So do people actually Believe in Absolute Dicatorship or just Fanboyism?

[LeSauce]

I never said the Kages were dictators. I'm also not ignoring it. It's clear that you either become Hokage by:
1. Being voted by the Jonin
2. Being declared by the Feudal Lord Council
3. Being declared by the current Jonin

The only time a Hokage was elected by the people were Hashirama.

Since you have no idea what I'm really arguing in this thread, allow me to clarify.

I said it's possible that Sasuke's rule can be democratic, and can be supported and appreciated by the people. Someone replied to me and said that it isn't because Sasuke is declaring himself leader, that the people haven't chosen him, so they'll never accept that. I'm saying:

1. We don't know that Sasuke will force people to follow him.
2. There have been Kages who come into power or rule or whatever you want to call it without being chosen by the people, yet they were fine with it. Hiruzen, Minato, A, Tsunade, Kakashi, none of them had an election or had the Jonins vote for them.

There's also the fact that the 3rd Hokage chose Minato even though a lot of jounin wanted Orochimaru to become Hokage.

 

[-Spoiler-]

That makes absolutely no sense. Danzo said that once the Jonin council accepts him, the Jonin council will have no choice but to accept him as well? :|

The Other Kages thats the conference he was referring to if the Kages accept him as the leader of Konoha, the Jounins will have no choice but to accept him as well.

 

[-Spoiler-]

There's also the fact that the 3rd Hokage chose Minato even though a lot of jounin wanted Orochimaru to become Hokage.

One that was a filler.
Two Danzo was the only one wanting Orochimaru as kage

 

[bencoby]

Like I said, shallow words. Petty insults and words with no backing because you can't form a proper counterargument. Your best bet at this point would be to shut the **** up instead of making yourself look dumber.

All you arguments throughout this thread have lacked logic.

I can tell you a delusional fanboy who would not accept what ever fact given to you.

You seemed insane when you said when Sasuke kills Naruto and the kages then he would be the good guy and Naruto and the others would be the bad guys.

Also how does killing Naruto and the kages lead to peace?. If he does that he would have to kill all the SA and citizens of the other villages too.

OP: Sasukes way of thinking and doing things is very wicked.

 

[Punk Hazard]

The Other Kages thats the conference he was referring to if the Kages accept him as the leader of Konoha, the Jounins will have no choice but to accept him as well.

I think you have your shit mixed up. You called that meeting of the feudal lords the Jonin Council, when I posted that scan of Kakashi being declared Hokage without then need of a Jonin vote. Since when does the Kages take precedence over the Feudal Lords? You said it yourself, the Kages answer to the Lords, not the other way around, so this either means:

1. The feudal lord meeting wasn't the actual Jonin Council like you claimed, and I was right that the feudal lords can elect a Kage without Jonins and citizen consent

2. The Kages have greater pull than the Feudal Lords, the ones they answer to, in who becomes Hokage.

Which one sounds actually true to you?

 

[Punk Hazard]

All you arguments throughout this thread have lacked logic.

I can tell you a delusional fanboy who would not accept what ever fact given to you.

You seemed insane when you said when Sasuke kills Naruto and the kages then he would be the good guy and Naruto and the others would be the bad guys.

Also how does killing Naruto and the kages lead to peace?. If he does that he would have to kill all the SA and citizens of the other villages too.

OP: Sasukes way of thinking and doing things is very wicked.

I can tell you haven't understood anything I've said.

I'm not saying Sasuke's way will definitely lead to peace.
I'm not saying the Kages and Naruto will definitely be wrong.

I'm saying just two things about this whole thing:

1. The ideal that Naruto and the Kages have led to the world being ensnared by darkness

2. Sasuke's revolution can go two ways: Either he's right, and the Kages' ways need to go, or he's wrong, and his plans will fail. However, NB is either saying the former or latter are guaranteed. My outlook is hypothetical. I'm simply explaining how the former can happen, I'm not speaking from the outlook "Sasuke's way is guaranteed to be right", I'm speaking from the outlook "Sasuke's way succeeding and Sasuke's way failing are equally likely at the moment, mainly because we don't know the full details of the way." I acknowledge both sides of the argument, I am simply posting as a devil's advocate in all of this against the people who think his ways are guaranteed to be wrong from that outlook of equal acknowledgement.

 

[-Spoiler-]

I think you have your shit mixed up. You called that meeting of the feudal lords the Jonin Council, when I posted that scan of Kakashi being declared Hokage without then need of a Jonin vote. Since when does the Kages take precedence over the Feudal Lords? You said it yourself, the Kages answer to the Lords, not the other way around, so this either means:

1. The feudal lord meeting wasn't the actual Jonin Council like you claimed, and I was right that the feudal lords can elect a Kage without Jonins and citizen consent

2. The Kages have greater pull than the Feudal Lords, the ones they answer to, in who becomes Hokage.

Which one sounds actually true to you?

What are you talking about? Danzo was heading to the Kage Summit when he said that, and the Jounin council is always present at the meeting they are to the right of the table. and the elders already decided on Kakashi as the candidate as they did with Tsunade so no its not just appointed severalpeople have to decide on it

 

[Dannie]

You are truley delusional lol.

And yet this Naruto fanboy can't even counter his words.

