No, wait, don't leave. This is not another thread trying to justify either Sasuke or Naruto in any form or way, this is simply a thread going over and theorizing what Sasuke should or do have knowledge and ability of when it comes to the Rinnegan. Now, with that out of the way. Let's begin. Current Sasuke — What do we know he can? Let's start with the abilities of the Rinnegan that we know Sasuke is completely capable of using. Specific jutsu and abilities that he has either showcased or proven he is capable of. (For example, we know he is capable of a standard Chibaku Tensei even though he has never done it, as he has only done a multiple and more advanced version of it.) Preta Path: Sasuke demonstrated the chakra absorption abilities of the Preta Path when he faced off against Naruto in the Valley of the End II fight. Proving that he is capable of using it both at a single target and multiple at once. (Surpassing every other shown user of his technique.) Deva Path: When Sasuke announced his plan of a revolution, he quickly demonstrated a master level of control with the Deva Path unlike any we'd seen previously. (It's debatable whenever or not Madara's level was on pair.) He demonstrated his knowledge and power with this path by using the Chibaku Tensei to seal all the Bijuu away. (Yes, Chibaku Tensei is an ability of the Deva Path. We know that because the main body of Pain which only hosted the powers of the Deva Path utilized this ability.) Infinite Tsukuyomi Dispel: When combined with Naruto's Bijuu chakra, Sasuke showed that he is capable of dispelling Infinite Tsukuyomi. This means that if he obtains said chakra, he should be able to cast it as well. (As that would pretty much turn him into what Juubi Jin is.) Indra's Arrow: This is regarded as a power of the Rinnegan as it requires the Preta Path to absorb enough chakra to make this attack. A technique Sasuke displayed during the final fight with Naruto. Heavenly Hand Power: Sasuke's unique Rinnegan ability. First shown against Madara Uchiha during the Fourth Great Ninja War, and later as part of his main arsenal of techniques. So that is the Rinnegan power that we know Sasuke possess, though they are far from all the powers of the Rinnegan, and we haven't even seen him preform all the variations of said ability yet. (Which is likely that we will never do.) Then what about powers he should have, but haven't showed yet? Current Sasuke — What should he be able to do? Despite his already impressive arsenal, there are several other Rinnegan abilities that he has yet to show. Before you go ahead and say that he has no knowledge of them, we know that those who awaken the eyes also gain full knowledge of them. (As seen with Madara when he awoke the Rinnegan and Sasuke's Sharingan evolution and Rinnegan.) So what are abilities that Sasuke should posses but has yet to be shown? The Remaining Paths: Sasuke possess a Rinnegan, and all known users have been capable of utilizing different paths, while Nagato was capable of using all of them. There is no lore reason why Sasuke shouldn't possess all of them, he has however, yet to show any other than two of them. Banshō Ten'in: Banshō Ten'in is also known as Heavenly Attraction of All Creation and was demonstrated by Pain when he fought Kakashi during the attack on Konoha. This ability allows the user to pull anything towards them using magnetic force. This is a ability of the Deva Path, which Sasuke has proven he is capable of using on a much higher level than Nagato. Hence, there is no reason he shouldn't be able to use this specific technique. Standard Chibaku Tensei: A ability showed by Madara and Pain (Nagat) multiple times. Where as Sasuke has never shown the use of the standard version, he has however shown the use of a more advanced version of this technique when he imprisoned all of the Bijuu. Because of that, there is no reason why he shouldn't be capable of using the standard variant. Shinra Tensei: Yet another ability displayed by Pain when he attacked Konoha. He demonstrated the attack abilities of this technique, as well as the defensive when he used it to both level Konoha to the ground and to block several attacks such as a Rasenshuriken by Naruto. This is an ability by the Deva Path, one path which Sasuke has shown talent within. Hence, there is no reason he shouldn't be capable of using it. Tengai Shinsei: An ability only displayed by Madara Uchiha when he attacked the Fourth Division during the last war. By combining the Rinnegan and Susano'o, the user can drag meteorites down on the Earth itself. While not directly stated to be an ability by the Rinnegan, it does require Susano'o to work, and it shares attributes with the Deva Path. Because of those two things, there is no lore reason why Sasuke should be unable to preform this technique. It remains debatable whenever or not Sasuke possess the abilities of the other Paths, however one thing remains pretty certain. He should be able to use the techniques that goes along with the paths he has already shown ability within. These are abilities such as, but not limited to; Shinra Tensei, Banshō Ten'in, Tengai Shinsei and Standard Chibaku Tensei. |
[Discussion] Sasuke's Rinnegan — What is he actually capable of?
