[Theory] The True Origin of the World : The One

ROHAN

Active member
Supreme
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
23,854
Kin
95💸
Kumi
1,799💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Disclamer : Before you read this, let me say that most of the material here is very speculative. I doubt that Kishi will ever use this idea in his story. But, it's still pretty mindblowing and I would appreciate it if you read it to the end. :)

A) The Three Celestial Gods :-

In the Naruto Verse, Two gods have been shown and I believe a Third God will be revealed.

I wouldn't explain this much as I and many others have made theories about this. But, in a nutshell :-

There were three celestial gods involved in the Creation of NV. They were :-

1) Shinju, the God Tree representing Creation and the Earth. (Already shown in the manga.)

2) Kaguya, the Rabbit Goddess representing Maintainence and Preservation. She is represented by the Sun. The Byakugan and Red Hair are connected with the Sun.

(Already shown in the manga, the Sun part has not been shown).

3) Sobojo, the Tengu God representing Destruction and the Moon. He is sealed within the Shinju's fruit and is the origin of the Sharingan's power.

(While he has not been shown in the Manga, if you have read Tethows Youth Group's Theory, you will pretty much know who Sobojo is).

Link below, in case :-

B) A Greater Being :-

Moving on, If you think that Point "A" makes sense then eventually you would ask yourself a question which is :-

" Is there a being greater then the Three Celestial Gods ? "

I thought about it and dismissed it until the Earth-shattering relevation by Black Zetsu :-

You must be registered for see images

"Kaguya and the Shinju are one being as the Juubi".

(Notice the focus on the Juubi rather than the Shinju ? I will explain later.)

Kishi basically revealed to us that two celestial gods power's were combined to create the Juubi, namely Kaguya and Shinju.

And to me this was pretty mindblowing as it opened up the possibilities to a Greater Being.

But wait, According to Point "A" and Tethows Youth Group's Theory, Sobojo is sealed within the Shinju's Fruit.


Going by the above logic, we can assume that the Three Celestial God's powers have been combined in One Being (Albeit in sealed states). Because the fruit was a part of the Shinju.

Sobojo as the Fruit and Kaguya and the Shinju were one being as the Juubi.

Thus, we see there is a Greater being in existence who was created when the powers of the Three Celestial gods were combined.

C) The One :-


So, What is this Greater Being ?

Now, to be honest, I got this idea from another story, namely the "Animorphs". :sweat:

In this story, there are two ultimate beings, The Ellimist who helps the Protaganoists.

The Second Ultimate being is revealed in the later chapters and this was his description as far as I remember :-

" The being was enormous. His body was Gigantic. But what filled me with Fear, was by looking at his Central Reddish eye. This being was called - "The One" ."

Here we see a being called "The One". And to be honest, his description matches very well with a being from the Naruto story :_

You must be registered for see images

You guessed it right, The One's appearance is similar to the First form of the Juubi.

The First form of the Juubi :-

1) Is Gigantic.
2) Has a central reddish eye.


D) The Juubi :-

I think the Juubi is The One in a sealed state.

The One was revived in the Fourth Shinobi World War in the form of the Juubi (Obviously neither Madara or Obito realised this) as it's components were sealed .

But, as we know, The Shinju was released by Obito.

Kaguya was revived by Black Zetsu.

And Sobojo would be eventually released when the Fruit ripens.


The above could lead to the full revival of "The One".




You must be registered for see images

The Juubi in it's Second form looked like it was mutating into the Shinju and gaining tree like characteristics. It looked deformed and twisted.

The Third form is pretty much an enlarged form of the Second, when it absorbed too much natural energy.

Not to mention, there are a few inconsistencies in The Juubi's transformations as pointed out by Fear X Death :-

By Fear X Death.

The Story of the Bi-Polar Entity :-

Now this is something I came across that weirded me out. Now follow me closely.

Obito Unleashes the Juubi/God Tree :-

You must be registered for see images
You must be registered for see images

Obito is defeated, Madara is revived, He starts kicking ass and taking names and all of a sudden.

