Was Sasori downgraded against Sakura?

[~Ethereal~]

When Sasori realized they sent The Fodder after him, he decided to kill himself, but in a more indiscreet way. It was also a revenge, so Sakura could look good for one fight, and be put back in her place later on.

You really believe that?

 

[shelke]

1. Sasori wasted a large amount of chakra sealin a bijuu for 3 days

2 Sasori tryed keeping them alive so he coukd turn them into human puppets (holding back)

3. Sakura had gotten intel on Sasori, Sasori had no idea she was a medical ninja.

4. They had a antitode for his poison a major factor they would have lost since IC techinque

5. Even when with the odds against Sasori still choose to did by his grandmother while at a disadvatage.

The fight made Sakura look like acouple scrub.

Oh boy ... the amount of fan-fiction in this one post - I am just copying two of my posts on Sasori fight that are relevant here:

Sakura began to see through those attacks quite early on:

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- Note the term "even without my assistance, she can do it". Which means Sakura could have done all the punching and the dodging all on her own by now. Now if you want to argue a clear cut manga statement, then we have no agreement.

Sakura is shown reading his movements, and Sasori acknowledges it:

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Want another acknowledgement?

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Now despite being hit, she was still fast enough to pull out the rope, all of it, and yank him back:

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Sasori isn't even that skilled with multiple puppets. How many of his got crapped on by ten puppets and Sakura? Let's see:

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Sakura easily dodged this many puppets:

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Not only that, she ran from all the way over to the right, and reached Chiyo BEFORE Sasori could blitz her:

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He wasn't taking them seriously? Are you sure?

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- As soon as he brought out Iron Sand, he went at them with an intent to kill. That was way early into the fight.

Sasori himself requires a recipe to make the poison:

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He praised her for her medic skills on prepping the poison:

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So let's see:

- He went at them with an intent to kill very early on in the battle? Check.
- Having intel on poison means nothing as only Sakura came up with the antidote and Sasori himself requires a recipe to make one? Check.
- No manga evidence that he was low on chakra.
- Sasori was without puppets and out of options.

NB and their fan-fictions.

 

[super yang]

it doesn't matter whether U feel the script(his mindset, his decisions, his stubbornness, antidote) affected the outcome.
he ''lost''.
but that doesn't change the actual quality of his ninjutsu or his ''strength'', which lies in what a shinobi is potentially capable of doing
he wasn't ''nerfed'' at all, in this regard.
there was a decent amount of plot armor 4 his opponents, but that has nothing to do w/ Sasoris character & portrayal.

there are not many true nerfs before the juubi arc & none that I can think of offhand

 

[SailorMoonLover]

Oh boy ... the amount of fan-fiction in this one post - I am just copying two of my posts on Sasori fight that are relevant here:





So let's see:

- He went at them with an intent to kill very early on in the battle? Check.
- Having intel on poison means nothing as only Sakura came up with the antidote and Sasori himself requires a recipe to make one? Check.
- No manga evidence that he was low on chakra.
- Sasori was without puppets and out of options.

NB and their fan-fictions.

Wrong in order to turn someone into a human puppet you have to keep them alive , he already stated he wanted to turn them into human puppets.(intent wasn't to kill)

Spoiler

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Having intel on posion is nothing ? You drunk They would have lost as soon as IC technique struck if it wasn't for the antidote


So using chakra for 3 days straight isn't going to effect on a shinobi lol

Without puppets ? He already stated he has 297 other human puppets they were useless do to the antidote again a major factor .

You know when someone callin facts fan fic the hurt is real come again.

 

[Conspirator.]

Sasori told her about his techs. He also wanted to be killed.

This is the truth.

 

[Holy Cross]

I do believe he was nerfed. I believe he should've been able to kill them both if he had used his iron sand in conjunction with his 100 puppets. Also I don't think he was being cocky, i think he was appearing to be cocky because in the end he wanted to die anyway. So I'm sure he could've done a lot more if he were being serious considering Deidara said that he was inferior to him, and he also had a scroll on his back that he never used in the Sakura/Chiyo fight.

