[Discussion] Who's the victim? The Teacher or The Student?

[ArabianLuffy]

There are obstacles both a teacher and student face in education. Mostly who have a hard life is the student.

01. Family's problems.
02. Illness.
03. Mental problems.
04. Part-Time jobs.
05. Poverty.
06. Transportation.
07. Unprepared environment for studying.
08. Bad students/friends who influence his studying.
09. Being bullied by students.
10. Damaging/stealing student's books, notebooks, pens and such.

so many reasons to count.

and a teacher shares as same reasons as a student, but he/she learned to try not to let his problems to interfere with his/her work. School's problems and house's/family's problem both in their own and never let his problems in school effects on him/her and how he/she being with his/her family.

If only a student learned how they keep school and home as 2 separated issues non of them has to do with the other. When a student gets low marks, they try to make any excuse that it's so weak and unconvincing to a teacher from their own point of view. Just so a student hope to get more marks.

Some students are being so careless about their school and studies.

- Sleeping during a lesson.
- Talking during a lesson.
- Studying a subject like math during English class for example.
- Being absent whether school or class.
- After school, a student sleep, eat, hang out, play, and no checking on books, homeworks, preparing for exams.
- Bad friends who are careless about school.
- Hobbies that take so much of their times like videogames and\or other hobbies.

If a teacher being strict hard-working with students, makes classes meaningful, and important and fair, checking students' homeworks, how many marks they got in exams and so on. If a teacher keeps on check of everything that a student won't have any way to blame a teacher on.

Well, the results differ. Either a student accept what he/she gets based on his/her efforts ... or ... break a glass of the teacher's car for getting low marks.

and there is another problem

You meet good students and bad students
Good teachers and bad teachers

and I'm talking about some gay/lesbian students/teachers.

there is the prey and the victim. It can be both and mix of many things you could imagine depends on many things. The school's department if it's strict or careless. How is the district and such.

Who was wrong first?
who are the victims mostly?

 

[Wolfus]

It will depend a lot on the situation. The teacher isn't always right, they make mistakes as well. But studends also make mistakes. So, depending on the situation, the person who was wrong will have to face that he/she was wrong.
Some teachers think they're always right and some studens always blam the teachers. Both actions are mistakes.

 

[gutSy Sage]

we are the victims of the government...yeee I went thuurrr.

 

[-S-]

Yeah. You're comparing children with adults here. It's like saying, ''why can't a baby stop crying, and just feed itself?''.

Most of those children eventually mature, and develop the mentality of the adults who teach.

There are no victims here.

 

[Punk Hazard]

OK, let's put the bullshit aside for a second. A student should learn to keep personal life out of school? That's rich sincee school has limited our personal lives so much.

And then you talk about hobbies taking up book time? WTF? We are in school seven hours a day, for five days a week from morning. I go to school in the morning, then get home at five, so ****ing excuse me if when I come home from school, I actually want to enjoy being alive for a while instead of giving all my attention on school AGAIN.

Not to mention we are in school five days a week with only two days to ourselves, and even then, we have homework and assignments and studying to do, not to mention chores and the time we spend sleeping at night. If anything, some of us could use MORE time not thinking about school.

 

[Wolfus]

we are the victims of the government...yeee I went thuurrr.

Oh, please. "Lol, look at me, I'm against the sistem, bla bla bla". Grow up, kid.

 

[Wolfus]

OK, let's put the bullshit aside for a second. A student should learn to keep personal life out of school? That's rich sincee school has limited our personal lives so much.

And then you talk about hobbies taking up book time? WTF? We are in school seven hours a day, for five days a week from morning. I go to school in the morning, then get home at five, so ****ing excuse me if when I come home from school, I actually want to enjoy being alive for a while instead of giving all my attention on school AGAIN.

Not to mention we are in school five days a week with only two days to ourselves, and even then, we have homework and assignments and studying to do, not to mention chores and the time we spend sleeping at night. If anything, some of us could use MORE time not thinking about school.

You are there to learn, not to "fly arround". Either way, if you have personal problems, that's not a reason for disrespecting a teacher or a classmade, that's the point. The same goes for the teachers. The studens are not the reason he is angry.
School is part of your personal life as well, that's obvious. So, that doesn't mean you can't share the problem with your classmates and teachers. However, not only in school, but anywhere, your problems are not excuse to disrespect people. Never.

