Team Danzo vs Akatsuki Pairs

[Brother Numpsay]

That seal was broken out of by willpower on Sasuke's part...Who was tired as ****, Please don't go thinking the seal is OP, As your making it sound like there is no way to counter it, If its a physical chakra seal, Kakuzu can simply fire jutsu at it from one of his hearts who would of course be on the outside of him already, as nothing suggests it inhibits chakra flow entirely.

And lmao at you saying he would just target the Fire mask, with what? Oh yeah..>FUUTON which gets countered in every single possible way, he can't do shit to Kakuzu with that being his only offensive maneuver...Its that simple...One Elemental people get KO'd pretty quickly against Kakuzu.

Your saying Danzo would end hidan while fighting Kakuzu? Gian is faster then anything Danzo has.....

Kakuzu has no method of breaking juinjutsu...

Concerning Sealing Technique ​

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Spoiler

• 1. Absorbing: I have seen someone argued before, that characters with the ability to absorb chakra, are able to do it to Sealing Technique. It seems that this is false. Sealing is one of the exceptions of being cancel through absorption because of the way it "acts". It has the ability respond through certain commands/demands and even used to counter/block Chakra itself. The best evidence, to avoid elaboration, would be Killer Bee's
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  encountering Kisames
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  . We know that when physical contact is made in absorption, any chakra-based/used chakra should be eaten up. That whole fight was demonstrated in Kisame vs Bee and you can see it in SM Naruto vs Pein. If absorbing the seal is possible would mean that the seal for Naruto and Bee should of been broken, thus removing their tail beast from their bodies. Thus said, Sealing Jutsu CANNOT be absorbed.

• 2."Breaking":The manga so far has shown only ONE way, will clear up the exception of vs Sasuke, of breaking/beating Sealing Techs. To beat a Seal jutsu is to beat it with another seal, I could only find two examples [
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  ] [
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  ]. I seen some people claiming since Sasuke method worked, meaning all they need to do to break Danzo's curse is to "power up" your chakra level. Wrong, what made Sasuke able to break it was through two things, and that is listening to Tobirama's analysis. [
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  ]<-- He explains that they arose and unlock a special chakra through emotion. IF you look carefully in Danzo's fight Sasuke you see it happening at 476 pg 6-8, remembering what Itachi sacrifice for him. That said to counter this jutsu requires the "emotional state of mind" and "the special chakra", both applying to break this curse.

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Danzo's Juinjutsu is dangerous. The battle can end just by landing one-hit/imprint. Once sealed means you cannot use jutsu to escape (Example would be Sasuke's Genjutsu canceling once Danzo activated the seal [

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]), the only chances were the requirements that I listed above, which is slim to none.

Now for your second paragraph: I took both scenarios into consideration, Kakuzu does have CQC style so I took in character into consideration, that he doesn't jump start his Masks. So at the end it is still an effective counter. As for if he does have it out already, wouldn't matter much. Having a superior element doesn't mean nothing but ONLY for the logic of collision. You can have a lighting sword and still fight agains't a wind user. Its as long as your don't collide with it. With that said an Izanagi spawn from the Fire mask's back is still vulnerable to any of Danzo's arsenals, wither its wind release or not.

Im just picking up scenarios. Fuu and Torune can do fine on their own against and in fact immobilize him with poison. The momment Lightening Release is charge the jutsu gets torn by Danzo's Wind. Depending on it hitting head on [

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] or if its traveling multiple areas [

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] [

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]

 

[Zexion~]

Kakuzu has no method of breaking juinjutsu...

Concerning Sealing Technique ​

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Spoiler

• 1. Absorbing: I have seen someone argued before, that characters with the ability to absorb chakra, are able to do it to Sealing Technique. It seems that this is false. Sealing is one of the exceptions of being cancel through absorption because of the way it "acts". It has the ability respond through certain commands/demands and even used to counter/block Chakra itself. The best evidence, to avoid elaboration, would be Killer Bee's
  You must be registered for see links
  encountering Kisames
  You must be registered for see links
  . We know that when physical contact is made in absorption, any chakra-based/used chakra should be eaten up. That whole fight was demonstrated in Kisame vs Bee and you can see it in SM Naruto vs Pein. If absorbing the seal is possible would mean that the seal for Naruto and Bee should of been broken, thus removing their tail beast from their bodies. Thus said, Sealing Jutsu CANNOT be absorbed.

• 2."Breaking":The manga so far has shown only ONE way, will clear up the exception of vs Sasuke, of breaking/beating Sealing Techs. To beat a Seal jutsu is to beat it with another seal, I could only find two examples [
  You must be registered for see links
  ] [
  You must be registered for see links
  ]. I seen some people claiming since Sasuke method worked, meaning all they need to do to break Danzo's curse is to "power up" your chakra level. Wrong, what made Sasuke able to break it was through two things, and that is listening to Tobirama's analysis. [
  You must be registered for see links
  ]<-- He explains that they arose and unlock a special chakra through emotion. IF you look carefully in Danzo's fight Sasuke you see it happening at 476 pg 6-8, remembering what Itachi sacrifice for him. That said to counter this jutsu requires the "emotional state of mind" and "the special chakra", both applying to break this curse.

