Tobirama and Edo Tobirama vs Hashirama/EMS Madara

[Apêx1]

Well.. Wouldn't

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practically be considered a fight ender. It's not sealing but it's immobilising him and making him unable to move for eternity, gives the fück up, goes to sleep.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Tobiramas takes this. Hashi and Maddy have no sealing techs and since they are alive they'll run out of chakra eventually. Gojo kibakufuda is really op too.

Why would they worry about sealing techs?

Well.. Wouldn't

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practically be considered a fight ender. It's not sealing but it's immobilising him and making him unable to move for eternity, gives the fück up, goes to sleep.

True. But once again why should they be worry about sealing? Maybe I should break up the sentence again. Here:

Hashirama or Madara just needs to defeat alive Tobirama in order to win.

 

[Minato namikaze123]

Madara n hashirama stomps...!!!

 

[AGoodBoy]

At best it is as powerful as 1 or 2 tbb even that is an exaggeration, he is not busting budha summon nor PS plus kyuubi with that. The firepower will be too much for him to escape.

Well.. Wouldn't

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practically be considered a fight ender. It's not sealing but it's immobilising him and making him unable to move for eternity, gives the fück up, goes to sleep.

Edo tobirama is immortal, has unlimited chakra, and has ftg... Neither of those 2 can outlast him or pin him down. The only thing alivee tobirama needs to do in this fight is survive and let edo tobirama FTG->Kibaku fuda over and over. Alive tobirama simply makes 2 kage bushin and run them off as far as possible. The second he's in danger, he ftgs around the place to a kunai, a kage bushin, etc. MAdara/Hashirama won't ccatch him because of ftg+sensing, and they won't pin him down due to FTG. In the rare instance they destroy all of alive tobirama's bushin and seals, he still has edo tobirama, who can never be defeated, to teleport to as a last ditch effort.

Buddha/PS don't need to be destroyed. They just need to be thrashed enough times so that madara/hashirama waste chakra keeping them up. They'll very quickly exhaust themselves... assuming the KF didn't already bring those jutsu down with the constant explosions. Considering it's edo tobirama, and not some random fodder, who's using KF, it will be that much harder for either of those two to sstop KF from launching.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Considering it's edo tobirama, and not some random fodder, who's using KF, it will be that much harder for either of those two to sstop KF from launching.

Keep in mind that fodder edo can still switch around with Edo Tobirama, making it easier, since if Edo Tobirama does it, he will be out of commission for a while. And his teamwork plays a vital role.

 

[Koro]

Team 2 ransacks.

 

[Oblivionx]

Tobirama wins against both... there is no way to pin down a ftg user.... Most of attacks from both hashirama and madara will be avoided via ftg or shunshin... Even only alive tobirama will give a good fight and now that we have two tobiramas, nor hashirama neither madara has any chance.... with edo tensei and superior speed both will be tagged eventually and then it'll be over.... as to avoid tagging hashirama has to keep his SM up and madara has to keep his susano up... both are not long lasting techs....
and lol @ people saying an ftg user can't get out of range of hashirama or madara's attacks... heck then who can... XD
also proved by manga the only people who could avoid obito's onslaught (who is stronger than both hashirama and madara) were tobirama and minato.... getting away from attack is no problem for ftg users...

i'll be generous and still say tobirama wins high diff....

 

[ARGUS]

Tobirama wins against both... there is no way to pin down a ftg user....

Yes there is,,,, Madara pinned down Tobirama in canon,,,,

Most of attacks from both hashirama and madara will be avoided via ftg or shunshin...

No,,, not when Hashirama and Madara have attacks with an AOE that easily bypasses the limits of FTG

Even only alive tobirama will give a good fight and now that we have two tobiramas, nor hashirama neither madara has any chance.... with edo tensei and superior speed both will be tagged eventually and then it'll be over.... as to avoid tagging hashirama has to keep his SM up and madara has to keep his susano up... both are not long lasting techs....

