Tobirama's FTG vs. Minato's FTG

[Dissonant Values]

So I understand that this is a hot-topic among the base because we know so little about Tobirama's FTG...

However I want to put forth an idea that might be considered radical, even blasphemous. I think we might be able to assume that Tobirama had a superior FTG to Minato's in the sense that he DID NOT require seals to teleport to.

If we look at 624, Tobirama uses the FTG Slash.

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Obviously this is a Space-Time Ninjutsu, but also a Kenjutsu. My theory is, requiring Tobirama to "mark" the opponent like Minato would strip a Kenjutsu of it's effectiveness. This isn't a Body Flicker Technique like Sasuke used against Naruto.

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Rather this is a teleportation jutsu that utilizes speed to overcome the enemy so as to deliver a swift strike. Marking the opponent beforehand would be a waste that could otherwise be used to strike.

Now I know people may ask, "Well why was Minato the 'Yellow Flash'." My answer to that would be, his unpredictability and ability to hit *Multiple* targets in an almost instantaneous manner.

 

[Sefirosu Masamune]

But what about the seals ability to create a space time barrier? 0.0 sounds like S/T to jutsu me

 

[accept pain]

i dont have knowledge abbout FTG,and i dont think tobirama has FTG

 

[Craigeh]

Isn't the multiple targets superior then??

 

[Dissonant Values]

But what about the seals ability to create a space time barrier? 0.0 sounds like S/T to jutsu me

I think Kishi is retconning the FTG. Don't forget, all a Space-Time Ninjutsu does is manipulate the flow of time. In a sense FTG is a glorified Body Flicker that allows the caster to distort the flow of time around him so he appears to be moving at light speed. Minato it seems incorporated Fuinjutsu into the FTG as seen in his kunai and then the Space-Time Barrier.

i dont have knowledge abbout FTG,and i dont think tobirama has FTG

We have two instances of Canon proof that Tobirama has FTG...

Isn't the multiple targets superior then??

Overall, yes Minato's FTG is superior if this is the case: that Tobirama doesn't require seals.

It restricts Tobirama, but in one on one instances it gives him an advantage.

EG: He doesn't need to throw the kunai or mark the opponent before catching him off guard.

 

[Sefirosu Masamune]

I think Kishi is retconning the FTG. Don't forget, all a Space-Time Ninjutsu does is manipulate the flow of time. In a sense FTG is a glorified Body Flicker that allows the caster to distort the flow of time around him so he appears to be moving at light speed. Minato it seems incorporated Fuinjutsu into the FTG as seen in his kunai and then the Space-Time Barrier.

Ok well why would that not be the same logic when he uses FTG?.If he can make a S/T barrier to move other object, why not us the same methods to move yourself. FTG is teleportation and Body flicker is movement. Teleportation is instant. this is why he can do this in mid air. you cannot body flicker to 3 different point in mid air. its not possible. physics will not allow it because you need something to push off of to gain energy. FTG can do that and do it instantaneously.

 

[Crow Zero]

But even if tobirama didnt need seal i dont think he can finish 50 people in an instance like minato did.

 

[GucciSinclair]

the reason Tobirama didn't have a nickname that goes with his speed only means he was known for more than just speed, he's famous for his Water release (according to ANBU member) and Edo Tensei(according to Chiyo and Muu), he's shown to be a great sensor and even Minato praised Tobirama's S/T skills, I don't think something like "the White Flash" is a nickname that can describe Tobirama's true skills properly.

Minato and Tobirama's S/T are the same level, jus used differently with different strengths

 

[Dissonant Values]

Ok well why would that not be the same logic when he uses FTG?.If he can make a S/T barrier to move other object, why not us the same methods to move yourself. FTG is teleportation and Body flicker is movement. Teleportation is instant. this is why he can do this in mid air. you cannot body flicker to 3 different point in mid air. its not possible. physics will not allow it because you need something to push off of to gain energy. FTG can do that and do it instantaneously.

Because Minato isn't using the barrier to move himself. He's able to move objects because they're coming into contact with the seal on his kunai. It's a barrier ninjutsu that allows the FTG to be passed on to the object that comes in contact with it. The FTG itself doesn't require the use of seals, rather it's improved and varied with a seals use. That's also why Minato had to direct the Tailed Beast Bomb when he used the Space-Time Barrier. Imagine a third person FTG.

 

[GwemBaba]

<div class="bbWrapper">Nice effort!</div>

 

[Dissonant Values]

i think minato's jutsu is the fodder one??

i mean itachi can 1 shot him via tsukoyomi

minato the original copy ninja

LOL XD

Tobirama one shotted Izuna using FTG...Izuna is a strong candidate for being stronger than Itachi since he was Madara's blood brother.

Following that logic since Minato's FTG is more varied than Tobirama's he could take down Itachi. Let's not forget Minato took on Obito, without ever looking him in the eyes.

 

[Sefirosu Masamune]

Because Minato isn't using the barrier to move himself. He's able to move objects because they're coming into contact with the seal on his kunai. It's a barrier ninjutsu that allows the FTG to be passed on to the object that comes in contact with it. The FTG itself doesn't require the use of seals, rather it's improved and varied with a seals use. That's also why Minato had to direct the Tailed Beast Bomb when he used the Space-Time Barrier. Imagine a third person FTG.