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Danzo's Juinjutsu is dangerous. The battle can end just by landing one-hit/imprint. Once sealed means you cannot use jutsu to escape (Example would be Sasuke's Genjutsu canceling once Danzo activated the seal [

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]), the only chances were the requirements that I listed above, which is slim to none.

Now for your second paragraph: I took both scenarios into consideration, Kakuzu does have CQC style so I took in character into consideration, that he doesn't jump start his Masks. So at the end it is still an effective counter. As for if he does have it out already, wouldn't matter much. Having a superior element doesn't mean nothing but ONLY for the logic of collision. You can have a lighting sword and still fight agains't a wind user. Its as long as your don't collide with it. With that said an Izanagi spawn from the Fire mask's back is still vulnerable to any of Danzo's arsenals, wither its wind release or not.

Im just picking up scenarios. Fuu and Torune can do fine on their own against and in fact immobilize him with poison. The momment Lightening Release is charge the jutsu gets torn by Danzo's Wind. Depending on it hitting head on [

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] or if its traveling multiple areas [

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] [

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]

So what your saying is that this seal is unbreakable? Idc to argue this that much, as it seems that you are most likely right...However that means that he basically wins every match, however he simply wouldn't Engage in CQC with Danzo, As he has threads and jutsu to negate this, i really don't believe the Izanagi allows him to spawn anywhere he pleases, as if that were the case he should of ended Sasuke rather easily...When he was out of Susano, however i can't prove this atm....So i'll just say that Kakuzu's reactions are far from average.

As for that second point i know what instance you are referring too with the lightning blade, and let me tell you it was utter BS, danzo should of won that little stand off with Sasuke...

Regardless this is different, the fuuton would be coming at Kakuzu and he would launch a katon, which upon impact would explode back at Danzo.

As for that "Appearing behind danzo" First off this isn't happening while the Katon heart is flying in the air...Which tbh is what it should do in most fights...Second he would be unable to see the mask of the creature nor would he have any reason to only aim for the mask in general, which means he could aim for the mid-section and the attack would fall ineffective

 

[Brother Numpsay]

So what your saying is that this seal is unbreakable? Idc to argue this that much, as it seems that you are most likely right...However that means that he basically wins every match, however he simply wouldn't Engage in CQC with Danzo, As he has threads and jutsu to negate this, i really don't believe the Izanagi allows him to spawn anywhere he pleases, as if that were the case he should of ended Sasuke rather easily...When he was out of Susano, however i can't prove this atm....So i'll just say that Kakuzu's reactions are far from average.

Your right, Kakuzu does not need to engage that close as he has Jingou. But at the end of the day Kakuzu is going to kill him/strangle him. So when that happens. [

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]<-.. It was shown already that he can spawn anywhere, it was the fact that he was dealing with Sasukes defense that made it useless to do it. You see it here [

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] to here [

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]. Here [

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] to here [

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]. And at this point it was getting to cheap lol. Kakuzu has good reaction but he can still get caught with a unexpected surprise attack.

As for that second point i know what instance you are referring too with the lightning blade, and let me tell you it was utter BS, danzo should of won that little stand off with Sasuke...

I could make other examples. Asuma vs Hidan. Asuma had the upper hand in enchanted weapons, but Hidan used his skill to create a "medium" for a weapon so when it collided with Asuma's, that would break instead of his main weapon. They are others, but you get the point. Don't attack it head on with the inferior element..

Regardless this is different, the fuuton would be coming at Kakuzu and he would launch a katon, which upon impact would explode back at Danzo.

Once again Danzo is not going to use his Wind if Kakuzu is going to use his Fire head on.

As for that "Appearing behind danzo" First off this isn't happening while the Katon heart is flying in the air...Which tbh is what it should do in most fights...Second he would be unable to see the mask of the creature nor would he have any reason to only aim for the mask in general, which means he could aim for the mid-section and the attack would fall ineffective

Most fights it fly's and comes down closer to attack once more, example here [

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]. I personally believe 3/4 mask super jump. Danzo can also gain enough air [

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]<-- Scan showing him using jet stream so that it is able to spawn enough at its range.

 

[awesomeseimei]

Ok so let's pretend that while Danzo fights Kakuzu Fu and Torune manage to poison Hidan (with full intel they know they can't let him take their blood). For example Fu uses Mind Transfer (I do believe was can assume that he's at least as fast with it as War Ino), lets Torune get close and releases the jutsu at the last moment. So poor Hidan is now locked in a struggle with nanobugs, and Fu and Torune go help Danzo. I've got way too many scenarios of Danzo vs Kakuzu fight going through my head but as long as Danzo is still okayish they might have a chance to get Kakuzu with nanobugs as well (while he's distracted).

