Themes and plot points that had more potential but were ultimately dropped.

[Shadow Phantasm]

Are there themes or plot points that anyone felt deserved more looking into but were dropped or forgotten as time went on?If so then post them in this thread.

Here's mine:

The theme of hardwork beats natural talent:It seems as the manga went on this theme became more and more irrevelant.Now in order to be powerful you must inherit a special legacy or come from a ultra powerful clan in order to keep up with those who are.Many characters such as Rock Lee had proven hard work can beat someone who is gifted anytime,now that does'nt matter anymore.

The theme of making your own destiny:The main thing I liked about Naruto is that he was'nt the Chosen One or the Messiah that so many Shounen protoganists typically are.He was a no talented,loud mouthed brat that nobody ever paid attention to,that is until Naruto worked his a*s off and prove anyone who though he was a loser wrong.Now come the Fourth World War Arc-the current one and Naruto is not only the son of both the Fourth Hokage and a Uzumaki,but he was also the descendant of the SO6P and a reincarnation of Ashura.

The Child of Prophecy made Naruto the Chosen One and that's quite disappointing IMO,I like main characters that aren't destined or chosen for anything except for what they make on their terms.

The theme of Revenge is never good for anybodyid anyone notice the thematical contradiction between Shikamaru avenging Asuma and Sasuke avenging his clan?In the case of the latter it was hammered home time and again that revenge is poison and it ruins the person who pursues it,we saw this with Sasuke who kept falling deeper into darkness and even took a hit in the sanity department.

Contrast this with Shikamaru who never had to go through such a thing,in fact his pursuit of vengance was considered to be something good.

Now onto plot points....

Danzo's relationship with Obito and Orochimaru:We know with the latter that Orochimaru used to work with Danzo during his time at ROOT,however we don't know whether or not their relationship continued even during Orochimaru's attack on Konoha.Did Danzo willling let Orochimaru do his thing like with what happened with Pain?Did he orchestrate Hiruzen's death?Those questions may never receive answers which is a shame indeed.

Obito trying to recruit Nagato but was stopped by Yahiko:This one was interesting in the fact that given what Obito said to Nagato it implied that he was somehow involved in Yahiko's death.Yet nothing came out of it for some reason,given Obito's manipulative nature and the fact he needed Nagato's help it's logical to think he would remove the only obstacle in his way.

Anyone else got plot points or themes to share that were dropped for some reason?

 

[Slowpoke]

That's very interesting. ​

 

[The Necromancer]

I agree with all of your points.

 

[RokudaimeUzumaki]

Hmmmm...Good Points Completely agree with you

 

[reizon]

I agree with all of your points.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

Come on guys,post any plot points or themes that you felt were dropped in the thread.

 

[Gagster]

I think you're wrong on most of these.

 

[slaton02]

That's very interesting. ​

Is that all you ever say?
OT agreed, I can't of nothing else. Well lee neji rivalry, I still wanna see Dai vs the swordsmen the anime better pick it up.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

I think you're wrong on most of these.

How am I wrong exactly?

 

[Zealous Sparks]

Nice Points eagle.

Some other things that had potential were:

Orochimaru's parents (This has potential but has not yet been covered)

The Uzumaki Clan- We got only a few flashbacks about them and that they created RDS (How and who they were destroyed by is still something of an unknown but may be covered later)

Mangetsu Hozuki- Said to be able to utilize all 7 swords of the mist yet was barely shown

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

Nice Points eagle.

Some other things that had potential were:

Orochimaru's parents (This has potential but has not yet been covered)

The Uzumaki Clan- We got only a few flashbacks about them and that they created RDS (How and who they were destroyed by is still something of an unknown but may be covered later)

Mangetsu Hozuki- Said to be able to utilize all 7 swords of the mist yet was barely shown

Those are some plot points that should be delved into,especially the ones regarding the Uzumaki and Mangetsu.

 

[Gagster]

How am I wrong exactly?

Are there themes or plot points that anyone felt deserved more looking into but were dropped or forgotten as time went on?If so then post them in this thread.

