Theory: Rise of the Senju (1 of 3 Senju theories)

[Gagster]

damn, i edited it too late


Furthermore, what Rikudou said was "did not inherit my strong chakra genes"... Senju do not have Rikudou's strong chakra genes.. thats the uchiha. Senju rely on durability and having high quantity of chakra.

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So what rikudou said was right, but you are taking it out of context and saying Ashura didn't inherit anything.. but rikudou only mentioned him no inheriting what Indra inherited, and that is the strong chakra that runs in the Uchiha clan.


PS: why would the sage say "my chakra bloomed inside of ashura"? lol.. Ashura doesn't have Rikudou's chakra, none of them do.. he simply has the genes for longevity and high amounts of chakra.

I can't get through to you can I? The sage EXPLICITLY STATES ASURA INHERITED NOTHING. NADDA.

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The sage then Laters says that ASURA'S OWN POWER BLOOMED. Nowhere does it say he awakened any kind of special Genes or
Abilities.

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So please, show where you think the Sage contradicted himself, and said Asura infact DID inherit powers from the sage's genes.

And that Scan of Obito explaining it isn't true at all, since Neither Madara nor Obito new the truth about the Sage.

 

[KingHashirama]

________(Post)_________

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Don't try to take things out of context please.


Show me where i claimed that Ashura was inherited with Strong chakras. Show me where Rikudou said Ashura didn't inherit anything, because he only stated he didn't inherit his strong chakra genes. Which Obito (the guy who you are claiming to be wrong).. already said long before Rikudou..


Uchiha clan = Have strong chakras


Senju clan = Does not have strong chakras

^^^^^^^^ Confirmed long before Rikudou's scan you keep posting over and over.

I can't get through to you can I? The sage EXPLICITLY STATES ASURA INHERITED NOTHING. NADDA.

Bold, its funny you say this... but issue is Rikudou said he didn't inherit the strong chakra genes.... never said "Ashura inherited nothing".

 

[Gagster]

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Don't try to take things out of context please.


Show me where i claimed that Ashura was inherited with Strong chakras. Show me where Rikudou said Ashura didn't inherit anything, because he only stated he didn't inherit his strong chakra genes. Which Obito (the guy who you are claiming to be wrong).. already said long before Rikudou..


Uchiha clan = Have strong chakras


Senju clan = Does not have strong chakras

^^^^^^^^ Confirmed long before Rikudou's scan you keep posting over and over.



Bold, its funny you say this... but issue is Rikudou said he didn't inherit the strong chakra genes.... never said "Ashura inherited nothing".

The first line of your post claimed Asura inherited the strong body of the sage.

Ashura, the man who started the senju bloodline ( no senju clan yet), gifted by the Sage's body starts the war with his brother Indra.

The Sage confirmed the exact opposite, saiying that Asura DID NOT INHERIT HIS GENES.

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You can't possibly belive Obito over THE SAGE HIMSELF.

Especially not when It was confirmed by Black Zetsu that he lied about everything he told Madara and Obito.

So show me the scan of The SAGE saying Asura inherited ANYTHING from him, when he already clearly said he DID NOT.

 

[KingHashirama]

The first line of your post claimed Asura inherited the strong body of the sage.

Strong body =/= strong chakra

Hashirama = strong body

Madara = strong chakra

Ashura = strong body

Indra = strong chakra


^^^^^^^ This is known to any fan who has proper knowledge on these 2 bloodlines. Now let me know where i claimed he inherited strong chakras.


Body = REQUIRES TRAINING and HARDWORK

The Sage confirmed the exact opposite, saiying that Asura DID NOT INHERIT HIS GENES.

Spoiler

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@Bold, he never said that try reading what you post again. He stated he didn't inherit "STRONG CHAKRA" genes...... :erm:

Spoiler

You can't possibly belive Obito over THE SAGE HIMSELF.

Especially not when It was confirmed by Black Zetsu that he lied about everything he told Madara and Obito.

So show me the scan of The SAGE saying Asura inherited ANYTHING from him, when he already clearly said he DID NOT.

Obito: Indra inherited the Powerful chakras of the sage

Rikudou : Indra inherited the strong chakra genes


Now tell me how Obito is wrong. Rikudou is his dad, all his power comes from the God of shinobi, the Gojuu dama he has, are a result of him having Rikudou's genes.