Argh, I don't really like debating. There are simply too many options and unknown factors. For example we can't possibly know whether nanobugs affect Kakuzu's wires or not (I'm pretty sure they can affect hearts though). But I'd say there is a chance for team Root to win this one.

Deidara and Sasori on the other hand, not so much. Once Deidara flies they won't reach him. Danzo might deflect (blow away) Sasori's needle attack but once Sasori unleashes his full arsenal it's over.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

There are simply too many options and unknown factors. For example we can't possibly know whether nanobugs affect Kakuzu's wires or not (I'm pretty sure they can affect hearts though).

We actually can know how the nanobugs will effect Kakuzu due to the effects he dealt with against Naruto's jutsu: [

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]

Deidara and Sasori on the other hand, not so much. Once Deidara flies they won't reach him. Danzo might deflect (blow away) Sasori's needle attack but once Sasori unleashes his full arsenal it's over.

They actual can, until Danzo decided to use Baku in the right radius of the suction, dragging him down closer. I can see them puling a victory here. As for Sasori that is true, but not against Danzo. So Danzo has to imprint him before Sasori gets to that point. And yes seals do work on Sasori. We seen it twice used from Chiyo that

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or

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[awesomeseimei]

They actual can, until Danzo decided to use Baku in the right radius of the suction, dragging him down closer. I can see them puling a victory here. As for Sasori that is true, but not against Danzo. So Danzo has to imprint him before Sasori gets to that point. And yes seals do work on Sasori. We seen it twice used from Chiyo that

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or

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Hm, let's see, Danzo has Baku use suction on Deidara but Deidara throws a bomb into Baku's mouth, just like Sasuke did with a fireball. So there's that. Also Deidara might be able to switch with a suicide bombing clone like he did vs Team Guy (with no arms I must add). As to Sasori, I'm pretty sure he will try to keep Danzo on the distance. Let's say Danzo manages to break Hiruko with wind jutsu (with intel he knows about the real Sasori). Sasori jumps away and whips out the Third Kazekage with iron sand, and I don't really see Danzo countering it in all of its entirety. Also, if the seal paralyzes Sasori, he might still be able to use chakra strings, as he was seen just sprouting them from his body and standing there while controlling 100 puppets. So even if team Root wins somehow it will be extremely high diff.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Hm, let's see, Danzo has Baku use suction on Deidara but Deidara throws a bomb into Baku's mouth, just like Sasuke did with a fireball. So there's that. Also Deidara might be able to switch with a suicide bombing clone like he did vs Team Guy (with no arms I must add). As to Sasori, I'm pretty sure he will try to keep Danzo on the distance. Let's say Danzo manages to break Hiruko with wind jutsu (with intel he knows about the real Sasori). Sasori jumps away and whips out the Third Kazekage with iron sand, and I don't really see Danzo countering it in all of its entirety. Also, if the seal paralyzes Sasori, he might still be able to use chakra strings, as he was seen just sprouting them from his body and standing there while controlling 100 puppets. So even if team Root wins somehow it will be extremely high diff.

Explosives acts different then a Fire-ball, so it wouldn't have the same effective (maybe c2 but differently c3/4). But check out my analyze I made for Baku:

Baku Viewed As A One Trick Pony?​

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Spoiler

CQC?: I have seen discussions that Baku is only good for one thing and that is his suction. The fact is Baku is a Chimera. A Chimera are mythical creatures with part animal limbs, making it a mix hybrid. Because it is mix, it is able to use every limbs to what animal part they have mix with. If a Chimera has a serpents tail, it is able act as a separate entity and strike as a snake [

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] <-- Example of Chimera. With that said lets look at at Baku [

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]<--The circle show that it is hybrid with a Tiger. Having Tiger limbs enables him to attack like tigers [

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]<--Evidence shows griping its paws like a tiger, for CQC purposes. And with Elephant trunks, that is an elephant main arsenal, being larger then v3 Sussanoo proves it be also be use as a weapon. This characteristic, and the fact that its a Chimera can easily triumph over most summons in the series.


"Exhale": The way Baku jutsu works when it opens its mouth and inhales, it can create a powerful suction that sucks in everything within a large radius, while at the same time exhaling through its trunk.[

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]. I underlined Inhales and Exhales for a reason. These two things plays a factor on how this jutsu works, it explains how Baku is continuously using the suction, when at the same time, explains where it exits. So logcially speaking, by reversing the function of the jutsu Baku is able to blow out a power gust of wind to push away anything in its radius. By simply using his Trunk to Inhale all the air and his mouth to Exhale, making the "Exit" way.

