The byakugan will get its own susanoo

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I've made this prediction before that I see the byakugan getting an upgrade of it's own ms and susanoo with its susanoo version going to have a bird face like tengu are either depicted with bird heads or big noses.

We know that sharingan is heavily inspired by jqoqnese lore and the byakugan is inspires by Chinese lore. I think it its techniques will take from chinese mythology.

I think the byakugan susanoo will be called


The Chinese storm god what's interesting about this in its folkore it fights a demon fox like susanoo fights the 8 headed snake.

I could even see the byakugan version even having it's own chakra weapons that equals itachis that belong to the itachi of the boruto series.

I'm going to hold off on saying who I think that is will just say I dont think kawakii will be borutos only rival.
 
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I've made this prediction before that I see the byakugan getting an upgrade of it's own ms and susanoo with its susanoo version going to have a bird face like tengu are either depicted with bird heads or big noses.

We know that sharingan is heavily inspired by jqoqnese lore and the byakugan is inspires by Chinese lore. I think it its techniques will take from chinese mythology.

I think the byakugan susanoo will be called


The Chinese storm god what's interesting about this in its folkore it fights a demon fox like susanoo fights the 8 headed snake.

I could even see the byakugan version even having it's own chakra weapons that equals itachis that belong to the itachi of the boruto series.

I'm going to hold off on saying who I think that is will just say I dont think kawakii will be borutos only rival.
Itachi weapons don't belong to his chakra armour . . .

Anyway, i hope not. The nature of Byakugan makes it unnecessary and unfitting to have special powers attached to it. There is also a very specific reason why MS could have its own special, automatic powers. Thay reason does not apply to Byakugan. In fact, those reasons are the opposite for the Byakugan.

Byakugan 'power', if any at all, was perfected with Toneri. Nothing more is needed. As far as i see it . . .
 
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Itachi weapons don't belong to his chakra armour . . .

Anyway, i hope not. The nature of Byakugan makes it unnecessary and unfitting to have special powers attached to it. There is also a very specific reason why MS could have its own special, automatic powers. Thay reason does not apply to Byakugan. In fact, those reasons are the opposite for the Byakugan.

Byakugan 'power', if any at all, was perfected with Toneri. Nothing more is needed. As far as i see it . . .
I know itaxhis weapons dont come with the susanoo what I mean is like those weapons that are inspired by Japanese myths we might see a byakugan susanoo user have there own version inspired by chinese myths.

Also from what we know of ms it comes from special chakra from the brain I think that chakra is a portion of the juubi chakra they awaken that same chakra could be found in byakugan since both lines are offspring of kaguya.

Also we already got tenseigan byakugan equivalent to the rinnegan so wont be a big surprise if theres an ms equivalent aswell.
 

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The nature of Byakugan makes it unnecessary and unfitting to have special powers attached to it
Perhaps Byakugan since it's meant to be the Yang while Sharingan is Yin. So it must function on the realms of physical rather than mental, like its counterpart.

There is also a very specific reason why MS could have its own special
Mangekyu is a separate beast altogether than Sharingan. I think Kishi threw a lot at the Sharingan/Mangekyu (since I believe the whole duality theme was later thought of DURING Pein arc rather than before: Rikudou Sennin reincarnate plot).
I think some of the ocular powers must have been a Byakugan/Jougan power instead if the duality plot was thought of earlier in the series (Indra/Asura transmigrant).

Again, the powers for Mangekyu and Jougan would depend on their affinities. Largely being Yin or Yang, respectively. But since they are the "upgraded" version, they include a little bit of the opposite affinity (the Yin within the Yang and vice versa).

This way, the Susanoo makes sense as it is chakra that gained physical properties while being a mental power.

Coming up with just a powerful technique for the Jougan should be easy as long as it is following those restrictions and parameters.

To make it unique to the Hyuga, it should also keep in mind special techniques of the Senju (Sage Mode, physical strengthening,etc.) and Uzumaki (Chakra Mode, sealing, etc)

Byakugan 'power', if any at all, was perfected with Toneri
I wouldn't counter Toneri as "Byakugan" as first of all, that was Tenseigan. Secondly, his Tenseigan isn't complete as it was still maturing so most of the fight, he was using his own hereditary powers (Branch - which I assume to be Uzumaki since the powers are too similar to Naruto's and Minato's, who used the Uzumaki dead demon seal techniques).


So my take on all of this is that:

Hagoromo = unlocking, buffing, mental powers
Hamura = sealing, debuffing, physical powers

Hyugas are known to block chakra pathways and their palm techniques can "dispell" chakra techniques or damage chakra entities like the Tailed Beasts.
Uzumaki are known to seal/unseal as shown by Minato using 2 OP Uzumaki sealing techniques and Kushina who uses her unique chakra mode, chakra chains to hold down Kurama.

I dont consider the palm techniques to be Jougan techniques to clarify. I think it should be something more. It has to be a mental power to be ocular. Otherwise, it is not any different to body type techs like Sage Mode and Chakra Mode.

Of course, it shouldn't be able to dwarf the Chakra Mode as it should be the superior one out of the 2 Yang families much like how Mangekyu is the superior on out of the 2 Yin families.

With that being said, I believe that the Hyuga can still be able to "solo" as that is typically the path of the older ones much like how the older ones develop the ocular power instead of body.
This could be different for the Hamura family however as it may be the opposite case.

The Senju were "wiped" out for the Hagoromo side while the "Hyuga" were wiped out of the Hamura side.
The Uchiha only had 1 surviving clan member to carry out a world changing plan and the "Uzumaki" was the only 1 remaining on the Moon.
(we are not counting the Hyugas on Earth much like how we are not counting Tsunade and possibly other unknown Senjus roaming around the Earth, if there are still).
 
