[Discussion] Smoker vs Luffy

[Bogard]

Smoker fodder stomps Luffy in s1-s3 and Luffy mid diffs Smoker in S4.


IMO Luffy is above Smokers level or on par with him at the time of Alabasta and MF but he'd lose against Smoker because he can't hit him.

-_-
Once again, intangibility is off. Read OP

 

[A v i]

Because he is doctor, he is not just a pirate??? Lol. Anyway I get what you wanted to say, but his "doctor" abilities come from his devil fruit and help him in battles and also part of his power level.

Cora said that it's powers aren't like magic,He need to be a skilled doctor to be able to use it. He trained to get stronger as well as to be a great doctor where as only thing Luffy did is to get stronger and stronger yet Law is keeping up with Luffy despite of having less amount of time than Luffy.

That's my point, Luffy trained hard, Law took it easy, at least easier than Luffy, considering that both were equals prior to time-skip, Luffy know should be a lot stronger than Law.

This is assuming that Luffy has same potential as Law oe > Law but there is nothing that suggests this point. As I said before Law don't have as much time as Luffy to get stronger hence we can't decide the difference in their potential.

Actually Luffy has yet to show his strength in this arc, Law did show more, so he could maybe made impression that he is stronger, but he shouldn't be. That's just impression.

Yes,I know and that's why I said from what we have seen Law is a bit above Luffy.

-_-
Once again, intangibility is off. Read OP

Sorry, My bad.


Smoker wins mid dif in S1.

Luffy wins high dif-very high at Alabasta.

Luffy wins b/w mid and high dif at MF.

Luffy wins mid dif if it is current Luffy

 

[Forbidden Tale]

Cora said that it's powers aren't like magic,He need to be a skilled doctor to be able to use it. He trained to get stronger as well as to be a great doctor where as only thing Luffy did is to get stronger and stronger yet Law is keeping up with Luffy despite of having less amount of time than Luffy.




This is assuming that Luffy has same potential as Law oe > Law but there is nothing that suggests this point. As I said before Law don't have as much time as Luffy to get stronger hence we can't decide the difference in their potential.


Yes,I know and that's why I said from what we have seen Law is a bit above Luffy.

Same goes to Luffy both of them need to train their Devil Fruit.

Law had much more time than Luffy, considering that he is 7 years older than him. His job as doctor also fit his fighting style and his power level, Ope Ope no Mi fruit and it's operation powers are useful in surgery just like they are useful in fight.

 

[Punk Hazard]

Because he is doctor, he is not just a pirate??? Lol. Anyway I get what you wanted to say, but his "doctor" abilities come from his devil fruit and help him in battles and also part of his power level.

That's my point, Luffy trained hard, Law took it easy, at least easier than Luffy, considering that both were equals prior to time-skip, Luffy know should be a lot stronger than Law.

Actually Luffy has yet to show his strength in this arc, Law did show more, so he could maybe made impression that he is stronger, but he shouldn't be. That's just impression.

There you go saying that again. Where is your proof that Law took it easy and disntdidn't train just as hard as Luffy? And if Law took it easy and is still on egrounds as Luffy who trained hard, you do know that means Law is just immensely more talented than Luffy

-_-
Once again, intangibility is off. Read OP

That's lame.

 

[Messiah]

How was Luffy able to grab the smoke when tashigi was vsing luffy?

 

[TheHokage]

S1: Smoker high-diff.
S2: Smoker high-diff.
S3: Luffy high/extreme-diff.
S4: Luffy high/extreme-diff.

To save time - this is my opinion on the matter.

 

[Forbidden Tale]

@ Riker Slade

If Law is more talented than Luffy, Law would be far above Luffy pre-time skip.

From what we saw Pirates only trained when they disband their crew, like Luffy did. Otherwise they got stronger during their 'adventures'. Luffy and co got a lot stronger from the chapter they entered Grand Line to the MF arc.

Law [

You must be registered for see links

] said that they will wait for a right moment to enter New World, not that they will train until they enter New World. Once they entered New World, there is no time to train that much, just fight for survival and getting stronger through that same survival.

Smoker likely trained hard, still post-time skip Smoker is far from Luffy.

 

[TheHokage]

@ Riker Slade

If Law is more talented than Luffy, Law would be far above Luffy pre-time skip.

From what we saw Pirates only trained when they disband their crew, like Luffy did. Otherwise they got stronger during their 'adventures'. Luffy and co got a lot stronger from the chapter they entered Grand Line to the MF arc.