To avoid tagging madara and hashirama can use their PS and SS respectively,,, both of them would annihilate tobirama if he attempts to shorten the distance between the two,,,,,,,
@Bold - where did u get that,,,,
they dont need to use these techniques for a long time,, seeing that it wont take much efforts to take tobirama down

and lol @ people saying an ftg user can't get out of range of hashirama or madara's attacks... heck then who can... XD

Lol @you claiming that an FTG user is invincible when the manga has clearly portrayed madara and hashirama to be leagues above any other ninja bar juubi jins and sages family
The fact that the AOE of Both the users attacks ranges for over kilometres is why tobirama simply cant escape their attacks,,,, without any prep markings before the battle

also proved by manga the only people who could avoid obito's onslaught (who is stronger than both hashirama and madara) were tobirama and minato.... getting away from attack is no problem for ftg users...

Juubito never attempted to use any larger scale AOE techs to counter their FTG,,, not only that but the FTG users by themselves would get buttraped by juubito,, so i dont see what point u are tying to make
-running away and defeaating someone are 2 different things

i'll be generous and still say tobirama wins high diff....

u are not being generous,, you are being stupid,,,

 

[Son Wukong]

Madara and Hashirama Destroyers!!

 

[Oblivionx]

Yes there is,,,, Madara pinned down Tobirama in canon,,,,

lol i didn't know we were talking about rinnegan madara because EMS madara doesn't have black rods... and what about hashirama??

No,,, not when Hashirama and Madara have attacks with an AOE that easily bypasses the limits of FTG

jin obito had attacks much stronger and of wider range than both madara and hashirama and still couldn't bypass ftg's limits... where did you even get that...

To avoid tagging madara and hashirama can use their PS and SS respectively,,, both of them would annihilate tobirama if he attempts to shorten the distance between the two,,,,,,,

yeah and i did say PS is only way to avoid tag but it won't last against edo tensei tobirama... and how does SS protect hashirama from tagging?? SS didn't even hit madara... it only hit giant kyubi... and you are saying it can hit tobirama with ftg... wow...

@Bold - where did u get that,,,,
they dont need to use these techniques for a long time,, seeing that it wont take much efforts to take tobirama down

huh! when we both know that tobirama is edo and neither hashirama nor madara has any sealing techs... i won't bother to explain how tobirama fights because they simply can't kill or seal edo tobirama...

Lol @you claiming that an FTG user is invincible when the manga has clearly portrayed madara and hashirama to be leagues above any other ninja bar juubi jins and sages family

i never stated ftg users are invincible... where did that even come from?? and i'm not denying their power that's why i know that alive tobirama loses to madara or hashirama.... i'm simply not underestimating speed and overestimating power like you are... manga stated that tobirama was fastest of his time and madara admitted there wasn't much of a difference in their skills and tobirama was confident of killing madara.... stop with this BS....

The fact that the AOE of Both the users attacks ranges for over kilometres is why tobirama simply cant escape their attacks,,,, without any prep markings before the battle
Juubito never attempted to use any larger scale AOE techs to counter their FTG,,, not only that but the FTG users by themselves would get buttraped by juubito,, so i dont see what point u are tying to make
-running away and defeaating someone are 2 different things

lol you do know in this match up alive tobirama is sipping tea far away and can mark any location... and dude obito put up a barrier so that ftg users won't get anyone else out of range of his attack... and ftg users were the only ones to hold their ground against jubito... you say avoiding an attack is running away.. lol that's what speed is for... you can cover large distances so why stand there and tank shit... also ftg users when on defensive were hit only once by jubito, that was tobirama who actually not only marked jubito but used his strongest tech on him as well... while hashirama didn't even know what happened... other times they were hit when they were on offense... and both jubi's jin had higher reactions and speed than them... thus proving that you can overcome speed only with more speed or better reactions... and only SM hashirama has better reactions in this match up than tobirama...

u are not being generous,, you are being stupid,,,

you are not that bright yourself, are you.. considering you didn't counter shit and think of yourself like you actually proved me wrong...! damn kids these days...

 

[ARGUS]

lol i didn't know we were talking about rinnegan madara because EMS madara doesn't have black rods... and what about hashirama??

That example was only used to tell u that FTG user can still be pinned down

jin obito had attacks much stronger and of wider range than both madara and hashirama and still couldn't bypass ftg's limits... where did you even get that...