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Perhaps Byakugan since it's meant to be the Yang while Sharingan is Yin. So it must function on the realms of physical rather than mental, like its counterpart.



Mangekyu is a separate beast altogether than Sharingan. I think Kishi threw a lot at the Sharingan/Mangekyu (since I believe the whole duality theme was later thought of DURING Pein arc rather than before: Rikudou Sennin reincarnate plot).
I think some of the ocular powers must have been a Byakugan/Jougan power instead if the duality plot was thought of earlier in the series (Indra/Asura transmigrant).

Again, the powers for Mangekyu and Jougan would depend on their affinities. Largely being Yin or Yang, respectively. But since they are the "upgraded" version, they include a little bit of the opposite affinity (the Yin within the Yang and vice versa).

This way, the Susanoo makes sense as it is chakra that gained physical properties while being a mental power.

Coming up with just a powerful technique for the Jougan should be easy as long as it is following those restrictions and parameters.

To make it unique to the Hyuga, it should also keep in mind special techniques of the Senju (Sage Mode, physical strengthening,etc.) and Uzumaki (Chakra Mode, sealing, etc)



I wouldn't counter Toneri as "Byakugan" as first of all, that was Tenseigan. Secondly, his Tenseigan isn't complete as it was still maturing so most of the fight, he was using his own hereditary powers (Branch - which I assume to be Uzumaki since the powers are too similar to Naruto's and Minato's, who used the Uzumaki dead demon seal techniques).


So my take on all of this is that:

Hagoromo = unlocking, buffing, mental powers
Hamura = sealing, debuffing, physical powers

Hyugas are known to block chakra pathways and their palm techniques can "dispell" chakra techniques or damage chakra entities like the Tailed Beasts.
Uzumaki are known to seal/unseal as shown by Minato using 2 OP Uzumaki sealing techniques and Kushina who uses her unique chakra mode, chakra chains to hold down Kurama.

I dont consider the palm techniques to be Jougan techniques to clarify. I think it should be something more. It has to be a mental power to be ocular. Otherwise, it is not any different to body type techs like Sage Mode and Chakra Mode.

Of course, it shouldn't be able to dwarf the Chakra Mode as it should be the superior one out of the 2 Yang families much like how Mangekyu is the superior on out of the 2 Yin families.

With that being said, I believe that the Hyuga can still be able to "solo" as that is typically the path of the older ones much like how the older ones develop the ocular power instead of body.
This could be different for the Hamura family however as it may be the opposite case.

The Senju were "wiped" out for the Hagoromo side while the "Hyuga" were wiped out of the Hamura side.
The Uchiha only had 1 surviving clan member to carry out a world changing plan and the "Uzumaki" was the only 1 remaining on the Moon.
(we are not counting the Hyugas on Earth much like how we are not counting Tsunade and possibly other unknown Senjus roaming around the Earth, if there are still).
Good points on their natures

The problem is that those didn't play out with the authors only applying the ideas od duality later on.

So as long as that is the case, then we must consider that the counter to the Byakugan is the Rinnegan and not the MS nor the 3T.

Remember how the Aburame clan was hardly known during the Chunin Exams, despite being a fully fledged clan? So it is possible the Senju still exist as an organised clan, just not that involved in major issues. Danzo being so focussed on Senju vs Uchiha politics makes me think the Senju are still around.
 

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I know itaxhis weapons dont come with the susanoo what I mean is like those weapons that are inspired by Japanese myths we might see a byakugan susanoo user have there own version inspired by chinese myths.

Also from what we know of ms it comes from special chakra from the brain I think that chakra is a portion of the juubi chakra they awaken that same chakra could be found in byakugan since both lines are offspring of kaguya.

Also we already got tenseigan byakugan equivalent to the rinnegan so wont be a big surprise if theres an ms equivalent aswell.
Oh, i hear you.

Looking at the aliens, as well its utility, i think the normal Byakugan is the equivalent of the Rinnegan, with the Tenseigan being some sort of special version, similar to how Momoshiki had a red Rinnegan with special powers. I'm not too sure though
 

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The problem is that those didn't play out with the authors only applying the ideas od duality later on.
Yeah truly was such a waste. I think Kishi really didn't mean to extend it past Nagato. But it just ended up like that because of either pressure from the studio to prolong the series or that he became inspired when building more onto the world building.

Certainly majority of the Uchiha tech and Naruto being Senju is based on only 1 Rikudou Sennin. There wasn't any reason to include Madara and Hashirama into the mix. I think it just got complicated since the whole Uchiha tech were established to be separated from Rinnegan (Rinnegan isn't connected to the Sharingan in anyway).

So either a completely obvious retcon is needed or an equally plentiful additional ocular tech must be introduced along with the Jougan to match the speciality of the eye compared to the other 3 hereditary powers (Mangekyu, SM, and CM).

So as long as that is the case, then we must consider that the counter to the Byakugan is the Rinnegan and not the MS nor the 3T.
I'm not understanding this one. Can you further explain the reasoning? Isn't it given that the Rinnegan should be able to counter anything under its level? Even including Tenseigan (since the more powerful one in Hamura's side is the body, mode, instead of the mind, ocular). The only counter of Rinnegan should be the Rikudou Sennin Mode (since they are mind and body, respectively).

So if we do this whole Yin Yang stuff it'd be:

Hagoromo = Hamura
Uchiha = Uzumaki
Senju = Hyuga

Hagoromo being a stronger ocular user (Yin) while Hamura's side will have stronger mode (Yang)

So Byakugan would be weaker than whatever the base "Uzumaki" hereditary body tech is.
As Sharingan would be a stronger than whatever the base Senju hereditary body tech is.