- Thread starter Crovus
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Mikeuhsomething36
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Debatable? The only people that debate whethervSasuke has all the paths are troll, Salty Madara fans, and the bad side of the Naruto fandom or a combination if the three.
On that note pretty much, but I doubt Sasuke will use his powers to their full potential. Otherwise he would've took momo and kin by himself. Heck Naruto could if he wasn't nerfed.
The closest you're getting is the games. Sasuke can make tengai shinsei with CT essentially but it's just quicker I suppose. These are just standard rinnegan abilities. Sasuke just doesn't have limbo. And he can combine his path powers such as preta+Asura or something
On that note pretty much, but I doubt Sasuke will use his powers to their full potential. Otherwise he would've took momo and kin by himself. Heck Naruto could if he wasn't nerfed.
The closest you're getting is the games. Sasuke can make tengai shinsei with CT essentially but it's just quicker I suppose. These are just standard rinnegan abilities. Sasuke just doesn't have limbo. And he can combine his path powers such as preta+Asura or something
It remains debatable, and proven multiple times. Those who awaken the power, also gains all knowledge of them without having to use it first. Madara knew how Rinne Tensei worked, as well as all of the abilities he showed with. Yet we have no proof that he ever used if or even witnessed it before the Fourth Great Ninja war. (We also know that Black Zetsu didn't teach it to him, and that it wasn't contained on the tablet.) Going by that, its logical that Sasuke also gained all that knowledge when he gained his Rinnegan. It's debatable because we haven't actually seen him use either, meaning he might know of them, but be unable to use for a reason not given.
Uchiha boii
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Good thread sasuke should logically have all the paths I imagine kishi doesn't want to change his fighting style too much or he just decided not to show us his full potential
I assumed that as well, and to avoid him becoming too much like Nagato. As well as for appearances when Sasuke uses himself as a shield to protect Sarada. He could have used Deva Path to change the trajectory of the knifes, or Shinra Tensei to block them, but at the end of the day it looked far better (from a writer's view) if he used himself as a human shield to protect his daughter whom he already had a slightly shaken relationship with.
Which is why I put it under; "Powers he should have" as he haven't shown the ability to use them, meaning it is no way to confirm it yet. By that logic then Obito should also have had the ability to utilize all paths, as he had full knowledge of them and possessed a Rinnegan. Yet he never showed it, so its only theorized that he had them.
Donald J Trump
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He has Shinra tensei for 100%. If you watch Sasuke vs Kinshki, at one of the moments he's on the ground and uses Shinra Tensei to push himself away so he doesn't get hit. It's very clear and it makes the faint noise.
BlueMeteor
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Uh then that's proof that he has it. You can't use 1 path and not have the other ones that come with that path. Sasuke used the strongest deva technique. But can't use weaker one's? Same as Madara. Obito was using outer path to control the bijuu's and it wasted a lot of chakra that's why he didn't use the rest. You can't have a Rinnegan but not have all basic six paths.
There can be other reasons why he is incapable of using the paths, while its everything but confirmed that he knows about it, then he still haven't used them. Hence there is no proof that he can, other than logic and theory. (And no, neither of those work as proof.) Pain demonstrated the use of Shinra Tensei on a large scale, which costed so much chakra that he had to go on a cool down. Sasuke lacks a big chakra pool such as someone of the Uzumaki clan would have, or Senju. (Madara undoubtedly gained a somewhat larger pool, not to mention his already large pool which logically speaking was bigger than Sasuke's naturally.) However, he does possess Rikudou Chakra, which is potent.