His attacks were stronger but he didnt really use any long range attacks,,, instead he attempted to attack them head on,,, not only that but the FTG users attacked as backup to Naruto and Sasuke

yeah and i did say PS is only way to avoid tag but it won't last against edo tensei tobirama... and how does SS protect hashirama from tagging?? SS didn't even hit madara... it only hit giant kyubi... and you are saying it can hit tobirama with ftg... wow...

SS busted PS with only one chojo kobetsu,, despite the attack being hit by 11 PS-infused TBB,,,,
and how is PS the only way to avoid tagging,,, Madaras V3 legged alone has more than enough durability to tank most of Tobiramas attacks,, so does hashiramas mokujin (which absorbs chakra),,,
-SS didnt hit madara because he was camped inside PS,,, it still destroyed PS and restrained kurama completely,,,
Both of these constructs would hit tobirama if he's within their range of attack,,,,

huh! when we both know that tobirama is edo and neither hashirama nor madara has any sealing techs... i won't bother to explain how tobirama fights because they simply can't kill or seal edo tobirama...

Sealing techs are the only reason why they cant win,, if howwever they are granted sealing techs,, madara or hashriama can beat tobirama rather comfortably,,,,,,

i never stated ftg users are invincible... where did that even come from?? and i'm not denying their power that's why i know that alive tobirama loses to madara or hashirama.... i'm simply not underestimating speed and overestimating power like you are... manga stated that tobirama was fastest of his time and madara admitted there wasn't much of a difference in their skills and tobirama was confident of killing madara.... stop with this BS....

We are looking at feats here,,, Tobirama was also confident of killing madara when he had the real rinnegan,,,
Gokage were also confident that they coulld edo madara,, yet it didnt happen did it,,,
jiraiya was also confident he could kill pein,,, yet he couldnt,,,,

im not overrating power,, neither am i underrating speed,,,, the fact is that the best tobirama can do is run away as he simply cant bust through PS and SS nor can he afford to get hit by these constructs even once,,,,

and only SM hashirama has better reactions in this match up than tobirama...

Yes,

you are not that bright yourself, are you.. considering you didn't counter shit and think of yourself like you actually proved me wrong...! damn kids these days...

I dont think i proved u wrong,,, yet u claiming that tobirama can magically mark hashirama while hes on SS,, is why i think ur not the right person to say that im not bright

 

[AGoodBoy]

Yes there is,,,, Madara pinned down Tobirama in canon,,,,

No,,, not when Hashirama and Madara have attacks with an AOE that easily bypasses the limits of FTG

To avoid tagging madara and hashirama can use their PS and SS respectively,,, both of them would annihilate tobirama if he attempts to shorten the distance between the two,,,,,,,
@Bold - where did u get that,,,,
they dont need to use these techniques for a long time,, seeing that it wont take much efforts to take tobirama down

Lol @you claiming that an FTG user is invincible when the manga has clearly portrayed madara and hashirama to be leagues above any other ninja bar juubi jins and sages family
The fact that the AOE of Both the users attacks ranges for over kilometres is why tobirama simply cant escape their attacks,,,, without any prep markings before the battle

Juubito never attempted to use any larger scale AOE techs to counter their FTG,,, not only that but the FTG users by themselves would get buttraped by juubito,, so i dont see what point u are tying to make
-running away and defeaating someone are 2 different things

u are not being generous,, you are being stupid,,,

So, Ems Madara has Black rods now...? Hashirama doesn't know how to shut off the chakra points like madara did. This response is foolish.

Oh, So, they can just 'take down' an edo tobirama that easily? This argument makes 0 sense.