Metabolism: His Metabolism should not be underestimate. [

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]. It was able to take in rocks, boulders, and trees, and pretty much everything in that location. And not once did effect him the slightest. That concludes that he can take in things that are unnatural or having a metabolism on a whole different scale in the Naruto-series.

Deidara has to have Clay on the ground in order to do that. My premise is what they can take advantage of him in the air, using Baku suction. Dragging Deidara back down makes Deidara vulnerable.

That is true about Sasori but I was merely talking about Sasori ending up getting a kill from Danzo. When that happens, will be the perfect opportunity to catch him [

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]

I agree with the difficulty.

 

[awesomeseimei]

Explosives acts different then a Fire-ball, so it wouldn't have the same effective (maybe c2 but differently c3/4).

In reality it's true, but in Naruto explosions are pretty much fireballs. Check out Deidara's clone exploding:

Spoiler

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That's why I ever mentioned this clone. Deidara is quick to realize that he is getting sucked in, and he might be able to swap himself with a clone, since he managed to do it quickly during both team Guy fight and he was even able to trick Sasuke with it. So he has quite impressive speed with it.

Dragging Deidara down would make him only a bit more vulnerable. He still has a lot of bombs. Sasuke had to do things like shielding himself with a snake, and he even lost a CS form wing. Sure Danzo can Izanagi himself out of it, but only a limited amount of time, plus there's also Sasori.

And as much as I love Fu and Torune they are barely a factor in a match like this. On the other hand if Sasori is vulnerable to Mind Transfer and stands still (as a puppeteer, you know), they might get him provided they aren't being bombarded by Deidara at that time.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

In reality it's true, but in Naruto explosions are pretty much fireballs. Check out Deidara's clone exploding:

Spoiler

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That's why I ever mentioned this clone. Deidara is quick to realize that he is getting sucked in, and he might be able to swap himself with a clone, since he managed to do it quickly during both team Guy fight and he was even able to trick Sasuke with it. So he has quite impressive speed with it.

Dragging Deidara down would make him only a bit more vulnerable. He still has a lot of bombs. Sasuke had to do things like shielding himself with a snake, and he even lost a CS form wing. Sure Danzo can Izanagi himself out of it, but only a limited amount of time, plus there's also Sasori.

And as much as I love Fu and Torune they are barely a factor in a match like this. On the other hand if Sasori is vulnerable to Mind Transfer and stands still (as a puppeteer, you know), they might get him provided they aren't being bombarded by Deidara at that time.

Cant see the link but I think you were talking about clone suicide explosion.

Deidara setting clones don't just happen, he finds opportunity to do it. vs Guy and hid behind the the clay on the floor, vs Sasuke he took advantage in the mist of his land mine explosions, and via against Onoki he did it off screen because he expected them coming to attack them soon.

Deidara switching out with clones would still mean he is near by via inside his clay bird, original is still vulnerable.

Fu and Torune can use basic ninja tools for c1 [

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] until Deidara takes it up a level.

But your right they are barely a non factor that only could posses some support to create an argument for Danzo taking this.

I don't think mind transfers work on Sasori but I do think Puppet-Mind transfer does, but a chances of doing that in combat is like Itachi trying to catch someone with Izanami.

In thee end my goal was to make it a debatable battle

 

[awesomeseimei]

Cant see the link but I think you were talking about clone suicide explosion.

Deidara setting clones don't just happen, he finds opportunity to do it. vs Guy and hid behind the the clay on the floor, vs Sasuke he took advantage in the mist of his land mine explosions, and via against Onoki he did it off screen because he expected them coming to attack them soon.

Deidara switching out with clones would still mean he is near by via inside his clay bird, original is still vulnerable.

Fu and Torune can use basic ninja tools for c1 [

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] until Deidara takes it up a level.

But your right they are barely a non factor that only could posses some support to create an argument for Danzo taking this.

I don't think mind transfers work on Sasori but I do think Puppet-Mind transfer does, but a chances of doing that in combat is like Itachi trying to catch someone with Izanami.

In thee end my goal was to make it a debatable battle

On the subject of Mind Transfer working on Sasori, I guess the closest thing we've seen is Ino using the Mind-Clone Switch on two Zetsu clones. Do these have actual physical brains? It doesn't seem so, as they are made of white goo/Hashi's cells. The Spiral Zetsu who was with Obito could even split open his head. Still Ino could transfer her mind into them. I know Sasori is different, but his "core" might contain all organs he needs to live, and he clearly had a "mind" (and soul since he was Edoed, I'm still not sure whether mind and soul are the same in NV or not). So maybe Mind Transfer would work. So if they get a chance they might have Torune hit Sasori's core with the bugs or take it out/crush it (since they have intel and know that they need to go for the core). But again, for this to happen Hiruko must be destroyed first, plus Deidara eliminated/distracted.