So the equal of the Byakugan is the Senju tech while equal to the Sharingan is the Uzumaki tech.
This also scales up, making the Mangekyu equal to the Chakra Mode rather than the Sage Mode (supposedly).

Madara's and Hashirama's line is the different one. The moment Madara summoned the Gedo Mazou is the moment they stopped being transmigrants.

Perhaps it was even before that. Hashirama wasn't the conventional Asura transmigrant. He didn't start off weak and needing to rely on anyone. Madara wasn't also a soloer. He often relied on Izuna. Certainly, both of them broke the Indra and Asura traits. Hashirama being matured and powerful while Madara being the immature and relying one (he can't even pee when someone watches him). So I think they weren't true Indra and Asura transmigrants.

Since Madara transcended out of bounds of Indra and Asura, the same could be said to Sasuke and Naruto. Sasuke getting Sage Mode through the Curse Mark and Naruto not being Senju but being a Jinjuuriki (Yin).

Danzo being so focussed on Senju vs Uchiha politics makes me think the Senju are still around.
Oh, they certainly are still around. For example, Nagato is part Senju being the case. He isn't old neither. Even younger than Obito so he's basically just a senior of Naruto's generation and younger than the teachers' generation.
Basically if the teachers are boomers, Naruto's generation is Gen Z and making Nagato a millenial.

If that's the case then Senjus were around in millenial generation so you'd get either more half-breeds for Naruto's generation or fully fledge Senjus but in hiding. I think this is more like the whole Naruto and Karin thing with the Uzumaki. There are still around the world. Just either used by shadow organization or in hiding or just being protected. Afterall, Naruto is one of those individuals that even have to use his mother's last name instead of his father for political reasons.
Senjus would also be doing the same thing since they are one of the founding clans and they have political power.
 
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I think the origin of Susanoo is linked to the origin of the ten tails. My best guess is that they are a clan that the Otsutsuki subjugated to make use of their abilities. They were turned into Juubi for this purpose. Although their physical form has been altered their essence is the same and is manifested through an MS user's Susanoo. I don't think a full blooded Otsutsuki is capable of Susanoo because their chakra system cant produce a chakra based transformation without transforming physically. This is one of the reasons that the Otsutsuki set out to subjugate the Juubi clan in the first place. In my opinion, the Otsutsuki are powerful because of their ability to use chakra but their ability to produce their own is very limited or nonexistent altogether. I suspect that they are originated from a nonphysical dimension and must steal chakra to be manifested physically.

In order for a byakugan user to activate Susanoo... Let me rephrase that. In order for BORUTO to produce susanoo he would have to meet a certain condition. Which is have a mangekyou sharingan or have the chakra of one who has a mangekyou sharingan. This actually ties into a theory that I have been playing around with. In the prologue Boruto is wearing Sasuke's clothing. I am beginning to think that is because he is symbolic of the peace that has been made between Ashura and Indra. The two have been reunited and the power has been passed down to the new generation. In Boruto's case with Sasuke as his sensei he has acquired the power of Indra. It works out fine because Boruto is a dojutsu user. I should clarify that a little more. Sasuke awakens a new power and it trumps all his other abilities so he passes them to Boruto via ninshu. Basically what's going to happen is they are going to find out that ninshu not ninjutsu is the way to defeat the Otsutsuki. This will cause Naruto and Sasuke to become more powerful and awaken their Ashura and Indra power in full. Sarada receives tailed beast chakra from Naruto. Boruto receives a seal from Sasuke that is equivalent to mangekyou sharingan. This triggers new abilities in both of them that surpass the previous generation.
 

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I'm not understanding this one. Can you further explain the reasoning? Isn't it given that the Rinnegan should be able to counter anything under its level? Even including Tenseigan (since the more powerful one in Hamura's side is the body, mode, instead of the mind, ocular). The only counter of Rinnegan should be the Rikudou Sennin Mode (since they are mind and body, respectively).

So if we do this whole Yin Yang stuff it'd be:

Hagoromo = Hamura
Uchiha = Uzumaki
Senju = Hyuga

Hagoromo being a stronger ocular user (Yin) while Hamura's side will have stronger mode (Yang)

So Byakugan would be weaker than whatever the base "Uzumaki" hereditary body tech is.
As Sharingan would be a stronger than whatever the base Senju hereditary body tech is.

So the equal of the Byakugan is the Senju tech while equal to the Sharingan is the Uzumaki tech.
This also scales up, making the Mangekyu equal to the Chakra Mode rather than the Sage Mode (supposedly).

Madara's and Hashirama's line is the different one. The moment Madara summoned the Gedo Mazou is the moment they stopped being transmigrants.

Perhaps it was even before that. Hashirama wasn't the conventional Asura transmigrant. He didn't start off weak and needing to rely on anyone. Madara wasn't also a soloer. He often relied on Izuna. Certainly, both of them broke the Indra and Asura traits. Hashirama being matured and powerful while Madara being the immature and relying one (he can't even pee when someone watches him). So I think they weren't true Indra and Asura transmigrants.

Since Madara transcended out of bounds of Indra and Asura, the same could be said to Sasuke and Naruto. Sasuke getting Sage Mode through the Curse Mark and Naruto not being Senju but being a
I meant in terms of hierarchy, in terms of categorization.

The Rinnegan is partnered to the Byakugan in the aliens.

Hamura had a Byakugan, Hagaromo had a Rinnegan.

Otherwise, you keep speaking of Yin-Yang from Otsutsuki. The premise of that is that the Otsutsuki are complete or the originator of all powers. That may not be true. Have you considered that there may be other aliens that the Otsutsuki are fighting againstgl, hence the hurried fruit (power) collection? Hmm, i see a parallel between them and the Hidden Cloud Village. Perhaps Isshiki is with his special eye because of some mixed breeding?