Law [

You must be registered for see links

] said that they will wait for a right moment to enter New World, not that they will train until they enter New World. Once they entered New World, there is no time to train that much, just fight for survival and getting stronger through that same survival.

Smoker likely trained hard, still post-time skip Smoker is far from Luffy.

I wouldn't say he's far from Luffy.

 

[Punk Hazard]

@ Riker Slade

If Law is more talented than Luffy, Law would be far above Luffy pre-time skip.

From what we saw Pirates only trained when they disband their crew, like Luffy did. Otherwise they got stronger during their 'adventures'. Luffy and co got a lot stronger from the chapter they entered Grand Line to the MF arc.

Law [

You must be registered for see links

] said that they will wait for a right moment to enter New World, not that they will train until they enter New World. Once they entered New World, there is no time to train that much, just fight for survival and getting stronger through that same survival.

Smoker likely trained hard, still post-time skip Smoker is far from Luffy.

Waiting to enter the New World also doesn't mean NOT training until they get to the new world either. Like I said, until you give irrefutable proof that Law didn't train and took it easy, what you're saying just isn't right.

 

[Bogard]

I wouldn't say he's far from Luffy.

Law > Vergo > Smoker and Luffy is roughly on Law level, so yes they shouldn't be that close

 

[TheHokage]

Law > Vergo > Smoker and Luffy is roughly on Law level, so yes they shouldn't be that close

The One Piece strength system doesn't work like that and you know it. Not to mention it's a very obtuse way of looking at things. Sanji was defeated by Kalia yet Nami defeated her would you say at that moment Sanji was weaker because he couldn't win. No. Also I get the point Sanji never kicks woman however it's more of the point I'm trying to make itself.

Smoker gave Law a harder time than Vergo did in their fight. There are many variables that contribute to an outcome of a fight for instance Law's hax power for people like Vergo, Smoker and Luffy who are more brawler characters he is their nightmare. Again though you can believe that Oda has wasted 10 years building their rivalry up all for Luffy to suddenly be able to dominate Smoker all you like end of the day until I see Luffy beat Smoker in a low - mid diff fight like you obviously believe I'm going to have too differ in opinion.

 

[Hexuze]

He's more experienced than Law, what happened to him? His experience didn't helped him to estimate how strong his opponents attack is which is why he was easily defeated by Law.

Looks like you didn't read what I posted after that, I meant in haki. Law defeated Vergo because of his DF, not because of superior haki. Just because Law defeated him pretty easily... I don't know why people think Luffy will automatically be able to win. Both Luffy & Law fight differently if you haven't noticed.

 

[A v i]

Looks like you didn't read what I posted after that, I meant in haki. Law defeated Vergo because of his DF, not because of superior haki. Just because Law defeated him pretty easily... I don't know why people think Luffy will automatically be able to win. Both Luffy & Law fight differently if you haven't noticed.

My point is that experience plays no cards here. Law has far less experience than Vergo yet he figured that Vergo is weaker than him/his attack is strong enough to cut through Vergos haki where as Vergos experience didn't helped him to estimate his opponents capabilities. Hence, he failed against Law. Like wise it doesn't matter if he has more experience. If his opponent is a capable dude then he's done for.

Btw,I didn't said that Luffy beats Vergo because he had lost to Law. My point is that you can't use experience as an argument to say that he can beat Luffy.

 

[Hexuze]

My point is that experience plays no cards here. Law has far less experience than Vergo yet he figured that Vergo is weaker than him/his attack is strong enough to cut through Vergos haki where as Vergos experience didn't helped him to estimate his opponents capabilities. Hence, he failed against Law. Like wise it doesn't matter if he has more experience. If his opponent is a capable dude then he's done for.

Btw,I didn't said that Luffy beats Vergo because he had lost to Law. My point is that you can't use experience to say that he can beat Luffy.

CoA experience is a factor to consider for someone fighting against Luffy. Luffy uses hand-to-hand combat so it's relevant. What part of Luffy & Law having different combat styles did you not understand? They don't fight the same way either, so quit bringing up Law to prove that haki experience can't be used to say he beats Luffy. I'm not saying that's the only factor that proves Vergo is stronger than Luffy, there's other feats as well.

 

[Punk Hazard]

My point is that experience plays no cards here. Law has far less experience than Vergo yet he figured that Vergo is weaker than him/his attack is strong enough to cut through Vergos haki where as Vergos experience didn't helped him to estimate his opponents capabilities. Hence, he failed against Law. Like wise it doesn't matter if he has more experience. If his opponent is a capable dude then he's done for.