 

[Gagster]

Strong body =/= strong chakra

Hashirama = strong body

Madara = strong chakra

Ashura = strong body

Indra = strong chakra


^^^^^^^ This is known to any fan who has proper knowledge on these 2 bloodlines. Now let me know where i claimed he inherited strong chakras.


Body = REQUIRES TRAINING and HARDWORK

@Bold, he never said that try reading what you post again. He stated he didn't inherit "STRONG CHAKRA" genes...... :erm:



Obito: Indra inherited the Powerful chakras of the sage

Rikudou : Indra inherited the strong chakra genes


Now tell me how Obito is wrong. Rikudou is his dad, all his power comes from the God of shinobi, the Gojuu dama he has, are a result of him having Rikudou's genes.

I already told you how Obito is wrong, he got his information from Madara, who got it from Black Zetsu.

No where does the sage say Asura had a "Strong body".

The Sage himself once again proves you wrong.

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[Zris]

kek. I used to crack jokes about Kakashi's clan/Jiraiya being part senji because of their resemblance. [geniuses, white hair, swegswag] i still do sometimes, but then people like you make it seem that maybe i've always been right. but nawe, it's just too good to be true and sorta kinda far fetched. This is a nice theory and i enjoy reading them for the nod, with Kishimoto, I believe truly he meant for the other clans to be different and not related to the senji at all. they were just an OP clan that had to be killed off to restore balance in the NVworld. the same as the uchiha's/uzumaki's

still though, looking forward to reading the other bits of this when you get around to them.

 

[KingHashirama]

I already told you how Obito is wrong, he got his information from Madara, who got it from Black Zetsu.

But you haven't proven the information wrong. =]. Especially when the information Obito gave is the same as the information Rikudou gave. try again.

No where does the sage say Asura had a "Strong body".

The Sage himself once again proves you wrong.

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No where did the Sage said Indra had a MS/EMS... guess what tho? he did



Use common sense and logic, you already got proven wrong in trying to prove me wrong.

Obito + what is shown + Hashirama + Madara = Senju have strong bodies

Last time i checked .. Ashura = Senju.

kek. I used to crack jokes about Kakashi's clan/Jiraiya being part senji because of their resemblance. [geniuses, white hair, swegswag] i still do sometimes, but then people like you make it seem that maybe i've always been right. but nawe, it's just too good to be true and sorta kinda far fetched. This is a nice theory and i enjoy reading them for the nod, with Kishimoto, I believe truly he meant for the other clans to be different and not related to the senji at all. they were just an OP clan that had to be killed off to restore balance in the NVworld. the same as the uchiha's/uzumaki's

still though, looking forward to reading the other bits of this when you get around to them.

But if you look at what the Senju are... they are diverse people who united to achieve a goal under a leader.

Senju clan of Hashirama =/= Senju clan before Hashirama

^^^^ 2 different clans. Hatake group joins the Senju clan during Hashirama's time, and become part of the senju clan. Once the village is made, where is the senju clan? nowhere, you have these small families.

Jiraiya had big reserves enough to master SM, but no from a clan? don't see it happeninggg ;p.

 

[Gagster]

But you haven't proven the information wrong. =]. Especially when the information Obito gave is the same as the information Rikudou gave. try again.


No where did the Sage said Indra had a MS/EMS... guess what tho? he did



Use common sense and logic, you already got proven wrong in trying to prove me wrong.

Obito + what is shown + Hashirama + Madara = Senju have strong bodies

Last time i checked .. Ashura = Senju.

Obito's information is diretlcly contradicted by the Sage, try again.

And did the Sage say Indra didn't have Sharingan? No he didn't, but he did say Asura DIDN'T inherit his power and awakened his own.

If you read the manga you would know why Obito is wrong, just like how Madara was wrong about Infiniute Tsukiyomi, and the Rinnegan.

 

[KingHashirama]

Obito's information is diretlcly contradicted by the Sage, try again.

Show me the contradiction.

Rikudou = Indra had my strong chakra genes, Ashura didn't.

Obito = Indra inherited the powerful chakra, Ashura didn't.

And did the Sage say Indra didn't have Sharingan? No he didn't, but he did say Asura DIDN'T inherit his power and awakened his own.