Well, even if there arent other aliens, there is clearly variety within the clan. So even Kaguya could simply be a Yin/Yang within the clan, such that it would be in-accurate to use her as a basis of equality, as a completion of duality, because she herself was biased towards either Yin or Yang.
Maybe
 

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The Rinnegan is partnered to the Byakugan in the aliens.

Hamura had a Byakugan, Hagaromo had a Rinnegan.
That wasn't true though. The Last movie showed us that Hamura later on gained Tenseigan. But since this is now in the duality plot: we can say that they fit the Indra and Asura trope. Meaning the Hamura had the body enhancement first and Hagoromo had the occular power first and the rest came next. Meaning that the Rinnegan isn't really partnered with the Byakugan but rather the RSM (Yang). In terms of ocular powers, then Rinnegan = Tenseigan and in terms of body enhancements, Yin RSM = Yang RSM. But which one is superior between the two is based on the affinity. Rinnegan being superior as it is Yin while Yang RSM is superior to Yin RSM due to being Yang.
Yin and Yang RSM is still unknown. We only know Naruto being able to use Yin RSM from Hagoromo and Toneri doesn't count as his is arguably the same as Naruto's CM rather than a RSM and also his Tenseigan wasn't matured. I would say Kinshiki but we only ever see him use chakra weapons and no other powers worthy to be "next level" so he's like TenTen.

Remember the whole (older one gets ocular power while the younger one gets body enhancement). Unlike Indra and Asura, since they are a higher being (the twins of a transcended 3 eyed GT Jin, Kaguya), it is likely that when they BOTH reached maturity, they unlocked their other powers that aren't their strength. Meaning that Hamura gets his Tenseigan and Hagoromo gets his RSM (although in the flashback, it looks like he already has that Yin seal that signifies SM).
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I think the reasoning for this is the whole The Last movie spoiler and how Kishi didn't want to reveal the plot yet (since it was already under development just before this chapter).

Otherwise, you keep speaking of Yin-Yang from Otsutsuki. The premise of that is that the Otsutsuki are complete or the originator of all powers. That may not be true.
I think I've already covered this with my 6 Paths theory.
The aliens are just Path Sages. The "Otsutsuki" Clan are the 3 yin and yang pairs (6 in total). There are most likely other space vampires like them but the 6 may have eliminated them or simply that they never interact with other 3 pair clusters all that much.

These aliens have their own unique techniques.:
Heavenly pair:
Deva (Yin = Isshiki)
Asura (Yang = Kaguya)

Earth pair:
Human (Yin = unnamed)
Animal (Yang = Urashiki)

Hellish pair:
Preta (Yin = Momoshiki)
Naraka (Yang = Kinshiki)

Transcending allows one to use paths outside of their own. (this is where I theorize the Outer Path)
Kaguya being a transcended being gave birth to twins.
I would say that they began as 3 paths users (only using their own affinities).

This is where wide speculation starts (yes I know, it already sounds like fan fic to begin with but they were contrived from parallels, symbolisms, and comparisons)

3 scenarios:
1) maturity = being transcended offsprings, they will naturally unlock the other 3 paths that aren't in their affinity
2) seals = they both transferred/shared their powers in their seal so they have access to one another's affinity
3) ownership of Juubi/Gedo Mazou = unlocks the other affinity as they no longer need the other sibling as a fill-in

This theory implies that the aliens are merely the sages of paths (the 6 paths being unique to them or that the other clusters are comprised of those 6 paths) and there are other paths still remaining. Madara or his stand-ins (Obito/Nagato) have already made another path: Outer Path. This makes me think that there are other pair clusters out there that use different paths other than the 6 that we know of.

The 3 legendary sannins also have their own powers and there are many other sages out there too. The Tailed Beasts are sages themselves. Each having unique techniques.

So yes, there could be many other space aliens out there. But they could also be wiped out by the 6 Otstusukis or some other reason or entities.

Perhaps Isshiki is with his special eye
Eh, I think that's BS. It's just one of those things like one eye due to Berserk (Guts) homage. Like One eye + missing arm and is a black swordsman? Wow... how original.

Another note is that Ikemoto seem to abide for that design choice and consciously overwriting Kishimoto's original Boruto design of having 2 Byakugans (to be fair, I will say that Jougan =/= Byakugan so we might still see Boruto wielding 2 Byakugans).

So like the one eye thing was just that because he met the same conditions as Sasuke met when he got his.

Well, even if there arent other aliens, there is clearly variety within the clan. So even Kaguya could simply be a Yin/Yang within the clan, such that it would be in-accurate to use her as a basis of equality, as a completion of duality, because she herself was biased towards either Yin or Yang
yeah but Ikemoto/Kodachi had already settled in the whole premise of Yin and Yang partnership. So Kaguya simply was the Yang between the two: Isshiki and Kaguya. But since she made way with the fruit, she transcended and gotten the other half, making her a Yin-Yang entity.

Now, in terms of having the whole case of not being strictly a Yin or Yang, then I do agree that it should be the case. However, the only ones that fit that mold are Hagoromo and Hamura. They were the ones that have gained 2 affinities. A lot of it is missing as to how they did it (which is why I came up with the 3 scenarios with the theory above, #2 is the most likely that happened first then #3 comes next rather than being 2 separate scenarios)
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I suspect that they are originated from a nonphysical dimension and must steal chakra to be manifested physically.
That's actually a great catch. I remember having this conversation with someone (vulpix or something.. sorry if I forget your name).

That person and I were theorizing about the whole aspect of Jougan which then delved into the whole nature of it. Going off to what I said that the ocular powers being Yin, that person talked about different dimensions. Otsutsuki being from there than being a native of the Naruto dimension. (This is deriving from the fact that Kaguya teleported the last fight being different dimensions instead of just different planets).