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

Was that the Gedo Mazou? Thats kinda weird I thought that became the Juubi and that is now the God tree... whatever.

You must be registered for see images
You must be registered for see images

Wait a minute... Madara just summoned the Juubi and then absorbed it? Making him the Jinchuriki... So then... Wait.. So what happened to the Tree? I guess it was summoned to Madara along with the Juubi since their one in the same?

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

NOPE!!! So then what the HELL is going on here? How can the Juubi and Holy Tree be in 2 places at once, and dont even get me started on what the Gedo Mazou was doing over there when we clearly saw it become the Juubi.

The above shows that the Juubi was kinda not fitting in with the Shinju which makes it look like a separate entity.

E) The Juubi's Central Eye :-
You must be registered for see images

The Juubi's central Reddish eye is mystical. We have no idea why it exists except as a medium to Cast Infinite Tskyumoni.

According to Obito, "Infinite Tskyumoni makes everyone one".

You must be registered for see images

If we take his statement and the point above, it stands to reason that the central eye is The One's Eye because it fuses everyone into one being via Infinite Tskyumoni.




How is the Juubi's eye created :-

I think the Red Central Eye is born when you combine all three Celestial god's powers namely Kaguya, Sobojo and Shinju's powers.


F) The True Origin of the World :-

This is where it all began, and this is where it will all end, namely "The One".




1) The One is the Ultimate Being and split himself into Sobojo, Shinju and Kaguya.

2) When the Shinju sealed Sobojo in the fruit and Kaguya became a part of it, The Central Red Eye or the One's eye was born in the Shinju. The Shinju was transformed into the Juubi, The One in a Sealed State.

3) In the War, The One was revived in the form of the Juubi. Eventually the sealed components were unsealed. The Shinju was released, Kaguya was revived and Sobojo would be eventually released from the Fruit.

4) If the three celestial gods in their unsealed state re-combine their powers, then The One will be truly revived.

5) If "The One" is fully revived, then the world will truely come to an end, because everyone will become "One" as it was in the Beginning.

G) The Cryptic Warning :-

Kurama, during the Gedo Mazou's transformation to the Juubi gives a Cryptic Warning to Naruto and his Team revealing that :-

You must be registered for see images


(See Bottom most Panel).

"Grandpa Rikudou said that the Juubi's Complete revival will signal the End of the World."

I highly doubt that Hagoromo was referencing to the Shinju as it is a source of Creation and not a source of "The End of the World".

So, was Hagoromo referencing to "The One" ?
 
Last edited:

vasu 32

Active member
Veteran
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
3,765
Kin
11💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
In short, it's like hinduism where there are 3 main supreme GODS, one who creates, one who preserves and then one who transforms or destroys. But in the end they are but one, three parts of the supreme god, UNIVERSE.
 

NaruSasuRival

Active member
Regular
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Messages
914
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
I think you got tricked by all the literary inspiration that Kishi had when writing the story. In Narutoverse, there is only one true god, and he is neither Shinju, nor Juubi, nor Kaguya, nor Hagoromo. Basically we have not seen that god yet. The greatest mistakes that most readers have made are the folowings:

(1) Most readers speak of god without a common definition of that being. In each culture, there are gods, and each individual has can have his own god that can be anything he trust in. In the case of Naruto, if we are talking about god, I assume we want to think of a god who created everything, care for his creation, and love them. If such logic exists, then none of the people or character we have seen so far is a god.

(2) Most readers ignore completely that before kaguya became what she is, she was a being who had no power to do anything. basically, she knew that eating the fruit would give her power, but so far, we can say that she had no power prior to eating the fruit. thus, no matter what BZ said, Kaguya was simply a Jinchuriki for the Shinju, and her body was taken by Shinju to materialize into Juubi. Basically, Kaguya was no god, and she was called only god as a result of eating the fruit. Taking this into consideration, BZ is actually the fool and Hagoromo is right when he said that he thought Juubi along with Hamura. Their mother was being controlled by Juubi, which is no more than the incarnate Shinju. My point here is that Kaguya is not a god, she had no chakra prior to eating fruit, and cannot claim any chakra as her own. The being we are saying now as Kaguya is simply the Shinju incarnated.

