Wait people do realize that Obito's Kamui is the weakest S/T Tech right?

[NarutoX28]

I don't think it's a noob jutsu. I'm just comparing it to the other space time tech's. In terms of execution which Minato was talking about Kamui > FTG but over all FTG > Kamui which is why Minato trashed Obito. As I said it may be good for some aspects but for others no. Konana's paper bombs would never work for FTG, the user could escape that while Kamui users can't. IT varies depending on the situation but as for over all it's at the bottom of the pile

I don't understand. If it has superior execution and provides the user with defensive capabilities ever seen, then it would suggest that Kamui was superior to FTG. There's really no other way to interpret Minato's statement. Why Minato won was because he had an elaborate strategy that took advantage of Obito's carelessness and eagerness to finish the fight in a hurry, not because FTG is flat-out better.

What's been elaborated on throughout the manga is that a tool is only as good as its user. Kamui is a better tool, but Minato was the superior fighter which was why he managed to win even with FTG.

FTG requires more time and precision to execute properly whereas Kamui doesn't necessarily require that. Obito simply exploits openings and prepares to tag and bag as he did against KCM Naruto with practically no effort at all. With minimal knowledge, Kamui is clearly better. He nearly warped away Minato and would've, hadn't Obito given Minato ample time to regain composure and process what had actually happened.

 

[ComplexCity]

Grasping as straws again. That whole only kamui can counter kamui was made redudnant when FTG
countered Kamui. It only works if the statement hasn't been contradicted :lol

Kakashi never used Kamui on Minato. I'm just using your logic and going by what the databook said though

You mean that KidGamer guy? He didn't destroy anything

I beg to differ

and I'm sure he would try to deny Manga and Databook fact that Yata can block any attack because he doesn't want to belive the author can make a shiled is his own story

But I just posted a scan 4 times with the author saying that he couldn't escape the dimensions and you're deny it

thats capable of doing that because he needs facts which is retarded and no surprise you think the same thing

You sound like this guy in my sig who can't deal with facts, so it's just apparent that you don't know how to debate

Again the scan says "Nothing I do works" How do you know what sasuke tried from what he didnt? Oh wait you don't cuz all you're doing is assuming and no he wasn't given enough time or did you forget Sasuke was decleared a GENIUS from the very beginning of the Manga.

Because he said nothing

 

[BenjerminGaye]

It's the best. There's literally only 1 technique in the series that can completely nullify Obito's kamui, and that's Konan's 600 Billion paper bombs. The only one. It's the perfect defense. Period.

And thats only when he/kakashi is limited to 1 eye.


Double kamui is broken tier.

 

[Styles]

Not to sound like a douche, but you aren't making much sense and seems like you're downplaying

How am I downplaying? And how does it not make sense?

 

[shelke]

I don't understand. If it has superior execution and provides the user with defensive capabilities ever seen, then it would suggest that Kamui was superior to FTG. There's really no other way to interpret Minato's statement. Why Minato won was because he had an elaborate strategy that took advantage of Obito's carelessness and eagerness to finish the fight in a hurry, not because FTG is flat-out better.

What's been elaborated on throughout the manga is that a tool is only as good as its user. Kamui is a better tool, but Minato was the superior fighter which was why he managed to win even with FTG.

FTG requires more time and precision to execute properly whereas Kamui doesn't necessarily require that. Obito simply exploits openings and prepares to tag and bag as he did against KCM Naruto with practically no effort at all. With minimal knowledge, Kamui is clearly better. He nearly warped away Minato and would've, hadn't Obito given Minato ample time to regain composure and process what had actually happened.

He won because Sharingan cannot see behind the head. Without a visual feedback, it failed to turn on Intangibility. Minato had zero intel on this. He got lucky.

 

[Blackzoro]

True, but it's weakness compared to other S/T like FTG is that it isn't Instant, and you are vulnerable when attacking because you have to disable intangibility. And it only last 5 minutes if I remember correctly.

While Kamui may be the strongest S/T, it loses viability compared to other S/T because of its weakness.

Bruh Teleportation is instant no matter which one it is just cuz it's not as flashy like the others doesn't mean it's slow eyes can be deceiving

 

[NarutoX28]

He won because Sharingan cannot see behind the head. Without a visual feedback, it failed to turn on Intangibility. Minato had zero intel on this. He got lucky.

He left his blind-spot unguarded because his carelessness and eagerness to finish the fight quickly clouded his judgement. Had he been focused on the Kunai and hadn't underestimated Minato, then he would've processed much more other than: "Minato disappeared."