This was all to theorize the characteristics of Jougan and its possible powers. Yin being imaginary and Yang being reality.
So the thought process was that everything is reality but in a different dimensional space.

Like for example, what you are imagining is true but untrue in this reality. So what happens is that chakra is what brings that thing from one reality into this reality.

So we were talking about the Mangekyu was the eye that can see the object from different reality while the Jougan is the eye that can see different realities. Sage Mode is the interaction in between realities while the Chakra Mode is the interaction in specific that specific (or this could be reversed).

This makes it that the Jougan can see the "void" (I described it as the Naruto reality being one room in a hallway of other doors which lead to other rooms, realities). The Mangekyu can peer into those rooms but not choose which room. The Jougan can see which rooms are which.

Basically this:
Mangekyu = see in the rooms
Sage Mode = get into the rooms
Jougan = see in the hallway
Chakra Mode = traverse in the hallway

I think this was also derived from what said about Yin and Yang characteristics based on Kaguya being split into 2: Juubi and Gedo Mazou. One being chakra which was so immense that it manifested physical traits and Gedo Mazou being so phyiscally massive that it breaches into other realities that it becomes imaginary power.
 
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That wasn't true though. The Last movie showed us that Hamura later on gained Tenseigan. But since this is now in the duality plot: we can say that they fit the Indra and Asura trope. Meaning the Hamura had the body enhancement first and Hagoromo had the occular power first and the rest came next. Meaning that the Rinnegan isn't really partnered with the Byakugan but rather the RSM (Yang). In terms of ocular powers, then Rinnegan = Tenseigan and in terms of body enhancements, Yin RSM = Yang RSM. But which one is superior between the two is based on the affinity. Rinnegan being superior as it is Yin while Yang RSM is superior to Yin RSM due to being Yang.
Yin and Yang RSM is still unknown. We only know Naruto being able to use Yin RSM from Hagoromo and Toneri doesn't count as his is arguably the same as Naruto's CM rather than a RSM and also his Tenseigan wasn't matured. I would say Kinshiki but we only ever see him use chakra weapons and no other powers worthy to be "next level" so he's like TenTen.
Remember the whole (older one gets ocular power while the younger one gets body enhancement). Unlike Indra and Asura, since they are a higher being (the twins of a transcended 3 eyed GT Jin, Kaguya), it is likely that when they BOTH reached maturity, they unlocked their other powers that aren't their strength. Meaning that Hamura gets his Tenseigan and Hagoromo gets his RSM (although in the flashback, it looks like he already has that Yin seal that signifies SM).
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I think the reasoning for this is the whole The Last movie spoiler and how Kishi didn't want to reveal the plot yet (since it was already under development just before this chapter).
Wasn't it with special circumstances that Tenseigan was gained?

That is to say, that initially it is still Byakugan vs Rinnegan.

If youre worried about power levels not evening out (Rinne / Byakugan), i think the Boruto team didn't match up the Byakugan in scaling. Basically, if Neji and Hinata could see over several kilometres, then aliens should be able to see over entire countries, similar to how Nagato had a stronger gravitational range than the Divine Path.


I think I've already covered this with my 6 Paths theory.
The aliens are just Path Sages. The "Otsutsuki" Clan are the 3 yin and yang pairs (6 in total). There are most likely other space vampires like them but the 6 may have eliminated them or simply that they never interact with other 3 pair clusters all that much.

These aliens have their own unique techniques.:
Spoiler: The six Path users (not to be confused to user of the 6 paths) Heavenly pair:
Deva (Yin = Isshiki)
Asura (Yang = Kaguya)

Earth pair:
Human (Yin = unnamed)
Animal (Yang = Urashiki)

Hellish pair:
Preta (Yin = Momoshiki)
Naraka (Yang = Kinshiki)
Transcending allows one to use paths outside of their own. (this is where I theorize the Outer Path)
Kaguya being a transcended being gave birth to twins.
I would say that they began as 3 paths users (only using their own affinities).

This is where wide speculation starts (yes I know, it already sounds like fan fic to begin with but they were contrived from parallels, symbolisms, and comparisons)

3 scenarios:
1) maturity = being transcended offsprings, they will naturally unlock the other 3 paths that aren't in their affinity
2) seals = they both transferred/shared their powers in their seal so they have access to one another's affinity
3) ownership of Juubi/Gedo Mazou = unlocks the other affinity as they no longer need the other sibling as a fill-in
This theory implies that the aliens are merely the sages of paths (the 6 paths being unique to them or that the other clusters are comprised of those 6 paths) and there are other paths still remaining. Madara or his stand-ins (Obito/Nagato) have already made another path: Outer Path. This makes me think that there are other pair clusters out there that use different paths other than the 6 that we know of.

The 3 legendary sannins also have their own powers and there are many other sages out there too. The Tailed Beasts are sages themselves. Each having unique techniques.

So yes, there could be many other space aliens out there. But they could also be wiped out by the 6 Otstusukis or some other reason or entities.
Doesn't the symbolism of the 6 paths speak against the likelihood of other aliens?

Such that if others exist, they are not related to paths?



Eh, I think that's BS. It's just one of those things like one eye due to Berserk (Guts) homage. Like One eye + missing arm and is a black swordsman? Wow... how original.

Another note is that Ikemoto seem to abide for that design choice and consciously overwriting Kishimoto's original Boruto design of having 2 Byakugans (to be fair, I will say that Jougan =/= Byakugan so we might still see Boruto wielding 2 Byakugans).

So like the one eye thing was just that because he met the same conditions as Sasuke met when he got his.
Even so, they are always explained within the story.