(3) There is actually a god in the Narutoverse. I am confident in his existence for two reasons: (1) Before Kaguya ate the fruit, it was a tradition to not eat the Shinju. Someone knew it was dangerous. The people who know that are evidence that either (1.a) Kaguya was not the first person to eat the fruit, or (1.b) there is someone out there who knows what the fruit is and has follower who has the secret. The second reason is (2) the toads who gave prophecy to Jiraya, and Naruto also gave prophecy to Hagoromo. Prophet work for a god, and they take intels that are given by a god. If Hagoromo also received a prophecy from Gamamaru when he was Jinchuriki of Juubi, and when he was the enemy of Juubi, this prove that neither Hagoromo, nor Juubi, nor Kaguya is true god. basically, the ultimate being in Narutoverse is the one who is giving prophecy to Gammamaru. He is the true God of narutoverser, and cannot come from combining the being he is using his people to fight.

As I said, the definition of a god is necessary fro every theory. Yet, even by reading Naruto, I can tell that Kishi has the same definition of a the true god as I do - that is the suppreme god that rule over everything and keep everything in check. In that sense, that true god is the one who created Shinju whose fruit contains knowledge. That god also created life and everything by using certainly the same knowledge that is embedded in the tree.

As you can see, the Kaguya who has the power of the tree can create forms and lands, but all the forms and lands she creates are empty and have know life. This is why she has to use actual people to create her army, or probably her people to fill her dimension so that she can be called a true god. Shinju does not have the power to give life.
 

ROHAN

Active member
Supreme
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
23,854
Kin
95💸
Kumi
1,799💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Thanks to everyone for liking my Theory. :)

Blazing: Yeah, I was inactive for a while. :p

vasu: Exactly, what I was saying. You must have noticed that this Three gods symbolism exists in near about every religion. And for that Purpose, I will use these Quotes :-

The Number three has a very vast connection with our world. It is even said that perfection can only be achieved with three powers.

There was an Ancient Aliens episode " The Power of Three" (I also suggest that you watch it) which showed how the number Three is embedded in our History, Religion, Astronomy (The three Orion Stars), The laws of Motion and even in our DNA.

The episode overall was very knowledgeable although the Aliens part was Bogus. Lol

The Sun, Moon and Earth are three celestial objects which are closely connected to each other. Could Kishi have been inspired by this ?
I can give some parallel about this without mentioning ( G O D ) .

They are known as the three primary forces :

In Hinduism : Creator , Preserver , Destroyer .

And also in Hinduism : Brahma , Vishnu , Shiva .


In Egypt : Osiris , Horus , Isis .

In Jewish : Kether , Chokmah , Binah .


It is also known as : Birth , Growth , Death .

You can also say : Beginning , Middle , End .

Which means everything does something and then stop .
Interestingly, it rhymes very well with this :-

Earth : Shinju : Creator : Birth : Beginning

Sun : Kaguya : Preserver : Growth : Middle

Moon : Sobojo : Destroyer : Death : End
Naru: Wow, I never expected such a Reply. :sweat:

While your point about Kaguya is logical, you can see the three forces symbolism above. As, far as I know, this is a 50-50 point.

Moving on, you yourself say that there is a ultimate god in the story. This would mean that Kishi would explore this possibility.

And there is the problem. The story has introduced two gods : Kaguya and the Shinju. The way they got their powers does not hold water as they were called gods regardless.

Moreover, Rikudou was called a Sage, not a God as far as I remember. While, he may have used COAT you can see that his actions are the end result of the Shinju and the Kaguya fiasco.

Kishi always connects everything in his story. Nagato was connected to Obito connected to Madara and so on. So, the point is that Kishi will definitely tie in Kaguya and Shinju to the creation of the ultimate god.

And that's why I came up with the combination of the three gods powers leading to the formation of "The One", the Ultimate God. Sobojo fits in the story too perfectly along with Kaguya and the Shinju and he completes the Trio gods symbolism.

