"The type of Hokage I want to be, is one that doesn't sacrifice a life!

[lndra]

Do you think from Sarada's perspective, that this type of belief is prominent? I feel like that's why Naruto gets formerly criticized, because of his soft bone.

I don't necessarily see an issue with it personally, but I do think that a Hokage sometimes has to make tough choices for the sake of the Village.

They seem to be setting up Sarada to be kind of almost a cookie-cutter Hokage, with love and such. But I think it would be better if she was more like Tobirama (in the sense of being hard -- not his ideals) but with Naruto's abrasiveness.

What do you think?

It could also be that they want to leave the dark stuff for Boruto, like they do for Sasuke when they are older /shrugs

I think Sarada should be okay with killing if its warranted. Why are they trying to make this generation even more soft than the last?

 

[Horus]

I do agree that the generation is a bit soft.. so is Naruto with his TNJ xD

I guess the writers are exploring different avenues of resolving conflict.

 

[lndra]

I do agree that the generation is a bit soft.. so is Naruto with his TNJ xD

I guess the writers are exploring different avenues of resolving conflict.

That's kind of my worry. It's hard to build the story different from Naruto's story, when every possible outcome is being resolved almost the same.

Granted I understand that the focus of these Arcs aren't that serious yet, as no one has been killed nor has a War started. But I would hate for them to still be cookie-cutter ninjas who don't do what needs to be done, for the sake of goals or stereotypes.

Killing should be warranted under the case that it's deserved, for sure. I hope this doesn't hold the series back like Naruto.

 

[Bad Touch Yakushi]

Call it soft, but in this world- this story was solved by messiah optimism. The manga tells us that Danzo, Pain, Itachi & Sasuke's ways were not right. They're rightfully villainized.

Characters with unreal optimism and naive dreams like Hashirama and Naruto win, because it's that gorgeous Shonen idea of 'what if people actually tried for Utopia for once'.

 

[lndra]

Call it soft, but in this world- this story was solved by messiah optimism.

It's that gorgeous Shonen idea of 'what if people actually tried for Utopia for once'.

Yeah that's what makes it hard for me to like this series for the long term if this is the continuous running gag. I'm lenient long term because I understand that the beginning of the story is supposed be light hearted, but how can we keep our noses high when we have almost everyone not doing what needs to be done?

I expected more for Boruto and Sarada specifically, but they only seem to be delivering with Mitsuki. Things might change when they are older, but from the setups now, at least for Sarada -- They shouldn't have done this.

Naruto made this mistake before and look where it got him. All that's missing is her saying she wants to protect everyone, and they pretty much have soiled themselves. These characters need to be realistic, realistic.

 

[Vulpini]

Sarada is still young, she doesn't know much about the shinobi world or how it works. I think she'll change her mind when she gets older.

I wonder if she'll think the same way once she sees a Konoha comrade getting killed right in front of her eyes.

 

[Bad Touch Yakushi]

Yeah that's what makes it hard for me to like this series for the long term if this is the continuous running gag. I'm lenient long term because I understand that the beginning of the story is supposed be light hearted, but how can we keep our noses high when we have almost everyone not doing what needs to be done?

I expected more for Boruto and Sarada specifically, but they only seem to be delivering with Mitsuki. Things might change when they are older, but from the setups now, at least for Sarada -- They shouldn't have done this.

Naruto made this mistake before and look where it got him. All that's missing is her saying she wants to protect everyone, and they pretty much have soiled themselves.

No when I say 'actually tried for Utopia', I mean characters like Naruto and Hashirama who actively make the world a better place by inspiring the people in it to in turn, get better.

I really wouldn't call 'TNJ' a gimmick...and more like the entire point of the Naruto series. From day 1 with Zabuza/Haku forming Naruto's ninja way to everybody he encounters and affects until the end. If that optimism annoys you then...yeah maybe Naruto isn't the series for you. Because, sure you have Sasuke, Itachi and Danzo exploring those alternatives but they naturally won't succeed due to the genre.

Subverting the 'necessary evil' trope in an inspiring way that fiction does best. Call it traditional, I find Naruto's optimism really, really refreshing.

 

[salamander uchiha]

Nah she's going to curb stomp the fodders.

 

[InfiniteMugen]

I agree for the most part, but you never know, I hope they’re setting up this cookie cutter thought of the kind of hokage she wants to be as a turning point for her, like maybe something happens in the plot that makes her realize that being a kage involves more than easy decisions and simply thinking “I won’t let anyone die”, you know, something a lil more dark and serious

 

[lndra]

No when I say 'actually tried for Utopia', I mean characters like Naruto and Hashirama who actively make the world a better place by inspiring the people in it to in turn, get better.

