demise.

Zabuza solos mid-high diff. These guys got beat by mere Genin and had to go all out against fodder Special Jounin. They aren't beating ninja leagues above them like Zabuza and Asuma.

Curse Mark · Oct 28, 2013

ShaneEyyy said:
Ok obviously my regular countering jutsu argument isn't working so I'll end this debate right now:

The thread states that Zabuza and Asuma are going through a forest, trying to assassinate the Sound 4. Zabuza is the ultimate assassin, he will track the Sound 4 down. He wasn't the leader of the Hidden Mist Assassination Unit for nothing. Due to the Sound 4 not consisting of any sensor ninja, once Zabuza locates them, he will make Water Clones and assassinate them all at once before Tayuya even has the time to play her flute. He has shown twice to make multiple Water Clones when dealing with multiple opponents so this is his likely move.

True, Kidomaru may set up detective spider strings, however, those strings just notify that the enemy is coming. Zabuza is still moving so Kidomaru or the others won't know his exact spot, which is their downfall.

Again, they have no knowledge on Zabuza's Silent KIlling, which is the main cause of their demise.

Zabuza solos mid-high diff. These guys got beat by mere Genin and had to go all out against fodder Special Jounin. They aren't beating ninja leagues above them like Zabuza and Asuma.

He won't blitz before tayuya plays the flute. You're providing a scenario you made up without any evidence backing up that it might happen.

ShaneEyyy · Oct 28, 2013

dkdankong said:
He won't blitz before tayuya plays the flute. You're providing a scenario you made up without any evidence backing up that it might happen.

Ok obviously it's a very likely argument. He has shown to blitz ninja with Silent Killing in a flashback in Part 1 and when he was edo.

He's as assassin, of course he's going to blitz behind his opponent and kill them silently. Tayuya's speed doesn't compare to Zabuza's. Zabuza was fast enough to blitz Kakashi who is way faster than Tayuya,

Tayuya doesn't compare to Zabuza, sorry buddy deal with it

Curse Mark · Oct 28, 2013

ShaneEyyy said:
Ok obviously it's a very likely argument. He has shown to blitz ninja with Silent Killing in a flashback in Part 1 and when he was edo.

He's as assassin, of course he's going to blitz behind his opponent and kill them silently. Tayuya's speed doesn't compare to Zabuza's. Zabuza was fast enough to blitz Kakashi who is way faster than Tayuya,

Tayuya doesn't compare to Zabuza, sorry buddy deal with it

Lol takes her less time to play two notes than for him to activate the mist and attack

Icelerate · Oct 28, 2013

So I read this thread and I hope no one is saying that the Sound four are beating two mid-high jounins. Although I agree that they defeat them in a 1 on 4 battle.

NewKageism · Oct 28, 2013

Icelerate said:
So I read this thread and I hope no one is saying that the Sound four are beating two mid-high jounins. Although I agree that they defeat them in a 1 on 4 battle.

The main threat is Zabuza. Most of his hidden mist etc... Is a team killer.

If Asuma was on his team he be stuck in the mist too.

Basically Shane is saying Zabuza is going to blitz the flute user. Which we all know why would she be in the front line if they have better equip people in front of her.

Plus with the summons they have from the the ghost who come out of the Doki mouth = You can't kill them eating the charka, to the big spider which would cause problems to the gate +their team work skills. I can see the four winning.

Amaterasuice · Oct 28, 2013

The whole Kabuto vs Uchiha brothers fight proved how powerful the sound four were together...so I say it could go either way in extreme high diff.

Now if Kimimaro was on the team, he alone could take out Zabuza or Asuma. While the other five dominate the last one.

Izuna Kakashi Senju · Oct 28, 2013

I give this to Zabuza and Asuma mid-high diff.

ShaneEyyy · Oct 28, 2013

EjBlack said:
1. Actually its a mid range move [
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] seeing from their distance here. Ranking the characters is irrelevant unless they are fodder themselves. But of course these "genin" together would whoop Zabuza. So once again, the counter is for the Mist, Zabuza will be on ground, and Zabuza will be in mid range to silent kill. Zabuza will trip from this "no name" jutsu until proven wrong.

Lolol Zabuza isn't tripping to that fodder move! When trees were around, he has shown in his first battle with Team 7 to hide in them, thus the ground tech doesn't work. Also, Zabuza will probably be out of its striking distance and due to the mist, when he gets close, Jiroubo won't know when to use it. Also, it only caused rumble on the ground in front of him, Zabuza moves behind his opponent. There's way too many ways that technique doesn't work so drop that stupid argument. Like honestly it's an awful argument to a point it's funny.