Now It's basically up to you whether you think there is an Ultimate God and the Three Forces forming the Ultimate Being have no relevance. But, to me the Three Forces have relevance considering the huge amount of evidence.
 
Last edited:

Angelic.

Active member
Supreme
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
23,034
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Awards
nice read. i agree about kurama saying it would be the end of the world and everything becoming one. he said complete revival. so far juubi was underwhelming. theres also still spiral zetsu running around, ive always felt he was the shell of the fruit. and to tie in with rabbits theory about oro, he did something to spiral earlier.

but what would this have to do with kaguya wanting an army?
 

NaruSasuRival

Active member
Regular
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Messages
914
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Naru: Wow, I never expected such a Reply. :sweat:

While your point about Kaguya is logical, you can see the three forces symbolism above. As, far as I know, this is a 50-50 point.

Moving on, you yourself say that there is a ultimate god in the story. This would mean that Kishi would explore this possibility.

And there is the problem. The story has introduced two gods : Kaguya and the Shinju. The way they got their powers does not hold water as they were called gods regardless.
Well, this is a matter of reading and comprehension. The way the manga state does not make any of Kaguya or the Shinju god. See, this is where the problems lie:

(1) The Shinju is called the god tree. It does not mean it is god. It could simply mean a tree that connects to god rather than being itself a god. See for yourself. How a god can be just motionless and stand there until it get its power stolen by mere human being? How can people such as Obito or Madara have fun playing around with a god? Why would such god be called god by human? This should compel anyone to understanding that the tree is not a god. Rather, taking its fruit open the mind to knowing things that only god can control. It is possibly a connecting power.

(2) Kaguya was never call god. Rather, she was a princess, and after she ate the tree which was previously being worship by humans, she obtains powers. It is in presence of her power and what she could do with it (the fear of her power) that led people to call her the rabbit god of the moon. See, they called her god, but she was not a god. Human being would call anything that can determine their fate as god, especially if the powerful person is forcing them to do so.

As you can see, you cannot dissociate Kaguya's power from the Shinju, the god tree. Thus, Kaguya was simply connected to knowledge that gave her power to control things around her. This is why I say the tree is not god because even a human can control it. Kaguya is not god, but a powerful human being who obtained power that was expected to be used only by gods. The point is everyone who eat the fruit can achieve the same power as Kaguya.

Moreover, Rikudou was called a Sage, not a God as far as I remember. While, he may have used COAT you can see that his actions are the end result of the Shinju and the Kaguya fiasco.
Rikudo was referred as god because he beat the Juubi. Besides, if Kaguya was god, and juubi was god according to you, I assumed that you also should think Hagoromo who beat both of them to be a god! Not doing that is the evidence that you understand my argument, and actually, the discussion should stop here. But I know you have a theory and you are defending it.

Kishi always connects everything in his story. Nagato was connected to Obito connected to Madara and so on. So, the point is that Kishi will definitely tie in Kaguya and Shinju to the creation of the ultimate god.
How can you even connect Nagato to Obito? And how do you connect Obito to Madara? The connections there have nothing to do with making someone god. Besides, how do you want to create an ultimate god out of some lower gods? I guess the definition of god for you are different from my definition of god. My opinion is that you cannot bring a higher god out of lower gods. Rather, a higher or ultimate god should be the creator of everything else.

And that's why I came up with the combination of the three gods powers leading to the formation of "The One", the Ultimate God. Sobojo fits in the story too perfectly along with Kaguya and the Shinju and he completes the Trio gods symbolism.
You can't make one stable thing out of conflicting things. If Sobojo is destruction, how can he associate with creative power. What the point? In Christianity for example, while the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are three in 1, they have the same Will. They are in one accord.

Now It's basically up to you whether you think there is an Ultimate God and the Three Forces forming the Ultimate Being have no relevance. But, to me the Three Forces have relevance considering the huge amount of evidence.
Yeah. I think there are three parts in the manga: (1) Human beings, (2) spirit of chaos, (3) spirit of order. The second is represented by Indra, and the third by Ashura. They can choose any human to do their jobs. Still, I believe there is a true god out there besides these three parties. He is the one who has priest and Hagoromo was one of them as well as Gammamaru.
 

