Without CS Sasuke would've died EP 1

[sG Taka]

No guys, not literally EP 1. What I mean is that lately people have been saying two things about Sasuke that I don't agree with:

The first is that Naruto is like a "cheat" for using the Nine Tails Chakra in most of his battles. This..is..well, what does this have to do with anything? This doesn't degrade his abilities. Killer Bee uses the Eight Tails Chakra, does he suck? No. I find this argument useless, it's part of who he is, he didn't choose to have it, he didn't control Minato so that the Kyuubi would be sealed inside him. He's not cheating and by using part of the Kyuubi's chakra he's not less of a fighter than anyone else.

The second is that Sasuke is a "genius" that relies on his "natural abilities" to win every battle. What? True, Sasuke is definitely intelligent and he did not choose to have the curse mark upon him but he did choose to continue using it as a mean to gain more power.

"Kakashi Hatake used the Evil Sealing Method to try and prevent this -meaning the Curse Mark-, but its effectiveness relied on Sasuke's choosing not to use his Cursed Seal. Sasuke ultimately chose to advance his seal to its second level, and went to Orochimaru with the help of the Sound Four. " -Article on the Cursed Seal of Heaven by Narutowikia

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Sasuke has used his curse mark in practically EVERY battle.

Sasuke vs Zaku (Forest of Death)
Sasuke vs Yoroi
Sasuke vs Gaara (Continuing the fight of the Chunin Exams in the forest)
Sasuke vs Naruto (Final Valley)
Sasuke vs Orochimaru
Sasuke vs Deidara
Sasuke vs Itachi

The only battles I can remember of him not using CS are:
Sasuke vs Naruto (Orochimaru Hideout)
Sasuke vs Danzo (Because he couldn't)
Sasuke vs Haku (Because he couldn't)
Sasuke vs Gaara (Chunin Exams 2)
Sasuke vs Raikage

I'm not going to count Sasuke vs the Kage Summit because it wasn't really a battle, Mei didn't do much and Onooki practically killed him with his Dust technique but Tobi and Karin saved him.

Sasuke could've cooperated with Kakashi and stopped using his CS but someone was filled with too much hatred and revenge.

All I'm saying, is that if you Sasuke fanboys are going to call Nartuo a "cheat" for using his Kyuubi chakra, they should look at Sasuke first. In any case, Sasuke is more of a cheat than Naruto.

I'm not a Naruto fanboy, he's not even my favorite character.
Feel free to correct me in any way, just don't flame or don't post stupid responses.

 

[Zoro..]

lol nice and true xd

 

[Dr Strangelove]

+rep man. Must have taken you a while to type that out.

 

[Owarij]

Sasuke vs Yoroi

He did not use it here... it was taking him over, but he stopped it, and continued the fight without it..

It was on him for like 2 secs.... He made no physical contact with yoroi

 

[sG Taka]

lol nice and true xd

Thanks!

+rep man. Must have taken you a while to type that out.

Thanks! It didn't actually, I mean, less than 5 minutes, I sort of already had my argument in my head. Cheers!

Sasuke vs Yoroi

He did not use it here... it was taking him over, but he stopped it, and continued the fight without it..

It was on him for like 2 secs.... He made no physical contact with yoroi

I just looked that up, you're right. I'll make sure to scratch it out, thanks!

 

[The Thinker]

Cool nd agreed!

 

[Blaze Release]

Bullcrap. Firstly from what I've seen its naruto fans who start this.
Secondly the fox and naruto are two entities, they have different minds. Sasuke and the cs do not. Thirdly naruto has relied on the fox in all his battles, even now currently he is still relying on it.

Find it funny that you didn't make a list of naruto's battles, if you did you'd know the fox has always helped someway or another

 

[HBKJames]

if one doesn't like Sasuke's use of the CS and call him a cheat then they'd have to say the same about Naruto's use of the kyubi thus both are equally cheats

but is it really cheating when you're just using the tools/weapons you've got. playing the hand you're dealt in fights where there are no rules then the word cheating is irrelevant and not applicable

 

[DhattUchiha]

Bullcrap. Firstly from what I've seen its naruto fans who start this.
Secondly the fox and naruto are two entities, they have different minds. Sasuke and the cs do not. Thirdly naruto has relied on the fox in all his battles, even now currently he is still relying on it.

Find it funny that you didn't make a list of naruto's battles, if you did you'd know the fox has always helped someway or another

+rep said so elequent.

 

[sG Taka]

Bullcrap. Firstly from what I've seen its naruto fans who start this.
Secondly the fox and naruto are two ejtities, they have different mindd. Sasuke and the cs do not. Thirdly naruto has relied on the fox in all his battles, even now currently he is still relying on it.

Find it funny that you didn't make a list of naruto's battles, if you did you'd know the fox has always helped someway or another

Without proper training, Naruto cannot control the Kyuubi at all. If emotions prevail, he's done. Unlike Naruto, Sasuke could've said no to the Curse Mark and stopped it, before it got out of hand like in the Itachi battle.

Out of my head I can remember Naruto vs Kiba. No Kyuubi there. And the thread is not about wheter he uses it or not, it's about him not being a cheat.

 

[sG Taka]

+rep said so elequent.

You and your friend clearly didn't understand the thread..

 

[HBKJames]

Without proper training, Naruto cannot control the Kyuubi at all. If emotions prevail, he's done. Unlike Naruto, Sasuke could've said no to the Curse Mark and stopped it, before it got out of hand like in the Itachi battle.

