[VS] War arc Kankuro vs Zabuza

[EZQ]

Restrictions: Featless sasori's puppet

Knowledge: Zabuza knows he faces a master puppet, while Kankuro knows about Zabuza's reputation with silent killing

Distance: 25 m

Location: Open field, near a water source

 

[Booker]

My initial thought process was that Kankuro would just spam his puppet through the mist, keeping Zabuza on his toes. But by doing that he leaves himself completely open to being decapitated.

I say Zabuza.

 

[EZQ]

I have one good tactic for Kankuro. I'm on the fence for some argument

 

[Forbidden Technique]

You know the Sasori puppet isn't featless, right? It actually has some pretty good feats.

Zabuza is facing a very tactically inclined opponent, who was even chosen to lead the Surprise Attack Division for the SA. When the mist goes up, Kankuro can safely take shelter

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. From there, he bombards the outside with poison [

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]-[

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], which should go unnoticeable to Zabuza. Also, Kankuro was entrusted the Mother and Father puppets, so he should have access to them in battle. They can use their

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and stretch it over a long distance at an attempt to blindly take out Zabuza [

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], which is another tactic he can't trace.

Then there are other methods that I can think of to employ that wouldn't allow Zabuza to touch Kankuro before he falls into a trap, that will finish him. All in all, Kankuro is too tactically versatile for Zabuza, and won't lose this fight.

 

[EZQ]

You know the Sasori puppet isn't featless, right? It actually has some pretty good feats.

Actually i didn't know lol. I read in a thread some days ago someone saying it's featless.

What chapter did he use it so i read it?

Zabuza is facing a very tactically inclined opponent, who was even chosen to lead the Surprise Attack Division for the SA. When the mist goes up, Kankuro can safely take shelter

You must be registered for see links

. From there, he bombards the outside with poison [

You must be registered for see links

]-[

You must be registered for see links

], which should go unnoticeable to Zabuza. Also, Kankuro was entrusted the Mother and Father puppets, so he should have access to them in battle. They can use their

You must be registered for see links

and stretch it over a long distance at an attempt to blindly take out Zabuza [

You must be registered for see links

], which is another tactic he can't trace.

Then there are other methods that I can think of to employ that wouldn't allow Zabuza to touch Kankuro before he falls into a trap, that will finish him. All in all, Kankuro is too tactically versatile for Zabuza, and won't lose this fight.

I think this argument misses the point of how Kankuro would see Zabuza to land an attack. But yes i agree that he wins.

 

[BLAZE]

Actually i didn't know lol. I read in a thread some days ago someone saying it's featless.

What chapter did he use it so i read it?

464

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[EZQ]

464

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Hmm, i supposed it can do that. But did he use it in the war arc? Throwing kunais and bombs is too basic

 

[Forbidden Technique]

Actually i didn't know lol. I read in a thread some days ago someone saying it's featless.

What chapter did he use it so i read it?

He used it once here

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and read on from here

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I think this argument misses the point of how Kankuro would see Zabuza to land an attack. But yes i agree that he wins.

Uhh... No, it doesn't. Kankuro doesn't need to see Zabuza to let off poison gas. And the point of extending the wires over a large distance would be so that the chances of landing a hit on Zabuza would be greater as the puppet move around in the mist.

 

[EZQ]

He used it once here

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and read on from here

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Uhh... No, it doesn't. Kankuro doesn't need to see Zabuza to let off poison gas. And the point of extending the wires over a large distance would be so that the chances of landing a hit on Zabuza would be greater as the puppet move around in the mist.

The bold is what i meant. This is completely impossible. Zabuza can hear the puppets and the strings which would make noise. Zabuza hides in the mist, but he doesn't lose the sight from his opponents. In the hypothetical case Kankuro uses this, Zabuza simply dodges it (if Kankuro ever manages to send the puppets close to Zabuza). Not to mention, Zabuza can use a suiton to knock the puppets off.

