[Spoilers] The Simple Truth of Kaguya and BZ

[blue22]

Okay so after finishing reading 668 the idea of the whole kaguya and bz seemed pretty simple to me, but after reading the forums I saw how complex people are making it out to be

I haven't seen this idea posted yet so sorry if it's out there but to me it seems the most simple and rational

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In this page, we see madara seemingly inject his will into a white zestu, but what exactly does this mean?

As we know from other chapters, BZ is not simply a madara clone, it has thoughts and ideas based off itself

So what does this mean?

When madara used the ying yang justsu to create BZ, I don't think he injected himself into BZ. What I think he did was inject a desire, an idea, a "will" into BZ

We know madara wants to complete the eye of the moon plan more then anything else in the world

But the eye of the moon plan wasn't originally madaras idea, it was Kaguyas

So this is my belief, when madara did the ying yang justsu to create BZ, he injected the will to carry out the eye of the moon plan, but this was actually kaguyas will not madaras, and for the almost whole exsistence of BZ it was going along and helping madara cause that was the smart thing to do the eye of the moon plan, but in the last chapter the truth came out and now BZ will resurrect kaguya and attempt to complete the eye of the moon plan

 

[Obítō1]

Agree XD XD

 

[3MESSIAH]

Could be....another good theory

 

[Ver55e]

Still can't belive madara fell for it twice .stab me once from the back shame on you .stab me twice from the back shame on me

 

[XR999]

Nice theory

 

[KING KISAME]

Awesome logical factual thread guy kudos

 

[Nagato fan01]

So far that's the most sensible theory about it that I've read so far

 

[a banned cartoon]

Just a theory.

 

[002]

It is quite possible that, similar to how Black Zetsu used Obito's body to 'resurrect' Madara, Black Zetsu will use Madara's body to bring forth Kaguya. Very interesting.

 

[blue22]

thanks for the support this is one of my first threads and is the first one that's gotten good feedback so thanks alot

the only problem i have with my own theory that might prove it wrong is when BZ talks to madara he talks about how madara could be manipulated in a similar matter to obito

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this makes me think that maybe kaguya has had a hand in the eye of the moon plan since before madara even came up with the idea himself, i mean he had to survive somehow at the valley of the end and how did he even learn about IT?

so i'm not sure, this weeks chapter will tell us but i definity think its either madara brought back kaguyas will, or she had a hand in everything before

 

[Ventuis]

This does seem possible...

 

[Tdogg]

Okay so after finishing reading 668 the idea of the whole kaguya and bz seemed pretty simple to me, but after reading the forums I saw how complex people are making it out to be

I haven't seen this idea posted yet so sorry if it's out there but to me it seems the most simple and rational

You must be registered for see links

In this page, we see madara seemingly inject his will into a white zestu, but what exactly does this mean?

As we know from other chapters, BZ is not simply a madara clone, it has thoughts and ideas based off itself

So what does this mean?

When madara used the ying yang justsu to create BZ, I don't think he injected himself into BZ. What I think he did was inject a desire, an idea, a "will" into BZ

We know madara wants to complete the eye of the moon plan more then anything else in the world

But the eye of the moon plan wasn't originally madaras idea, it was Kaguyas

So this is my belief, when madara did the ying yang justsu to create BZ, he injected the will to carry out the eye of the moon plan, but this was actually kaguyas will not madaras, and for the almost whole exsistence of BZ it was going along and helping madara cause that was the smart thing to do the eye of the moon plan, but in the last chapter the truth came out and now BZ will resurrect kaguya and attempt to complete the eye of the moon plan

Ah, very good stuff you have formulated here. Similar to itachi's use of izanami to inject a belief in someone, not necessarily control every thought/action, BZ was created with a concept in mind to follow, not as a puppet for madara but like a follower completely devoted to the mission of bringing Mugen Tsukiyomi to pass. +rep

 

[KINGXEagle]

Nice, madara is no push over im sure he will try his best to survive

 

[so12p]

Okay so after finishing reading 668 the idea of the whole kaguya and bz seemed pretty simple to me, but after reading the forums I saw how complex people are making it out to be

I haven't seen this idea posted yet so sorry if it's out there but to me it seems the most simple and rational

You must be registered for see links

In this page, we see madara seemingly inject his will into a white zestu, but what exactly does this mean?

As we know from other chapters, BZ is not simply a madara clone, it has thoughts and ideas based off itself

So what does this mean?