 

[KingHashirama]

Actually chiyo and sakura were nerfed.

 

[super yang]

well, he didn't want to ruin their bodies, in case they weren't strong enough to kill him, so he could make new puppets.

 

[KGB Kakuzu]

He was not. But again, its like everyone forgets Chiyo was there.

You know... Chiyo

-The lady who knew all about how to fight as a puppet user.
-The lady who had personal insight into Sasori's mental persona.
-The lady who knew the moves of several of his puppets.
-The lady who used her skill for half-three quarters of the fight to keep Sakura and her own injuries to a minimum...


Combine that with Sakura...

-The girl who had the prep time to make his poison worthless for roughly 6 or so minutes between all the antidotes.
-The girl who had the brute strength to counter Sasori's starting puppet.
-The girl who baited him into a close range scenario to destroy the Kazekage puppet.
-The girl with the medical skill to survive being stabbed.


IT REALLY screws you over. Sakura and Chiyo was a god awful match up for him. He had a lady who knew his fighting style, and several of his moves. This same lady could control the other lady as a weapon, and the other lady had the power to break his puppets like a toothpick. Not to mention also carried 3 or so antidotes to his normally game ending poison.

Even with all that, Sasori would have won had he not CHOSEN death. Chiyo notes Sasori saw through her last ploy, but took the bait purposely.



Sasori if anything, is underrated due to the ignorance regarding Sasori's situation, and personal bias members of the forum have for Sakura.

Actually chiyo and sakura were nerfed.

Except for that time they came in with knowledge on their enemy. And that time they came prepared with three antidotes. And that time Sasori just happened to decide he'd finish Sakura with a CQB attack when cutting her up with Iron Sand was just as easy. And that time Sasori immediately decided not to mix and match his other various human puppets into a team that'd be effective, and just spammed an army of useless puppets.

Wait... I'm not helping your argument

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[RedRobin]

• Sasori was not nerfed
• Sakura and Chiyo together was his worst match up
• Sakura and Chiyo did 50% of the work and wouldnt have survived without the other
• Sakura and Chiyo has prep + intel, Sasori had Intel on Chiyo's abilities
• Sasori was TNJ in the end by both Sakura and Chiyo which he is why he let the last attack hit

 

[BAS3D]

Don't think so, his speciality are his poison which was deemed incurable (it even took Sasori the creator of the poison months to a find antidote for) and his puppets

Sakura already managed to find a antidote by the help of Kankuro and Both chiyo and Sakura had the strength to stop his puppets

They were both his worst match up, he had a killing intent from the very start, he simply underestimated them

 

[Endles Waltz]

LOL this thread! autoplay

You guys are good.

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[Seventh Sama]

Of course he was, he could've either poisoned both easily from the start, used his black sand from the start, or attack them with his "true strength" (puppet) from the stard.

Some people just don't show their full strength at the start of a fight, an example would be madara....

OT. nahh

 

[Lariatoo]

He was EXTREMILY downgraded. The duo got everything handed to them with an unbelievable amount of PIS and plot induced mess...
And even with all these handouts, Kishi had to make Sasori kill himself because it wasn't enough...

 

[Desiigner]

Edo sasori was nerfed .

The one who fought with sakura and chiyo was the strongest sasori form we saw fight. So how exactly he is downgraded when you haven't seen him stronger before?


Their teamwork defeated him

They dodged The attacks ,they healed the attacks that they couldn't dodge,they used antidotes that grands them immunity for minutes Against the poison .

He used his black sand but sakura tricked him and destroyed the puppet.

The 100 puppets were useless against chyio .

His absolute defense got shattered by sakura punch


Face it that fight was fair . Sasori Only lost the last minute because his emotions got in the way .


Sakura who had the antidote

Won't even argue again, but you consider a 2vs1 fight where the grandmother knows everything about the opponent fair? Seems legit. u_u

Anyway, he lost. No need to debate on this any longer, in my opinion, he was nerfed, but many people do not think so and so be it.

