Was Kakashi wrong or was Kishi wrong? Or is everybody just Wrong?

[Strawberry]

Okay, when determining obito's abilities kakashi took notice of how obito's teleportation and phase abilities were the exact same thing. Just the phase ability was teleporting some parts of the body where the teleportation was the entire body. IT made total sense.

However during obito's fight with konan when the sea of paper bombs were launched at him he tries teleporting away but couldn't and instead simply started phasing to avoid the attacks for however long he could.

Now this would mean teleport and phase =/=

a phase being a single body part targeted teleport, a full body phase would mean a total body teleport.
he attempted the full body teleport before but couldnt complete it which means The two techs are not the same but kakashi proved they are the same.

These two scenarios cannot co exist so whats up.

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

 

[-immortal-]

kakashi = kishi

 

[Unbiased]

Kishimoto a good portion of the time, does not remember things he's said/written in the past.

 

[AlphaScythian]

To fully teleport Obito has to be tangible, bombs where preventing him from that so he was phasing all the time.

 

[Neonian]

It is all to confusing.


So.. herp derp

You must be registered for see images

 

[Ebisu]

Call Sir Derp Obito he can figure it out he is a Derp and Obito.​

 

[AlphaScythian]

It is all to confusing.


So.. herp derp

You must be registered for see images

Rofl. Nothing is confusing here.

While intangible obito cannot use S/T. To use S/T obito has to warp himself to kamuiland then go back to intended location.
And to warp himself obito has to be tangible. 600 billion paper bombs would hurt him if tried to warp himself so he resorted to ghost mode(intangibility)

 

[Cycoresis]

To fully teleport Obito has to be tangible, bombs where preventing him from that so he was phasing all the time.

I have something I don't understand here...so Obito fully phased on that scenario? Because surely the blast was everywhere not just on random parts of his body...2ndly when naruto hit him with a TBB he also fully phased to the other dimension and got his Mask broken by a rasengan there....he didn't wrap to avoid the TBB he phased we saw that...what I don't get is this....Is fully phasing the same as fully wrapping?

 

[xKiD SPiiD3rMaN]

Obito can stay fully phased without entering the dimension for 5 minutes before the Kamui dimension forces him back out.

He can warp himself to the dimension and stay there for as long as he wants. The warp is highlighted by the swirl pattern of Kamui.

However against Konan he couldn't warp in the dimension (swirl pattern) because to do so he has to become tangible, and the explosion would kill him.

After the 5 minute limit of his phasing ability, I assume that is where he took damage but used Izanagi to survive.

 

[scorezor]

you are the one that it's wrong here , Lol.

 

[AlphaScythian]

I have something I don't understand here...so Obito fully phased on that scenario? Because surely the blast was everywhere not just on random parts of his body...2ndly when naruto hit him with a TBB he also fully phased to the other dimension and got his Mask broken by a rasengan there....he didn't wrap to avoid the TBB he phased we saw that...what I don't get is this....Is fully phasing the same as fully wrapping?

Yes and no.

Why yes? Because in both cases his body physically in kamuiland.

Why no? Because his body is still bound to normal dimension and maintaining his body in kamuiland takes a lot of chakra from him.
In fact it consumes all his chakra or so in 5 min, which is chakra hungry technique. With normal full body warping he no longer wastes his chakra for being in kamuiland.

 

[Cycoresis]

Obito can stay fully phased without entering the dimension for 5 minutes before the Kamui dimension forces him back out.

He can warp himself to the dimension and stay there for as long as he wants. The warp is highlighted by the swirl pattern of Kamui.

However against Konan he couldn't warp in the dimension (swirl pattern) because to do so he has to become tangible, and the explosion would kill him.

After the 5 minute limit of his phasing ability, I assume that is where he took damage but used Izanagi to survive.