Kankuro wins this by outlasting, or with this:

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He can purposely let Zabuza come close to him, but he'd have switched with his puppet like here

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With this, he counters any clone feint attempt from Zabuza. Then, by restraining him with the puppet, he traps him with what i already showed in the scan above. Zabuza can't tell if its Kankuro or the puppet since Kankuro does the change inside his salamander.

Zabuza can't even get close with the poison cloud, so for this battle to make some steps forward, Kankuro sets Zabuza inside this trap.

But Hiding and trying to get Zabuza out in the mist with the strings if beyond impossible, with Zabuza's speed and Kankuro left without single method to track him down, he needs Zabuza to be the one to approach.

 

[TheSages456]

Zabuza kills him. He puts up the mist and Kankuro loses him since he has no sensory abilities.
If Kankuro hides in the salamander, that reduces his mobility, so Zabuza simply uses this

Spoiler

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and destroys it.

Kankuro's puppets moving out throughout the mist make them easy targets to being one shotted by Zabuza's blade. Zabuza's senses are such that even a simple eye movement can alert him to where a target is inside the mist.
Karasu randomly firing off a poison smoke bomb wouldn't even work since it doesn't cover anywhere near the full area of the mist and Zabuza would sense the bomb being fired and the gas spreading.

 

[Icelerate]

You know the Sasori puppet isn't featless, right? It actually has some pretty good feats.

Zabuza is facing a very tactically inclined opponent, who was even chosen to lead the Surprise Attack Division for the SA. When the mist goes up, Kankuro can safely take shelter

You must be registered for see links

. From there, he bombards the outside with poison [

You must be registered for see links

]-[

You must be registered for see links

], which should go unnoticeable to Zabuza. Also, Kankuro was entrusted the Mother and Father puppets, so he should have access to them in battle. They can use their

You must be registered for see links

and stretch it over a long distance at an attempt to blindly take out Zabuza [

You must be registered for see links

], which is another tactic he can't trace.

Then there are other methods that I can think of to employ that wouldn't allow Zabuza to touch Kankuro before he falls into a trap, that will finish him. All in all, Kankuro is too tactically versatile for Zabuza, and won't lose this fight.

Can you show me where Kankuro was entrusted with Mother and Father puppets? Altogether he has seven puppets right?

 

[Forbidden Technique]

The bold is what i meant. This is completely impossible. Zabuza can hear the puppets and the strings which would make noise. Zabuza hides in the mist, but he doesn't lose the sight from his opponents. In the hypothetical case Kankuro uses this, Zabuza simply dodges it (if Kankuro ever manages to send the puppets close to Zabuza). Not to mention, Zabuza can use a suiton to knock the puppets off.

Zabuza will hear the puppets moving around, sure, but how is he going to hear and distinguish wires? That doesn't make sound once expanded. And even if he hears it, doesn't mean he can distinguish what Kankuro is doing with them based on hearing alone. Suiton isn't doing anything... Puppets can be serviceable even while broken up into pieces. Between this and poison gas, I don't see Zabuza winning.

And this is Kankuro taking an offensive approach, he can sit and play the defensive trap game too.

Kankuro wins this by outlasting, or with this:

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He can purposely let Zabuza come close to him, but he'd have switched with his puppet like here

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With this, he counters any clone feint attempt from Zabuza. Then, by restraining him with the puppet, he traps him with what i already showed in the scan above. Zabuza can't tell if its Kankuro or the puppet since Kankuro does the change inside his salamander.

Zabuza can't even get close with the poison cloud, so for this battle to make some steps forward, Kankuro sets Zabuza inside this trap.

But Hiding and trying to get Zabuza out in the mist with the strings if beyond impossible, with Zabuza's speed and Kankuro left without single method to track him down, he needs Zabuza to be the one to approach.

I thought of that, but it wouldn't work. Zabuza can track by sound, and more then likely can distinguish between the real Kankuro (heart beating) and his puppets.

Can you show me where Kankuro was entrusted with Mother and Father puppets? Altogether he has seven puppets right?