 

[shelke]

Wrong in order to turn someone into a human puppet you have to keep them alive , he already stated he wanted to turn them into human puppets.(intent wasn't to kill)

Spoiler

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Having intel on posion is nothing ? You drunk They would have lost as soon as IC technique struck if it wasn't for the antidote


So using chakra for 3 days straight isn't going to effect on a shinobi lol

Without puppets ? He already stated he has 297 other human puppets they were useless do to the antidote again a major factor .

You know when someone callin facts fan fic the hurt is real come again.

- There are scans up there to refute your first argument. He only wanted to turn them into a human puppet very early on in the fight. I have not even included the ones where he went at them with knives out repeatedly. Let me repost them, just in case:

1 -

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2 -

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- Looks like he went at them with the intent to kill as soon as he brought out the iron sand.

- Even posted a scan which you conviniently decided to ignore:

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- Sasori's poison was something well-known, but no one could make an antidote besides Sakura. All Medic nins in the Sand failed, even Chiyo who knew how Hanzo's poison worked:

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- So it was nothing but talent on Sakura's part that she even managed to prepare it. So having intel on it - which many people already did - means nothing, when Sasori himself needs a freaking recipe for it.

- Only Deidara complains on low chakra. Not Sasori. Without evidence, it's speculation. Since he has completely turned himself into a puppet, his chakra obviously replenishes and works on a completely different level than humans. He isn't human anymore.

- Doesn't matter to me. As he used countless, and Chiyo took them out with only 10 of them, along with Sakura aiding her. Goes to show how shitty his puppet mastery is compared to Chiyo.

Still fan-fiction, when I gave you plenty of evidence.

 

[Anorien16]

So let's see:

- He went at them with an intent to kill very early on in the battle? Check.
- Having intel on poison means nothing as only Sakura came up with the antidote and Sasori himself requires a recipe to make one? Check.
- No manga evidence that he was low on chakra.
- Sasori was without puppets and out of options.

NB and their fan-fictions.

Excuse me I never understood the point @bold .... Everyone who makes something on regular basis has recipe/pattern/plan for it, my mom has a recipe for her chocolate cake and so does the best baker in the world. Sasori requiring a recepie doesnt really make any kind of point because since his intention IS to use a poison that causes excruciating pain and cause nearly certain death, it is only natural that he uses ingredients necessary for such result thus following a recipe. Sakura making the antidote is great credit to her but it is also the sole reason the actually won. Even though barely.

 

[shelke]

Excuse me I never understood the point @bold .... Everyone who makes something on regular basis has recipe/pattern/plan for it, my mom has a recipe for her chocolate cake and so does the best baker in the world. Sasori requiring a recepie doesnt really make any kind of point because since his intention IS to use a poison that causes excruciating pain and cause nearly certain death, it is only natural that he uses ingredients necessary for such result thus following a recipe. Sakura making the antidote is great credit to her but it is also the sole reason the actually won. Even though barely.

I have never required a recipe for dishes that I make or my family makes. Secondly, Sasori emphasizes the importance of the recipe in the process - he cannot afford to make even a slight error. Sakura prepared a counter antidote for it without a recipe when even Sasori requires one, because of the mistakes he probably makes himself without it?

There is a scan for you up there. It does matter a lot. You people unmining it is not helping your case when it's a huge feat on Sakura's part. Intel on his poison means jack, when no one could make an antidote for it, not even Chiyo whose knowledge on poisons is unsurpassed bar Tsunade.

 

[Anorien16]

I have never required a recipe for dishes that I make or my family makes.

So u chug in lamb, carrots and some oil randomly on the pan to make chicken stew, right? Because if you follow some particular set of methods and particular ingredients to make a specific thing, then you are indeed following a recipe. (Dictionary: recipe: a set of instructions for preparing a particular dish, including a list of the ingredients required ...... since everything require a particular set of instructions and particular set of ingredients .... every concoction has a recipe)

Secondly, Sasori emphasizes the importance of the recipe in the process - he cannot afford to make even a slight error.

So? That poison is very intricate .... it is obviously going to be risk prone. So unless he wants to have something less than his desired results he better not mix up belladonna extract with Itachi's sweat.

