Yin Seal/Gates counter to Genjutsu (theory)

KingHashirama

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No butthurt is required.... So either post like intelligent members, or don't post like intelligent members.

Genjutsu: are techniques that are employed in the same fashion as ninjutsu, requiring chakra and hand seals. However, the primary difference between the two is that the effects of genjutsu are illusory; instead of attacking the victim's body, like taijutsu or ninjutsu, genjutsu techniques manipulate the flow of chakra in the victim's brain, thus causing a disruption in their senses. According to the Second Mizukage, genjutsu fittingly falls under the broad category of Yin Release.[1]

Why Uchiha can break Genjutsu:

Notice that Genjutsu is the manipulation of the chakra of the brain in your opponents. And we know that the sharingan is directly connected to the chakra of the brain.

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Jiraiya also listed that the way to break genjutsu is to disrupt chakra. Uchiha do it by disturbing their chakra also. But they can do it easily, because of the sharingan's relation to the chakra of the brain.

Example, Itachi casted Tsukuyomi on Sasuke. Itachi controls Sasuke's brain chakra and manipulates it. However Sasuke can distrub that chakra flow created by Itachi and get out of it. <<<< That is the process of how Sasuke broke out of Itachi's genjutsu.

Now lets go to the Gates.​


Gates:

The 8 gates are the following:

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Notice that the first 2 gates are at the brain area. And we know that one someone powers up in the gates their flow is going to be disturbed easily. Why do i say this? because the 8 gates are chakra limiters. They limit the chakra flow of the person. So if someone was to release the first gate, they chakra flow would be affected drastically. Hence the chakra flow created by the person using the genjutsu would be broken.

However, what I am unsure of is that if it keeps disrupting the chakra flow or if the chakra flow becomes normal once you release the gates. But Gates are a very very good way to break out of Genjutsu. (A taijutsu technique to counter genjutsu).


Now lets move on to the Yin Seal.
Yin Seal:​

What is Yin seal? Yin seal is a seal that stores chakra in the person's forehead. And releases it when unsealed. The Yin Seal chakra slowly starts to fade away, because it doesn't come out in just a big rush. Its a process where the user has the choice to take all of it out or to let it flow naturally (hence the length of the markings). To be able to use the Yin seal properly one requires extraordinary chakra control. The seal is noted to be the pinnacle of chakra control in the second databook.

Though we can say that a person with that precise of chakra control should be able to break genjutsu. Some disagree and want to see scans or "feats", though Itachi did acknowledge Naruto's attempt with this.

Not let me provide a chakra chart to show the sharingan//gates/yinseal.

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Now we can see that the Yin chakra point is in the middle of the brain. We also know that the chakra has to be turned the abnormal way for the genjutsu to work. While the yin seal chakra flow is the normal way (as far as we know of in the manga. ). The Yin constantly supplying the user with chakra will provide a "immunity" type of a thing against genjutsu.

For example, Itachi castes a genjutsu on Tsunade, while Tsunade has the yin seal on. He manipulates the flow of the chakra thats in the chakra system.. but that flow is automatically disrupted when the yin seal provides chakra into Tsunade.

Hence, why genjutsu can be countered with Yin seal.

Conclusion

So basically the Yin seal and the Gates user (who are all taijutsu users) can counter genjutsu users. Just like how a sharingan user can counter a genjutsu.

My thread is based upon the mechanics of how a sharingan user counters genjutsu. And how a genjutsu can be countered according to the one of the Sanin.

Also, as of Itachi saying only his family or someone with his eyes can counter his genjutsu. He was partially correct, because the stronger the sharingan, the stronger the connection to the brain chakra.
 

The Necromancer

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Nope. Kabuto proved that an inflow of chakra is not all that's required to negate Genjutsu. If Sage Mode (or any other similar ability such as the 8 Gates or Yin Seal) could negate genjutsu by circulating the brain's chakra, then he wouldn't have had to seal off his eyesight and he wouldn't have been affected by Itachi's Tsukuyomi.
 
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paratise

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I think it is plausable as long as the person realises s/he is in a genjutsu. İ dont see it working against something like Tsukiyomi though.

Also this can be added up for gates: usage of them causes pain on the user due physical restrains and inflicting pain on oneself breaks out genjutsu. But there is this, Gai a gates user developed the method of avoiding eye contact, sharingan genjutsu could have Been considered as a risk by him, but it can be because he would not want to lose any time even for a little by effected by genjutsu and Break it.
 

Xēnovia.