Despite possessing that however, he still wouldn't have a huge reserve. Hence, there are other reasons why Sasuke might avoid using those techniques or is unable to use them. Not to mention that Sasuke's Rinnegan is unique, whenever or not it possess all powers wasn't made clear, but there isn't a reason he shouldn't have them, yet it has never been confirmed that he has them. The awakening of the Rinnegan only proves that he knows about the techniques, not that he can use them. (Sasuke also knows about Limbo, but shouldn't be able to use it, as an example.)
@Bold You know Sasuke have Hashirama DNA right and Hagoromo's chakra. His chakra pool is by far larger than Nagato's. And he was special not all Uzumaki's have a large chakra pool. Kushina doesn't she had a strong chakra only. Karin doesn't. And Naruto is is Ashura's transmigrant. And Sasuke is the original user of the Rinnegan.
Chakra isn't an issue for Sasuke at all when using any of his abilities unless it's to open dimensions.
Except all Rinnegan user's get the basic six paths techniques they just have to learn them it isn't like MS where you know of the abilities already.
Limbo could be exclusive to Madara only but the DB said it's a Rinnegan technique. So if DB is right Sasuke can learn limbo unless it is exclusive to Madara like Amaterasu is to Itachi and Sasuke.
Rinnegan is the same Mangekyou Sharingan; each owner has his own exclusive Jutsu.
- Madara has Limbo.
- Sasuke has Amenotejikara.
- Nagato has Ashura, Animal and Naraka Path.
Sasuke has Hashirama's DNA? I thought that stupid theory was proven wrong so many times that even trolls had stopped using it. I assume you are referring to Kabuto's treatment during the war? In which, the RAW and official translations only state that he used the research he and Orochimaru had done into Hashirama's DNA to treat Sasuke as best he could. Nowhere was it stated that he implanted the cells into him, nor was it ever discussed or mentioned. (Despite the fact that it would result in a face being grown.)
Furthermore, Uzumaki have a strong life-force. Uzumaki are of the exact same lineage of the Senju which derive from Asura, and because of that they have a strong chakra and strong life-force of "The Body of the Sage". Nagato was elected to be the user of Madara's Rinnegan exactly because his lineage towards the Senju. While
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isn't the official one, they state the same. Nagato is of the Senju lineage, and we know he is a Uzumaki. Now allow me to correct the remaining of your errors.As stated in the OP, we have no proof that Madara even used a single technique of the Rinnegan prior to the war. He most certainly didn't train with it, as he was at death's door when he awoke it. Yet Madara had full knowledge of all Rinnegan powers he showed. He instantly knew how to summon the Gedo Statue, he was full aware of the Six Paths jutsu and I doubt he used Preta Path while in the cave. Hence, he knew about all those powers before even using them once. Meaning he gained that knowledge when he awoke it, same as a Sharingan. (No other logical explanation to it.)
Limbo is unique to Madara as far as we know, same as Heavenly Hand Power is to Sasuke. (Madara quoted it as a "the power of your eye, Sasuke" after all. Despite that, it still remains a Rinnegan technique. In the same way as Kagutsuchi is unique to Sasuke and Tsukuyomi is unique to Itachi. (Also, Amaterasu cannot be unique to either of the brothers as Tobirama had seen in prior to the 4th Great Ninja War, meaning either Izuna or Madara had it.)
I know that each Rinnegan has their unique abilities, never said otherwise. However you are wrong on that last point on the list. Nagato's Rinnegan is and will always be Madara's. Transplanted eyes don't gain new abilities unique to the person who gets it. When Kakashi gained Obito's Sharingan, he also gained Kamui, the long range variant. When Madara later stole it, he also gained the exact same version of Kamui. Proving that in cases like Kakashi and Nagato's, they don't get unique powers. So no, Nagato is the only one capable of using the Ashura, Animal and Naraka paths. (They are part of the Six Paths of the Rinnegan.)
To dispel the Infinite Tsukuyomi, all that is required is the chakra of all 9 Bijuu and a Rinnegan. Sasuke first state this right after exiting the Susano'o shield he created.