Glazebone

Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2014
Messages
157
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Interesting read. I doubt Kishi will tie all of this together and you yourself said it was all speculation but you made some points nontheless.

However..

NaruSasuRival kind of disproved parts of your theory. It's true that Kaguya was not a God (originally). Even Hagoromo stated that she was a 'princess from a far away land' before consuming the fruit. It is only after that she received 'god-like powers' (and I emphasize on the term 'god-like'=/='god') and became revered but also feared.

Neither is the Shinju a God. It was a fruit of immense power. I won't elaborate further on this.

If you seek a true God, then you must think more abstract and separate yourself from the manga entirely. Kishimoto isn't likely to emphasize on this subject at all in the coming chapters. Anyway, in any given world there should be 1 true God - The Creator of All Things. Anything less is not in the same category. And I believe that you cannot combine 3 lesser beings to create a being of unlimited Power. If you combine 3 beings of limited power you will create a being of far-greater but (again)limited power. I hope you get what I mean by limited and (un)limited power.

Going back to the anything less - we could be observing god-like Beings or Entities. They are not God as their power is obviously limited ( and anything with a limited power =/= God ) but are immensely strong nontheless. Possible such entities could be, but may not be limited to: The God of Life, the God of Death, The God of Knowledge, etc. In their specific field they are 'Gods' but no one 'God' can overpower or reign supreme as it's own power is limited to his own realm. Again, I hope you see my point of view.

Lastly I was to highlight a possible mistake/error/confusion in your thread.
In part of your theory you provide a panel with BZ explaining that "even Hagoromo was unaware of the fact that 'Kaguya's Will' was trying to take back it's chakra." which leads me to believe that Hagoromo himself had little information on the true Shinju or his mother Kaguya's influence or plan. Now, this could just be BZ spilling B$ or it could be true. And if it is true, then your last part [G] is false. Why so? Well, if Hagoromo has no clue about the previous statement, then how could he have possibly known about the (possible) existence of 'The One'. In my minds he was simply referring to the 10 Tails juubi, as in "there is no person alive today that could match its strength". And so he would be true as neither Naruto, nor Sasuke alone can match the power of the 10 Tails.

Sorry for the long post but I believe that one does not necessary need spoilers, fancy writing or highlights or even links to support his arguments. I still want to thank you for sharing your theory with us and hope you don't take my criticism as anything hostile. It's just my opinion.
 

ROHAN

Active member
Supreme
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
23,854
Kin
95💸
Kumi
1,799💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Naru: Well, according to the Theory, There is an ultimate God called "The One". My assumption is that he split himself to create Kaguya, Sobojo , Shinju and everything in this world. So, the only way to truly revive him is to recombine everything.

First, I will reference to a statement made by Rikudou :-

"A one being with too much power will always get corrupted"

This statement's implications can be seen in the Real world and even in the Naruto verse. So, much so, that if there is a one being with too much power, he will get 100 % Corrupted. This is why the Shinju and Kaguya were corrupted.

If I assume that there is one Ultimate god who created everything, Kaguya, Shinju, humans, etc; it stands to reason that the Ultimate God would have gotten corrupted by his power.

So, the Ultimate god split himself into everything that we know, just so that he wouldn't get corrupted by his power which led to the creation of everything.

I believe that he would have ensured that the knowledge of his revival would have been lost for eternity, because the only way to revive him would be to make everyone one. And that would cause everything that he created to cease to exist. Infinite Tskyumoni sums this up pretty much by making everyone one.

If you want, I could explain this even further, if you are interested. :)

Glazebone : About Black Zetsu :-

Here we see two people, Black Zetsu and Hagoromo. Both have equal knowledge about everything. But, here we see BZ saying that Hagoromo never knew about BZ's existence. But, this was only from BZ's point of view. Hagoromo never said anything about this.