Out of my head I can remember Naruto vs Kiba. No Kyuubi there. And the thread is not about wheter he uses it or not, it's about him not being a cheat.

actually your wrong...Naruto gained some control over his ability to draw on the kyuubi's chakra back then in part I and early on in part II

So both Sasuke had choices on whether or not they used it...Naruto willfully drew on the kyuubi and asked it to give of its chakra to beat Neji. Naruto willfully chose to draw on the kyubi the way Jiraiya taught him to to summon Gambunta to fight Gaara...and did it again against Sasuke at the VoTE fight

 

[sG Taka]

actually your wrong...Naruto gained some control over his ability to draw on the kyuubi's chakra back then in part I and early on in part II

So both Sasuke had choices on whether or not they used it...Naruto willfully drew on the kyuubi and asked it to give of its chakra to beat Neji. Naruto willfully chose to draw on the kyubi the way Jiraiya taught him to to summon Gambunta to fight Gaara...and did it again against Sasuke at the VoTE fight

Still the Kyuubi could easily overpower him like the battle with Orochimaru or Pain. Kakashi tried to help Sasuke get rid of the Curse Mark, which was a bad thing, and he denied. Naruto can't get rid of the nine-tails, he'd die. Obviously they're going to train him.

 

[ReXii]

If your pointing out the fact that the kyuubi requires control you should also note that using the cursed seal require a huge amount of control case in point being jugo the original CS user turning in to a sadistic murderer under its influence

As for this topic its pointless if people have power of course they will use it
By the threads logic onoki using dust release is cheating its muu's moves that he gave onoki and the 4th raikage is cheating by using his fathers technique and gaara is cheating because his control of sand was given by shukaku and the puppet guy is cheating using a sasori puppet and jiraiya cheated using the frogs for sage mode and pein cheated by using the rinnegan that was given to him apparently

You see what im getting at?

 

[Blaze Release]

Without proper training, Naruto cannot control the Kyuubi at all. If emotions prevail, he's done. Unlike Naruto, Sasuke could've said no to the Curse Mark and stopped it, before it got out of hand like in the Itachi battle.

Out of my head I can remember Naruto vs Kiba. No Kyuubi there. And the thread is not about wheter he uses it or not, it's about him not being a cheat.

I cannot remember kiba vs naruto properly but I can list the fight that the fox has helped him. Infact currently in the war, who's power do you think he is using, his own?.

Also naruto has also been told to stop using the fox before he his training arc due to him not recognising friend from foe. Also if I remember correctly he broke the 1st hokage's necklace which contained sealing abilities to further unleash the fox's wrath.

If you want I can list the fights naruto has been in with the aid of the fox. Far exceeds what Sasuke has done with the cs

 

[sG Taka]

People, the point of showing that Sasuke has used CS in most of his battles is not to hide the fact that Naruto uses his Kyuubi, it's to support my argument that Sasuke doesn't rely on his "natural" or "innate" abilities. The Kyuubi is natural to Naruto, he was practically born (sort of infused inside the womb) with it.

 

[HBKJames]

Still the Kyuubi could easily overpower him like the battle with Orochimaru or Pain. Kakashi tried to help Sasuke get rid of the Curse Mark, which was a bad thing, and he denied. Naruto can't get rid of the nine-tails, he'd die. Obviously they're going to train him.

I'm sorry but the kyuubi was more evil and bad than the CS

Ans Naruto could get rid of the kyuubi by having the seal undo since it was nothing but a seal keeping the kyubi in Naruto no different than the seal that Sasuke had

 

[sG Taka]

If your pointing out the fact that the kyuubi requires control you should also note that using the cursed seal require a huge amount of control case in point being jugo the original CS user turning in to a sadistic murderer under its influence

As for this topic its pointless if people have power of course they will use it
By the threads logic onoki using dust release is cheating its muu's moves that he gave onoki and the 4th raikage is cheating by using his fathers technique and gaara is cheating because his control of sand was given by shukaku and the puppet guy is cheating using a sasori puppet and jiraiya cheated using the frogs for sage mode and pein cheated by using the rinnegan that was given to him apparently

You see what im getting at?

I'm not saying Sasuke is a cheat! I'm saying that Naruto isn't. The point of the CS battles is to show Sasuke doesn't rely on his natural abilities.

 

[HBKJames]

People, the point of showing that Sasuke has used CS in most of his battles is not to hide the fact that Naruto uses his Kyuubi, it's to support my argument that Sasuke doesn't rely on his "natural" or "innate" abilities. The Kyuubi is natural to Naruto, he was practically born (sort of infused inside the womb) with it.

here is where you're misunderstanding the power of the CS...the CS doesn't give you chakra you didn't have before. Its just like the Opening of the Gates in that it forces the chakra you already have out in full force...so in essence, yes Sasuke was relying on natural ability since the power given to him by the CS was his own chakra...just forces out at unhealthy levels

and the kyyubi is no more natural to Naruto than the heart of a hart transplant patient...in both cases it wasn't something they're born with but given to them after

 

[ReXii]

Kyuubi is not a natural ability it is an symbiotic life form living inside naruto and by comparison sasuke relied on CS a lot less he used it as a last resort most of the time and no longer uses it

On the opposite side of that scale naruto has become dependant on the kyuubi power

When all is said and done they are both the same as is every other character in the series if they soley relied on natural abilitys it would just be ninjas using the basic 5 elements and taijutsu + ninjutsu against each other and that would completely suck