And did the sage say Ashura didn't have a strong body? No he didn't, but he did say Ashura Doesn't have the power that Indra had.

If you read the manga you would know why Obito is wrong, just like how Madara was wrong about Infiniute Tsukiyomi, and the Rinnegan.

If you read the manga properly, you would know that Obito wasn't wrong, Zetsu only changed the stuff about Infinite Tsukuyomi.. Madara wasn't wrong about the Rinnegan either.. only thing he was wrong on.. was the fact Rikudou toook on the juubi by himself.. while in reality it was Hagoromo + Hamura.

 

[SenseiSama]

Asura wasn't gifted with the Sage's body, he inherited nothing from the Sage.

He inherited the Sage's body but couldn't awaken his power until mid-puberty. He's a late bloomer.

Naruto and Hashirama weren't able to use Sage Mode until around 15 while Madara and Sasuke had their Sharingan since they were 12ish.

 

[Gagster]

Show me the contradiction.

Rikudou = Indra had my strong chakra genes, Ashura didn't.

Obito = Indra inherited the powerful chakra, Ashura didn't.




And did the sage say Ashura didn't have a strong body? No he didn't, but he did say Ashura Doesn't have the power that Indra had.



If you read the manga properly, you would know that Obito wasn't wrong, Zetsu only changed the stuff about Infinite Tsukuyomi.. Madara wasn't wrong about the Rinnegan either.. only thing he was wrong on.. was the fact Rikudou toook on the juubi by himself.. while in reality it was Hagoromo + Hamura.

So now your even ignoring the scan you keep posting.

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Obito said Asura was BORN WITH THE SAGES BODY- The SAGE HIMSELF Said he wasn't.

Like I proved a hundred times already, the Sage said Asura DID NOT INHERIT HIS GENES. PERIOD.

And now your actually trying to jutstify Obito being right about the Sage.
Everything Obito/Madara did was a lie just apart of BZ's plan.

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[KingHashirama]

So now your even ignoring the scan you keep posting.

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Obito said Asura was BORN WITH THE SAGES BODY- The SAGE HIMSELF Said he wasn't.

Yea the sage never said "Ashura wasn't born with my body"... he only said he didn't have the Uchiha gene of strong chakra... Do you even freaking read?

Like I proved a hundred times already, the Sage said Asura DID NOT INHERIT HIS GENES. PERIOD.

But Ashura is Rikudou's son... its impossible for him to be his son, with rikudou's genes. :|

And now your actually trying to jutstify Obito being right about the Sage.
Everything Obito/Madara did was a lie just apart of BZ's plan.

Nope, atleast read the scans you posted. He only changed some of the events.

Ashura + indra = rinnegan = information on the tablet that you claim BZ changed = Proven right by Madara uchiha.

Senju = strong bodies = information on tablet = proven right by the Senju clans and the Uchiha clans....



This is you vs the manga:

Manga : Rikudou states Ashura doesn't have strong chakra genes.

You: Rikudou states Ashura doesn't have his genes

Manga: Those who have the power of body bloom later on through hardwork and etc .

You: Ashura doesn't have anything from rikudou, because he wasn't born strong like indra.

Manga: Rinnegan is obtained through combination of ashura and indra's chakras

You : Its false, because it wasn't stated by Rikudou

He inherited the Sage's body but couldn't awaken his power until mid-puberty. He's a late bloomer.

Naruto and Hashirama weren't able to use Sage Mode until around 15 while Madara and Sasuke had their Sharingan since they were 12ish.

Yea plus Hashirama didn't get Mokuton until was around 17 or so.

 

[Zris]

But if you look at what the Senju are... they are diverse people who united to achieve a goal under a leader.

Senju clan of Hashirama =/= Senju clan before Hashirama

^^^^ 2 different clans. Hatake group joins the Senju clan during Hashirama's time, and become part of the senju clan. Once the village is made, where is the senju clan? nowhere, you have these small families.