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. This is later stated
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, who supports Sasuke's theory. Not to mention that Hagoromo once dispelled the jutsu himself, lacking the Rinne-Sharingan. Meaning that dispelling it, a Rinnegan is only required as it is an ability of a Rinnegan. (The Rinne-Sharingan is only the strongest version of the Rinnegan.) Hence why I stated that if he gained the Bijuu chakra, he should be able to preform Infinite Tsukuyomi if he wanted to, as it would make him into a Juubi Jin with the Rinnegan, same as Madara. (Who did cast it.) Though without the chakra, he can't cast or dispel it. So the fault wasn't mine, but yours here.
The second part? What? I stated that Sasuke might have other reasons why he is unable to use the other paths, one of them being the lack of chakra. So how is that a fault on my part? You just agreed with me. (Unless you agree with me, then disagree in the same sentence, in that case you are a nutcase, but I don't think that is the case.) Sasuke have only shown to close his eyes after overuse of Heavenly Hand Power and even displayed the ability to use Preta Path while his eye was closed. We also know that Kaguya's time/space-dimensional jutsu costed her a huge chunk of chakra. Hence that is probably the case for him closing his eye. Heavenly Hand Power as a time/space-dimensional ninjutsu costs a huge chunk of chakra and has a cooldown.
That however, isn't proof that all of the Rinnegan abilities work like that. He managed to cast 9 Chibaku Tensei that all were stronger than Nagato's one (when Nagato tired his very best), proving that he used both more chakra and had better control. Along with using Preta Path while he was completely drained of chakra. He also maintained the seals of the Bijuu while being drained, though lacked full control over the seals. Hence, I'd bet that its only Heavenly Hand Power that causes him to go on a cooldown and use a lot of chakra, which is probably also why he is shown to only use it when its absolutely needed.
Having transplanted eyes do not mean that the person cannot develop his own Jutsu. Kakashi used Obito's Doujutsu better than Obito himself did, as he was able to manifest PS and Kamui Shuriken, something Obito could not display during his fight against Kaguya.
I already made it clear to you, that if you're going to outright deny an official established made by databook IV, which states that Infinite Tsukuyomi is cast by Rinne Sharingan and not Rinnegan, as manga did not expand on this information, then you will be ignored. So for this part here, you'll be ignored for denying an official established. I'm not wasting my time arguing with outright denial.
He closes his eye to conserve Chakra in the same transplants of Doujutsu's shut their eye with exception of Nagato. It has nothing to do with overuse or cooldown. Nagato could handle two Rinnegan from his childhood to his deathbed activated and spamming techniques, while Sasuke shuts it and can't overuse it without getting exhausted.
All stronger? No. The size of CT's were the size of Biju's, whereas Nagato's dwarfed mountain range, which only tired him out of sheer size as well as prior to fighting Konoha and Naruto. Until he shows other Six Paths techniques, he doesn't get it.
Rohan
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The Databooks have known to give hyped information though so trusting it is doable. In the end, the main source of information is the Manga, and everything else is secondary. So, if in the Manga, a Rinnegan can block and dispel MT, then it can activate MT also.
However a huge inconsistency that rises is that the word "Rinnesharingan" is never mentioned in the Manga (I have not seen the word used anywhere). It is either referred to as Rinnegan or Sharingan in the Manga.
To solve this two way confusion between the Databook and the Manga, in my opinion, Sasuke's left eye is a six tomoe Rinnesharingan which explains the connection to MT. Kishi's perhaps hid plot relevant material by not using that word ? Who knows ?
NextGenNinja
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Perhaps, he didn't bother to fully master the rinnegan hence why he hasn't shown those other paths?
You should firstly learn to differentiate between an exaggeration and information; what the databook gave was an expanded information the manga had not gave anything about. In that case, the information is an official established and cannot be argued against. Databook is as just reliable as the manga because it's written by the author who too writes the manga. It's an official establishment. Do not argue against it.
What you think does not matter when there is an officially established content. Databook calls it Rinne Sharingan while Sasuke's eye is Rinnegan. Theories are not opened. End of discussion.