Sasuke's TNJ was forced by Kishi

[Kurama2012]

But it was extremely illogical for Sasuke to suddenly do a face-heel turn in the span of one chapter. Why can no one see this?

because i see it in a totally different way, i see it as sasuke wanting to escape any form of happiness as he sees it as weakness and him learning he couldn't overpower naruto in any kinda way proved his way was wrong and seeing naruto in a similar situation allowed him to confess everything and from what kishi is saying is that sasuke has been tackling this side of himself for years and when it comes down to it sasuke never wanted to kill naruto he just felt it was the best way to have no weaknesses but it didn't work

 

[EmperorSasuke]

because i see it in a totally different way, i see it as sasuke wanting to escape any form of happiness as he sees it as weakness and him learning he couldn't overpower naruto in any kinda way proved his way was wrong and seeing naruto in a similar situation allowed him to confess everything and from what kishi is saying is that sasuke has been tackling this side of himself for years and when it comes down to it sasuke never wanted to kill naruto he just felt it was the best way to have no weaknesses but it didn't work

Even if what you say is true, Kishi should have spread it out across multiple chapters though. The sudden face-heel turn just breaks my suspension of disbelief.

 

[Kurama2012]

That still doesn't explain why Sasuke suddenly went from wanting to kill Naruto to being a Naruto fanboy in the span of one chapter.

thats because from sasukes perspective its been in the back of his mind for years now and yes it happened in one chapter for us the viewer but these characters are living a life and just because the author doesn't tell you everything at once doesn't mean it becomes a forced plot device

 

[Transcendence]

Not at all. This has been foreshadowed for hundreds of chapters. Plus, Naruto really didn't TNJ Sasuke. Sasuke did it to himself, if that makes sense. This was as natural of a character path change as you will ever see. Not forced in the slightest.

 

[EmperorSasuke]

Not at all. This has been foreshadowed for hundreds of chapters. Plus, Naruto really didn't TNJ Sasuke. Sasuke did it to himself, if that makes sense. This was as natural of a character path change as you will ever see. Not forced in the slightest.

Yeah, i agree Sasuke TNJed himself. That makes it even more ludicrous. Sasuke TNJed himself in one chapter. It's obviously forced by Kishi.

 

[Transcendence]

Yeah, i agree Sasuke TNJed himself. That makes it even more ludicrous. Sasuke TNJed himself in one chapter. It's obviously forced by Kishi.

It's called accepting your demons. It wasn't forced. After seeing how strong Naruto's resolve was, Sasuke couldn't help but accept it.

 

[Kurama2012]

Even if what you say is true, Kishi should have spread it out across multiple chapters though. The sudden face-heel turn just breaks my suspension of disbelief.

no he shouldn't have to, in a way its kinda like a plot twist in the sense that when it is revealed everything you thought you knew becomes a completely new perspective take me for instance ive never been the biggest fan of sasuke never hated him but never loved him and i never truly understood him as a character but with this reveal he made in this chapter completely shifted my perspective on him and i feel i understand him a lot more than i ever did

also kishi has been hinting at this in the beginning of the fight sasuke repeated what he had said back when they first fought that naruto his his best friend so that right there should tell you everything you need to know. he wasnt trying to kill naruto because he wanted to but rather he felt he had to

 

[EmperorSasuke]

It's called accepting your demons. It wasn't forced. After seeing how strong Naruto's resolve was, Sasuke couldn't help but accept it.

But all of that in one chapter? I still call bullshit.

no he shouldn't have to, in a way its kinda like a plot twist in the sense that when it is revealed everything you thought you knew becomes a completely new perspective take me for instance ive never been the biggest fan of sasuke never hated him but never loved him and i never truly understood him as a character but with this reveal he made in this chapter completely shifted my perspective on him and i feel i understand him a lot more than i ever did

also kishi has been hinting at this in the beginning of the fight sasuke repeated what he had said back when they first fought that naruto his his best friend so that right there should tell you everything you need to know. he wasnt trying to kill naruto because he wanted to but rather he felt he had to

But it honestly feels a bit like an asspull though you may be right.

 

[Transcendence]

But all of that in one chapter? I still call bullshit.

Sasuke already showed this chapter that it wasn't just in one chapter. Sasuke has always felt that way towards Naruto. He's just had a weird way of showing it, and has had other things to tend to (Mainly revenge against Itachi for over 300 chapters of the manga) before he could accept it.