On subject of Deidara's clone, this too depends on how exactly the fight plays out. What if he doesn't even start flying right away? He starts with C1 to "test" his enemies, as seen with Sasuke. If Danzo decides to pull out Baku early Deidara can make a clone it time. Also, team Root has no lightning chakra, that is, no means to defuse bombs.

Still, they have a slim chance of winning it maybe? However I don't see them winning against Itachi and Kisame at all. Itachi tends to cast genjutsu at the start of his fights and Fu and Torune can't resist that (which we know thanks to Obito). If Danzo breaks genjutsu somehow it's still 1 vs 2 and those two are very powerful.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

On the subject of Mind Transfer working on Sasori, I guess the closest thing we've seen is Ino using the Mind-Clone Switch on two Zetsu clones. Do these have actual physical brains? It doesn't seem so, as they are made of white goo/Hashi's cells. The Spiral Zetsu who was with Obito could even split open his head. Still Ino could transfer her mind into them. I know Sasori is different, but his "core" might contain all organs he needs to live, and he clearly had a "mind" (and soul since he was Edoed, I'm still not sure whether mind and soul are the same in NV or not). So maybe Mind Transfer would work. So if they get a chance they might have Torune hit Sasori's core with the bugs or take it out/crush it (since they have intel and know that they need to go for the core). But again, for this to happen Hiruko must be destroyed first, plus Deidara eliminated/distracted.

I think Ino was able to do it due to the cells that Zetsu posses. Its human DNA which may give a reason why it worked. Sasuke was also able to put it under a genjutsu so there is more evidence that cells are required here. As for Sasori he does not posses cells but one core that breaks the law of nature. Using a wooden puppet as a medium doesn't carry anything with human cells. Thats a good counter for Torune since the nanobugs can also eat him the wooden body like termites . Don't forget Torune also has his anime feats and can use something like this too [

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].

On subject of Deidara's clone, this too depends on how exactly the fight plays out. What if he doesn't even start flying right away? He starts with C1 to "test" his enemies, as seen with Sasuke. If Danzo decides to pull out Baku early Deidara can make a clone it time. Also, team Root has no lightning chakra, that is, no means to defuse bombs.

That is plausible but I don't think Danzo needs to desperately start with his Summon. He just needs it for tight situation like Deidara flying. I don't think defusing the bombs is that important, unless Deidara is planing on Suicide..

Still, they have a slim chance of winning it maybe? However I don't see them winning against Itachi and Kisame at all. Itachi tends to cast genjutsu at the start of his fights and Fu and Torune can't resist that (which we know thanks to Obito). If Danzo breaks genjutsu somehow it's still 1 vs 2 and those two are very powerful.

To be fair Obito played dirty and caught them in his Kamui, so in his dimension he can do anything to them at that point. Danzo has full knowledge on Itachi and Kisame, even Manga Knowledge=Full intel, so they can exchange knowledge and prepare counters. If Itachi plans on using his genjtusu Danzo's Sharingan will see through it and break them out, example of Sasuke helping Juugo out [

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] [

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]. I always thought that Torune and Fuu focus on Kisame. Torune can be a bad match up to Kisame as Samehada and him can be effected by his poison. Also it can spread on Kisames water source making it worst. Which is why I already think this match up is debatable

 

[awesomeseimei]

I think Ino was able to do it due to the cells that Zetsu posses. Its human DNA which may give a reason why it worked. Sasuke was also able to put it under a genjutsu so there is more evidence that cells are required here. As for Sasori he does not posses cells but one core that breaks the law of nature. Using a wooden puppet as a medium doesn't carry anything with human cells. Thats a good counter for Torune since the nanobugs can also eat him the wooden body like termites . Don't forget Torune also has his anime feats and can use something like this too [

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].



That is plausible but I don't think Danzo needs to desperately start with his Summon. He just needs it for tight situation like Deidara flying. I don't think defusing the bombs is that important, unless Deidara is planing on Suicide..



To be fair Obito played dirty and caught them in his Kamui, so in his dimension he can do anything to them at that point. Danzo has full knowledge on Itachi and Kisame, even Manga Knowledge=Full intel, so they can exchange knowledge and prepare counters. If Itachi plans on using his genjtusu Danzo's Sharingan will see through it and break them out, example of Sasuke helping Juugo out [

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] [

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]. I always thought that Torune and Fuu focus on Kisame. Torune can be a bad match up to Kisame as Samehada and him can be effected by his poison. Also it can spread on Kisames water source making it worst. Which is why I already think this match up is debatable

Well if Torune gets clone to Sasori's real body he can just tap the core right away. I don't think nanobugs can eat wood tbh since they are, well, nano-sized (unless they also act like nano-mites from that G. I Joe movie), and they don't have corrosive acid. But I may be wrong. Sasori still has cells and presumably brain in his core (having literally only a heart there wouldn't make any sense at all), and he is an individual with memories and everything, therefore I believe he does have a mind just like a regular human. Heck Ao's mind was in the puppet and he was fine. So I actually think Mind Transfer can work.