 

[Punk Hazard]

You are there to learn, not to "fly arround". Either way, if you have personal problems, that's not a reason for disrespecting a teacher or a classmade, that's the point. The same goes for the teachers. The studens are not the reason he is angry.
School is part of your personal life as well, that's obvious. So, that doesn't mean you can't share the problem with your classmates and teachers. However, not only in school, but anywhere, your problems are not excuse to disrespect people. Never.

When did I say personal problems makes it ok to disprespect people?

 

[-S-]

You are there to learn, not to "fly arround". Either way, if you have personal problems, that's not a reason for disrespecting a teacher or a classmade, that's the point. The same goes for the teachers. The studens are not the reason he is angry.
School is part of your personal life as well, that's obvious. So, that doesn't mean you can't share the problem with your classmates and teachers. However, not only in school, but anywhere, your problems are not excuse to disrespect people. Never.

Okay, respect is due from the students. But all what you said is just looking at what a student should be. That's not reality.

Human nature kicks in, it's difficult for youths to pull away from who they are; especially during adolescence. You are a teacher, and should know that. If you can't cope, then quit your job because you are not suited for it.

 

[Wolfus]

When did I say personal problems makes it ok to disprespect people?

Just making sure you don't think that way, as a lot of people do.

 

[Wolfus]

Okay, respect is due from the students. But all what you said is just looking at what a student should be. That's not reality.

Human nature kicks in, it's difficult for youths to pull away from who they are; especially during adolescence. You are a teacher, and should know that. If you can't cope, then quit your job because you are not suited for it.

Yeah, I know of our flawed nature. But being our nature or not, is a mistake. The students are the one to develop, to learn how to be citizens. Respect goes for both sides.
If we allow every student to do what they want because they're young, because it's their nature, becaue they have problems they'll never be citizens, and they won't fit society, as they'll think they can do anything they want.
Keep in mind that to live in society, humans must go against their nature.

 

[ArabianLuffy]

OK, let's put the bullshit aside for a second. A student should learn to keep personal life out of school? That's rich sincee school has limited our personal lives so much.

And then you talk about hobbies taking up book time? WTF? We are in school seven hours a day, for five days a week from morning. I go to school in the morning, then get home at five, so ****ing excuse me if when I come home from school, I actually want to enjoy being alive for a while instead of giving all my attention on school AGAIN.

Not to mention we are in school five days a week with only two days to ourselves, and even then, we have homework and assignments and studying to do, not to mention chores and the time we spend sleeping at night. If anything, some of us could use MORE time not thinking about school.

We are living in a time that even who have A bachelor degree serves him no good, but enroll in teaching. Good for whoever is. At least he found a job so he can feed himself instead of letting someone else feeds him.

You live according to your believes, but sooner or later you're gonna re-think about what you've done in your life and the decisions you made if they were right or wrong.

"If only I could go back the time I was a student, I would work and study hard, so I can be so and so"

call it bullsh!t whatever you like...... son.

nothing helps you unless you get master degree at least and hopefully PhD..

take a good look at life and how the world works

and system of education differ from one country to another.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Just making sure you don't think that way, as a lot of people do.

There's a difference between disrespect and just wanting to be left alone. Sometimes, I'm tired or irritated and would prefer if a certain few of my teachers don't speak to me directly. Does that make me disrespectful?

 

[DeadManWonderLand]

There completely separate ?

Is that why there are counselors and programs that extend outside of school hours to help them with food and other immediate needs ?

School prepares you for the future it is as personal as anything else at home.


And your post doesn't make much sense for the most part and where i do understand what ever question you attempt to propose you answer yourself in the following lines.

The scenario involving any student and teacher are entirely situational.

 

[Punk Hazard]

We are living in a time that even who have A bachelor degree serves him no good, but enroll in teaching. Good for whoever is. At least he found a job so he can feed himself instead of letting someone else feeds him.

You live according to your believes, but sooner or later you're gonna re-think about what you've done in your life and the decisions you made if they were right or wrong.

"If only I could go back the time I was a student, I would work and study hard, so I can be so and so"

call it bullsh!t whatever you like...... son.

nothing helps you unless you get master degree at least and hopefully PhD..

take a good look at life and how the world works

and system of education differ from one country to another.

So much of that has nothing to do with anything I said.

Ignoring your sad attempt to rile me up by calling me "son", I have to say you missed my point. I'm not saying you shouldn't work hard. I'm saying a lot of us work hard enough as it is IN school. Seriously, do you adults think school is just sitting down in a chair listening to someone talk? We do work in class as well, we work even harder in class than we do in homework, and we do that all day. So it's not really fair when you ridicule us for trying to enjoy life outside of school.