Here's mine:

The theme of hardwork beats natural talent:It seems as the manga went on this theme became more and more irrevelant.Now in order to be powerful you must inherit a special legacy or come from a ultra powerful clan in order to keep up with those who are.Many characters such as Rock Lee had proven hard work can beat someone who is gifted anytime,now that does'nt matter anymore.
8 gates Guy, Killer Bee, The 3rd, 4th Hokages, J-dawg, ect ect.
The theme of making your own destiny:The main thing I liked about Naruto is that he was'nt the Chosen One or the Messiah that so many Shounen protoganists typically are.He was a no talented,loud mouthed brat that nobody ever paid attention to,that is until Naruto worked his a*s off and prove anyone who though he was a loser wrong.Now come the Fourth World War Arc-the current one and Naruto is not only the son of both the Fourth Hokage and a Uzumaki,but he was also the descendant of the SO6P and a reincarnation of Ashura.
The sage said himself, being the descendant of great people doesn't make you great. Naruto inherited almost nothing from his parents. And he wasn't a born the reincarnation of Asura, Asura chose him because their ideals where similar.
The Child of Prophecy made Naruto the Chosen One and that's quite disappointing IMO,I like main characters that aren't destined or chosen for anything except for what they make on their terms.
He wasn't the only "child of prophecy" and the supposed "child of prophecy" before him (His dad) died. Also the prophecy predicted that he would destroy the world, which he didn't do, he chose not to.
The theme of Revenge is never good for anybodyid anyone notice the thematical contradiction between Shikamaru avenging Asuma and Sasuke avenging his clan?In the case of the latter it was hammered home time and again that revenge is poison and it ruins the person who pursues it,we saw this with Sasuke who kept falling deeper into darkness and even took a hit in the sanity department.
No one said revenge is always bad, the idea was not to blind yourself to only revenge which Sasuke did and Shikamaru didn't
Contrast this with Shikamaru who never had to go through such a thing,in fact his pursuit of vengance was considered to be something good.
Shikamaru showed the correct way to go about it.
Now onto plot points....

Danzo's relationship with Obito and Orochimaru:We know with the latter that Orochimaru used to work with Danzo during his time at ROOT,however we don't know whether or not their relationship continued even during Orochimaru's attack on Konoha.Did Danzo willling let Orochimaru do his thing like with what happened with Pain?Did he orchestrate Hiruzen's death?Those questions may never receive answers which is a shame indeed.

Obito trying to recruit Nagato but was stopped by Yahiko:This one was interesting in the fact that given what Obito said to Nagato it implied that he was somehow involved in Yahiko's death.Yet nothing came out of it for some reason,given Obito's manipulative nature and the fact he needed Nagato's help it's logical to think he would remove the only obstacle in his way.

Anyone else got plot points or themes to share that were dropped for some reason?

there .

 

[LogicnoJutsu]

Are there themes or plot points that anyone felt deserved more looking into but were dropped or forgotten as time went on?If so then post them in this thread.

Here's mine:

The theme of hardwork beats natural talent:It seems as the manga went on this theme became more and more irrevelant.Now in order to be powerful you must inherit a special legacy or come from a ultra powerful clan in order to keep up with those who are.Many characters such as Rock Lee had proven hard work can beat someone who is gifted anytime,now that does'nt matter anymore.

The theme of making your own destiny:The main thing I liked about Naruto is that he was'nt the Chosen One or the Messiah that so many Shounen protoganists typically are.He was a no talented,loud mouthed brat that nobody ever paid attention to,that is until Naruto worked his a*s off and prove anyone who though he was a loser wrong.Now come the Fourth World War Arc-the current one and Naruto is not only the son of both the Fourth Hokage and a Uzumaki,but he was also the descendant of the SO6P and a reincarnation of Ashura.

The Child of Prophecy made Naruto the Chosen One and that's quite disappointing IMO,I like main characters that aren't destined or chosen for anything except for what they make on their terms.

The theme of Revenge is never good for anybodyid anyone notice the thematical contradiction between Shikamaru avenging Asuma and Sasuke avenging his clan?In the case of the latter it was hammered home time and again that revenge is poison and it ruins the person who pursues it,we saw this with Sasuke who kept falling deeper into darkness and even took a hit in the sanity department.

Contrast this with Shikamaru who never had to go through such a thing,in fact his pursuit of vengance was considered to be something good.

Now onto plot points....

Danzo's relationship with Obito and Orochimaru:We know with the latter that Orochimaru used to work with Danzo during his time at ROOT,however we don't know whether or not their relationship continued even during Orochimaru's attack on Konoha.Did Danzo willling let Orochimaru do his thing like with what happened with Pain?Did he orchestrate Hiruzen's death?Those questions may never receive answers which is a shame indeed.

Obito trying to recruit Nagato but was stopped by Yahiko:This one was interesting in the fact that given what Obito said to Nagato it implied that he was somehow involved in Yahiko's death.Yet nothing came out of it for some reason,given Obito's manipulative nature and the fact he needed Nagato's help it's logical to think he would remove the only obstacle in his way.

Anyone else got plot points or themes to share that were dropped for some reason?

The only one i agree with is the Shikamru revenge thing, while it was going on i was confused on why Kakashi encouraged Shikamaru to go for it, instead of telling him its bad. But then i realized that Kakashi never told Sasuke that going for his revenge was bad for him til he showed signs of trying to hurt his teammates. He just gave him the option to not go for it. Also Sasuke was still 12 at the time and Hidan was a threat for everyone. Same with Itachi but its just different circumstances.