I knew you'd bring up Danzo snapping Fu and Torune out of genjutsu, but that would actually be out of character for him. He didn't care if they died when he threw them at Tobi. It may be a weak argument but that's who Danzo is.

Fu and Torune against Kisame? Well, first, I what is Samehada made of? Can the bugs affect it? If they can, than Kisame will be forced to discard it, but he's already shown that he can fight without it. After that Kisame will try not to touch Torune and he has a good chance of drowning them. Clones? Water Prison? Those things gave people like Kakashi, team Guy and Naruto trouble. Fu and Torune have no feats like Neji's to break it. And the Prison was shown to catch quite fast ninjas in it as well, so intel may be of no help.

And Danzo will struggle greatly against Itachi. I don't really want to be that person but Sasuke did beat Danzo. Itachi (assuming he's healthy) should be even a worse match-up. He even knows about Izanagi, not needing to figure it out, and his Tsukuyomi is stronger (Danzo said that himself). Since Danzo isn't an Uchiha I doubt he'd break Tsukuyomi, not without ill effects at least.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Well if Torune gets clone to Sasori's real body he can just tap the core right away. I don't think nanobugs can eat wood tbh since they are, well, nano-sized (unless they also act like nano-mites from that G. I Joe movie), and they don't have corrosive acid. But I may be wrong. Sasori still has cells and presumably brain in his core (having literally only a heart there wouldn't make any sense at all), and he is an individual with memories and everything, therefore I believe he does have a mind just like a regular human. Heck Ao's mind was in the puppet and he was fine. So I actually think Mind Transfer can work.

I think wood carries cells and through Obito's observation it said that the jutsu continuously gather, eating them up. so I think it should decay the wooden parts that are effected. Sasori's body is very hard to explain someone explained it to me long time ago, it was applied to Kakuzu but the same can apply to Sasori:

Kakuzu's Immunity to Genjutsu | Exploit #3[/FONT][/U][/I][/B]

Spoiler

Kakuzu's Immunity to Genjutsu | Exploit #3

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Kakuzu has an interesting body structure as many of you have already noticed, Kakuzu is able to deploy hearts using his tendrils (he's a rag doll after all) which are known as "ghosts" or masks. Now his body structure is the key to countering ANY, and ALL Genjutsu-based approaches, and here is why.

Take a look at this quote:



The only known organ within Kakuzu's body are hearts (need to use various elemental nature affinities) however, some may argue that it is irregular that he doesn't possess a brain, and that he more than likely possesses one. I say this is false due to that fact that we've seen another Akatsuki member with a "5" in intelligence, along with no bodily functions limited; that shinobi would be Sasori.

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The only living things on Sasori is his core, and what exactly did his core contain? Well it's rather interesting:



So due to the quote above, all that is needed to operate the shinobi body is a chakra storage in which is capable of executing chakra through out their bodies to perform techniques, and bodily movements; basically chakra controls everything. Kakuzu has a similar structure to Sasori, Kakuzu is a rag doll, while Sasori is a puppet they're both entities that we don't believe to have brains correct? (a puppet, or a doll having a brain would be quite absurd).

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His hearts channel chakra throughout his whole body enabling him to control his tendrils (which take chakra to use as well; Jiongu), along with his elemental ninjutsu-based assaults/defenses. This is how his masks were able to fight independently even when he died multiple times, it's due to the fact that "the heart serves as a chakra executor" (all the body needs to function in the NarutoVerse is a chakra storage in which transfers chakra through the body). Here you can see a dead Kakuzu, and his mask (containing each a single heart) acting dependent sort of like a symbiotic attachment like Kisame, and Samehada's relationship:

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To furthermore prove that Kakuzu is truly immune to Genjutsu, take a look at this quote about Kinjutsu (Jiongu is a Kinjutsu after all):



Pay attention heavily to the second category, "violates the laws of nature". Well isn't that exactly what Jiongu does? It allows the user a state of immortality, by the integration of a maximum of 5 hearts, while also allowing the user to take on a rag doll like body structure completely being made up of threads/tendrils. Thus I can conclude that Kakuzu does not have a brain, uses his heart as a chakra executor to transfer chakra into his tendrils to perform bodily movements along with the ability to perform elemental attacks, and grants him immunity to Genjutsu.​

What Ao was caught in was a sealing jutsu and Mind transfer combo. This is one that I think will work. Not the normal mind transfer.... Then again does Mind transfer work the same way as Genjutsu?

I knew you'd bring up Danzo snapping Fu and Torune out of genjutsu, but that would actually be out of character for him. He didn't care if they died when he threw them at Tobi. It may be a weak argument but that's who Danzo is.