Okay

I really wouldn't call 'TNJ' a gimmick...and more like the entire point of the Naruto series. From day 1 with Zabuza/Haku forming Naruto's ninja way to everybody he encounters and affects until the end. If that optimism annoys you then...yeah maybe Naruto isn't the series for you. Because, sure you have Sasuke, Itachi and Danzo exploring those alternatives but they naturally won't succeed due to the genre.

There could be a balance of the two. I don't mind solutions like Naruto, but I don't necessarily agree with the hardness of the other side. But I think that they should explore it more, instead of denouncing it altogether. I'll go more with it below

Subverting the 'necessary evil' trope in an inspiring way that fiction does best. Call it traditional, I find Naruto's optimism really, really refreshing.

This is my problem. I found Naruto's take on things refreshing once upon a time, but it definitely lost its spunk somewhere around the War Arc. That's neither here nor there, but I think that for the Boruto series, as they are marketing it to be different, it should be different.

What's traditional should exist now only to be overturned later. Imagine the reactions if Boruto actually kills someone who deserves it, instead of TNJ'ing them back to the good side, imagine Sarada coming to terms that she can't save 'everyone', etc.

There are far more alternatives to explore that would be an interesting, refreshing, or 'unique' for this genre specifically.

Sarada is still young, she doesn't know much about the shinobi world or how it works. I think she'll change her mind when she gets older.

I wonder if she'll think the same way once she sees a Konoha comrade getting killed right in front of her eyes.

I hope this goes for everyone. It's stupid how they are making them naive.

 

[Inmate]

Still too early to judge. Wait a little longer.

 

[Nidaime Suiton]

The Perfect Hokage = Naruto's power + Tobirama's personality

 

[lndra]

I agree for the most part, but you never know, I hope they’re setting up this cookie cutter thought of the kind of hokage she wants to be as a turning point for her, like maybe something happens in the plot that makes her realize that being a kage involves more than easy decisions and simply thinking “I won’t let anyone die”, you know, something a lil more dark and serious

It's not impossible. But I thought the same for Naruto once upon a time.

The gravity of the situation hits me harder specifically for Boruto. He wants to be like Sasuke, in the shadows, yet will they even let him cross that side? How stupid would it be for Boruto to be doing the dirty work-type missions, and yet he's still soft as ever?

These are serious problems that can determine whether or not people can buy into what they are selling IMO.

 

[Bad Touch Yakushi]

There could be a balance of the two. I don't mind solutions like Naruto, but I don't necessarily agree with the hardness of the other side. But I think that they should explore it more, instead of denouncing it altogether.

Like...Hashirama having to kill Madara? Or Naruto fighting the dark corners of his mind in the Waterfall of Truth? Accepting the fact that he let Neji down? Every time Naruto fights Sasuke, he has to challenge that idea and how far they'll go. These characters have questioned their naive beliefs and the entire series is about Naruto's Ninja Way being tested.

The fact that he never bends, becoming some jaded, dark path leader doesn't make him uninteresting, that's cliche in itself. Plus he never has to, other big characters go this route and develop those ideas themselves. Sasuke's motivation was often explained as 'the shadow'. Danzo and Itachi call it 'Konoha's darkness'...it pops up a LOT and is really developed...so you can't say Kishi didn't tackle it. Plus you gotta remember, Shippuden is a story with BZ: an objective evil.

It was the stories' main theme and it explored it pretty well. Sasuke's way winning would be a horrible ending and give no message other than: "conflicting war-torn worlds are war-torn, but damn that governing tho."

 

[Askeladd]

As stated by Kishimoto, the series will become darker. Anyway, it's obvious when you look at the Boruto from the flash forward.

 

[Ansatsuken]

She says she wanted to be a Hokage that will no longer sacrifice people life but before she took the position she enjoys the killing like a mad man. :Sparks:

You need to understand the "context" Indra.

The context of her statement is when she already become a Hokage and not before that :Sparks:

 

[lndra]

Like...Hashirama having to kill Madara? Or Naruto fighting the dark corners of his mind in the Waterfall of Truth? Accepting the fact that he let Neji down? Every time Naruto fights Sasuke, he has to challenge that idea and how far they'll go. These characters have questioned their naive beliefs and the entire series is about Naruto's Ninja Way being tested. The fact that he never bends and becomes some jaded, dark path leader doesn't make him uninteresting, that's cliche in itself. Plus other big characters go this route and develop those ideas themselves. Sasuke's motivation was often explained as 'the shadow'. Danzo and Itachi call it 'Konoha's darkness'...it pops up a LOT and is really developed...so you can't say Kishi didn't tackle it.