 

[Kurama2012]

But all of that in one chapter? I still call bullshit.

but it wasn't all in one chapter throughout the entire fight sasuke was trying to kill the one person he felt was holding him back but after countless times of failing to do so and seeing naruto counter everything and finally seeing the two laid on the ground with a missing arm each sasuke comes the realisation that he cant eliminate naruto and so prompts the confession

 

[Anorien16]

Apparently Sasuke fans like OP doesnt even pay attention to Sasuke even ... Sasuke did mention: "I might come after your ass again you know" And also he said something to the like of " .... that would be revolutionary too" which still indicates that it his will to bring around change but decided to give up since he thinks he is dying.

 

[EmperorSasuke]

Sasuke already showed this chapter that it wasn't just in one chapter. Sasuke has always felt that way towards Naruto. He's just had a weird way of showing it, and has had other things to tend to (Mainly revenge against Itachi for over 300 chapters of the manga) before he could accept it.

It's obviously retcon.

Apparently Sasuke fans like OP doesnt even pay attention to Sasuke even ... Sasuke did mention: "I might come after your ass again you know" And also he said something to the like of " .... that would be revolutionary too" which still indicates that it his will to bring around change but decided to give up since he thinks he is dying.

That's another thing that doesn't make sense. If he thought that he was dying, why wouldn't he think that Naruto would die too? They were essentially in the same condition.

 

[Kurama2012]

Apparently Sasuke fans like OP doesnt even pay attention to Sasuke even ... Sasuke did mention: "I might come after your ass again you know" And also he said something to the like of " .... that would be revolutionary too" which still indicates that it his will to bring around change but decided to give up since he thinks he is dying.

i forgot about the part when he thinks hes gonna die and as itachi said a person's true nature is revealed as there about to die

 

[Kurama2012]

It's obviously retcon.

That's another thing that doesn't make sense. If he thought that he was dying, why wouldn't he think that Naruto would die too? They were essentially in the same condition.

how is it a reckon when this is what kishi has had planned for years now and this is what the series has been about "bonds" and its clear to me that you'll never understand what went down in this chapter

 

[EmperorSasuke]

how is it a reckon when this is what kishi has had planned for years now and this is what the series has been about "bonds" and its clear to me that you'll never understand what went down in this chapter

All I saw in this chapter was forced TNJ.

 

[Kurama2012]

All I saw in this chapter was forced TNJ.

and clearly that is all you will see as you need kishi to spell everything out for you instead of coming up with your own interpretation outside of "tnj"

 

[EmperorSasuke]

and clearly that is all you will see as you need kishi to spell everything out for you instead of coming up with your own interpretation outside of "tnj"

I have my own interpretation and that is Sasuke having a "bond" with Naruto was retcon. Kishi just recently thought of it. You don't think he really thought of it 5 or 10 years back, do you?

 

[Kurama2012]

I have my own interpretation and that is Sasuke having a "bond" with Naruto was retcon. Kishi just recently thought of it. You don't think he really thought of it 5 or 10 years back, do you?

yes i do what do you think he was planning when he had sasuke leave to have naruto kill sasuke
every main villain in the series has had some form of redemption so why would sasuke be any different see how he has been narutos main driving force

kishi has had this ending in mind since pain vs naruto as he comments in one of the volumes on how the finaly has been decided and i have no reason to not trust him

also isnt a reckon a major change in back stories and law within a series and how was sasuke reckoned when back in his first fight with naruto he revealed he had a bond with naruto so its not like it was out of the realms of possibility

 

[EmperorSasuke]

yes i do what do you think he was planning when he had sasuke leave to have naruto kill sasuke
every main villain in the series has had some form of redemption so why would sasuke be any different see how he has been narutos main driving force

kishi has had this ending in mind since pain vs naruto as he comments in one of the volumes on how the finaly has been decided and i have no reason to not trust him

also isnt a reckon a major change in back stories and law within a series and how was sasuke reckoned when back in his first fight with naruto he revealed he had a bond with naruto so its not like it was out of the realms of possibility

It is really obvious that it is retcon, at least part of it. Before they became genin, they hardly had any interaction. But today's chapter makes it look like they had a bond even before graduating from the academy, which is bullshit IMO.

 

[Kurama2012]

It is really obvious that it is retcon, at least part of it. Before they became genin, they hardly had any interaction. But today's chapter makes it look like they had a bond even before graduating from the academy, which is bullshit IMO.

there bond isn't that of how me or you would see it, there bond comes from the fact they were both alone and they could relate to each other but there stubborn personalities got in the way and so there bond became a rivalry instead which in their case is the strongest bond they have
as naruto said in this chapter for the first time he felt connected to someone as that person had the same pain of being alone