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Tsukiyomi and above are one shots, so it wouldn't work.​
 

KingHashirama

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Nope. Kabuto proved that an inflow of chakra is not all that's required to negate Genjutsu. If Sage Mode (or any other similar ability such as the 8 Gates or Yin Seal) could negate genjutsu by circulating the brain's chakra, then he wouldn't have had to seal off his eyesight and he wouldn't have been affected by Itachi's Tsukuyomi.

He has none of the above mentioned.

Neither does he have any thing related to brain. Your comparison of Kabuto has nothing to do with the ones i mentioned.
 

The Necromancer

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He has none of the above mentioned.

Neither does he have any thing related to brain. Your comparison of Kabuto has nothing to do with the ones i mentioned.

He has Sage Mode. Sage mode absorbs chakra from nature and distributes it throughout the body the same way the Yin seal and 8 Gates distribute chakra throughout the body. They're certainly comparable. You can't say they're not.

If anything, Sage Mode should be even more potent for genjutsu negation than Yin Seal and 8 Gates because it is not the user's own chakra.

For all we know, Yin seal was modeled after Sage mode, as the theme of the Sannin is incomplete Sage Mode.
 

KingHashirama

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Tsukiyomi and above are one shots, so it wouldn't work.​
This would deny that Sasuke broke out of it by disrupting his chakra flow. However, that is a manga fact.

I think it is plausable as long as the person realises s/he is in a genjutsu. İ dont see it working against something like Tsukiyomi though.

Also this can be added up for gates: usage of them causes pain on the user due physical restrains and inflicting pain on oneself breaks out genjutsu. But there is this, Gai a gates user developed the method of avoiding eye contact, sharingan genjutsu could have Been considered as a risk by him, but it can be because he would not want to lose any time even for a little by effected by genjutsu and Break it.

And actually yes I totally forgot about that. The gates would provide an immunity genjutsu, due to the inflicting pain on the body.

Gai a gates user developed the method to avoid eye contact, because you must have the ability to go into gates while under the genjutsu. That is the problem.

However, people are blindly forgetting that Kishimoto always provides a counter. Counter to taijutsu is the Uchiha's sharingan or characters with amazing reflexes and sensing ability. Counter to ninjutsu for samurai's is what Mifune uses the "quick draw" of the blade. I doubt its a simple coincidence, that the Gates have the starting gates in the brain the same place where genjutsu is used, and then the gates are used by people who aren't genjutsu users themselves and rely on taijutsu. And same for the Yin seal.

Tsukuyomi / KA all can be broken by chakra disruption. Anytime when Itachi's tsukuyomi has been broken its always been due to chakra disruption.


(this is just a theory.)

He has Sage Mode. Sage mode absorbs chakra from nature and distributes it throughout the body the same way the Yin seal and 8 Gates distribute chakra throughout the body. They're certainly comparable. You can't say they're not.

If anything, Sage Mode should be even more potent for genjutsu negation than Yin Seal and 8 Gates because it is not the user's own chakra.

For all we know, Yin seal was modeled after Sage mode, as the theme of the Sannin is incomplete Sage Mode.
No you need to absorb chakra to get into sage mode. SM doesn't constantly absorb chakra, as far as i know.

Sure if one was to gather Sage mode while under genjutsu, it should provide a way to get out of it. And you must also know that the other 2 sanin have genjutsu, while Tsunade doesn't. o_O
 
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The Necromancer

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No you need to absorb chakra to get into sage mode. SM doesn't constantly absorb chakra, as far as i know.

Sure if one was to gather Sage mode while under genjutsu, it should provide a way to get out of it. And you must also know that the other 2 sanin have genjutsu, while Tsunade doesn't. o_O

Kabuto passively absorbs Senjutsu due to his Juugo enhancements. Making it passive, and negating your entire argument. Circulating chakra passively does not cancel or immunize a shinobi to genjutsu.
 

TheEvilOne

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This is obviously true, but it wouldn't work on the Tsukuyomi for example.
 

Joshutsu

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The facts man. Already know though nay sayers. I'm sure they will be proven wrong in the future I can't be bothered.

Good analysis
 

KingHashirama

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Kabuto passively absorbs Senjutsu due to his Juugo enhancements. Making it passive, and negating your entire argument. Circulating chakra passively does not cancel or immunize a shinobi to genjutsu.

Oh welp didn't know about that. But the problem my argument isn't on Sage Mode. While he absorbs it passively. But what does that mean? SM is simply clinging onto the chakra that is already there, its not disrupting the flow.

While the things i mentioned are affecting the chakra flow actively. My argument still stands mate.
 
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