 

[Punk Hazard]

The Council is the Jounins :| that's why Shikaku is there, its called the Jounin Council.

EDIT: I also like how you ignore that the elders had actually decided on Kakashi before hand [

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]

I didn't ignore that. That actually furthers my point. I was going to use that at first because it shows that Kakashi was put up for Hokage without any say from the people, but I went with the page after that because it shows Kakashi being declared the official Hokage without any say from the people, which was stronger to my point.

What are you talking about? Danzo was heading to the Kage Summit when he said that, and the Jounin council is always present at the meeting they are to the right of the table. and the elders already decided on Kakashi as the candidate as they did with Tsunade so no its not just appointed severalpeople have to decide on it

We have a mix up in communication here, streams being crossed, let's restart this.

The group of feudal lords declared Kakashi as Hokage without the jonins and without the vote from citizens.

 

[bencoby]

I can tell you haven't understood anything I've said.

I'm not saying Sasuke's way will definitely lead to peace.
I'm not saying the Kages and Naruto will definitely be wrong.

I'm saying just two things about this whole thing:

1. The ideal that Naruto and the Kages have led to the world being ensnared by darkness

2. Sasuke's revolution can go two ways: Either he's right, and the Kages' ways need to go, or he's wrong, and his plans will fail. However, NB is either saying the former or latter are guaranteed. My outlook is hypothetical. I'm simply explaining how the former can happen, I'm not speaking from the outlook "Sasuke's way is guaranteed to be right", I'm speaking from the outlook "Sasuke's way succeeding and Sasuke's way failing are equally likely at the moment, mainly because we don't know the full details of the way." I acknowledge both sides of the argument, I am simply posting as a devil's advocate in all of this against the people who think his ways are guaranteed to be wrong from that outlook of equal acknowledgement.

Okay, this was exactly what you said in your first post and I respected that opinion.
However moving on some of the arguments you made from then on didn't sound like there was logic behind it.

I that i saw you say Naruto and the Kages would be the bad guys in all of this if Sasuke kills them. Its also oblivious thae some of Sasukes actions would lead to repercussions beyond his control, so atleat we know some things unlike the way you put it.

 

[LeSauce]

One that was a filler.
Two Danzo was the only one wanting Orochimaru as kage

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[Punk Hazard]

Okay, this was exactly what you said in your first post and I respected that opinion.
However moving on some of the arguments you made from then on didn't sound like there was logic behind it.

I that i saw you say Naruto and the Kages would be the bad guys in all of this if Sasuke kills them. Its also oblivious thae some of Sasukes actions would lead to repercussions beyond his control, so atleat we know some things unlike the way you put it.

I never said that. Sasuke's way is more than likely opposite to what the Kages believe in. I said if he kills them, if people accept his way and if it works, then it makes them the bad guys because their way, being the opposite, would have failed and they would have tried to stop him from implementing this way that would have worked in favor of failure. Not intentionally the bad guys.

 

[-Spoiler-]

We have a mix up in communication here, streams being crossed, let's restart this.

The group of feudal lords declared Kakashi as Hokage without the jonins and without the vote from citizens.

Yes the feudal lords is at the top of the Hierarchy and can directly appoint a new leader without voting, by going from merit and reputation, but this is not always the case.

 

[KingHashirama]

Its not personal, there just the symbolic representation of the current shinobi system that sasuke wants to get rid of

False, all shinobi who are alive, even his own Sensei aka Kakashi, is a symbolic representation of the current shinobi system. So he would have to kill all of them.

Yes the feudal lords is at the top of the Hierarchy and can directly appoint a new leader without voting, by going from merit and reputation, but this is not always the case.

they need the approval of the people in the village.

Hashirama the first Hokage, was elected via the approval of all the people + feudal lords, big difference.

Feudal lord cannot by himself appoint the new Hokage.

Still need the approval of the jounin to be the actual Hokage, otherwise you'd just be a Danzo type "fake" Hokage.

 

[Shadow Phantasm]

One that was a filler.
Two Danzo was the only one wanting Orochimaru as kage

It wasn't filler since Orochimaru said the people wanted him to be hokage and were surprised that Minato was chosen instead after Hashirama told his story.

 

[-Spoiler-]

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That statement is very ambigous, it doesn't say it came down the Council and Hiruzen overrule them

 

[Darth Uchiha]

It wasn't filler since Orochimaru said the people wanted him to be hokage and were surprised that Minato was chosen instead after Hashirama told his story.

No he didn't.

 

[KingHashirama]

No he didn't.

He did........ Sannin were all together more popular within the village, especially Orochimaru, since he was the only one who stayed within the village, unlike the other 2 who were traveling. It was only logical of people to believe that the next Hokage would be the Sandaime's student.

 

[LeSauce]

That statement is very ambigous, it doesn't say it came down the Council and Hiruzen overrule them

Not really, he says that Hiruzen took him out of the equation in favor of Minato and, even though the citizens disagreed with Hiruzens decision, they simply acceptes it.

 

[LeSauce]

That statement is very ambigous, it doesn't say it came down the Council and Hiruzen overrule them

Not really, he says that Hiruzen took him out of the equation in favor of Minato and, even though the citizens disagreed with Hiruzens decision, they simply acceptes it.