I always want to disscuss characters in character, but the fact is Danzo mindset is completely different. It looks like he doesn't but he actually does [

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]. Danzo will save them since he knows he can't do it alone here. And plus he

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them that Madaras jutsu was mysterious there nothing he could of done that they got caught when he was hoping they stall enough time for him to jump in.

Fu and Torune against Kisame? Well, first, I what is Samehada made of? Can the bugs affect it? If they can, than Kisame will be forced to discard it, but he's already shown that he can fight without it. After that Kisame will try not to touch Torune and he has a good chance of drowning them. Clones? Water Prison? Those things gave people like Kakashi, team Guy and Naruto trouble. Fu and Torune have no feats like Neji's to break it. And the Prison was shown to catch quite fast ninjas in it as well, so intel may be of no help.

Kisame wouldn't know what they are capable of them either, until they use them. So one can still craft an argument on how they can deal with Kisame.

And Danzo will struggle greatly against Itachi. I don't really want to be that person but Sasuke did beat Danzo. Itachi (assuming he's healthy) should be even a worse match-up. He even knows about Izanagi, not needing to figure it out, and his Tsukuyomi is stronger (Danzo said that himself). Since Danzo isn't an Uchiha I doubt he'd break Tsukuyomi, not without ill effects at least.

Itachi is in his condition he was in part 2. Danzo can pressure him since MS does stress the character

 

[awesomeseimei]

I think wood carries cells and through Obito's observation it said that the jutsu continuously gather, eating them up. so I think it should decay the wooden parts that are effected. Sasori's body is very hard to explain someone explained it to me long time ago, it was applied to Kakuzu but the same can apply to Sasori:


What Ao was caught in was a sealing jutsu and Mind transfer combo. This is one that I think will work. Not the normal mind transfer.... Then again does Mind transfer work the same way as Genjutsu?



I always want to disscuss characters in character, but the fact is Danzo mindset is completely different. It looks like he doesn't but he actually does [

You must be registered for see links

]. Danzo will save them since he knows he can't do it alone here. And plus he

You must be registered for see links

them that Madaras jutsu was mysterious there nothing he could of done that they got caught when he was hoping they stall enough time for him to jump in.



Kisame wouldn't know what they are capable of them either, until they use them. So one can still craft an argument on how they can deal with Kisame.



Itachi is in his condition he was in part 2. Danzo can pressure him since MS does stress the character

I doubt that Mind Transfer works the same way as genjutsu. Genjutsu disrupts chakra flow in one's brain (and not only). Mind Transfer substitutes the target's mind with the caster's. It's a basic mind swap, and yes it doesn't make scientific sense but in this manga nothing does anyway.

Danzo still took his time to unwrap that arm (in the anime it actually seems that he wasn't in any hurry at all). It almost seemed like he was waiting until Fu and Torune were gone, he viewed them as expendable pawns. Remember, he didn't care if Fu lost his eye, too, even Ao pointed that out. In that page he merely states that, yeah, many ninjas die, and tries to TnJ Sasuke pretty much. Maybe he would snap Fu and Torune out of genjutsu if was really certain that he wouldn't do it alone. But don't forget that Danzo is quite confident in his skill. He was going to take on who he thought to be Madara after all.

I still doubt that Danzo can deal with Tsukuyomi. Amatersu and Susanoo can be countered by Izanagi and Baku I guess.

Still I don't really see a way for Fu and Torune to beat Kisame "Tailless Tailed Beast" Hoshigaki. Say Kisame slaps Torune with Samehada. Okay, let's pretend it is poisoned and Kisame has to toss it aside, but Torune doesn't have Bijuu level chakra so he'll be drained and helpless. Fu can't really do anything alone, right?

 

[Brother Numpsay]

I doubt that Mind Transfer works the same way as genjutsu. Genjutsu disrupts chakra flow in one's brain (and not only). Mind Transfer substitutes the target's mind with the caster's. It's a basic mind swap, and yes it doesn't make scientific sense but in this manga nothing does anyway.

Meh maybe.

Danzo still took his time to unwrap that arm (in the anime it actually seems that he wasn't in any hurry at all). It almost seemed like he was waiting until Fu and Torune were gone, he viewed them as expendable pawns. Remember, he didn't care if Fu lost his eye, too, even Ao pointed that out. In that page he merely states that, yeah, many ninjas die, and tries to TnJ Sasuke pretty much. Maybe he would snap Fu and Torune out of genjutsu if was really certain that he wouldn't do it alone. But don't forget that Danzo is quite confident in his skill. He was going to take on who he thought to be Madara after all.

Danzo taking his time was to build suspense for the readers, nothing more. Danzo is not cruel to leave his comrade die in front of him, especially when they are outnumber in skill.