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He has shown the Sasori puppet, Salamander, Crow, 2 Black Ants, and the Mother and Father puppets should be in his possession.

 

[Zexion~]

Couldn't Kankuro just spam his explosives?

However having puppets further away from his body is terrible as Zabuza can sense them and take them down with ZERO reaction from Kankuro.

 

[TheAncientCenturion]

Zabuza has the potential to win here.

 

[EZQ]

Zabuza will hear the puppets moving around, sure, but how is he going to hear and distinguish wires? That doesn't make sound once expanded. And even if he hears it, doesn't mean he can distinguish what Kankuro is doing with them based on hearing alone. Suiton isn't doing anything... Puppets can be serviceable even while broken up into pieces. Between this and poison gas, I don't see Zabuza winning.

A wire that travels at that speed "cuts" the wind. Try hitting the air really fast with a stick or a rope and hear it, it whistles. Plus, Zabuza has no reason to get even close to the puppets to be cut. He dodges them everytime, or he makes a clone go near them and realizes what they do.

Bold 1: If he's in a tight possition, suiton would push them back, for example if Kankuro in this blind rampage does manage to put Zabuza in a tight position Zabuza just pushes them back and goes to a safe position.

Bold 2: Zabuza doesn't win i didn't say that.

And this is Kankuro taking an offensive approach, he can sit and play the defensive trap game too.

Agreed. That's my argument

I thought of that, but it wouldn't work. Zabuza can track by sound, and more then likely can distinguish between the real Kankuro (heart beating) and his puppets.

Mixed with the explosives and wire sound Zabuza won't tell. Kankuro knows about sillent killing as the OP states, so he can make noise to disturb Zabuza's hearing. His ability itself is a good counter to sillent killing since he has so many tools to make noise.

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He has shown the Sasori puppet, Salamander, Crow, 2 Black Ants, and the Mother and Father puppets should be in his possession.

After reading what you posted me, Sasori's puppet is still no very special. It could be aswell unrestricted here.

Edit: after some considerations Zabuza could win too

Edit 2: He just can't destroy the salamander

 

[Icelerate]

He has shown the Sasori puppet, Salamander, Crow, 2 Black Ants, and the Mother and Father puppets should be in his possession.

Did Sasori give them at that spot though? He said he can have them but I don't think they are in Kankuro's arsenal during the war arc. Afterwards yes.

Those two puppets would put Kankuro above Chiyo.

 

[EZQ]

Did Sasori give them at that spot though? He said he can have them but I don't think they are in Kankuro's arsenal during the war arc. Afterwards yes.

Those two puppets would put Kankuro above Chiyo.

Chiyo with her 10 white puppets is above Kankuro imo, due to the difference in skill, 10 puppets at the same time, and the databook states that each one has a special ability. But Kankuro could surpass her eventually

 

[Bad Touch Yakushi]

Sasori's fans easily blow away the mist, making Kankuro among the 5% who can dispel that insanely OP fighting style. Ninja to ninja skill-wise it's still going to be tough though. I give it to Zabuza although I think Kankuro deserves it.

 

[Forbidden Technique]

A wire that travels at that speed "cuts" the wind. Try hitting the air really fast with a stick or a rope and hear it, it whistles. Plus, Zabuza has no reason to get even close to the puppets to be cut. He dodges them everytime, or he makes a clone go near them and realizes what they do.

Bold 1: If he's in a tight possition, suiton would push them back, for example if Kankuro in this blind rampage does manage to put Zabuza in a tight position Zabuza just pushes them back and goes to a safe position.

Bold 2: Zabuza doesn't win i didn't say that.


Agreed. That's my argument



Mixed with the explosives and wire sound Zabuza won't tell. Kankuro knows about sillent killing as the OP states, so he can make noise to disturb Zabuza's hearing. His ability itself is a good counter to sillent killing since he has so many tools to make noise.



After reading what you posted me, Sasori's puppet is still no very special. It could be aswell unrestricted here.