2. He can start when Zabuza starts putting up the mist. Jirbo buys time. If you want to still nitpick this part, then simply lay webs on the ground works perfect too.

Due to his lack of knowledge, when the mist goes up he isn't going to be like, "Mist? This must be Zabuza Momochi, master of Silent Killing!" He has no knowledge on Zabuza. He isn't going to react in time and start setting traps immediately. He is not going to have the time against Zabuza. Jiroubo isn't buying time he is weak and even called the weakest one of the 4. He has nothing on Zabuza and I will not debate that he does any further. Kidomaru isn't covering the entire ground in sticky web, he has never shown such feat. Plus, Zabuza can get knowledge on this when he sends in Water Clones and the possibility of the clones falling for the web. But as I already explained, the web isn't stopping the clone from continuing swinging its sword. They aren't blocking his famous Silent Killing.

3. Brining up genin ranking, once again means nothing, as these are skilled shinobi that played a important role for part 1 series. Its as irreverent as a anbu skill ninja getting
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. Please avoid degrading characters to make excuses that Zabuza counters the jutsu.

Anbu are not a specific rank, they could even be Chuunin. Anbu are Anbu for a unique ability. It isn't too impressive Kidomaru beat Anbu, as Kabuto from Part 1 argued he could beat 10 and Zabuza is stronger than Part 1 Kabuto.

Fact of the matter is, they were beaten by Genin, showing how they aren't as strong as you make them out to be. Even arguing they can beat high Jounin like Zabuza and Asuma when they barely beat two fodder Special Jounin lol.

4. You didn't even know the scnerio of how the battle went. We do know that they end up fighting with kunais and shriukens. Not once do use see the after match of their "main" jutsus on the field. So once again counter the arugment instead of using abc logic. The same ABC logic which was completely irrelevant to begin with.

Dude, they had to go V2 against fodders! Clearly they don't have a chance in beating Zabuza and Asuma. Zabuza solos high diff. They are not skilled enough to beat someone of his caliber.

5. So what, they are not dumb. They are not going to stand there and not do nothing, just because they can't see their opponent. They adapt like normal ninjas and attempt to counter.

They don't even know what they're countering! Lolol. Zabuza takes them out before they even know. Kakashi even mentioned that Silent Killing is so fast, that you pass through this life time without even knowing what happened.

dkdankong said:
Lol takes her less time to play two notes than for him to activate the mist and attack

She doesn't just play two notes; she has to play an entire melody to perform the jutsu. Do you not understand Silent Killing? If Zabuza is already hidden in the trees, he doesn't need the mist. The mist just covers him up once he has been revealed for he can continue his Silent Killing. If he succeeds with his first strike, which he will due to his far superior speed, he doesn't even need any prep time.

Curse Mark · Oct 28, 2013

ShaneEyyy said:
Lolol Zabuza isn't tripping to that fodder move! When trees were around, he has shown in his first battle with Team 7 to hide in them, thus the ground tech doesn't work. Also, Zabuza will probably be out of its striking distance and due to the mist, when he gets close, Jiroubo won't know when to use it. Also, it only caused rumble on the ground in front of him, Zabuza moves behind his opponent. There's way too many ways that technique doesn't work so drop that stupid argument. Like honestly it's an awful argument to a point it's funny.

Due to his lack of knowledge, when the mist goes up he isn't going to be like, "Mist? This must be Zabuza Momochi, master of Silent Killing!" He has no knowledge on Zabuza. He isn't going to react in time and start setting traps immediately. He is not going to have the time against Zabuza. Jiroubo isn't buying time he is weak and even called the weakest one of the 4. He has nothing on Zabuza and I will not debate that he does any further. Kidomaru isn't covering the entire ground in sticky web, he has never shown such feat. Plus, Zabuza can get knowledge on this when he sends in Water Clones and the possibility of the clones falling for the web. But as I already explained, the web isn't stopping the clone from continuing swinging its sword. They aren't blocking his famous Silent Killing.

Anbu are not a specific rank, they could even be Chuunin. Anbu are Anbu for a unique ability. It isn't too impressive Kidomaru beat Anbu, as Kabuto from Part 1 argued he could beat 10 and Zabuza is stronger than Part 1 Kabuto.

Fact of the matter is, they were beaten by Genin, showing how they aren't as strong as you make them out to be. Even arguing they can beat high Jounin like Zabuza and Asuma when they barely beat two fodder Special Jounin lol.

Dude, they had to go V2 against fodders! Clearly they don't have a chance in beating Zabuza and Asuma. Zabuza solos high diff. They are not skilled enough to beat someone of his caliber.