 

[Wolfus]

There's a difference between disrespect and just wanting to be left alone. Sometimes, I'm tired or irritated and would prefer if a certain few of my teachers don't speak to me directly. Does that make me disrespectful?

And how do you tell them that? You can explain that you're going through problems and want to be left alone, as nobody has to guess that. Reasonable teachers will understand.
Of course, you're duty is still school, so sometimes, you have to hold your ground, no matter what you're going through. This will happen in school, in work, in life.
But of course, if a teacher is reasonable, he won't request too much of you, but you still have to do something(as it is your duty, as I said). You can't expect that because you have problems, you're free to do anything you want, or you don't have to pay attention, do do works, etc.

 

[-S-]

Yeah, I know of our flawed nature. But being our nature or not, is a mistake. The students are the one to develop, to learn how to be citizens. Respect goes for both sides.
If we allow every student to do what they want because they're young, because it's their nature, becaue they have problems they'll never be citizens, and they won't fit society, as they'll think they can do anything they want.
Keep in mind that to live in society, humans must go against their nature.

That's not my point. My point is that there is no reason why a teacher should feel like a 'victim'. You're making it seem as if children can't develop on their own, which is not true. As your mind opens, and you age, your mentality changes. You adapt as you transition into an adult, as you try to become like the adults around you in order to survive. Teachers should not feel like a victim, as they should have already acknowledged that they must cope with this in their career.

And our nature is not flawed. It's simply due to the chemical and biological changes in our body. If you remove establishment and society, you realise that those changes do not affect us. It is only because we are not evolved to adapt to the world we shaped over the last few thousands of years, that we find it so hard to cope as we develop during adolescence.

 

[Jazzy Stardust]

No ones to blame, it's just a maturity issue. If you think about it a students life span is 60% of time at school, it can be hard to differentiate and keep things separate when that's a major part of your life.

 

[Wolfus]

That's not my point. My point is that there is no reason why a teacher should feel like a 'victim'. You're making it seem as if children can't develop on their own, which is not true. As your mind opens, and you age, your mentality changes. You adapt as you transition into an adult, as you try to become like the adults around you in order to survive. Teachers should not feel like a victim, as they should have already acknowledged that they must cope with this in their career.

And our nature is not flawed. It's simply due to the chemical and biological changes in our body. If you remove establishment and society, you realise that those changes do not affect as. It is only because we are not evolved to adapt to the world we shaped over the last few thousands of years, that we find it so hard to cope as we develop during adolescence.

Nobody should feel as a victim here, I guess. However, children do need a guide. They need someone to teach them or at least show them what is wrong and what is right(meaning, what is good and what is bad for life in society, before any hippie comes and says that it's relative).

And yes, our nature is flawed. Do you have full knowledge on our nature? Here it goes then.


Humans want more than survival. They want control. They want what is good for them, no matter the future consequences. They want what they think to be true, and anybody who enters their way will be destroyed.

Another thing is, our culture, not only our culture, but our nature seems to make us want to take control of everything in the way we think is better. Basically, even though humans have intelligence and knowledge, they can only think of what is good for themselves, ignoring every possible negative consequences for others or for the future.

Our nature is also related to war. It seems that most humans alwyas want to fight everything or everyone "in their way", everyone that doesn't agree or accept the way they do things.

Humans can't face different opinions, thoughts, ideas or behaviors. Whenever facing differences, humans will try to impose their ideas, their characteristics. If they're unable to do that, they'll try to eliminate the source of the difference. So, fights, wars, killing. In smaller scales, segregation and disrespect. It's also part of our nature.

This ius what we are. So yes, our nature is flawed.

 

[ArabianLuffy]

So much of that has nothing to do with anything I said.

Ignoring your sad attempt to rile me up by calling me "son", I have to say you missed my point. I'm not saying you shouldn't work hard. I'm saying a lot of us work hard enough as it is IN school. Seriously, do you adults think school is just sitting down in a chair listening to someone talk? We do work in class as well, we work even harder in class than we do in homework, and we do that all day. So it's not really fair when you ridicule us for trying to enjoy life outside of school.

I know what you're saying, and I know what I'm saying.

and I'm sure you're hard-working student.

what I said was about students who don't pay effort in school neither after school, and if they got low marks, they blame the teacher despite how hard a teacher worked for a student's sake, and a student doesn't cooperate/ask for help or anything.

things differ from country to other.