Sasuke, for example, got his 1 eye Rinne-Sha because he did not naturally awaken his eyes.


For the last part, i think your Yin within Yang within Yin theory covers it quite well. Even if Kaguya was a Yin/Yang, her kids can/will have a duality of powers.
 

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Wasn't it with special circumstances that Tenseigan was gained?
not really. The thing about the last arc of Naruto is that it's so messed up. Most of the revelations came as the story develops while the planned ones ending up being kept secret for the sake of not spoiling the movies.

As far as we know, Tenseigan came about later in Hamura's life. Whether or not it's a mutation is never revealed. It seemed to be just like Hagoromo's side of the family. Meaning that the Tenseigan is truly something that is natural rather than a special case.
I mean the whole ritual of the "Hyugas" had their eyes put into the Tenseigan Orb for the sake of not trying to get the Tenseigan. On top of that, the entire process is the same deal and that is to get the other parts from the other family (in Toneri's case, the reverse Madara where Toneri ending up stealing the eyes like Madara stole Hashirama's chunk of his body).

That is to say, that initially it is still Byakugan vs Rinnegan.
yeah since Yin Otsutsukis have the Rinnegan naturally while the Yang Otsutsuki have the RSM (whatever they could be).
Kinshiki and Kaguya didn't really reveal anything unqiue. Both of them were fodder. Just a TenTen or recap of Part 1 (bone and palm stuff).

Heck, we still didn't get any special techniques of the 3rd eye from Kaguya's/Madara's and Momoshiki. At best the special technique is Karma. As for the IT, it is basically a planetary side genjutsu. Just a massive powerup of a Sharingan tech. It isn't unique. I was expecting more. Taking in the God Tree, again, didn't really see anything about it. I mean she blew up into a rabbit? Big woop! Toneri did the same thing when he started absorbing the sun's power and he isn't even at 3rd eye level or even complete Tenseigan RSM level.

In terms of ocular, yes. The Yin Otsutsukis get the Rinnegan while the Yang gets whatever RSM they got. I don't think Kinshiki had any ocular techniques.

However, this still makes Tenseigan an unknown. Should the entire series have included the Tenseigan from the very beginning, would Kaguya have it or is it strictly a Hamura lineage thing? Does having the Gedo Mazou unlock his ocular powers? If so, how come Kaguya didn't get it when her body is the Gedo Mazou (well, people can argue that it is the God Tree but we know that the God Tree is the bloom of an Otsutsuki chakra fruit).

If youre worried about power levels not evening out (Rinne / Byakugan)
No, even if we do Rinne/Tensei, they shouldn't even out. Since the rule is that Yin = Yang. Having Rinnegan being the Yin, then Yang RSM is equal to it and not the Tenseigan. Making the Tenseigan equal to the Yin RSM.

Basically, Hagoromo = Hamura. Hagoromo being the ocular user while Hamura being the enhanced user. This proves true to the backstory of Hagoromo having Rinnegan and Hamura not having the Tenseigan.
This also proves true to the 2nd generation (Indra and Asura). Indra having the Mangekyu and Asura having the Avatar.
This isn't a local thing as well. This also proves true to the "Hyuga" and "Uzumaki" where one has the eyes and the other has the enhancement. (Toneri having CM and having to steal a Byakugan from a "royal" line).

But again, if we are only speaking on terms of ocular power scaling, clearly Rinne = Tensei and not Byakugan. If we add Ikemoto's contribution:

Rinnegan = Tenseigan
Mangekyu = Jougan
Sharigan = Byakugan

Basically, if Neji and Hinata could see over several kilometres, then aliens should be able to see over entire countries
I don't doubt this one bit since they are purebreds and isn't diluted with other traits that can weaken or take away the effectiveness of the Byakugan powers. I think this is even more expected otherwise that's BS to have the scaling be the same no matter how diluted your blood gets. Totally messes the whole point of "closer to the blood of the originator (3-eyed GT Kaguya), the similar the power is"

Doesn't the symbolism of the 6 paths speak against the likelihood of other aliens?
Well this is just a theory that the 6 people had their own unique powers (path). Even if they are unique powers, it still does not mean that they banded together out of their own desire. It is most likely a societal culture that they follow this system.

Remember Kinshiki's remark about his predecessor? Meaning that there WERE other people like them. So it is confirmed that it isn't just the 6 of them originally. Kinshiki had a predecessor means that there were other people comprising that 3 pairs team.

Whether or not that group is unique is another matter. Are there more ACTIVE 3 pair teams or is it only 1 at a time?
Is it by generation? Kinshiki seem to mentioned that there have been a moment where a pair had to transcend forcefully (which is probably a big deal and shouldn't be taken likely based on their reaction).

So 2 things:
1) there WERE other members
2) there could still be Otstusukis and have their own teams (not necessarily comprising of 6 but they most definitely be at the very least a pair)

Such that if others exist, they are not related to paths?
That still remains to be seen. I'm sure there are fodder Otsutskis who can't use any paths. But there are certainly other Otsutsukis out there based on Kinshiki's remark.

As for paths, I don't think because they are unique that it prohibits others to not be able to be one. They could just be based on affinity.

Unless you are implying something like a Jin where only 1 could be a Jin of a TB at a time. So like the Rinnegan(s) were implanted or inherited somehow and the same for the RSM. The rest of the Otsutskis were truly just fodders and there were 6 individuals that were chosen in their civilization to cultivate and harvest and guard for the Otsutsuki race.

That is also possible. But I think the former would be most likely. How there are other Otsutsukis that have their own power/path.

Even so, they are always explained within the story.

Sasuke, for example, got his 1 eye Rinne-Sha because he did not naturally awaken his eyes.
yeah exactly but that's no excuse for Boruto. His wasn't a forced awakening. He truly is capable of that since he is the older sibling (meaning that he will get the ocular power while Himawari will get the enhancement power). His mother is powered by Hamura and his father is buffed by Hagoromo.