This raises my suspiscion that Hagoromo knew about Black Zetsu's existence. If you look at my theory, Hagoromo was the Jinchuriki of "The One". As such, it stands to reason that he knew about it's existence and would cause the splitting and sealing of the Juubi.

Another point, that I would like to mention is that Hagoromo gave Naruto and Sauske Sun and Moon seals, to seal Kaguya. But, the problem is even if Kaguya is sealed, BZ will keep on reviving Kaguya because there is nothing to seal him.

In the recent chapter, Hagoromo appears before the Edo Hokages and once again talks about seals. Question is, how would that be related to Kaguya if the Sun and Moon seals are enough ?

Unless of course the Seal in question will seal Black Zetsu ensuring that Kaguya would never be revived. But that would mean that Hagoromo knew about BZ's existence.

I find it pretty funny that Black Zetsu is so much filled with pride that he calls Hagoromo, Fodder and Garbage. Yet, Hagoromo is the son of Kaguya and the origin of the Ashura and Indra fiasco. Lol
 
Last edited:

Glazebone

Member
Joined
Apr 23, 2014
Messages
157
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Dragonor: You do have a point, mate.

Still, Hagoromo gave Naruto and Sasuke the Sun and Moon seals even before Kaguya was revived. From the Manga I deducted that he gave them these powers to combat Madara, as he was observing all the reincarnation of Indra&Ashura. Perhaps he was aware that his mother Kaguya would be revived but it wasn't specified in the Manga. It is very uncertain. Anyway this strains away from your OT so I will stop discussing :D
 

ROHAN

Active member
Supreme
Joined
Mar 10, 2014
Messages
23,854
Kin
95💸
Kumi
1,799💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Glazebone : To me it seems a pretty big coincidence that the Sun and Moon seals which can seal Madara can also seal Kaguya. If Hagoromo didn't know that , then why would the seals seal Kaguya ? Not to mention the Black Zetsu plothole. So logically it stands to reason that he knew that.

Hidari: Glad that you liked it. :D

Well, I must say that this theory is the final peice of the puzzle and when I put it all together, I get a perfect and clear picture. So, I leave this theory with this final piece :-

If you have read my previous theory about Orochimaru , you would know how I connected him to the Serpent in the bi ble.

Well the ultimate plot twist is this :-

Orochimaru is the Final Villian of the series and the true mastermind behind everything that is happening. His ultimate goal is the full and complete revival of "The One".

Orochimaru will then fuse himself with The One and become the Ultimate God. By doing so, He will be freed from the Shinju's curse of degradation.

Obviously, there is no way nobody will do anything about that.

As such it will cumilate in a final battle with the whole world at stake: Naruto, Sauske and everyone else VS Orochimaru as "The One".
 
Last edited:

Seventh Sama

Active member
Legendary
Joined
Nov 10, 2012
Messages
16,306
Kin
0💸
Kumi
0💴
Trait Points
0⚔️
Glazebone : To me it seems a pretty big coincidence that the Sun and Moon seals which can seal Madara can also seal Kaguya. If Hagoromo didn't know that , then why would the seals seal Kaguya ? Not to mention the Black Zetsu plothole. So logically it stands to reason that he knew that.

Hidari: Glad that you liked it. :D

Well, I must say that this theory is the final peice of the puzzle and when I put it all together, I get a perfect and clear picture. So, I leave this theory with this final piece :-

If you have read my previous theory about Orochimaru , you would know how I connected him to the Serpent in the bi ble.

Well the ultimate plot twist is this :-

Orochimaru is the Final Villian of the series and the true mastermind behind everything that is happening. His ultimate goal is the full and complete revival of "The One".

Orochimaru will then fuse himself with The One and become the Ultimate God. By doing so, He will be freed from the Shinju's curse of degradation.

Obviously, there is no way nobody will do anything about that.

As such it will cumilate in a final battle with the whole world at stake: Naruto, Sauske and everyone else VS Orochimaru as "The One".
@Bold That seems alot like how father(From fma) fused himself with god. :sweat:
Perhaps was that an inspiration for this theory? hmm
 
Top