This is more nonsense. Juubito created a sun barrier that exceeds madara and hashirama's biggest attacks several times over in size [

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], yet minato already had kunai on site that were way outside the range of this jutsu[

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]. Where you're getting your facts from are beyond me. In fact, Tobirama(and minato), both have seals on their respective hokage heads. When hashi/madara use their massive attacks, alive tobirama simply teleports to konoha while edo tobirama stays behind to 'die' and regenerate... Alive tobirama then proceeds to come back. Tobirama has 0 limit to his range. Only a severe lack of understanding of the mechanics of ftg would make you say this.

juubito setup

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, then setup a

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to stop them from leaving... All in an attempt to best their ftg. He failed. This argument is nonsense.
edo minato(replace with tobirama) and edo tobirama took juubito for a ride with just ftg[

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][

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][

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]. 1 FTG user is hard enough. 2 is a nightmare.

All of your arguments are unsupported by the manga.

Keep in mind that fodder edo can still switch around with Edo Tobirama, making it easier, since if Edo Tobirama does it, he will be out of commission for a while. And his teamwork plays a vital role.

Exactly. In fact, Tobirama (any version),

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making it that much easier for them to make a jihad edo appear in your face. Only hashi/madara wank would make me believe they could even with this...

 

[Oblivionx]

That example was only used to tell u that FTG user can still be pinned down

huh! that example showed that if ftg user can't use his chakra then he is pinned down... but doing that to an ftg user is not easy... and it's about EMS madara and alive hashirama so this point is completely moot...

His attacks were stronger but he didnt really use any long range attacks,,, instead he attempted to attack them head on,,, not only that but the FTG users attacked as backup to Naruto and Sasuke

lol.. dunno what to say... AGoodBoy gave excellent explanation but obviously it takes a mind to understand...

SS busted PS with only one chojo kobetsu,, despite the attack being hit by 11 PS-infused TBB,,,,
and how is PS the only way to avoid tagging,,, Madaras V3 legged alone has more than enough durability to tank most of Tobiramas attacks,, so does hashiramas mokujin (which absorbs chakra),,,

show feats of v3 susano tanking attacks of gojou kibakufa scale... then we'll talk...

-SS didnt hit madara because he was camped inside PS,,, it still destroyed PS and restrained kurama completely,,,
Both of these constructs would hit tobirama if he's within their range of attack,,,,

yeah it did destroy PS and restrained kurama who both are giant entities... still it didn't do shit to madara... why?? is it one hit move so it disappeared after destroying PS?? then it's nothing for an ftg user to avoid... and again show scans of feats you are giving to PS and SS... SS couldn't hit madara after destroying PS... and PS ain't hitting an ftg user... otherwise show feats...

Sealing techs are the only reason why they cant win,, if howwever they are granted sealing techs,, madara or hashriama can beat tobirama rather comfortably,,,,,,

so what were you debating about?? i never said alive tobirama beats any of them... huh! funny, isn't it...

We are looking at feats here,,, Tobirama was also confident of killing madara when he had the real rinnegan,,,
Gokage were also confident that they coulld edo madara,, yet it didnt happen did it,,,
jiraiya was also confident he could kill pein,,, yet he couldnt,,,,

lol this was response to your manga portrayal statement... heck hashirama hasn't been said to be strongest hokage by manga yet... and check out hype and artificially created manga portrayal here... i was just telling you what manga actually said.. not what it portrayed in your thoughts... also madara admitted it himself... you can't deny that even if you deny the rest... because madara was on winning side...

im not overrating power,, neither am i underrating speed,,,, the fact is that the best tobirama can do is run away as he simply cant bust through PS and SS nor can he afford to get hit by these constructs even once,,,,
Yes,

he doesn't need to bust PS or SS... i never said he could... i'm debating edo tobirama remember... who can outlast both PS and SS... and so you are admitting that if tobirama goes on defensive he can avoid both PS and SS??

I dont think i proved u wrong,,, yet u claiming that tobirama can magically mark hashirama while hes on SS,, is why i think ur not the right person to say that im not bright

1st: hashirama wasn't on SS in manga...
2nd: it looks odd even thinking that hashirama will sit on statue...
3rd: SS is non factor against an ftg user... who can easily avoid it... already explained how... (jubito's AOE)...
4th: what makes you think tobirama can't climb up on SS...
5th: being on SS mean hashirama is in SM which i already stated can protect hashirama from tagging...

 

[Tobby17]

I'm surprised to see Agoodboy defend Tobirama so well, I was always of the opinion he hates Tobirama