So if we do the counter of Yin-Yang, the count would be:
1 Yin Hamura
1 Yang Hamura (this is assuming that the powerup that Hinata got is complete and that Toneri's clan IS NOT tied to the Uzumaki
1 Yang Hagoromo (seal power up/Uzumaki is Senju: RS reincarnator plot)
1 Namikaze clan

So he is 3/4 Otsutsuki (doesn't really matter which plotline you choose for the Uzumaki since Yin Hagoromo is the one missing). This is also true for Himawari BTW. It's just hers would be the enhancement one. She already have proven that it would be the case since she knocked out Naruto and Kurama using taijutsu (yes I know it's a comedy gag and she used Byakugan but it really is just to assist the attack and not being used as the actual attack)

For the last part, i think your Yin within Yang within Yin theory covers it quite well. Even if Kaguya was a Yin/Yang, her kids can/will have a duality of powers.
So scenario #2? The exchange of seals?
 
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Yahcob13

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Hinata's twin lion fists always reminded me of susanoo. It makes me wonder if someone more powerful used that technique could it rival susanoo. The interesting thing about susanoo is that every MS user can use one. Its as if the ability is an evolution of some sort. I am of the mindset that the ten tails has an agenda and seeks to fulfill it via evolution. Sasuke substituting the gedo mazo with susanoo was a stroke of brilliance. Perhaps the tomoe rinnegan is the real reason he was able to accomplish such a feat.
 

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not really. The thing about the last arc of Naruto is that it's so messed up. Most of the revelations came as the story develops while the planned ones ending up being kept secret for the sake of not spoiling the movies.

As far as we know, Tenseigan came about later in Hamura's life. Whether or not it's a mutation is never revealed. It seemed to be just like Hagoromo's side of the family. Meaning that the Tenseigan is truly something that is natural rather than a special case.
I mean the whole ritual of the "Hyugas" had their eyes put into the Tenseigan Orb for the sake of not trying to get the Tenseigan. On top of that, the entire process is the same deal and that is to get the other parts from the other family (in Toneri's case, the reverse Madara where Toneri ending up stealing the eyes like Madara stole Hashirama's chunk of his body).



yeah since Yin Otsutsukis have the Rinnegan naturally while the Yang Otsutsuki have the RSM (whatever they could be).
Kinshiki and Kaguya didn't really reveal anything unqiue. Both of them were fodder. Just a TenTen or recap of Part 1 (bone and palm stuff).

Heck, we still didn't get any special techniques of the 3rd eye from Kaguya's/Madara's and Momoshiki. At best the special technique is Karma. As for the IT, it is basically a planetary side genjutsu. Just a massive powerup of a Sharingan tech. It isn't unique. I was expecting more. Taking in the God Tree, again, didn't really see anything about it. I mean she blew up into a rabbit? Big woop! Toneri did the same thing when he started absorbing the sun's power and he isn't even at 3rd eye level or even complete Tenseigan RSM level.

In terms of ocular, yes. The Yin Otsutsukis get the Rinnegan while the Yang gets whatever RSM they got. I don't think Kinshiki had any ocular techniques.

However, this still makes Tenseigan an unknown. Should the entire series have included the Tenseigan from the very beginning, would Kaguya have it or is it strictly a Hamura lineage thing? Does having the Gedo Mazou unlock his ocular powers? If so, how come Kaguya didn't get it when her body is the Gedo Mazou (well, people can argue that it is the God Tree but we know that the God Tree is the bloom of an Otsutsuki chakra fruit).


No, even if we do Rinne/Tensei, they shouldn't even out. Since the rule is that Yin = Yang. Having Rinnegan being the Yin, then Yang RSM is equal to it and not the Tenseigan. Making the Tenseigan equal to the Yin RSM.

Basically, Hagoromo = Hamura. Hagoromo being the ocular user while Hamura being the enhanced user. This proves true to the backstory of Hagoromo having Rinnegan and Hamura not having the Tenseigan.
This also proves true to the 2nd generation (Indra and Asura). Indra having the Mangekyu and Asura having the Avatar.
This isn't a local thing as well. This also proves true to the "Hyuga" and "Uzumaki" where one has the eyes and the other has the enhancement. (Toneri having CM and having to steal a Byakugan from a "royal" line).

But again, if we are only speaking on terms of ocular power scaling, clearly Rinne = Tensei and not Byakugan. If we add Ikemoto's contribution:

Rinnegan = Tenseigan
Mangekyu = Jougan
Sharigan = Byakugan



I don't doubt this one bit since they are purebreds and isn't diluted with other traits that can weaken or take away the effectiveness of the Byakugan powers. I think this is even more expected otherwise that's BS to have the scaling be the same no matter how diluted your blood gets. Totally messes the whole point of "closer to the blood of the originator (3-eyed GT Kaguya), the similar the power is"



Well this is just a theory that the 6 people had their own unique powers (path). Even if they are unique powers, it still does not mean that they banded together out of their own desire. It is most likely a societal culture that they follow this system.

Remember Kinshiki's remark about his predecessor? Meaning that there WERE other people like them. So it is confirmed that it isn't just the 6 of them originally. Kinshiki had a predecessor means that there were other people comprising that 3 pairs team.

Whether or not that group is unique is another matter. Are there more ACTIVE 3 pair teams or is it only 1 at a time?
Is it by generation? Kinshiki seem to mentioned that there have been a moment where a pair had to transcend forcefully (which is probably a big deal and shouldn't be taken likely based on their reaction).