I still doubt that Danzo can deal with Tsukuyomi. Amatersu and Susanoo can be countered by Izanagi and Baku I guess.

I'm not 100 percent sure either. It said only Uchiha blood can break it. But what if you have the strongest Sharingan jutsu with Shinju DNA boost? Does that count? If not he can always avoid direct eye contact. Amatersu and Sussanoo puts a strain on Itachi, even Obito commenting using multiple/2 at once MS moves takes too much, thus Sussanoo will need a cool-time. here [

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] and then [

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].

Still I don't really see a way for Fu and Torune to beat Kisame "Tailless Tailed Beast" Hoshigaki. Say Kisame slaps Torune with Samehada. Okay, let's pretend it is poisoned and Kisame has to toss it aside, but Torune doesn't have Bijuu level chakra so he'll be drained and helpless. Fu can't really do anything alone, right?

Kisame going too close would endanger both of them, due to Torune producing poison gas of nano bugs, covering more range then just the sword.

Fuu can support since he is a sensory type and maybe pull a tatic they did to Obito [

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]. Just throwing scenarios out there.

 

[awesomeseimei]

Danzo taking his time was to build suspense for the readers, nothing more. Danzo is not cruel to leave his comrade die in front of him, especially when they are outnumber in skill.

Kisame going too close would endanger both of them, due to Torune producing poison gas of nano bugs, covering more range then just the sword.

Fuu can support since he is a sensory type and maybe pull a tatic they did to Obito [

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]. Just throwing scenarios out there.

Danzo isn't cruel, but utterly rational (or he tried to be so anyway). He had shown literally no sign of caring about his subordinates. But well, I guess our interpretations of his character differ.

Kisame has enough range attacks. He can start by flooding the battlefield and I honestly don't think Torune would produce enough nanobugs for them to spread throughout the entire water body (even in the filler he said that the bugs need living flesh to grow/breed on and they die without it after a short while). Then Kisame can use his sharks, clones, again, Water Prison. His power is simply overwhelming. Fu's sensory skills wouldn't be of much help here.

Oh, and since they are fighting above water Kisame has a huge advantage actually.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Danzo isn't cruel, but utterly rational (or he tried to be so anyway). He had shown literally no sign of caring about his subordinates. But well, I guess our interpretations of his character differ.

I guess we can agree to disagree on this part, concerning aiding in certain situations.

Kisame has enough range attacks. He can start by flooding the battlefield and I honestly don't think Torune would produce enough nanobugs for them to spread throughout the entire water body (even in the filler he said that the bugs need living flesh to grow/breed on and they die without it after a short while). Then Kisame can use his sharks, clones, again, Water Prison. His power is simply overwhelming. Fu's sensory skills wouldn't be of much help here.

@bold/underline Read the OP location

Oh, and since they are fighting above water Kisame has a huge advantage actually.

Possibly if the water breaks down the bridge

 

[awesomeseimei]

Possibly if the water breaks down the bridge

Yes please! A huge wave taking down the bridge = instant awesome

Seriously though, I'm sure Kisame wouldn't hesitate to use environment to his advantage. And yes, for a moment there I forgot that bridges go over water hmm

So, I guess we can agree that team Root has a very very slim chance of winning this (even less than the previous one)?

As to Tobi and Zetsu. Let's just say it was pretty much established that you can't beat Obito without having access to his dimension. Even with full intel on him you have to pull something like Konan did to actually harm him. I know he got nano-bugged but that was an accident, Tobi grabbed Torune himself and tanked that anyway (pft, who needs an arm). With intel they probably want to avoid touching Obito... Meh, I don't really know. Kamui spam is just too OP.

 

[Brother Numpsay]

Yes please! A huge wave taking down the bridge = instant awesome

Seriously though, I'm sure Kisame wouldn't hesitate to use environment to his advantage. And yes, for a moment there I forgot that bridges go over water hmm

So, I guess we can agree that team Root has a very very slim chance of winning this (even less than the previous one)?

Agree.

As to Tobi and Zetsu. Let's just say it was pretty much established that you can't beat Obito without having access to his dimension. Even with full intel on him you have to pull something like Konan did to actually harm him. I know he got nano-bugged but that was an accident, Tobi grabbed Torune himself and tanked that anyway (pft, who needs an arm). With intel they probably want to avoid touching Obito... Meh, I don't really know. Kamui spam is just too OP.

Yea, I was thinking maybe one of them sacrifice them self to stay in the Kamui world and do this [

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]. But it seems only Kakashi is allow to do that. So I guess you cant beat that...

My last option was Danzo will go head on and let them touch each other [

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]. Danzo Izanagi's during the Kamui process. And Obito is sealed XD. Yea I know very very low possibility. I guess they can lose to him.

 

[Curse Mark]

I update the condition. Make an argument for them winning this

What was changed?