Kishimoto barely tackled it for Naruto, though. I think that's why I found Hashirama to be more realistic as a Hokage in some areas, when he announced that he would kill anyone who got in the way of his peace, whether it be his brother or friend. Naruto's undying will is completely naive at times, that's where he faces the most criticism.

The entire aspect of Naruto's character when it comes to trying to be the savior when it's not warranted comes out too forced. It is uninteresting, and it's bad. Kishimoto tried to make Obito more salvageable after his actions, by having the MC state he was an awesome/cool guy, because they both wanted to be Hokage. These motivations and goals are really important for this series ... I can't help but think that the reason why this series failed is because Kishimoto tried to solve every solution through words. I mean most of Naruto's responses don't even have solutions. Take an example of why Nagato killed himself for Naruto's sake, just based on the belief and hope that he would succeed, rather than an actual solution. The same happened VS. Sasuke. And a few years later, the Village is in shambles.

Itwas Naruto's main theme and it explored it pretty well.

Exactly my point. It was Naruto's main theme, why is Boruto's main theme too?

 

[Bad Touch Yakushi]

Kishimoto barely tackled it for Naruto, though. I think that's why I found Hashirama to be more realistic as a Hokage in some areas, when he announced that he would kill anyone who got in the way of his peace, whether it be his brother or friend. Naruto's undying will is completely naive at times, that's where he faces the most criticism.

Exactly my point. It was Naruto's main theme, why is Boruto's main theme too?

Because it's a continuation. A darker, more realistic story during peacetime is the wrong time and place for themes like that imo. This is a great chat btw.

Boruto's Dad had enough moments of self-doubt to barely scrape by without being wholly one-dimensional. Point is: Kishimoto as a whole does a great job of developing both sides of the argument. The whole series does, even that awful Itachi Hiden explores what Itachi & Danzo have in common and the failings of government due to the 'greater good'.

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You're in luck though, because people in this thread are likely right- we're still early and they're yet to be challenged. They'll probably break and form a more developed stance down the line with the whole Kawaki flash-forward...whether that makes Sarada & Boruto change their morality or path doesn't matter.

What MATTERS is that they are tested, not what they decide to do with that development.

 

[Hyuga Prodigy]

I think Sarada clinging to that ideology is a wishful thinking. She has alot of room to grow, and considering the structure of the sharingan may signifies that she had failed or when the world had fallen into depravity and her role is to endure the hardships and spread love to others even when experienceed her most toughest choice.


It's just like with Boruto where he successfully change Sumire mindset. In the beginning of the series they have to give a reason why Boruto represent the sun to Mitsuki. Mitsuki looked up to Boruto however at some point to the story, there will be some dark turning point and Boruto will become the outcast. He will no longer be the same person as he was before which is what sarada role to bring him back.

 

[lndra]

Because it's a continuation. A darker, more realistic story during peacetime is the wrong time and place for themes like that IMO.

Kishimoto said that the story would get darker though. Look I'm not worried about these problems now, as many have said before, they are just children.

I understand that context, it's why I was okay with Sumire being TNJ'd. I don't expect anyone killing anyone or any realistic situations coming into play, but my worry is for the future. The whole idea that this will be the running gag continuously makes the series boring. If every villain, or every threat, doesn't have a major consequence, then what's the point? It seems like the whole redemption theme of Naruto could be pulled here even more seriously, and we all know that one of the major problems with Naruto itself is because of his morality rate.

Naruto had enough moments of self-doubt to barely scrape by being wholly one-dimensional. Point is: Kishimoto as a whole does a great job of developing both sides of the argument. The whole series does, even that awful Itachi Hiden explores what Itachi & Danzo have in common and the failings of government due to the 'greater good'.

But Naruto's self doubt moment, for example in the Waterfalls of Truth, was Naruto going back to him not signing an autograph. Sure it provides Naruto with development to make him less one dimensional, but it's like Kishimoto doesn't want to take Naruto seriously.

You're in luck though, because people in this thread are likely right- we're still early and they're yet to be challenged. That flash-forward with Kawaki basically proves it.

Or the inevitable TNJ, come to the good side buddy rehash. After you killed all mah friends and familia!

I'm expecting the worse right now honestly. :|