I get you. You're saying that the different clans such as Gai's/Kakashi's old family joined under Hashi while still being their own clan. They united under Hashi's village because they wanted peace or needed a village. Right here is where I should put in that a Hatake possibly got with a senji and vice versa for the other fam groups. Once the senji's disappeared the remaining groups stuck with their clan names and decided to stay in the village. This is good. The way I've been thinking about it is that the other clans had migrated to the hidden leaf village from word of mouth. Since most clans are all 'muh bloodlines' they stayed within their own fractions and mingled together instead of intermingling with the other fams. Once the senji's left, not much had changed. My way is more closed off than yours, but I could definitely see your way as being more legit cause all Hashi wanted was for all the clans to be together and in peace. It's just..Kishi is the roadblock in regards to everything. Guy made it seem as though certain clans are not related to the senji's at all blood related or not.

Jiraiya had big reserves enough to master SM, but no from a clan? don't see it happeninggg ;p.

pffftttt are you saying then, that you agree there is a good possibility that Jiraiya is a senji? I could be wrong, if you agree with me then we could be wrong which is why it's fun calling everything a fanfic cause if this is all proven wrong then there's no harm done and no knickers in a knot. I refuse to dub Jiraiya an official senji since that's too crazy. You are more sure of your theory about this so you believe that he is. I just believe that everything is a big coincidence. I need proof from Kishimoto himself King, straight out of the mouth or an interview proof to get it through my head that Jiraiya the pervy sage is tied to being an actual senji even though all the evidence points to him being an actual senji

Spoiler

I want to believe.

 

[PlatinumTitan]

it's clearly stated that it isn't. Your just making up whatever you want while denying what the sage said.

For the last time

From what the sage himself said, Asura inherited nothing from him.

No where did the sage say he awakened his power.

Did you, or did you not read that scan?

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[Haloguy2710]

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/thread

 

[KingHashirama]

I get you. You're saying that the different clans such as Gai's/Kakashi's old family joined under Hashi while still being their own clan. They united under Hashi's village because they wanted peace or needed a village. Right here is where I should put in that a Hatake possibly got with a senji and vice versa for the other fam groups. Once the senji's disappeared the remaining groups stuck with their clan names and decided to stay in the village. This is good. The way I've been thinking about it is that the other clans had migrated to the hidden leaf village from word of mouth. Since most clans are all 'muh bloodlines' they stayed within their own fractions and mingled together instead of intermingling with the other fams. Once the senji's left, not much had changed. My way is more closed off than yours, but I could definitely see your way as being more legit cause all Hashi wanted was for all the clans to be together and in peace. It's just..Kishi is the roadblock in regards to everything. Guy made it seem as though certain clans are not related to the senji's at all blood related or not.


pffftttt are you saying then, that you agree there is a good possibility that Jiraiya is a senji? I could be wrong, if you agree with me then we could be wrong which is why it's fun calling everything a fanfic cause if this is all proven wrong then there's no harm done and no knickers in a knot. I refuse to dub Jiraiya an official senji since that's too crazy. You are more sure of your theory about this so you believe that he is. I just believe that everything is a big coincidence. I need proof from Kishimoto himself King, straight out of the mouth or an interview proof to get it through my head that Jiraiya the pervy sage is tied to being an actual senji even though all the evidence points to him being an actual senji

Spoiler

I want to believe.

Oh yea i agree with Jiraiya being part senju. Hes simply not from a high tier senju family like Tsunade, and hence why his background is unknown. Just like Tsunade's would've been if she weren't Hashirama's granddaughter. xD.


But about Hatake, no what i'm saying is Hatake is probably a senju related group, that isn't part of the main group.


VVVVVVVV My theory revolves around the main "Senju clan" only being held by the followers of whoever inherited leadership from the person who Ashura gave leadership to, and then who that guy gave the leader ship to .. and so on. That became the senju clan. But people like Hatake, were from lets says Ashura's kids, or grandkids . Ya get what i mean?

The reason for believing he had many children is due to how diverse the Senju bloodline gets overtime (this will be explained later on). But even his little group, has a main leader after him (most likely one of his sons) and this main group stays like this and is basically lead by the son or someone related to Ashura, which over time becomes known as the Senju clan (the one that Batsuma Senju lead). While the other sons and daughters of Ashura create the side groups of the senju bloodline.

 

[Rohan]

:lol at Gagster. Hagoromo himself later on regrets that he gave his full legacy to Ashura rather than dividing it between Infra and Ashura. Ashura inherited the legacy of the Sun from Hagoromo, this is shome by him standing under the Sun banner.