You are saying that Phasing is different from wrapping (swirl pattern) I don't blame you this is exactly my understanding of kamui but Kakashi clearly said it's wrong and it's one jutsu not two....that's what the OP is questioning...which analysis is right? The one that claims that Obito has one jutsu or the facts we've seen that he has phasing and wrapping? Argh it's driving me crazy :nuts: obito clearly has two jutsus here

 

[sumbul]

I cant really understand what you are saying but i think it was because he didnt had rinnegan at the time he was fighting konan but during his fight with kakashi,he had his rinnegan.Well its just a guess.

 

[xKiD SPiiD3rMaN]

You are saying that Phasing is different from wrapping (swirl pattern) I don't blame you this is exactly my understanding of kamui but Kakashi clearly said it's wrong and it's one jutsu not two....that's what the OP is questioning...which analysis is right? The one that claims that Obito has one jutsu or the facts we've seen that he has phasing and wrapping? Argh it's driving me crazy :nuts: obito clearly has two jutsus here

Kamui is one jutsu. The long ranged version, the short range version, and the phasing are all linked to the same dimension. I guess you could say that there are two different actions for accessing the dimension.

It's not two jutsu in the sense that... Kakashi was stating that they thought the phasing and warping were unrelated, but they are basically 2 sides of the same coin.

 

[AlphaScythian]

You are saying that Phasing is different from wrapping (swirl pattern) I don't blame you this is exactly my understanding of kamui but Kakashi clearly said it's wrong and it's one jutsu not two....that's what the OP is questioning...which analysis is right? The one that claims that Obito has one jutsu or the facts we've seen that he has phasing and wrapping? Argh it's driving me crazy :nuts: obito clearly has two jutsus here

In fact yes. One is more like a body projection to another dimension another is full transfer both involve kamuiland
So kakashi's statement is a bit incomplete.

 

[Cycoresis]

Yes and no.

Why yes? Because in both cases his body physically in kamuiland.

Why no? Because his body is still bound to normal dimension and maintaining his body in kamuiland takes a lot of chakra from him.
In fact it consumes all his chakra or so in 5 min, which is chakra hungry technique. With normal full body warping he no longer wastes his chakra for being in kamuiland.

So kakashi's analysis of the jutsu is wrong? It's not One jutsu? He clearly stated "we originally thought he had two jutsus, one that allows him to teleport and another that allows him to pass through objects...but it's actually one jutsu" lol dude I guess I just want someone else to say that statement made by kakashi is wrong

 

[AlphaScythian]

So kakashi's analysis of the jutsu is wrong? It's not One jutsu? He clearly stated "we originally thought he had two jutsus, one that allows him to teleport and another that allows him to pass through objects...but it's actually one jutsu" lol dude I guess I just want someone else to say that statement made by kakashi is wrong

You must be registered for see images

If you look at this scan you can find Obito channeling outer path chains while being completely intangible.
So intangibility in fact is 2 dimensional while normal kamui is one dimensional.
Obito awakened intangibility with 2T, but S/T was only available after MS got awakened.

Kakashi simply couldnt grasp the difference as he only has normal one dimensional kamui ability.
Still he is only partially wrong as intangibility does utilize kamuiland. I hope you get it now.

 

[Strawberry]

I have something I don't understand here...so Obito fully phased on that scenario? Because surely the blast was everywhere not just on random parts of his body...2ndly when naruto hit him with a TBB he also fully phased to the other dimension and got his Mask broken by a rasengan there....he didn't wrap to avoid the TBB he phased we saw that...what I don't get is this....Is fully phasing the same as fully wrapping?

exactly my whole point is that there are 2 things happening here and kakashi says they are the same and it's clearly not.


this want meant to be something to judge via logic or thinking something stated in the manga was later proven wrong.


so kakashi was wrong in his judgement or kishi forgot something.

 

[rollin]

Obito went from absorbing the paper bombs into the Kamui to phasing his own body to his Kamui dimension instead

 

[dms_kakashi]

they are same jutsu. just like kakashi. his original jutsu is for long range but could teleport himself too. and obitos main ability is switching some specific body or whole from one to next dimension without hurting himself. if kakashi tried to warp his hand only his hand would be detached but obitos wont. nd he has complete teleportation too