Sakura prepared a counter antidote for it without a recipe when even Sasori requires one, because of the mistakes he probably makes himself without it?

Here you have a great literature critic failing to understand the concept of 'recipe' .... Every dish/concoction, each and everyone of them have a recipe. All of them follow a set of methods and a set of indgridients to provide a certain result, while variations leads to various degrees of deviations from the desired result. A recipe is not mystical force that makes something successful, it is the process of making something.

There is a scan for you up there. It does matter a lot. You people unmining it is not helping your case when it's a huge feat on Sakura's part.

Yes it is a great Toxicological and Herbalism related feat. Yet this has nothing to do with your failure to understand the concept of Recipe or Procedure.

Intel on his poison means jack, when no one could make an antidote for it, not even Chiyo whose knowledge on poisons is unsurpassed bar Tsunade.

The Intel was everything because ... without Kankuro being taken back alive Sakura would not have prepared the antidote and both of them would have died quite a long ago. (Ignoring that Sakura still had to be somehow saved by Miracle jutsu)

Not to mention the antidote would have been useless if Sasori simply carried more than one kind of poison (which is a rookie mistake for an Assassin/Ninja).

 

[shelke]

So u chug in lamb, carrots and some oil randomly on the pan to make chicken stew, right? Because if you follow some particular set of methods and particular ingredients to make a specific thing, then you are indeed following a recipe. (Dictionary: recipe: a set of instructions for preparing a particular dish, including a list of the ingredients required ...... since everything require a particular set of instructions and particular set of ingredients .... every concoction has a recipe)

So? That poison is very intricate .... it is obviously going to be risk prone. So unless he wants to have something less than his desired results he better not mix up belladonna extract with Itachi's sweat.

Here you have a great literature critic failing to understand the concept of 'recipe' .... Every dish/concoction, each and everyone of them have a recipe. All of them follow a set of methods and a set of indgridients to provide a certain result, while variations leads to various degrees of deviations from the desired result. A recipe is not mystical force that makes something successful, it is the process of making something.

Yes it is a great Toxicological and Herbalism related feat. Yet this has nothing to do with your failure to understand the concept of Recipe or Procedure.

The Intel was everything because ... without Kankuro being taken back alive Sakura would not have prepared the antidote and both of them would have died quite a long ago. (Ignoring that Sakura still had to be somehow saved by Miracle jutsu)

Not to mention the antidote would have been useless if Sasori simply carried more than one kind of poison (which is a rookie mistake for an Assassin/Ninja).

You can never even get into the culinary world without knowing recipes by heart. Lol What the hell is this? Even I don't need recipes for some complicated traditional dishes and I am a far cry - a very very far cry - from being a half decent cook even. You are just arguing for the sake of it when Sasori disagreed and praised her for making one, thinking that it was an impossible feat:

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Why is it impossible? Because the recipe is so detailed and complicated that even Sasori cannot create without actually looking at the ingredients. A poison he has worked with all his life. It's so intricate - according to yours truly - but creating an antidote for that intricate poison without a recipe is not a feat? Ingrates.

No, they don't. I gave you an example of a very shitty cook who doesn't need a recipe, which would be me. Sakura prepping a recipe for it is a feat, when Sasori himself is flabbergasted that how she even managed to create one, because it's an impossible feat to even create the poison without the recipe. Guess what? The poison is that complicated to make that despite using it in every single one of his attacks, he still cannot make it without one. That should tell you where the complication of the recipe lies.

So in your view it isn't a feat to make an antidote for a poison for which the creator requires a recipe to make, when he uses it for his every single attack? Sorry, but Sasori and the manga disagree with you.

Please, open my eyes. When Sasori outright states that he's shitty when it comes to prepping something continuously without a recipe.

Those scans don't mean anything to you? Yeah, let's go by your little fanfiction on cookery that isn't even the same thing as cooking up poisons. What miracle Jutsu?

What different kind of poison, when Sasori uses only one in his entire arsenal? Lol This guy.