Well its teleporting so its S/T jutsu dude. if it were speed like body flicker than one would need to simply counter is intercept his linear path to the kunai. If this was the case he could not go places he marked that had a closed or locked door without smashing through the wall

 

[Dissonant Values]

Well its teleporting so its S/T jutsu dude. if it were speed like body flicker than one would need to simply counter is intercept his linear path to the kunai. If this was the case he could not go places he marked that had a closed or locked door without smashing through the wall

I'm not debating whether it's a "Space-Time" Ninjutsu. You're misunderstanding the difference between Space-Time Ninjutsu and a "Space-Time Barrier." They're two separate things. Kind of like how "All squares are rectangles but not all rectangles are squares."

The "Space-Time Barrier" is a separate technique derived from the FTG that incorporates Fuinjutsu.

 

[GucciSinclair]

Tobirama one shotted Izuna using FTG...Izuna is a strong candidate for being stronger than Itachi since he was Madara's blood brother.

Following that logic since Minato's FTG is more varied than Tobirama's he could take down Itachi. Let's not forget Minato took on Obito, without ever looking him in the eyes.

no Tobirama did not one shot Izuna, they've been battling for a while and many many times before that before Tobirama finally landed a proper hit. if we assume Tobirama did not use a tag on Izuna's body, then he did something Minato cannot do, if we assume Tobirama already placed a tag on Izuna's body, then elite taijutsu+intelligence is required for someone to place the tag on a MS user, it's a lot more than Hiraishin alone.

Itachi is actually a bad match up for Minato, since he is one of the most observant ninja as well as one of the best Kunai user in the manga, which are two of the best methods to counter Hiraishin.

plus Minato did look at Obito in the eye, before he teleported and after Obito became tangible.

 

[Craigeh]

i think minato's jutsu is the fodder one??

i mean itachi can 1 shot him via tsukoyomi

minato the original copy ninja

LOL XD

Didn't your thread get deleted?? Stop bringing it up...

 

[SeriousDogg]

Minato is the Master of Hiraishin.

 

[Kurama2012]

i think its to early to judge tobiramas ftg as we have only seen it once but for now i believe he can only do it in a linear movement and hopefully kishi will explain the workings of both ftg

minato may be able to ftg without seals but he may not know where to go as the seals may act as a guide post for him as i think travelling at that speed could distort one perception

also what makes me think theirs more to it then the seals is that minato never seems to retrieve his kunais back which you think he would as enemy ninja must have at some point experimented on the seal to learn how it works so the mark may just be a guide post so minato knows where to go
also what could support my theory that minato can do the similar ftg to tobirama is when he caught baby naruto and i know that could have been minatos base speed but what if that was minato ftging with out seals like tobirama and because naruto was in plain sight seals wearnt entirely needed
i believe the seals are used for more precise movement like when he used it against tobi when he throw it through his head it allowed him to time it just right

tobirama has shown that he may ftg without seals but we dont know what he needs for it also what you should keep in mind is that minato said that tobis s/t exceeded that of his and the 2nds so that means the 2nd was limeted in what he could do so from this if i was to give tobiramas ftg a limet it must be that it moves in a linear path and he cant just ftg around the battle field like minato who usies the marks

 

[Yellow Spark]

Minato use FTG lvl 2 against tobi... That shows that minato is better... And not only that minato's reflexes are the best in naruto series...

 

[Kurama2012]

minato has been successfully dehyped. right its even debatable whos stronger between orochimaru and minato

has no original techs and is outclassed by quite a few people (hashirama, tobirama, sasuke, itachi, naruto, nagato etc)


minato fans are so butthurt that they are trying make tobirama look bad. too bad it wont work, its clear to everyone that tobirama >>> minato


and to end this post i leave u with a quote

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"i completely fell short of all expectations"-minato namikaze

DEAL WITH IT hahah

how is it clear tobirama>minato thats just your assumption as tobiramas getting screen time and all people are doing is jumping on the tobirama band wagon and cant think clear just because tobirama may have a better ftg than minato doesnt mean he will win as im not sure who would win as there isnt to much to go off also if tobiramas ftg is so superior why is obitos superior to both of theres huh everyones seems so sure that tobirama can just blitz with ftg with out seals or marks

so if tobirama can ftg with out seals why is obitos kamui superior as you would think to ftg without seals would make tobirama one of the most op characters in the series so with this it tells me that tobirama has limits with his ftg and this may be the reason minato came up with the seals so he could ftg in any direction

and there are many ninja you have listed who dont have original techs

naruto the only original tech he has raesenshuriken and rasengan variations

sasuke i belive his only original tech is the chidori variations

nagatos are rinnegan techs which are orginaly madaras so please tell me an original tech that he possess

in the end of the day it doesnt matter if the techs are original or not its how they are used

 

[Arugon]

Ok, that is a terrible translation. Tobirama's technique is called Hiraishin, not FTG. Also FTG is a perfected version of Hiraishin.