Edit: after some considerations Zabuza could win too

Edit 2: He just can't destroy the salamander

So, Zabuza will be able to hear and distinguish the wires moving among everything else, but he wouldn't be able to do so to distinguish Kankuro with his puppets? You're not making sense. If anything, what should be easily distinguishable by sound for Zabuza is the sound that a human body makes, not wires moving through the air. If your argument is that noise from other occurrences will impair Zabuza's sound sensing, then the same should apply with the wires. And I don't think you understand what I'm saying.

Here's an attempt at drawing out the tactic.
x = Mother and Father Puppets
- = wires

x------------------------------------------------------------x

I'm saying the puppets lengthen the cables as long as they possibly can, and move around the mist like above, sweeping whatever is in between. Zabuza can very well avoid the puppets as you stated, but that doesn't mean he'd be clear from the cables. This, in addition to poison gas bombs, and explosive bombs, which will also help dissipate the mist (if you're unrestricting the Sasori puppet), is eventually going to catch Zabuza.

Did Sasori give them at that spot though? He said he can have them but I don't think they are in Kankuro's arsenal during the war arc. Afterwards yes.

Those two puppets would put Kankuro above Chiyo.

Sasori obviously wasn't in possession of the puppets at that time. Kankuro would of had to come across them when he retrieved Sasori's puppet body. So it's a possibility that they were already in Kankuros possession already. All Sasori did was entrust them to him. Speculation, but I don't see a reason why Kankuro shouldn't have access to them.

It was said that Kankuro's puppet mastery skills surpassed Sasori's, so it's plausible.

 

[EZQ]

So, Zabuza will be able to hear and distinguish the wires moving among everything else, but he wouldn't be able to do so to distinguish Kankuro with his puppets? You're not making sense. If anything, what should be easily distinguishable by sound for Zabuza is the sound that a human body makes, not wires moving through the air. If your argument is that noise from other occurrences will impair Zabuza's sound sensing, then the same should apply with the wires. And I don't think you understand what I'm saying.

Breathing and human noises <<<<<<<<<<< a wire travelling at high speed. Why are you even comparing these two noises? Zabuza doesn't need to recognize it's a wire, he only needs to tell there's something incoming. Not to mention that Zabuza doesn't need to put up v2 mist here, he uses v1. With v1 up,when the wire is close, its completely visible, since with v1 up everyone could see everyone when they were close. Zabuza can react and dodge the wire, or block it with his sword. And i know what you meant with the x----x but first of all

1- How long is that wire? The furthest Zabuza is from Kankuro, the longest the wire has to bee to actually have hope to land a hit.
2- Zabuza hears the wire (because it's a strong noise, not a human noise that needs to be heard from close), he also can see it when it's close enough, then he dodges
3- Kankuro can't see his puppets either, so if Zabuza manages to break one of them (slice the part where the wire is connected) then this tactic becomes futile. Kankuro can't make them dodge or anything. Zabuza desestabilizes them with a suiton and cuts away the wire.


The external sound bothering Zabuza's senses would bother Kankuro's human noises because they are too low, but a wire coming at him is a lot stronger, and Zabuza doesn't even need to distinguish it as a wire, he only needs to identify something is coming... since he can also see the wire as i also adressed.

Here's an attempt at drawing out the tactic.
x = Mother and Father Puppets
- = wires

x------------------------------------------------------------x

I'm saying the puppets lengthen the cables as long as they possibly can, and move around the mist like above, sweeping whatever is in between. Zabuza can very well avoid the puppets as you stated, but that doesn't mean he'd be clear from the cables. This, in addition to poison gas bombs, and explosive bombs, which will also help dissipate the mist (if you're unrestricting the Sasori puppet), is eventually going to catch Zabuza.

Agreed on the poison gas bombs being the most dangerous. Kankuro can sorround himself with them to avoid Zabuza getting closer. But that only makes the battle longer, Kankuro needs Zabuza to come close.

Dispersing the mist is not a good tactic since Zabuza simply puts up more. His feats on this category are amazing.