These circumstances certainly made the fight much easier for Minato, but I disagree with the fact that it was just luck. He took advantage of Obito's behavior and lack of intel and simply used it against him. Obito allowed Minato to work out his jutsu while Obito himself didn't gather enough intel on Minato's jutsu. It was his own fault that he kept utilizing the same strategy while Minato took advantage of that and decided to attack from an area he didn't take account for.

 

[Jiren]

They all have ups and downs kamui is haxed just like ameno and ftg

 

[ComplexCity]

He won because Sharingan cannot see behind the head. Without a visual feedback, it failed to turn on Intangibility. Minato had zero intel on this. He got lucky.

Tempted to sig this dogs***t

 

[Xavionl]

Yeah but that was already made redundant because he has to phase back to land an attack.

except that its not redundant because 1) every jutsu has a counter and 2) its still one of the most op defensive/dodging tactics in the entire narutoverse

 

[shelke]

He left his blind-spot unguarded because his carelessness and eagerness to finish the fight quickly clouded his judgement. Had he been focused on the Kunai and hadn't underestimated Minato, then he would've processed much more other than: "Minato disappeared."

These circumstances certainly made the fight much easier for Minato, but I disagree with the fact that it was just luck. He took advantage of Obito's behavior and lack of intel and simply used it against him. Obito allowed Minato to work out his jutsu while Obito himself didn't gather enough intel on Minato's jutsu. It was his own fault that he kept utilizing the same strategy while Minato took advantage of that and decided to attack from an area he didn't take account for.

It was luck because Minato doesn't know that Obito's Mangekyou Sharingan activates Intangibility "automatically" after the visual feedback. It works on an unconscious level, Obito doesn't even have to ecknowledge; the Sharingan works for him.

This is the part of the technique Minato had no idea about, which means, it never factored in into his stratagy. Which is why he got lucky on this front.

 

[NarutoX28]

It was luck because Minato doesn't know that Obito's Mangekyou Sharingan activates Intangibility "automatically" after the visual feedback. It works on an unconscious level, Obito doesn't even have to ecknowledge; the Sharingan works for him.

This is the part of the technique Minato had no idea about, which means, it never factored in into his stratagy. Which is why he got lucky on this front.

This is irrelevant because Minato's analysis of it revolved around how Obito used Kamui as he was aware that Obito always solidified to counter-attack. Because of that, Minato took advantage of Obito's behavior and lack of knowledge on Hiraishin and waited for the moment where Obito made his counter-attack to initiate Hiraishin at the very last minute to take the rear. It required clever planning and precision to identify when Obito was going to solidify to attack.

 

[shelke]

This is irrelevant because Minato's analysis of it revolved around how Obito used Kamui as he was aware that Obito always solidified to counter-attack. Because of that, Minato took advantage of Obito's behavior and lack of knowledge on Hiraishin and waited for the moment where Obito made his counter-attack to initiate Hiraishin at the very last minute to take the rear. It required clever planning and precision to do what he did.

How is it irrelevant? As he attacked simply on the factor that he has to "materialize" to win, and had he done so from the front, he would have been easily bested. Minato went at Obito by thinking that the one with the "quickest draw" wins, when it isn't a sound strategy to beat Obito.

His Intangibility analyses was also half-baked and poor. Sakura, Fuu and Torune made far better strategies, as they got the "automatic" factor somewhat right.

 

[Konoha Orange Spark]

you are never safe from kamui. tell me how could using Ameno land a hit on obito. using other dimensions is far greater since it can catch you off guard technically ANYTIME ANYWHERE within SIGHT. this is one crazy doujutsu we are talking about here.

 

[NarutoX28]

How is it irrelevant? As he attacked simply on the factor that he has to "materialize" to win, and had he done so from the front, he would have been easily bested. Minato went at Obito by thinking that the one with the "quickest draw" wins, when it isn't a sound strategy to beat Obito.

It's irrelevant because Minato doesn't even have to be aware that his intangibility is instantaneous to understand that counter-attacking when Obito attempts to strike is the best strategy. It's not just that, it's the fact that he analyzed exactly how Obito fought, took into account of his behavior, and required such great precision not only to react to his attack at the last minute, but also properly time when he threw his kunai as well. It wasn't as simple as being the faster fighter at all. There was was a lot of analysis and calculation involved as well.

His Intangibility analyses was also half-baked and poor. Sakura, Fuu and Torune made far better strategies, as they got the "automatic" factor somewhat right.

They never did (Sakura might have) and regardless, Torune and Fuu's strategy was downright retarded.