When madara used the ying yang justsu to create BZ, I don't think he injected himself into BZ. What I think he did was inject a desire, an idea, a "will" into BZ

We know madara wants to complete the eye of the moon plan more then anything else in the world

But the eye of the moon plan wasn't originally madaras idea, it was Kaguyas

So this is my belief, when madara did the ying yang justsu to create BZ, he injected the will to carry out the eye of the moon plan, but this was actually kaguyas will not madaras, and for the almost whole exsistence of BZ it was going along and helping madara cause that was the smart thing to do the eye of the moon plan, but in the last chapter the truth came out and now BZ will resurrect kaguya and attempt to complete the eye of the moon plan

Maybe, but your theory presupposes that Kaguya has been manipulating Madara for a long time, even back when he had the transmigration of Indra. I cannot see how that could possibly be the case, that Madara could be duped that long.

It is possible that he got the idea from Indra incarnate, but there are no manga facts to even suggest that Indra had any thoughts about IT whatsoever.

There are still holes in this madara-kaguya-BZ triangle IMO.

 

[blue22]

Maybe, but your theory presupposes that Kaguya has been manipulating Madara for a long time, even back when he had the transmigration of Indra. I cannot see how that could possibly be the case, that Madara could be duped that long.

It is possible that he got the idea from Indra incarnate, but there are no manga facts to even suggest that Indra had any thoughts about IT whatsoever.

There are still holes in this madara-kaguya-BZ triangle IMO.

Actually if you read my comment on my post you would see that I think that the only thing that's going to disprove my theory wrong is if madara has been controlled by kaguya for a longer time. my theory is saying that kaguya's will didn't come back into the picture until BZ was created, which was an accidental coincidence when madara put the will of completing the eye of the moon plan into the zetsu. Kaguya controlling madara actually hurts my theory, because it implies that her conscious existed before BZ was created, meaning that BZ being created wasn't an accident and in fact done by kaguya, which disagrees with my theory.

 

[blue22]

Ah, very good stuff you have formulated here. Similar to itachi's use of izanami to inject a belief in someone, not necessarily control every thought/action, BZ was created with a concept in mind to follow, not as a puppet for madara but like a follower completely devoted to the mission of bringing Mugen Tsukiyomi to pass. +rep

^that's exactly what my theory is trying to say, thanks for understanding and rephrasing it in a way easier to read!

 

[so12p]

Actually if you read my comment on my post you would see that I think that the only thing that's going to disprove my theory wrong is if madara has been controlled by kaguya for a longer time. my theory is saying that kaguya's will didn't come back into the picture until BZ was created, which was an accidental coincidence when madara put the will of completing the eye of the moon plan into the zetsu. Kaguya controlling madara actually hurts my theory, because it implies that her conscious existed before BZ was created, meaning that BZ being created wasn't an accident and in fact done by kaguya, which disagrees with my theory.

Ok, that takes the Indra transmigration out of the picture (presumably) but it still a long time for Madara to be duped. He was scheming at least back to the time Rin was killed. Actually before, since he engineered the events leading up to it. Some on NB theorize he actually setup the attack that crushed obito in the first place. So what, maybe 25 years? How long before that he created BZ is anybody's guess, so it could be longer.

Then the idea of the "accidental coincidence" seems like a stretch.

It's a theory and I guess as valid as any other theory on NB. I just see too many holes created with it that it does not seem like a simple truth at all because it would take as much background to fill those holes as it will for Kishi to eventually rationalize where he has taken the current storyline recently.

 

[blue22]

Ok, that takes the Indra transmigration out of the picture (presumably) but it still a long time for Madara to be duped. He was scheming at least back to the time Rin was killed. Actually before, since he engineered the events leading up to it. Some on NB theorize he actually setup the attack that crushed obito in the first place. So what, maybe 25 years? How long before that he created BZ is anybody's guess, so it could be longer.

Then the idea of the "accidental coincidence" seems like a stretch.

It's a theory and I guess as valid as any other theory on NB. I just see too many holes created with it that it does not seem like a simple truth at all because it would take as much background to fill those holes as it will for Kishi to eventually rationalize where he has taken the current storyline recently.

your right, its just a theory. I think any way that kishi explains it is going to be a hella long and help explain a lot of the questions weve still been wondering about, like how madara survived at VOTE and how he came up with the idea to do IT, but then again those concepts might not be related to kaguya, im excited to see how it will all pan out it'll be interesting