They don't even know what they're countering! Lolol. Zabuza takes them out before they even know. Kakashi even mentioned that Silent Killing is so fast, that you pass through this life time without even knowing what happened.

She doesn't just play two notes; she has to play an entire melody to perform the jutsu. Do you not understand Silent Killing? If Zabuza is already hidden in the trees, he doesn't need the mist. The mist just covers him up once he has been revealed for he can continue his Silent Killing. If he succeeds with his first strike, which he will due to his far superior speed, he doesn't even need any prep time.

Clearly she doesn't just play two notes, but once the melody is started, he's not going to have time to stop her. And what makes you think he'll go straight for her? Just because you said he would?

ShaneEyyy · Oct 28, 2013

dkdankong said:
Clearly she doesn't just play two notes, but once the melody is started, he's not going to have time to stop her. And what makes you think he'll go straight for her? Just because you said he would?

He will go for them all at once with Water Clones, as he has shown in both of his fights against Team 7.

Brother Numpsay · Oct 28, 2013

ShaneEyyy said:
Lolol Zabuza isn't tripping to that fodder move! When trees were around, he has shown in his first battle with Team 7 to hide in them, thus the ground tech doesn't work. Also, Zabuza will probably be out of its striking distance and due to the mist, when he gets close, Jiroubo won't know when to use it. Also, it only caused rumble on the ground in front of him, Zabuza moves behind his opponent. There's way too many ways that technique doesn't work so drop that stupid argument. Like honestly it's an awful argument to a point it's funny.

Of course he knows when to do it, he can use it as soon as Zabuza weave seals, Zabuza is not going to guess on what jutsu they have a attempt to blindly counter their jutsus. What are you talking about, the jutsu caused rumble around its shockwave. A earthquake works more then a specific spot, what proof that it only works in front of the opponent lol? Whats funny is that your attempting to underrate a jutsu/character to make your argument look good.

ShaneEyyy said:
Due to his lack of knowledge, when the mist goes up he isn't going to be like, "Mist? This must be Zabuza Momochi, master of Silent Killing!" He has no knowledge on Zabuza. He isn't going to react in time and start setting traps immediately. He is not going to have the time against Zabuza. Jiroubo isn't buying time he is weak and even called the weakest one of the 4. He has nothing on Zabuza and I will not debate that he does any further. Kidomaru isn't covering the entire ground in sticky web, he has never shown such feat. Plus, Zabuza can get knowledge on this when he sends in Water Clones and the possibility of the clones falling for the web. But as I already explained, the web isn't stopping the clone from continuing swinging its sword. They aren't blocking his famous Silent Killing.

By what evidence that they won't react in time? Setting traps little to no secs with the previous scans I already post. The webs wont stop them from swing but its not like they can't counter an obvious "rat" (expression) stuck in a house trap. Simple Kunais can deals with that.

ShaneEyyy said:
Anbu are not a specific rank, they could even be Chuunin. Anbu are Anbu for a unique ability. It isn't too impressive Kidomaru beat Anbu, as Kabuto from Part 1 argued he could beat 10 and Zabuza is stronger than Part 1 Kabuto.

Anbu can be something to brag as when Itachi join at a young age and Kakashi. So once again bringing ranking into an argument doesn't help you at all and doesn't excuse Zabuza from countering their jutsus, until proven he can.

ShaneEyyy said:
Fact of the matter is, they were beaten by Genin, showing how they aren't as strong as you make them out to be. Even arguing they can beat high Jounin like Zabuza and Asuma when they barely beat two fodder Special Jounin lol.

The fact is they were all bad match up fights and all risked their lives to win. And some where double teamed. But if you want to laugh and brag about ranking match ups: part 1 Gaara > Zabuza lol.

ShaneEyyy said:
Dude, they had to go V2 against fodders! Clearly they don't have a chance in beating Zabuza and Asuma. Zabuza solos high diff. They are not skilled enough to beat someone of his caliber.

Thats nice part 1 Gaara fodderize Zabuza

OT: Not once did they shown to use their main arsenals in the field they fought so your argument is invalid, to make claim that he can counter their jutsu.

ShaneEyyy said:
They don't even know what they're countering! Lolol. Zabuza takes them out before they even know. Kakashi even mentioned that Silent Killing is so fast, that you pass through this life time without even knowing what happened.

Of course they know what they are counter, they are not stupid. If a Mist is forming the obviously its a mist jutsu. If the mist is the reason why they can't see their opponent then obviously they plan on counter the jutsu.

Zabuza has 4 choices on who to kill.

Kidomaru can wet his pants and yet, benefits him from counter the Beheader slash, Due to the body creating a metallic armor, gold.[