Shikamaru told Tayuya that it was the simplest of all basic strategies:

You must be registered for see images

What Torune and Fuu did was exactly as Shikamaru said. Their first-hand was a feint and they attempted to connect with the second strike with no sort of precise timing or clever planning at all. Obito saw through it because it was a simplistic and retarded strategy, especially when they were simply running into Obito like lunatics.

What's ironic is Obito utilized their exact same strategy on Fuu where him simply kicking his Zetsu arm was a feint and counter-attacked and effortlessly warped his ass immediately afterwards. Torune and Fuu were downright retarded for thinking the best way to defeat an S/T Ninjutsu that surpassed Hiraishin was to use the most simplistic strategy ever.

 

[BenjerminGaye]

It's irrelevant because Minato doesn't even have to be aware that his intangibility is instantaneous to understand that counter-attacking when Obito attempts to strike is the best strategy. It's not just that, it's the fact that he analyzed exactly how Obito fought, took into account of his behavior, and required such great precision not only to react to his attack at the last minute, but also properly time when he threw his kunai as well. It wasn't as simple as being the faster fighter at all. There was was a lot of analysis and calculation involved as well.



They never did (Sakura might have) and regardless, Torune and Fuu's strategy was downright retarded.

Shikamaru told Tayuya that it was the simplest of all basic strategies:

You must be registered for see images

What Torune and Fuu did was exactly as Shikamaru said. Their first-hand was a feint and they attempted to connect with the second strike with no sort of precise timing or clever planning at all. Obito saw through it because it was a simplistic and retarded strategy, especially when they were simply running into Obito like lunatics.

What's ironic is Obito utilized their exact same strategy on Fuu where him simply kicking his Zetsu arm was a feint and counter-attacked and effortlessly warped his ass immediately afterwards. Torune and Fuu were downright retarded for thinking the best way to defeat an S/T Ninjutsu that surpassed Hiraishin was to use the most simplistic strategy ever.

sakura came up with the same strat they came up with

 

[shelke]

It's irrelevant because Minato doesn't even have to be aware that his intangibility is instantaneous to understand that counter-attacking when Obito attempts to strike is the best strategy. It's not just that, it's the fact that he analyzed exactly how Obito fought, took into account of his behavior, and required such great precision not only to react to his attack at the last minute, but also properly time when he threw his kunai as well. It wasn't as simple as being the faster fighter at all. There was was a lot of analysis and calculation involved as well.

His strategy was based on "who has the quickest draw!"

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

This is (nearly) the complete one:

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

So, he had no clue that Obito could teleport individual parts of his body as well? Had he attacked from the front with the same poor strategy, his attack would have gone completely through. He would have met a terrible failure. What kind of earth-shattering strategy did he make that didn't even take the "teleport a body part" into the equation?

They never did (Sakura might have) and regardless, Torune and Fuu's strategy was downright retarded.

Shikamaru told Tayuya that it was the simplest of all basic strategies:

What Torune and Fuu did was exactly as Shikamaru said. Their first-hand was a feint and they attempted to connect with the second strike with no sort of precise timing or clever planning at all. Obito saw through it because it was a simplistic and retarded strategy, especially when they were simply running into Obito like lunatics.

What's ironic is Obito utilized their exact same strategy on Fuu where him simply kicking his Zetsu arm was a feint and counter-attacked and effortlessly warped his ass immediately afterwards. Torune and Fuu were downright retarded for thinking the best way to defeat an S/T Ninjutsu that surpassed Hiraishin was to use the most simplistic strategy ever.

Their abilities were ill-suited to fight him. They are also a lot slower. Their strategy wasn't incorrect at all, as they were aware, just like Sakura, that Obito can teleport parts of himself as well (they devised the trap because of it, despite not stating it). Their strategy, in fact, wasn't that different from Minato's as it relied on Timing, Speed and counter attack as well. However, one is retarded but the other isn't?

Spoiler

You must be registered for see images

Minato's stratagy was far from smooth and kink free. It worked in his favour as he wasn't aware of visual feedback aspect and teleported behind him. It was even simpler than Fuu's and Torune's as they chose to utlize body transfer and posion as well to get a full grasp of things.

 

[NarutoX28]

sakura came up with the same strat they came up with

She only obtained an analysis of how Obito's Kamui worked, she never devised a strategy in order to counter it.

 

[ComplexCity]

Why is this debate still going on? People always trying to downplay chars

 

[NarutoX28]

Why is this debate still going on? People always trying to downplay chars

I'll form a rebuttal later. I don't view Minato as highly as a lot of the fan-base, but I still give credit when it's due.