So 2 things:
1) there WERE other members
2) there could still be Otstusukis and have their own teams (not necessarily comprising of 6 but they most definitely be at the very least a pair)



That still remains to be seen. I'm sure there are fodder Otsutskis who can't use any paths. But there are certainly other Otsutsukis out there based on Kinshiki's remark.

As for paths, I don't think because they are unique that it prohibits others to not be able to be one. They could just be based on affinity.

Unless you are implying something like a Jin where only 1 could be a Jin of a TB at a time. So like the Rinnegan(s) were implanted or inherited somehow and the same for the RSM. The rest of the Otsutskis were truly just fodders and there were 6 individuals that were chosen in their civilization to cultivate and harvest and guard for the Otsutsuki race.

That is also possible. But I think the former would be most likely. How there are other Otsutsukis that have their own power/path.



yeah exactly but that's no excuse for Boruto. His wasn't a forced awakening. He truly is capable of that since he is the older sibling (meaning that he will get the ocular power while Himawari will get the enhancement power). His mother is powered by Hamura and his father is buffed by Hagoromo.

So if we do the counter of Yin-Yang, the count would be:
1 Yin Hamura
1 Yang Hamura (this is assuming that the powerup that Hinata got is complete and that Toneri's clan IS NOT tied to the Uzumaki
1 Yang Hagoromo (seal power up/Uzumaki is Senju: RS reincarnator plot)
1 Namikaze clan

So he is 3/4 Otsutsuki (doesn't really matter which plotline you choose for the Uzumaki since Yin Hagoromo is the one missing). This is also true for Himawari BTW. It's just hers would be the enhancement one. She already have proven that it would be the case since she knocked out Naruto and Kurama using taijutsu (yes I know it's a comedy gag and she used Byakugan but it really is just to assist the attack and not being used as the actual attack)



So scenario #2? The exchange of seals?
Interesting.

Just on Boruto: He is a different case to the Isshiki that we were on about. His case could go back to things deeper than even Kaguya.


Hinata's twin lion fists always reminded me of susanoo. It makes me wonder if someone more powerful used that technique could it rival susanoo. The interesting thing about susanoo is that every MS user can use one. Its as if the ability is an evolution of some sort. I am of the mindset that the ten tails has an agenda and seeks to fulfill it via evolution. Sasuke substituting the gedo mazo with susanoo was a stroke of brilliance. Perhaps the tomoe rinnegan is the real reason he was able to accomplish such a feat.
That's a key difference, that Hyuga powers are learned while MS powers are unlocked.
So with scale, any ability can beat an unlocked power since the latter is fixed in scale while learned abilities (normal techniques, really) always have a power depending on the level of the user.
 

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That's a key difference, that Hyuga powers are learned while MS powers are unlocked.
So with scale, any ability can beat an unlocked power since the latter is fixed in scale while learned abilities (normal techniques, really) always have a power depending on the level of the user
True
 

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He is a different case to the Isshiki that we were on about. His case could go back to things deeper than even Kaguya.
Care to expand on that while we still have a chance? LOL!

I mean IDK what is going to happen now that Kishi is in the helm of things. The writing is going to get extremely inconsistent and just outright unnecessarily complicated due to: "oh, I'm working on another project so I can't reveal it to you so you should just get something boring" (talking about Kaguya's Part 1 feats instead of something new) or "oh, I'm such a fun writer and being able to make you feel different ways about my work" (like messing about with Sarada's origin story in Gaiden and not giving concrete answers).

Hell, as long as we get Ramen Noodle guy to be THE god of Narutoverse, I shall make a pass of his past transgressions.
 
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Care to expand on that while we still have a chance? LOL!

I mean IDK what is going to happen now that Kishi is in the helm of things. The writing is going to get extremely inconsistent and just outright unnecessarily complicated due to: "oh, I'm working on another project so I can't reveal it to you so you should just get something boring" (talking about Kaguya's Part 1 feats instead of something new) or "oh, I'm such a fun writer and being able to make you feel different ways about my work" (like messing about with Sarada's origin story in Gaiden and not giving concrete answers).

Hell, as long as we get Ramen Noodle guy to be THE god of Narutoverse, I shall make a pass of his past transgressions.
Care to expand on that while we still have a chance? LOL!

I mean IDK what is going to happen now that Kishi is in the helm of things. The writing is going to get extremely inconsistent and just outright unnecessarily complicated due to: "oh, I'm working on another project so I can't reveal it to you so you should just get something boring" (talking about Kaguya's Part 1 feats instead of something new) or "oh, I'm such a fun writer and being able to make you feel different ways about my work" (like messing about with Sarada's origin story in Gaiden and not giving concrete answers).

Hell, as long as we get Ramen Noodle guy to be THE god of Narutoverse, I shall make a pass of his past transgressions.
Just that the source of his powers is unclear, while Isshiki is definitely Otsutsuki so his powers can be directly explained by his recent blood lineage.

Otherwise, if something doesn't make sense, that mostly means we still have some learning to do, not necessarily that there is a fault with it.
 

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If Boruto and Sasuke fuse then I expect some sort of OP susanoo form. I know this will sound crazy but it appears that Boruto's karma only affects half of his body. That could be because the karma seal hasn't had time to mature as it did with Jigen and Kawaki. But it could also be that he's already part Otsutsuki and his Otsutsuki half isn't susceptible to the karma seal. Or he's part bijuu and that isn't affected by karma either. The byakugan in one eye, half body transformation, even after the time skip he appears to have control of himself. I think the secret is in his genetics. Momoshiki taunted Naruto saying that humans weren't capable of passing on their power. It has something to do with the six paths power that Hago passed on to Naruto and Sasuke. While they may not have access to it in full it may have given them genetic information that they unknowingly passed on. It may be six paths power that keeps Boruto from being overwritten.
 
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