Btw,I didn't said that Luffy beats Vergo because he had lost to Law. My point is that you can't use experience as an argument to say that he can beat Luffy.

What Corazon is trying to convey to you is that Law vs Vergo came down to the strength of Law's fruit vs the strength of Vergo's Haki. Law's own experience and strength with Haki, and Vergo's experience with Haki, were non-factors because you are not comparing the same traits.

With Luffy vs Vergo, experience does matter because you are putting Haki vs Haki. Therefore, the one who is more experienced with using Haki has a better chance of winning. And it's not like it's Don Chinjao all over again because Chinjao was out of his prime, while Vergo, in this scenario, is still in his. When it comes down to Vergo vs Luffy, experience with Haki plays a factor.

 

[A v i]

CoA experience is a factor to consider for someone fighting against Luffy. Luffy uses hand-to-hand combat so it's relevant.

No,it is not.

You didn't get my point, I am comparing their ability to estimate their opponents caliber. Law proved that he is better at estimating opponents strength despite of having less experience than Vergo. Same can be said to haki as well, you can't say that Vergo is better than Luffy just because he has more experience.

What part of it is so hard to understand?

If you want haki related example then you can read Don Chinjao VS Luffy.

What part of Luffy & Law having different combat styles did you not understand? They don't fight the same way either, so quit bringing up Law to prove that haki experience can't be used to say he beats Luffy. I'm not saying that's the only factor that proves Vergo is stronger than Luffy, there's other feats as well.

Lmao, are you even reading my posts? I have never used Law as a reference to say that Luffy beats Vergo. I don't even remember saying Luffy beats Vergo in the first place.

 

[Punk Hazard]

No,it is not.

You didn't get my point, I am comparing their ability to estimate their opponents caliber. Law proved that he is better at estimating opponents strength despite of having less experience than Vergo. Same can be said to haki as well, you can't say that Vergo is better than Luffy just because he has more experience.

What part of it is so hard to understand?

If you want haki related example then you can read Don Chinjao VS Luffy.



Lmao, are you even reading my posts? I have never used Law as a reference to say that Luffy beats Vergo. I don't even remember saying Luffy beats Vergo in the first place.

He's not saying that Vergo's experience in Haki makes him stronger, he's saying it plays a role. Give a lawyer a gun and give a soldier a gun, and then make them face off. Who is more likely to win?

 

[Bogard]

The One Piece strength system doesn't work like that and you know it. Not to mention it's a very obtuse way of looking at things. Sanji was defeated by Kalia yet Nami defeated her would you say at that moment Sanji was weaker because he couldn't win. No. Also I get the point Sanji never kicks woman however it's more of the point I'm trying to make itself.

Smoker gave Law a harder time than Vergo did in their fight. There are many variables that contribute to an outcome of a fight for instance Law's hax power for people like Vergo, Smoker and Luffy who are more brawler characters he is their nightmare. Again though you can believe that Oda has wasted 10 years building their rivalry up all for Luffy to suddenly be able to dominate Smoker all you like end of the day until I see Luffy beat Smoker in a low - mid diff fight like you obviously believe I'm going to have too differ in opinion.

The Sanji example is laughable because Sanji never tried to fight back, so it's inaccurate to base it to judge difference in level between characters.

And Smoker didn't really gave a harder time than Vergo to Law considering than unlike against Smoker, Law had to go all out to defeat Vergo.

And i don't think Luffy can low diff Smoker. I do think however he can mid diff him

 

[NarutoBmx33]

Luffy wins mid diff. The tables have turned for the White Chase.

 

[Forbidden Tale]

I wouldn't say he's far from Luffy.

Law > Vergo > Smoker. In case that Luffy can beat Smoker with just high to extrem. high diff, would mean that Luffy is around as strong as Vergo or even weaker, which is very unlikely.

Waiting to enter the New World also doesn't mean NOT training until they get to the new world either. Like I said, until you give irrefutable proof that Law didn't train and took it easy, what you're saying just isn't right.

So even if he trained for that time and with increase in power he got from NW, he still shouldn't be more powerful than Luffy, because as I already said 24 years old Law was equal with 17 years old Luffy. And as you said Luffy prior that was self thaught, while Law was self taught and was taught for some time by Doflamingo's executive.

Also in the picture I posted, Law exactly seems like guy who are going on some Island to chill and do nothing and wait for that moment he talk about. He don't seems being motivated to train at all.