Also we just know that Obito would wait for Nagato to see the truth for himself and he'd return their everyday until then. We already know how Yahiko died, Hanzo betrayed him. The anime went more in depth but we know it was Hanzos doing, making Nagato kill him. And we know Obito was gonna be waiting for him so thats what the hint was at. That Nagato went straight to Obito after those events happened.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

there .

Hmm,I see your point.But I still contend that Naruto was always destined for greatness even if he had to work for it in the beginning.

Gai had to use a suicidal technique just to inflict major damage on Madara,he is the epitome of hard work but even that was'nt enough.

Shikamaru still fought Hidan out of revenge though,just like how Sasuke went after Itach and then Danzo because of vengeance.Why one is considered less wrong than the other is up for debate.

 

[SlainPaladin]

I agree with you on the topic of hard work being left by the wayside. That was what made part 1 of the anime/manga so interesting. The contrast between Naruto and Sasuke and how they gained prowess as a ninja was what kept the conflicts between them interesting, along with other characters like Rock Lee.

On a side note, I always wanted to see what would happen if Lee fought Neji in the later portion of part 1, which would have been another conflict of hard work vs natural talent.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

The only one i agree with is the Shikamru revenge thing, while it was going on i was confused on why Kakashi encouraged Shikamaru to go for it, instead of telling him its bad. But then i realized that Kakashi never told Sasuke that going for his revenge was bad for him til he showed signs of trying to hurt his teammates. He just gave him the option to not go for it. Also Sasuke was still 12 at the time and Hidan was a threat for everyone. Same with Itachi but its just different circumstances.

Also we just know that Obito would wait for Nagato to see the truth for himself and he'd return their everyday until then. We already know how Yahiko died, Hanzo betrayed him. The anime went more in depth but we know it was Hanzos doing, making Nagato kill him. And we know Obito was gonna be waiting for him so thats what the hint was at. That Nagato went straight to Obito after those events happened.

But does'nt it seem suspect that Obito had everything to gain from Yahiko's death?If Madara can set up Rin to be killed in order to turn Obito into his pawn, then the same thing is possible with Obito being involved in Yahiko's death in order to get Nagato on his side.

 

[Made in Heaven]

The theme of good writing

 

[Gagster]

Hmm,I see your point.But I still contend that Naruto was always destined for greatness even if he had to work for it in the beginning.


Gai had to use a suicidal technique just to inflict major damage on Madara,he is the epitome of hard work but even that was'nt enough.

Shikamaru still fought Hidan out of revenge though,just like how Sasuke went after Itach and then Danzo because of vengeance.Why one is considered less wrong than the other is up for debate.

'

Of course Naruto was "destined for great things since the beginning" If he wasn't the manga wouldn't exist.

Gai fought one of the strongest living things to ever exist and barely lost. Imagine if he was older/more skilled. Master Shen from the fillers probably could beat Jubi Jin Madara.

Shikamaru didn't let his revenge betray and endanger his friends, that's the difference. He also had a strategy other than "A man that I must kill".

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

'

Of course Naruto was "destined for great things since the beginning" If he wasn't the manga wouldn't exist.

Gai fought one of the strongest living things to ever exist and barely lost. Imagine if he was older/more skilled. Master Shen from the fillers probably could beat Jubi Jin Madara.

Shikamaru didn't let his revenge betray and endanger his friends, that's the difference. He also had a strategy other than "A man that I must kill".

I agree with your point on Gai being able to beat Madara if he had hit a major spot,but then that's the same situation as Lee almost beating Gaara back in Part 1.They came close but it was'nt enough.

Also Sasuke intentionally cut himself off from his comrades and aside from trying to kill Karin almost never attacked anyone who was'nt his target until they attacked first.He even warned the Gokage to not get in his way back at the Kage Summit.

 

[UltimateDeadpool]

I 100% agree on your initial points. The manga used to be about hard work vs. natural talent, and how hard work ultimately beats natural talents. But now, everyone important possesses special traits that ultimately defeats to purpose of hard work. It's also incredibly cliche and annoying.

I also don't get why the plot points with Root and Danzo were dropped. It had some ominous build-up, but then was completely swept under the rug.

Something I have been curious about for the longest time is Sasuke's importance to Obito. He wanted Sasuke so badly and Itachi was aware of it and tried to prevent it, but Obito got Sasuke and... nothing. What was the big deal? He said to Zetsu that Sasuke was worth more to him than the rest of Akatsuki, he pushed Sasuke to get the EMS too, but what was his big plan? I have a feeling that Sasuke may had also been Itachi's replacement in Obito's plan.